Grimes looks solid but I need a larger sample size. How else is he impacting the game when his shot isn’t falling besides defense? Right now he’s a shooter off the bench in long term but again I’m liking what I’m seeing.

If Randle is a locker room cancer you HAVE to move him. Luckily I think there is a salary dump trade available but there’s no rehabbing someone who is in **** mental state and is ****ing up other peoples development.

The only core pieces I know for sure we have is RJ IQ and Mitch. Proper NBA starters/contributors.

To me there is some really bad and some really good.

The really bad is we had max cap space and the FO failed to upgrade the team. I wanted Derozan, Norm Powell, Lowry or Mike Conley. I wanted an impact veteran, not a bunch of role players but they have yet to ask me to run the team so there's the BAD

The GOOD is REALLY good, because its GOOD we have not seen here in 2 decades.

This is the 2nd year in a row our FO has drafted rotation players, AND our (doesnt play rookies) head coach has found them meaningful roles in the rotation, AND they are clearly developing. That is wonderful and to me could be what really turns this franchise around.

Obi was lottery pick so there are some expectations there but IQ was not and both played meaning roles as rookies and both are showing development in year 2.
Grimes/McBride/Sims didnt have us dancing in the streets, but Grimes is a 21 year old legit 3&D player who's defense isnt pretend. The kid is really good. McBride is too good for the gleague and has had some nice moments and Sims has been a surprise as well.

They are all not only clearly talented and athletic but all appear to be well coached. I dont care who you credit, FO, Thibs, his staff... but we clearly are developing a nice program, and while some of these guys are brought along slow they are getting time and showing growth. I think its telling we lost Woody last year and Payne this year. It speaks volumes of the quality of coaching this group brings. We can fire Thibs in a few years when he's outcoached in the finals and plays RJ every minute of every game for the whole year. It will be a wonderful day for many of you. Until then take a look at what is happening... its good. GOOD. I am loving these young guys.

fishmike wrote:

Uptown wrote:One of the biggest takeaways from this season is we have legit young building blocks. Gone are the days of winning meaningless games at the end of the season with Maurice N'Dour and other journeymen players that have no future here. We just beat the Heat, the Hornets, and the Bulls; teams that have something to play for with our young players leading the way. Clearly, we still need a legit number one option, but we have most of the other pieces in place.

Disagree with you about Julius. It would be my top priority to remove him from this team, this summer. Not only does Julius operate on the court in isolation, but if the reports are true, he has isolated himself from the team off the court, as well. Dressing away from the team in isolation, not participating in pre-game warmups and the starting line-up intros, and as we saw the other night, he didn't want any part of celebrating with the team, during the post-game victory. From the outside looking in, it's apparent that he doesn't want to be a part of what we are building here. No more coddling, and or trying to rebuild what is not there. We saw his true colors in year 1, in the playoffs against the Hawks and most of this season. How much more do we need to see? Get him and his terrible attitude as far away from this team as possible...We have something building here.

Agree with you about RJ as he has taken another step in his development. If he continues this trajectory, he will thrust himself into the conversation for serious allstar consideration next year. He's the best Knick draft pick in a very long time.

Moving forward, re-sign Mitch, trade Randle and get a playmaking pg or forward. We could also use another athlete on the wing.

totally agree... Mitch is a must re-sign. We can afford to make a mistake overpaying him. We cant afford to let him walk for nothing. Rim protectors always have homes in the league.

Remember Rose and Cam are back next year and Cam is in a contract year. I would expect him to be as ready to go as he's ever been in his career and for RJ to coach him on exactly what Thibs wants

Mitch is one of the most valuable players in this team...There is a difference between grabbing defensive rebounds when nobody is within 2 feet of you. and grabbing tough, offensive rebounds. Mith may not lead the team in rebounds. but his rebounds are far more impactful. He gives us extra possessions which is valuable especially on a team that had high volume shooters...

EwingsGlass wrote:1) RJ is getting his shot. Happy with where he is at 21 years old. He needs to improve his game to take the step to superstar. I think improving his passing game will open up the floor some for his drives.

2) Guys I wanted in FA were Devonte Graham, Kelly Oubre. I liked Murphy (19), McBride (21) and Jericho Sims (30). I was pretty high on Greg Brown also. I would have brought back Bullock, Burks and Noel at lesser contracts. Kind of feel like this team would have won a few more games in imagination land. But it seems like this FO is squeezing every penny out of draft picks and giving away tons on their contracts. I don’t know if any conversations were had with Oubre or Graham but we could have made those contracts work. I think the moral of the story is to keep collecting long athletic growth players for Thibs to mold into a squad.

Graham/Rose/McBride
Barrett/Quick/Burks
Bullock/Oubre/Brown
Randle/Toppin/Taj
Robinson/Noel/Sims

3) Randle. I wish he was the guy we want him to be. He might still be. But something has to change.

Graham hasn’t been good this season. I wanted DeRozan and just sticking Quickley at PG. letting DeRozan initiate offense like they have Burks. It’s water under the bridge though. This offseason I want to clear the necessary space for Brunson and finally have the PG fix. That plus an improvement from the kids gets this team back to respectability and a star will soon demand a trade here with any luck. The way the team is playing, you can win a lot of games with Brunson/ rose at PG even if Randle doesn’t get his mojo back next season.

EwingsGlass wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

EwingsGlass wrote:1) RJ is getting his shot. Happy with where he is at 21 years old. He needs to improve his game to take the step to superstar. I think improving his passing game will open up the floor some for his drives.

2) Guys I wanted in FA were Devonte Graham, Kelly Oubre. I liked Murphy (19), McBride (21) and Jericho Sims (30). I was pretty high on Greg Brown also. I would have brought back Bullock, Burks and Noel at lesser contracts. Kind of feel like this team would have won a few more games in imagination land. But it seems like this FO is squeezing every penny out of draft picks and giving away tons on their contracts. I don’t know if any conversations were had with Oubre or Graham but we could have made those contracts work. I think the moral of the story is to keep collecting long athletic growth players for Thibs to mold into a squad.

Graham/Rose/McBride
Barrett/Quick/Burks
Bullock/Oubre/Brown
Randle/Toppin/Taj
Robinson/Noel/Sims

3) Randle. I wish he was the guy we want him to be. He might still be. But something has to change.

Graham hasn’t been good this season. I wanted DeRozan and just sticking Quickley at PG. letting DeRozan initiate offense like they have Burks. It’s water under the bridge though. This offseason I want to clear the necessary space for Brunson and finally have the PG fix. That plus an improvement from the kids gets this team back to respectability and a star will soon demand a trade here with any luck. The way the team is playing, you can win a lot of games with Brunson/ rose at PG even if Randle doesn’t get his mojo back next season.

You are right about Graham this season. His defense specifically was suspect. He’s an example of a player on a second unit that didn’t transition well to the starting lineup. I have the same kinds of fear about Brunson. Unless Dejaunte Murray or SGA become available, I don’t really have any better suggestions though this season.

Brunson has dispelled the bench theory this year though. He’s a starter and the teams second best player. In 17 games games without Doncic he’s averaging 20 pts and 8 asts and is a +71. He shoots 50% from his career from the field. Compare his numbers this season to some of the best PGs in the league. He’s highly effective and efficient.

franco12 wrote:we're not that good, don't have that much talent, and are pretty capped out and going to be increasing so when we sign RJ to his max and take action on Mitch, Cam.

The FO ain't great with their free agent signings, they do a much better job with the draft.

RJ is a nice talent, but he's like a mini melo or Pat Ewing 2.0 - where he isn't talented enough to singlehandedly take us to the promised land.

And not sure help is on the way any time soon.

Randle is a problem, no matter how you look at it- and I think people are labeled haters if they see his problems as not fixeable - e.g., getting back to a level and style of play consistent with his play last year, in a contract year.

He has to be fixed or traded.

This year has been awful, but his reactions, though understandable perhaps, less than optimal.

And we have a great coach who may be too stubborn for his own good.

Realistic vision for this franchise right now?

Hope for a nice draft acquisition, though this group may trade back and we end up with more Grime's and McBride's than a third star we need.

Stop Gap fix for the PG position.

And maybe this group stays largely together and gets back into the playoffs and suffer a first round humiliation.

And then longer term, maybe it's a 50 win overacheiving team that again folds in the playoffs.

Guys get old, get paid and it's time to start over again.

It's a good jinx post. I see a .500 team next year with al least a play-in playoff birth. Rome wasn't built in a day, enjoy the ride and growth.

For me, RJ, IQ, Obi are primed to have major step growth. Grimes, Cam, Mitch are going to be wild cards. McBride and Sims gonna wreck Summer League and get full rotation minutes next year. Rokas hanging out in the wings wondering why the current Knicks core of wings can't throw a lob pass.

Top 12 pick is going to be interesting; recall that Duarte, Primo, Bouknight, Moody were all in that range last year, can't speak for this year but it's in that range?

Crosses fingers on full return of DRose, Noel. IMHO at least 2 of Burks, Noel, Kemba, Randle will get moved.

Knicks got 2 firsts and 4 second round picks in a super deep 2023 draft.

martin wrote:

franco12 wrote:we're not that good, don't have that much talent, and are pretty capped out and going to be increasing so when we sign RJ to his max and take action on Mitch, Cam.

The FO ain't great with their free agent signings, they do a much better job with the draft.

RJ is a nice talent, but he's like a mini melo or Pat Ewing 2.0 - where he isn't talented enough to singlehandedly take us to the promised land.

And not sure help is on the way any time soon.

Randle is a problem, no matter how you look at it- and I think people are labeled haters if they see his problems as not fixeable - e.g., getting back to a level and style of play consistent with his play last year, in a contract year.

He has to be fixed or traded.

This year has been awful, but his reactions, though understandable perhaps, less than optimal.

And we have a great coach who may be too stubborn for his own good.

Realistic vision for this franchise right now?

Hope for a nice draft acquisition, though this group may trade back and we end up with more Grime's and McBride's than a third star we need.

Stop Gap fix for the PG position.

And maybe this group stays largely together and gets back into the playoffs and suffer a first round humiliation.

And then longer term, maybe it's a 50 win overacheiving team that again folds in the playoffs.

Guys get old, get paid and it's time to start over again.

It's a good jinx post. I see a .500 team next year with al least a play-in playoff birth. Rome wasn't built in a day, enjoy the ride and growth.

For me, RJ, IQ, Obi are primed to have major step growth. Grimes, Cam, Mitch are going to be wild cards. McBride and Sims gonna wreck Summer League and get full rotation minutes next year. Rokas hanging out in the wings wondering why the current Knicks core of wings can't throw a lob pass.

Top 12 pick is going to be interesting; recall that Duarte, Primo, Bouknight, Moody were all in that range last year, can't speak for this year but it's in that range?

Crosses fingers on full return of DRose, Noel. IMHO at least 2 of Burks, Noel, Kemba, Randle will get moved.

Knicks got 2 firsts and 4 second round picks in a super deep 2023 draft.

Something has to happen with all those picks. Impossible to fit everyone on the roster. Consolidate? Trade for future picks? Unload a contract?

martin wrote:

franco12 wrote:we're not that good, don't have that much talent, and are pretty capped out and going to be increasing so when we sign RJ to his max and take action on Mitch, Cam.

The FO ain't great with their free agent signings, they do a much better job with the draft.

RJ is a nice talent, but he's like a mini melo or Pat Ewing 2.0 - where he isn't talented enough to singlehandedly take us to the promised land.

And not sure help is on the way any time soon.

Randle is a problem, no matter how you look at it- and I think people are labeled haters if they see his problems as not fixeable - e.g., getting back to a level and style of play consistent with his play last year, in a contract year.

He has to be fixed or traded.

This year has been awful, but his reactions, though understandable perhaps, less than optimal.

And we have a great coach who may be too stubborn for his own good.

Realistic vision for this franchise right now?

Hope for a nice draft acquisition, though this group may trade back and we end up with more Grime's and McBride's than a third star we need.

Stop Gap fix for the PG position.

And maybe this group stays largely together and gets back into the playoffs and suffer a first round humiliation.

And then longer term, maybe it's a 50 win overacheiving team that again folds in the playoffs.

Guys get old, get paid and it's time to start over again.

It's a good jinx post. I see a .500 team next year with al least a play-in playoff birth. Rome wasn't built in a day, enjoy the ride and growth.

For me, RJ, IQ, Obi are primed to have major step growth. Grimes, Cam, Mitch are going to be wild cards. McBride and Sims gonna wreck Summer League and get full rotation minutes next year. Rokas hanging out in the wings wondering why the current Knicks core of wings can't throw a lob pass.

Top 12 pick is going to be interesting; recall that Duarte, Primo, Bouknight, Moody were all in that range last year, can't speak for this year but it's in that range?

Crosses fingers on full return of DRose, Noel. IMHO at least 2 of Burks, Noel, Kemba, Randle will get moved.

Knicks got 2 firsts and 4 second round picks in a super deep 2023 draft.

500 is absolutely reasonable for next year.

We've played like a 500 team for stretches.

I just looked - our road record is better than our home record. what does that say about the club? They're struggling with pressure, and as the season has gone on, the team variously has grown to handle the pressure.

Next year, if this group starts the year a bit closer to how they finished- and we said this at the beginning of this year, look where we are!

Then, 500 is reasonable.