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hey... we were neck and neck with Milw with 4 weeks left to go
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fishmike
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5/25/2005  7:17 AM
They rested Michael Redd and played their whole roster. Now they will have a franchise center for a decade to build around.

We played Marbury 45 minutes a game and might be able to add a wing player that can make the rotation. But I can always take solace in those games we won in March. They were all so exciting.

I'm so glad we are under new management. ITs had such a huge impact
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
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tomverve
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5/25/2005  7:30 AM
I hear what you're saying-- and I was rooting for a tank as much as anyone-- but even if we did finish below Milwaukee, our odds would only have jumped from 3% to 6%, not exactly an earth shattering gain. And this is definitely something that should only be evaluated in terms of the percentage gain in probability, and not by today's hindsight with the results in place. Hopefully I don't need to explain why that's the case. It is tempting to critique based on hindsight, but ultimately it's just sloppy thinking.
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fishmike
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5/25/2005  7:53 AM
its not sloppy thinking. The simple fact is with no chance of a real playoff run and a lousy shot of making the playoffs the Bucks played young guys, rested their star and planned for the future. They did what we NEVER do, and thats gave themselves a shot at franchise talent. Even if they dont win they have a good idea what Zaza Pachulia and Gadzurich can give them. They did EXACTLY what the Knicks never do. Now the Knicks will go on with their great super successful patern while the Bucks have franchise talent to build around.

There is NO positive spin on Jackie Butler getting ZERO minutes, Ariza getting a DNP and our only franchise player in MArbury playing 40+ minutes when the team is totally out of contention. Its bad management. THATS the sloppy thinking going on here.

All I have ever asked is one of these years when the team is out of the race play the kids and just give yourself 1 chance to win a shot a franchise talent.

If the Knicks played Ariza, Sweetney, Butler and Bruno down the stretch to see what they have and didnt win the lottery no problem. We did the right thing, lets get ready for the draft and FA.

This management and ownership sucks, and last night was just another example of their ineptitude staring themselves in the face while another team with half a brain got "lucky"
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
SKY
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5/25/2005  8:12 AM
Posted by fishmike:

its not sloppy thinking. The simple fact is with no chance of a real playoff run and a lousy shot of making the playoffs the Bucks played young guys, rested their star and planned for the future. They did what we NEVER do, and thats gave themselves a shot at franchise talent. Even if they dont win they have a good idea what Zaza Pachulia and Gadzurich can give them. They did EXACTLY what the Knicks never do. Now the Knicks will go on with their great super successful patern while the Bucks have franchise talent to build around.

There is NO positive spin on Jackie Butler getting ZERO minutes, Ariza getting a DNP and our only franchise player in MArbury playing 40+ minutes when the team is totally out of contention. Its bad management. THATS the sloppy thinking going on here.

All I have ever asked is one of these years when the team is out of the race play the kids and just give yourself 1 chance to win a shot a franchise talent.

If the Knicks played Ariza, Sweetney, Butler and Bruno down the stretch to see what they have and didnt win the lottery no problem. We did the right thing, lets get ready for the draft and FA.

This management and ownership sucks, and last night was just another example of their ineptitude staring themselves in the face while another team with half a brain got "lucky"

welcome to the world of NY Knicks....

seriously, i hear you and i do agree with you 100%. but at some point during the last leg of the season, i lost my enthusiasm and loyalty towards this pathetic franchise. now, i'm just observing what the management might do to turn this mess around (or make it worse!) without emotional attachment. I haven't given up on them, but i don't see any reason why i should invest much of my time/heart/$$$ for this worst sport franchise ever...
diderotn
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5/25/2005  8:24 AM
I am getting close to feel exactly like you do..I am sick and tired of poor management in N.Y. It seems like our GMs are too affraid of how the fans will feel if they make a move. As a GM, you can't afford to try to please everyone...Isiah needs to start thinking with that frame of mind. Forget about the fans, do what is right. Trade all of the croppy assets that we have right now, hire a good coach and draft talented young men that can be trained to represent this franchise. One thing is for sure, we don't need none of the hair braded, tatooed out, substance abuse, type of players in N.Y.
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Marv
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5/25/2005  8:35 AM
Posted by diderotn:

One thing is for sure, we don't need none of the hair braded, tatooed out, substance abuse, type of players in N.Y.

C'mon man, braided hair and tatoos are a style, they're not a condemnation. I'll take Rip, Big Ben, Haslem, etc. anyday. Have you checked out what Chris Andersen looks like lately, and plenty of people want him on the Knicks.
TMS
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5/25/2005  9:32 AM
hey guys, stop complaining...it's more important to be ethical & preserve the spirit of competition than to make moves to help your future...didn't they teach you that in Sports fans ethics 101?
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eViL
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5/25/2005  9:46 AM
Oh well, we didn't win the lottery. I'm not going to cry over it. Charlotte tanked and they fell back 2 spots. So did Utah. That's just the way things work sometimes.
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TMS
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5/25/2005  9:55 AM
Posted by eViL:

Oh well, we didn't win the lottery. I'm not going to cry over it. Charlotte tanked and they fell back 2 spots. So did Utah. That's just the way things work sometimes.

Charlotte & Utah still have better picks than the Knicks, don't they?
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
eViL
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5/25/2005  10:04 AM
Yeah, do you think Utah fans are crying that they should have won four more games to get that six spot so they could make the jump to number 1?
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knicks1248
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5/25/2005  10:12 AM
Whats the difference, if you do your homework you can still pick up a bonifide star. And at this rate I would package my 2 picks and and aquire maggete or brand.
ES
TMS
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5/25/2005  10:20 AM
Posted by eViL:

Yeah, do you think Utah fans are crying that they should have won four more games to get that six spot so they could make the jump to number 1?

gimme a break already...you're going to sit here & tell me it was a GOOD thing that the Knicks won those last few meaningless games last year which gave us LESS of a chance to get a better lottery position? when the Knicks end up taking the next Mike Sweetney in the draft & watching guys like Dwayne Wade & Lebron James tear it up in the NBA, let me see you not cry about it...don't get on my back for complaining about the current sad situation this team is in as if i'm being a monday morning QB because i said at the beginning of the season that the worst possible outcome this year would be to miss out on the playoffs & end up w/a lottery pick in the #7-#10 range...that's exactly what happened, so excuse me for being a little pissed off about it.
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diderotn
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5/25/2005  10:25 AM
For crying out loud, after we found out that we weren't going to make the playoffs, it was senseless to try to win any danm way, especially because the youngins didn't get much burns. I don't care what any of you have to say about the last few games, because we could have lost our franchise player and risking a crucial injury to Kurt which would have made him more untradeable. It was a dumb decision, and you all know it.
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knicks1248
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5/25/2005  10:41 AM
So what now??? trade them or keep the picks. According to most of you, we mind as well not even have a draft picks unless there in the top three, which is dumb and ridiculous
ES
eViL
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5/25/2005  10:42 AM
gimme a break already...you're going to sit here & tell me it was a GOOD thing that the Knicks won those last few meaningless games last year which gave us LESS of a chance to get a better lottery position? when the Knicks end up taking the next Mike Sweetney in the draft & watching guys like Dwayne Wade & Lebron James tear it up in the NBA, let me see you not cry about it...don't get on my back for complaining about the current sad situation this team is in as if i'm being a monday morning QB because i said at the beginning of the season that the worst possible outcome this year would be to miss out on the playoffs & end up w/a lottery pick in the #7-#10 range...that's exactly what happened, so excuse me for being a little pissed off about it.

I'm not getting on anyones back. We all just have different ways of dealing with disappointment.

[Edited by - eViL on 05/25/2005 10:46:24]
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Cookdcokehop
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5/25/2005  10:48 AM
Can yall stop btchin about the past a move on. There isnt a Lebron or Dwight Howard in this draft n e way. Plus we got to f'n picks with a chance to get another one from Memphis. Bogut was not gonna change our franchise and thats the truth
TMS
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5/25/2005  10:53 AM
Posted by knicks1248:

So what now??? trade them or keep the picks. According to most of you, we mind as well not even have a draft picks unless there in the top three, which is dumb and ridiculous

haven't heard anyone say that, let's not be stupid in our overexaggerations...what would i do w/that #8 pick now? it all depends...if there's a chance Greene will be there, i say keep it & hope for the best...if not, i say try to package the #8 w/the #30 to move up a couple spots if you can...if that's not feasible, i'd consider trading down to get 2 picks in the mid teens, but i don't see any team willing to give up 2 picks for a #8 in this draft.

basically, unless Isiah makes an incredible pick or a blockbuster trade, we're going to have another Mike Sweetney situation develop here...a mediocre prospect not getting as much playing time as he should for the next couple years while this team flounders to yet another crappy season of missing out on the playoffs & ending up w/more #8 type lottery picks to add to our growing collection...oh joy.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
knicks1248
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5/25/2005  10:58 AM
Posted by TMS:
Posted by knicks1248:

So what now??? trade them or keep the picks. According to most of you, we mind as well not even have a draft picks unless there in the top three, which is dumb and ridiculous

haven't heard anyone say that, let's not be stupid in our overexaggerations...what would i do w/that #8 pick now? it all depends...if there's a chance Greene will be there, i say keep it & hope for the best...if not, i say try to package the #8 w/the #30 to move up a couple spots if you can...if that's not feasible, i'd consider trading down to get 2 picks in the mid teens, but i don't see any team willing to give up 2 picks for a #8 in this draft.

basically, unless Isiah makes an incredible pick or a blockbuster trade, we're going to have another Mike Sweetney situation develop here...a mediocre prospect not getting as much playing time as he should for the next couple years while this team flounders to yet another crappy season of missing out on the playoffs & ending up w/more #8 type lottery picks to add to our growing collection...oh joy.

Throw in the fact that if herb is still coaching, were a sure lock to repeat this never ending saga.
ES
Bonn1997
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5/25/2005  11:00 AM
The premise of this thread is wrong because the Bucks did not rest Redd. He played similar minutes (okay two less minutes) per game in April as he did during the rest of the season. It was still less minutes than Marbury got and I would have liked to see Marbury's minutes reduced, but there's no evidence that the Bucks rested Redd once they were eliminated. He missed a few games due to injury, but he played similar mpg in April as he did throughout the rest of the year. That's generally true for all the teams' top players in the lottery too. I don't buy the claim that everyone bad team (or even just some bad teams) but the Knicks are tanking.

[Edited by - Bonn1997 on 05/25/2005 11:05:47]
fishmike
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5/25/2005  11:13 AM
why didnt he play through the injury? It was mild knee sprain. MArbury played through it.... to the tune of 40+ minutes a night. If the Bucks were in the playoffs or a real race he would have been on the floor. Thats resting him.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
hey... we were neck and neck with Milw with 4 weeks left to go

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