Posted by Nalod:

I don't care that he can't "isolate" cause we got two guards that play the whole game that does this.

Don't go there. The Knicks have to compete with the rest of the league. No way does Ariza need to dominate the ball liek Allan Houston used to.

Take a look at the list of youngins I listed in the first post.

Lebron James?
Carmelo Anthony?
Josh Smith?
Josh Childress?
Andre Igudola(sp?)
Andres Nocioni?
Luol Deng?
Marquis Daniels?
Tashawn Prince?
Josh Howard?
Gerald Wallace?
Luke Walton?
Mike Dunleavy?
Mike Pietrus?

All these kids have better ball handling skills than Ariza and they can actually score the ball without a clear path to the basket.

It's not about crossover dribbles. It's about making something happen if you have the ball in your hand. If Ariza has the ball too far out he always looks to pass if he is not wide open because he can't do anything with it. Every time he drives to the hoop....if he doesn't have a clear dunk he always manages to throw up some crazy shot that has no chance in hell to go in. He needs to learn how to score the ball. It all starts with his ball handling.

Posted by MS:

Trevor isn't in the same class with any of those players yet, but he makes up for his weaknesses by hustling which is something other players don't do.....

Anyone who wants to resign TT please leave the site know, because u know nothing about the game....

Ariza has a good nose to find the ball, i see him as a 16 and 9 player down the road, who will eventually play defense....and i love the fact that it took isiah till the end of the season to finally work with trevor, what a snake......

He has a similiar IQ to crawford basketball wise which shows just how behind Jamaal is (he is garbage) but he hustles to get back into plays........his time will come

If you have to train someone to be an all-star your team sucks. Period. (yuck!)

Just look at all the championship contenders. They all can go 12 deep if they had to. If the Knicks lost Marbs they would be the worst team in the league.

Don't even talk West coast teams.....look at Detroit. They lost Rasheed Wallace last night with a precautionary injury. Mc Dyess just gets more minutes in his stead and they don't miss a beat. The other day Chancey was in foul trouble and Carlos Arroyo steps in and runs the team well to a victory. They got guys like Ronal Dupree that come off the bench that could easily start on the Knicks.

Look at what Indiana has done. Everything that could go wrong does yet they still had enough depth to continue to win. They were a team that didn't have enough player to suit up for a good stretch of games.

If you wanna get silly....look at any championship contender. Their bench probably could beat the Knicks in a 7 game series!


The Knicks have to get better. It's not even about coaching. Give any coach some talent and they can win.

How good is Ariza? How good is Crawford? How good is Marbs? How good is KT? How good is Sweets?

The answer can be found in the question.....How bad are the Knicks?

Posted by Silverfuel:

good thread. I like reading what most people think of this guy. IMO, we need one more year to figure out what caliber Ariza is.

Posted by EnySpree:

Posted by Nalod:

I don't care that he can't "isolate" cause we got two guards that play the whole game that does this.

Don't go there. The Knicks have to compete with the rest of the league. No way does Ariza need to dominate the ball liek Allan Houston used to.

Take a look at the list of youngins I listed in the first post.

Lebron James?
Carmelo Anthony?
Josh Smith?
Josh Childress?
Andre Igudola(sp?)
Andres Nocioni?
Luol Deng?
Marquis Daniels?
Tashawn Prince?
Josh Howard?
Gerald Wallace?
Luke Walton?
Mike Dunleavy?
Mike Pietrus?

All these kids have better ball handling skills than Ariza and they can actually score the ball without a clear path to the basket.

It's not about crossover dribbles. It's about making something happen if you have the ball in your hand. If Ariza has the ball too far out he always looks to pass if he is not wide open because he can't do anything with it. Every time he drives to the hoop....if he doesn't have a clear dunk he always manages to throw up some crazy shot that has no chance in hell to go in. He needs to learn how to score the ball. It all starts with his ball handling.

I dissagree, first of all, Lebron does not belong in this class, he is a freak and a exception to the rule. Melo is just more seasoned, period. Most of the rest are a bit older than ariza who won't turn 20 until late june. Nocioni is 25 already, pietrus is 22, Daniels is 23 or 24 I think, Prince, Howard, deng, wallace, Dunleavy are still at least two years ariza's senior. Howard is about 23 or 24 also.. Luke walton is a bum.... anyway these guys are a bit older than Ariza. As far as handling the ball, Josh smith probably has the worst handle not only of this bunch, but in the NBA, watch the hawks games and soon as he has the ball the announcers are almost screaming for him to pass the ball to a guard to bring it up....

A lot of these guys are a bit older than ariza and their games more seasoned, but I will argue that not many and we will exclude Lebron and melo, have a higher upside than ariza. Ariza has a lot to work on as expected, but already he has shown a basketb IQ that is above most on this list, and a well rounded game that a lot on this list have not shown.... I like ariza,I also like gerald wallace, but I think wallace will be more of a role player than ariza, who has a real shot of being a good starter. Josh Howard and Daniels are two fantastic ball players, right now they are better than your whole list of course with the excetption of James.. call me crazy but I will take Josh Howard over melos fat ass. Howard can rebound like crazy, score and defend, a heck of a all around ball player..

Posted by EnySpree:

I tried to take most of the young guys in the league that Ariza will be going up against throughout his career.

I do agree that Ariza has the biggest upside because he is suceeding right now off of intinct and his rubbery legs.

Just using all those young guys as an example you can put a shelf life on where Ariza should be ready to compete every night against them as a starter. I say the Knicks have 2 more seasons before he is ready.

So what do the Knicks do in the meantime? They need some real championship depth. Waiting for one player to reach his potential is a terrible way to run a franchise. Once that injury bug shows it's head the whole season is shot.