[ IMAGES: Images ON turn off | ACCOUNT: User Status is LOCKED why? ]

isiah's saying the right things, are you still mad at him now?
Forum Index  ›  NY Knicks Forum
Page 1 of 2  1  2 Next ›
« Reply To Topic
Author Thread
djsunyc
Posts: 44929
Alba Posts: 42
Joined: 1/16/2004
Member: #536
2/10/2005  9:37 AM
Isiah sets table for rebuilding

BY DARREN EVERSON
DAILY NEWS SPORTS WRITER

Knick fans probably don't want to hear it, but Isiah Thomas is saying it: the Knicks are in for a long ... slow ... tedious rebuilding process.

Speaking at the Garden last night before yet another loss, Thomas further braced the public for a painful retooling period. The Knicks president echoed James Dolan's plea for patience last week, and he hinted at the mess he inherited from Scott Layden.

"At some point in time we want to be playing for the NBA championship," said Thomas, who also reiterated his intention to remain solely in the front office, not to coach the team. "That's going to be a long, slow, tedious process. It took a long time to get in this spot that we find ourselves in today."

In saying that, Thomas seemed to be laying much of the blame for the Knicks' current condition on the preceding administration. "When I took the job," Thomas said, "none of you said we were going to turn it around in 11 months or 13 months."

But the roster already has been turned over almost entirely under Thomas. Only three players remain from previous regimes: Allan Houston, Kurt Thomas and Mike Sweetney. Although Isiah inherited salary-cap problems when he arrived, his acquisitions since may further limit the Knicks.

"There's nothing I can do about the numbers; there's nothing you can do about the numbers," Thomas said. "However, at the end of the day, we still found a way to get a (Stephon) Marbury at 27, to get a (Jamal) Crawford at 24 and a (Trevor) Ariza at 19. And you've got a Sweetney at 22. We got a (Nazr) Mohammed at 27. You've got Tim Thomas, who's probably having the worst year of his basketball life."

But then, the Knicks (19-30) are in the midst of an awful year themselves. Thomas insisted there is no quick fix.

"What I've got to do this summer - and I don't know if I can do it - but you've still got to try to find a way to work within this system to try to acquire some younger players," Thomas said. "New York has always been in a mode of robbing Peter to pay Paul. But at some time you've got to stop and you've got to absorb some pain."

That said, Thomas still wants to make the playoffs. Although a high lottery pick could be more valuable than another first-round flameout, Thomas said he would prefer to gain postseason experience than bank on the bounce of a Ping-Pong ball.

At the moment, of course, the playoffs aren't an issue. But to Thomas, neither is the Knicks' effort.

"I'm definitely disappointed in our record," said Thomas. "However, I'm not disappointed in the effort."

isn't this what all fans that wanted the rebuilding process wanted to hear? no more talk of playoffs. just an ultimate goal of getting to the championship while taking a long slow process.

if isiah did make a mistake last year, at least he's put himself in a position to get out of it.
AUTOADVERT
TMS
Posts: 60684
Alba Posts: 617
Joined: 5/11/2004
Member: #674
USA
2/10/2005  10:15 AM
i don't this this means he'd pass up the chance to trade for a guy that he thinks can really help this team win now, like he went after Vince Carter this year who has big dollars attached to him...i just hope you all don't get the automatic impression that he's resigned himself to letting these big contracts come off the books & build up from the draft, because i think he is still open to making a trade to get us a player that can bring the current team to another level...i just think he's trying to temper fans' expectations for this team as he's said from day one that it's a process to put together a championship calibre team...as long as that's the 1 & only goal & not just to sell tickets, then i think Isiah deserves everyone's patience for the time being until we can better judge a year from now on the progress of his moves up to that point.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
fishmike
Posts: 53867
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 7/19/2002
Member: #298
USA
2/10/2005  10:27 AM
Isiah is fulla crap.. you have no idea what to believe. Its not what he says its what he does. If KT is still here and playing 40 minutes a night after the deadline than maybe we have our answer.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Nalod
Posts: 71376
Alba Posts: 155
Joined: 12/24/2003
Member: #508
USA
2/10/2005  2:11 PM
If he wastrying to steal vince, ok, I was ok with that . He was trying to get damp, but ok, I guess in both instances he put a cap on how far he was willing to go.

TMS, sounds like your not ready to go into a slow painful process? sure he'll try to make a steal, as he should.

I am glad these boys in the garden are at least not in denial anymore.

First rule is to always blame the previous admin for current problems! It buys you time.

Isiah's big failure so far has been the Chaney/wilkens thing, and the belief you can exchange more expensive underperforming idiots, treat them with respect, and think they will come around as a unit.

It may take a while, and it still may come together late this season.

If you don't got wins, you gotta have hope!
TMS
Posts: 60684
Alba Posts: 617
Joined: 5/11/2004
Member: #674
USA
2/10/2005  2:17 PM
no, i didn't mean to infer that at all...i'm just not buying into this concept that the Knicks are resigned to rebuilding from scratch now...they are owned by Cablevision & they will always be looking at the bottomline, which is profits...i still think if Isiah has a chance to go after a Vince Carter type player who's worn out his welcome someplace else but is still relatively young but w/a big contract, he'd go for it...that's not wishful thinking on my part, just realistic in my view.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
crzymdups
Posts: 52018
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 5/1/2004
Member: #671
USA
2/10/2005  2:18 PM
Posted by fishmike:

Isiah is fulla crap.. you have no idea what to believe. Its not what he says its what he does. If KT is still here and playing 40 minutes a night after the deadline than maybe we have our answer.

The only thing about our burning desire to trade Kurt to San Antonio is the Cliff Robinson thing puts a dent in our plan. As does the Nazr injury, to some extent. But, if Malone retires and Cliff Rob goes to the Nets or Wolves, then San Ant may want Kurt after all.
¿ △ ?
fishmike
Posts: 53867
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 7/19/2002
Member: #298
USA
2/10/2005  2:21 PM
I just think Isiah is hedging his position. Its very hard to tell just how long this will take. God forbid we get lucky, land a guy like Bogut and sign a solid MLE frontcourt player. with Marbury, Crawford and Ariza already playing well we could be back in playoff contention very quickly. If we get the #8 pick, not a lot of guys come out and its tough to land a good young player via FA its tough.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Bonn1997
Posts: 58654
Alba Posts: 2
Joined: 2/2/2004
Member: #581
USA
2/10/2005  2:40 PM
God forbid we get lucky, land a guy like Bogut and sign a solid MLE frontcourt player. with Marbury, Crawford and Ariza already playing well we could be back in playoff contention very quickly.
Or God forbid we get 2 more stars at Marbury's level over the next two years via the same approach we used to getting Marbury and get some nice role players with the draft and MLE
Nalod
Posts: 71376
Alba Posts: 155
Joined: 12/24/2003
Member: #508
USA
2/10/2005  3:17 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:
God forbid we get lucky, land a guy like Bogut and sign a solid MLE frontcourt player. with Marbury, Crawford and Ariza already playing well we could be back in playoff contention very quickly.
Or God forbid we get 2 more stars at Marbury's level over the next two years via the same approach we used to getting Marbury and get some nice role players with the draft and MLE

RainMan Speak.

Give us an example? TT, Anfernee and a no 1 for Vince and Jaelen? Still no big.

TT for Stro in sign and trade?

Prove me an idiot with 2 good examples of your theory and lets see how it flies. Proving me an idiot must be tempting! Still got to prove it.

KT and TT for Miles and SAR? I like SAR, put we really need miles? Reezy is a far better prospect. Than MIles. What else, Malik Rose? We need a small PF? KT is more valuable to us, and in the right situation.

I you situation might not happen for 12 months, not until a good portion of the season is done, then those expiring can be good, only if you willing to take on a ton of contract in return.
fishmike
Posts: 53867
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 7/19/2002
Member: #298
USA
2/10/2005  3:23 PM
agree w/ Nalod on this. The Marbury trade happened because we had Ward w/ his immediate buy out to go w/ McDyess's contract ending at the end of THAT year and we still had to take on about $40mm of total uselessness (Penny) to make that trade. It also cost us 2 picks and 2 prospects. Maybe not great ones but it did regardless.

A more realistic option would this time next year trading Penny for Jalen Rose and Tor's #1 pick as it would free enough cap space to sign an almost max FA (or trade for a player making max $$) before they have to extend Bosh.

The expiring contract thing isnt really an asset that does anything for us until this time next year, and even then its suspect
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Allanfan20
Posts: 35947
Alba Posts: 50
Joined: 1/16/2004
Member: #542
USA
2/10/2005  3:40 PM
I agree. We got lucky in the Marbury trade only b/c Lampe and Milos could very well turn out to be not much. In most other scenarios, the other teams would be asking for expiring contracts, plus Sweetney AND Ariza. We are MUUUUUUUUCH better off going on the pace we are this year, and hitting gold in the draft, and then going for role players via trades and MLE signings.

If I were to choose a route, it would be to just look to trade KT and Nazr for picks or younger players (Which can happen) and possibly letting TT and Penny or at least just one of them, run off the books.
“Whenever I’m about to do something, I think ‘Would an idiot do that?’ and if they would, I do NOT do that thing.”- Dwight Schrute
Bonn1997
Posts: 58654
Alba Posts: 2
Joined: 2/2/2004
Member: #581
USA
2/10/2005  3:42 PM
Posted by Nalod:
Posted by Bonn1997:
God forbid we get lucky, land a guy like Bogut and sign a solid MLE frontcourt player. with Marbury, Crawford and Ariza already playing well we could be back in playoff contention very quickly.
Or God forbid we get 2 more stars at Marbury's level over the next two years via the same approach we used to getting Marbury and get some nice role players with the draft and MLE

RainMan Speak.

Give us an example? TT, Anfernee and a no 1 for Vince and Jaelen? Still no big.

TT for Stro in sign and trade?

Prove me an idiot with 2 good examples of your theory and lets see how it flies. Proving me an idiot must be tempting! Still got to prove it.

KT and TT for Miles and SAR? I like SAR, put we really need miles? Reezy is a far better prospect. Than MIles. What else, Malik Rose? We need a small PF? KT is more valuable to us, and in the right situation.

I you situation might not happen for 12 months, not until a good portion of the season is done, then those expiring can be good, only if you willing to take on a ton of contract in return.
I gave examples in other threads. I'm not gonna repeat myself (again). Sorry buddy
Nalod
Posts: 71376
Alba Posts: 155
Joined: 12/24/2003
Member: #508
USA
2/10/2005  3:51 PM
[I gave examples in other threads. I'm not gonna repeat myself (again). Sorry buddy

RainMan! Thanks for admitting you repeat yourself (again).
Bonn1997
Posts: 58654
Alba Posts: 2
Joined: 2/2/2004
Member: #581
USA
2/10/2005  3:59 PM
Posted by Nalod:
[I gave examples in other threads. I'm not gonna repeat myself (again). Sorry buddy

RainMan! Thanks for admitting you repeat yourself (again).
No problem, RainWoman! I have to repeat myself a few times for the slow people like you.
newyorknewyork
Posts: 30169
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 1/16/2004
Member: #541
2/10/2005  4:17 PM
They should put more emphasis on trying to turn Sweetney into the frontcourt stud they need.

I have no problem with going after a young player with a big contract if he is talented. A deal like Washington got for Jaimison wouldn't bother me at all.

Our #6pick, JYD, & Houston's 2nd rd for Al Harrington at the draft would be cool with me.

ATL can draft Chris Paul, Gerald Green, resign Walker for the Mid level, And overpay for Curry, Chandler, Dalembert, Kwame Brown, Illgauskas.
https://vote.nba.com/en Vote for your Knicks.
fishmike
Posts: 53867
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 7/19/2002
Member: #298
USA
2/10/2005  4:30 PM
It would be huge to put a do-all forward like Jamison, or your example of Harrington next to Marbury.

If we cant signing Walker to the full MLE (if he would) would be killer.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
islesfan
Posts: 9999
Alba Posts: 37
Joined: 7/19/2004
Member: #712
2/10/2005  8:40 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:
God forbid we get lucky, land a guy like Bogut and sign a solid MLE frontcourt player. with Marbury, Crawford and Ariza already playing well we could be back in playoff contention very quickly.
Or God forbid we get 2 more stars at Marbury's level over the next two years via the same approach we used to getting Marbury and get some nice role players with the draft and MLE

Same approach? Ok, so that'll be 4 more first round picks, 4 young players, taking back about $240MM in contracts and give up $30 million in expiring contracts. Is that it?

If rebuilding was Isiah's plan all along like he's pretending then why has he made the moves that he's made? Why trade away multiple first rd picks? Why decide to build around a 28 yr old PG when you don't plan on being in contention for another 3-4 years? Why sign Vin Baker when he could have signed a young player with potential for the MLE? Why tell us that you can't rebuild in NY and then a year later tell us that that's what he's been doing all along?

Fishfike and I finally agree on something. Isiah is full of crap and we'll believe this rebuilding talk when we see it. Too bad he set us back another couple of years. It's a good thing he can keep blaming Layden and you people will keep eating it up. Funny how Layden was at fault for his moves but Dolan is at fault for forcing Isiah to make certain moves.
If it didn’t work in Phoenix with Nash and Stoutamire... it’s just not a winning formula. It’s an entertaining formula, but not a winning one. - Derek Harper talking about D'Antoni's System
KNICKSdom
Posts: 20799
Alba Posts: 8
Joined: 1/17/2004
Member: #545
USA
2/10/2005  10:05 PM
Isiah is the messiah and prophet. Don't drag his name in the mud. Remember he said no more "robbing Peter to pay Paul". This whole mess is really Tim Thomas' fault.
Knicks are happening and have a Unicorn.
Nalod
Posts: 71376
Alba Posts: 155
Joined: 12/24/2003
Member: #508
USA
2/10/2005  11:07 PM
Posted by KNICKSdom:

Isiah is the messiah and prophet. Don't drag his name in the mud. Remember he said no more "robbing Peter to pay Paul". This whole mess is really Tim Thomas' fault.

It is "Paul" Laydens fault.
Nalod
Posts: 71376
Alba Posts: 155
Joined: 12/24/2003
Member: #508
USA
2/10/2005  11:13 PM
No problem, RainWoman! I have to repeat myself a few times for the slow people like you.

.

RainWomen? Im Slow? Do you know who RainMan was?
Page 1 of 2  1  2 Next ›
« Reply To Topic
isiah's saying the right things, are you still mad at him now?
Forum Index  ›  NY Knicks Forum

©2001-2025 ultimateknicks.comm All rights reserved. About Us.
This site is not affiliated with the NY Knicks or the National Basketball Association in any way.
You may visit the official NY Knicks web site by clicking here.

All times (GMT-05:00) Eastern Time.

Terms of Use and Privacy Policy