knicks1248 wrote:We have at least 6 guys on this roster that can handle the rock, and 2 pg's that are better at it than Randle is.

It's like teams know exactly what to do to turn Randle into a bad shooting turn over machine, the Hawks set the blue print in the playoffs.

Then Playing Randle next to a Center that can't space the floor forcing him into shoot wild ill-advised jump shots.

when teams play small ball, I would rather have mitch with 4 guards or Randle and OBI.

Randle and Mitch do not compliment each other..

The goal coming in was to play faster (3 fast breaks points last night to the raptors 21) we can never do that with Randle as our ball handler, and mitch as our center.

Why your whining after a loss like you know better? Randle is the no 1 option and he was passing even down the stretch. Shots did not fall. RJ gets a rebound, he takes it down court. IQ was PG and kemba off the ball. Drose could not hit last night and Toronto defense was all over him when he went to the rim. Kemba did not even try to penetrate. Toronto speed and length on defense is impressive. fornier got pulled also as his shots started coming up short.

My only critique of Randle is he has to see blindside guys coming from behind better. He gets a bit comfortable. IM sure they have tape of all of it.

Not sure when we play miami but there defense is kicking ass this year. will be a good test. IQ to me looks like he is thinking about his new role and working thru new rules too. If Thibs is confident in his development then he will stick to it. Not react like fans do thinking we experiment on the fly. Just because something is not working does not mean. You bring in Grimes or Duece and think just because IQ is not hitting, we dont’t lose anything trying a rookie. IQ is developing and sometimes a player is close enough you let them play thru it. We were behind. If we were ahead you don’t do that. Obviously you stick to what got you that and the players earned that game who did.

You actually saw a coach try to adapt, try to something differrent (IQ) but t did not bring us back.

We are over playing Mitch who is still finding his legs, Taj got hurt which is what happens with older players and Simms vs the Varsity looks like a rookie. Not the hype preseason stuff we saw vs. JV line ups. We miss Norlens.

Obi had nice defenive moments but Toronto got offensive rebounds. Blocking shots takes you out of defensive boxing out. Our oppponents had length and quickness!

Go 5-1 and then get cut down and now Randle as primary option is a problem? Seems reactive. Most of the fans here are very well read and should know better.

I know NYMentality is hyped but this is not a 60 win team. As deep as we are on paper its not together this early in the season. THats not to say we can’t be better as the season goes on. Fact is, other teams get better also!!

knicks1248 wrote:

martin wrote:Mitch playing with Randle has nothing to do with Randle's poor shot choice or his hero ball, iso mentality. Not the turnovers either.

You want a spacer at the 5, go find one, not many out there, and not many out there who can defend at the level Mitch does. And defense is one of Knicks' weaknesses right now

Dude, if you don't realize we are a slower team with randle as a ball handler and mitch as a center, your nuts...Neither one of them are fast players. Randle gets that rebound he's trotting up the court, not sprinting, same with mitch.

The defense is suffering because teams are swinging the ball and shooting 3's and playing small ball, and we are countering that with a slow line up that can't recover in time.

You want know why mitch is avg 1 block, because teams are more perimeter centric.

You saw it yourself last night were we traded 3 point baskets like a layup drill, and you see it in from every team

HoustonSprewell84 wrote:I felt our problem last night was on defense,
We got out hustled. It was shocking to see.

We couldn’t get a stop the entire second half. We gave up a lot of points in the paint and also on the 3 point line. It was the ugly, the Pelican game was ugly too on the defensive end.

Randle looked lazy on defense, he should of been benched. His body language on defense was not right, don’t know if he is injured but he was not hustling.

Never say that word. People will accuse you of panicking or freaking out. We are never to use anyone outside of the normal rotation unless there is a major injury. I am not sure if we are able to use them then. We don't want to stop supporting injured players. Don't worry if someone on the bench might have a better matchup. Don't worry how poorly normal rotations player play. Just forget the bench even exist.

martin wrote:Mitch playing with Randle has nothing to do with Randle's poor shot choice or his hero ball, iso mentality. Not the turnovers either.

You want a spacer at the 5, go find one, not many out there, and not many out there who can defend at the level Mitch does. And defense is one of Knicks' weaknesses right now

*cough* K...A...T *cough*

Moonangie wrote:

martin wrote:Mitch playing with Randle has nothing to do with Randle's poor shot choice or his hero ball, iso mentality. Not the turnovers either.

You want a spacer at the 5, go find one, not many out there, and not many out there who can defend at the level Mitch does. And defense is one of Knicks' weaknesses right now

*cough* K...A...T *cough*

Don't think that's realistic unless he's the one who forces the issue.

Nalod wrote:

foosballnick wrote:

Clean wrote:

HoustonSprewell84 wrote:I felt our problem last night was on defense,
We got out hustled. It was shocking to see.

We couldn’t get a stop the entire second half. We gave up a lot of points in the paint and also on the 3 point line. It was the ugly, the Pelican game was ugly too on the defensive end.

Randle looked lazy on defense, he should of been benched. His body language on defense was not right, don’t know if he is injured but he was not hustling.

Never say that word. People will accuse you of panicking or freaking out. We are never to use anyone outside of the normal rotation unless there is a major injury. I am not sure if we are able to use them then. We don't want to stop supporting injured players. Don't worry if someone on the bench might have a better matchup. Don't worry how poorly normal rotations player play. Just forget the bench even exist.

I agree - we should change lineups more frequently each game and base minutes on reaction to potential match ups and further investigation of what we have on from the current non-rotational players 10-15 on the roster each night. If a guy has a bad quarter or half - bench him for the 2nd half. After all, that methodology certainly worked so well over the last 5 years or so prior to Thib's arrival as HC.

There's a reason that crappy teams rotate players more frequently and good teams have defined & consistent roles. Patience and consistent leadership mean something to winners.

PS - Barrett has had many bad first half performances in his short career so far - only to perform incredibly in the 2nd half of games.

Barrets abilty to adapt and finish a game is the path to consistency. We can throw that word out alot but how does a player get it? Confidence? Try harder? Reps? Let the game come? More reps? Do **** besides score? Gain confidence? Get stronger, faster and see teh game slow down?
All the above.

Thibs has kept players who are hot stay longer and finish games. Its not foriegn.
Change to each game? Not sure thats ok unless your failing. 5-2 is not failing.
How did Randle for all his warts be all NBA and MIP? Has he lost something? With elf an bullock out is his defense worse or is he not exposed because of who is on the court?

Lets go to a blame game? benching Randle does what exactly? Give OBI the ball? Do teams really run to close out games? Is his defense better? where is Kemba in all this? If Randle has to extend his assignment does that leave his guys “more open”? teams are not stupid, they know Kemba is a liablity and will exploit it. Not one on one but know the help is coming and move the ball.

You guys really think you got it figured out for Thibs?

“Bad Losses”……. Is this based on expectations? Magic took apart the Wolves last night. Now the Wolves are better this year but Magic are crap right? Wolves were 3-2. Pacers beat the spurs. Not much there, but This is the NBA, take no game for granted.
This is not last season. unless one is thinking we a 60 win team and true contending then thats a different story.

Its not about being content, its about ones expectation vs another fans. Change the lineup daily? Thats Larry Brown on his way to a 23 win season and knows he is Fucked kind of panic.

COTY vs UK fan. My money on Thibs. He won’t always be right, but he too can second guess himself. He also has assistants to do so as well.

Perhaps you didn't realize that my post was being Ironic........the tell for you was embedded in the post.....

"After all, that methodology certainly worked so well over the last 5 years or so prior to Thib's arrival as HC".

BigDaddyG wrote:

Uptown wrote:Randle over-dribbling and iso-ing is on Thibs. All the players defer to Randle so if he asks for it, his teammates will give it up. Hopefully, Thibs and the coaching staff will point-out Randle's reckless ball handling in the open court and will rectify the situation with a game-plan that lessens Randles touches, especially in the open court. Would much rather see Randle fill the lanes on the fast break than him trying to impersonate Harden.

I wonder if he's just worn out. New kid, loads of minutes...If that's the case he needs to defer more to RJ, Kemba and Fournier. The problem is none of those guys are consistent playmakers that make others better. We still need that guy. Not killing Kemba, but he needs to be smarter on the court. The scoring is nice, but he needs to be the one that settles the team down and make sure the ball makes its way to the hot hand.

Agreed with Kemba. He has the credentials to make Julius fall-back. It may take a while since he is new to the team, and Julius has been here for 2 years and was clearly our best player last year. Outside of the 3-ball, he hasn't taken control of the ball like he did in Charlotte, but again, that may have to do with him joining Julius's team and also not being at the same level that he was pre-knee injury.

I can understand Julius high usage rate last year, but now that we have Kemba and Fournier, not to mention RJ's emergence, we have more players on the roster that can make plays for themselves and others. There is no need for Randle to handle the rock as much as he did last year, especially in the open court where he can be turnover prone as his handle is still not very tight.

knicks1248 wrote:

martin wrote:Mitch playing with Randle has nothing to do with Randle's poor shot choice or his hero ball, iso mentality. Not the turnovers either.

You want a spacer at the 5, go find one, not many out there, and not many out there who can defend at the level Mitch does. And defense is one of Knicks' weaknesses right now

Dude, if you don't realize we are a slower team with randle as a ball handler and mitch as a center, your nuts...Neither one of them are fast players. Randle gets that rebound he's trotting up the court, not sprinting, same with mitch.

The defense is suffering because teams are swinging the ball and shooting 3's and playing small ball, and we are countering that with a slow line up that can't recover in time.

You want know why mitch is avg 1 block, because teams are more perimeter centric.

You saw it yourself last night were we traded 3 point baskets like a layup drill, and you see it in from every team

Yeah I still don't get your point. When Randle brings the ball up the court slowly, it has nothing to do with Mitch. You should detach one from the other.

When Randle plays poorly, it has nothing to do with Mitch.