right now we are in spot 7. with 9 games left, looking at things within reason--we can finish as low as 6 or as high as 11. I don't need to go over the differnce between pick 6 and pick 11 because the detrimants are very high. This is a high stakes game now, thats why you see teams like the Bucks start taking Mike Redd out of their line up like last night, just enough to get them an L when they couldve won the game. the bottom 5 teams are set, from their patter of play and who they are using, theyll be litle chancge there. GS is trying to win because they already have several young players and they are selling a GREAt deal of hope. Right now, even if we won 6 out of 9, it represents little, arguably it represents nothing at all, because at the end of the season, its likely we will play the last 4 games that have 0 revelance. its very imperative we faulter down the stretch. i dont care about a little short term BS, I care about the long term good of the team. Put Marbury on the IR for the lasy 5 with ankle tendinitis, that would be a big help, along with starting sundov and jackson:>)

The way we are going right now, I'm not too concerened about winning games. We snapped, what, the 8 game losing streaks of 3 seperate (and awful) teams? I think this team can make it to pick 6, and hopefully they will. The lottery odds are significantly better for 6 then 8.

TT's defense is one of the main reason this team is so awful. As long as he isn't hitting 80% of his threes like he was right after the all-star break, I have a feeling he'll keep helping the draft cause. I hope we stay at 6 or 7. The Toronto game at MSG is gonna be HUGE. Both teams will probably be handing the ball back and forth, not wanting to score...

Posted by crzymdups:

TT's defense is one of the main reason this team is so awful. As long as he isn't hitting 80% of his threes like he was right after the all-star break, I have a feeling he'll keep helping the draft cause. I hope we stay at 6 or 7. The Toronto game at MSG is gonna be HUGE. Both teams will probably be handing the ball back and forth, not wanting to score...

We have tried to win. if we do not see sundov, butler, more ariza jackson quite a bit, and Crawford and Marbury are playing 40 minutes--it tells you something.

Toronto just loss Donyell for the season, Milwauke doesnt look like it will play Redd to much, LA Lakers are now in full tank mode with kobe gone orlando has no grant hill, we must follow the pecking order like what Portland has done. Remove Marbury and limit other gut like TT and KT[who are both hurt anyway] and give Sundov Jackson Butler PT.
You know if Butler goes off and has 14 pts and 9 rebounds in 28 minutes and we win fine, but i could care less if KT does it!

right now this could be a defining little play for the next several years, this is as important as anything that has happened all year, we need desperately to lose.

your blinding us with the obvious. Has Knick management, this or past years EVERY done things with the future in mind?

Its scary... it really is. The only spoiler role we will be playing is spoiling our own future, yet MSG will sell it like winning our games counts for something.

Its another test for ISiah, because he can call Herb and tell him to play the kids. Instead Herb will push them to win in hopes of landing a HC job next year because he knows it prob wont be here.

i don't think its worth making that big a deal out of it. Its clear the starters like steph, craw, tt, kt are not playing as hard as they were after the break. They're all getting 40mins a game and we lose virtually every game and even the close games marbury will find a way to lose it or crawford will hoist up a ridiculous 3 or TT or KT will brick a last second shot.

The only negative is that sweetney, ariza & butler are getting no playing time which will hurt them again next year. But if tanking is what you want then thats what you're getting.

I personally want the knicks to play the young guys and if they play well and we win then all the better. At least I'll feel good about this team next year. I don't think we'll win either way so bogut, green, taft are still intact!

Posted by fishmike:

Guns.. If Butler puts up 13 points, 7 rebs and 1.5 blocks in 25 minutes shooting 55% doesnt that affect how you view him this offseason?

This is the planning I'm talking about

exactly..thats what I said. i would rather us play the young guys and if we win with them getting major minutes then all the better. But getting embarrassed every night with KT, Marbury, Crawford & TT playing 40mins is very discouraging especially if we don't get lucky in the draft. i rather get lucky in the draft and see good things out of the youngsters.

I think that Bogut is good but, i don't know if he is the impact allstar player we are looking for, i wouldn't be opposed to trading down a few spots if we won the lottery in order to get another player.....

Posted by Bonn1997:

Posted by fishmike:

your blinding us with the obvious. Has Knick management, this or past years EVERY done things with the future in mind?

Marbury (at 26) and Crawford (at 24) trades didn't have the future in mind?

[Edited by - Bonn1997 on 04/07/2005 12:15:50]

good point. although it hasn't worked out as planned some of these moves were made with the future in mind which goes to show that Isiah is not Layden.

Posted by nyk4ever:

Posted by Bonn1997:

Posted by fishmike:

your blinding us with the obvious. Has Knick management, this or past years EVERY done things with the future in mind?

Marbury (at 26) and Crawford (at 24) trades didn't have the future in mind?

[Edited by - Bonn1997 on 04/07/2005 12:15:50]

Good points guys. I think Malk Rose was a move for the future too becuase obviously he wasnt brought in as guy to win this year, he was brought in so that when they do acquire the post prescence that they need, Malik would be the perfect guy to do all the dirty things and bring the championship attitude to the team. Theres no disputing that either, Malik Rose is known around the league as a winning player. If Isiah acquired Webber at the trade deadline then I would be able to see your point as totally giving up the future for a win-now attitude but he stayed away from that and acquired Mo T, who as of right now is his only-mistake BUT its hardly one. The money doesnt matter and obviously him taking playing-time away from the youngsters doesnt matter either since Herb isnt playing the youngsters. Mo T. will be a excellent 2nd unit player for this team once the whole picture comes together.

You do realize that malik rose will be 31 next year and mo taylor 29--those arent spring chickens in nBA years

marbury and TT will also be 29 next year. thats not exactly young --thats not rebuilding, they have alwasy been trying to win now. you dont spend that type of money if you arent trying to win now.
some of have questioned if we went overboard with the marbury thing when we ned to really blow it up and rebuild because we did not think we could put a team around marbury fast enough. 29s not old, but it sure isnt nBA young. they have to get their sht together quick

Posted by BRIGGS:

Posted by nyk4ever:

Posted by Bonn1997:

Posted by fishmike:

your blinding us with the obvious. Has Knick management, this or past years EVERY done things with the future in mind?

Marbury (at 26) and Crawford (at 24) trades didn't have the future in mind?


[Edited by - Bonn1997 on 04/07/2005 12:15:50]

Good points guys. I think Malk Rose was a move for the future too becuase obviously he wasnt brought in as guy to win this year, he was brought in so that when they do acquire the post prescence that they need, Malik would be the perfect guy to do all the dirty things and bring the championship attitude to the team. Theres no disputing that either, Malik Rose is known around the league as a winning player. If Isiah acquired Webber at the trade deadline then I would be able to see your point as totally giving up the future for a win-now attitude but he stayed away from that and acquired Mo T, who as of right now is his only-mistake BUT its hardly one. The money doesnt matter and obviously him taking playing-time away from the youngsters doesnt matter either since Herb isnt playing the youngsters. Mo T. will be a excellent 2nd unit player for this team once the whole picture comes together.

You do realize that malik rose will be 31 next year and mo taylor 29--those arent spring chickens in nBA years

marbury and TT will also be 29 next year. thats not exactly young --thats not rebuilding, they have alwasy been trying to win now. you dont spend that type of money if you arent trying to win now.
some of have questioned if we went overboard with the marbury thing when we ned to really blow it up and rebuild because we did not think we could put a team around marbury fast enough. 29s not old, but it sure isnt nBA young. they have to get their sht together quick

Briggs, so when you say moves are made for the future you are limiting it to only players that are under 25 years old? I think you'd agree that Malik Rose is not a player a team acquires at the deadline that puts them into championship play or even playoff contention, he's a intagibles player and someone that Isiah saw fitting into his still incomplete plan (notice its incomplete becuase he's been here for ONLY 15 months and has had only one draft and in that draft he drafted in the middle of the second round.) Maurice Taylor is a bench player and is still a bench player on the Knicks, if he was someone brought to the team to win now he'd be starting, not riding the pine. He's also not taking away ANY playing time for the Sweetneys, Arizas, Butlers either because Herb isnt playing Sweetney more then 20 minutes a game and he's a starter. Malik and Maurice were pieces for the FUTURE, as PIECES of Isiahs plan, along with the 1st rounders, not for right now.

[Edited by - nyk4ever on 04/07/2005 12:44:52]