BUT

We need a backup PG to step up from Dennis and Frank. Its RIDICULOUS that we are looking for a backup PG out of either of them. They SHOULD have been the two guys making it tough on Fiz to start them because they BOTH were delivering. Instead, we just need solid play from one of them to just keep the ship sailing.

Dennis doesn't look ok. Is it his back still affecting him? Is it just being out of rhythm? His shot looks broken and that's scary. The offense looks like a mess with him out there. What will get him fixed? He is the most upside PG to actually at any point claim the starting nod down the road or at least become a super sub from the bench. But there is something wrong. He doesn't look right.

Frank was actually most disappointing to me. Fiz has been treating him like he is in his doghouse, but then he gets the chance and craps the bed. Looked overwhelmed by the moment the same way we have seen him look in other down times. He should bring great D and stable playmaking from the bench. Small sample, but pretty terrible still.

Who will stand up? They both make me miss Kadeem Allen, and that is sad considering the talent they have. Its just game 1 of 82, but their issues are well reported and old by now.

DSJr is not right. He has to be hurt. Outside of RJ, he has highest ceiling but also the lowest floor. He needs to get healthy. I would try to trade him ala Fultz. I am sure there is somebody out there that would like to have him for a low 1st rounder.

Frank. I love Frank but man those 2 passes were terrible and it basically was his end for the game. Fiz did not do him any favors but he needs to step up. He can't make those bad passes.

I would have Frank be the backup just because DSJr is not healthy. No way he is healthy. Plus Frank still has that defensive skills to fall back on.

the two turnovers were horrendous though. One was clearly the result of the D knowing there was no way Frank would be looking to create his own shot so they jumped passing outlets. The other was just lazy.

Vmart wrote:The PG that lost us the game was Barrett and the PG that almost won the game was Payton. Barrett is the real deal but he is not a PG and our ridiculous coach start a really bad line up and he did not learn from his very first mistake of the season which was the starting lineup of having Barrett as PG. Fast forwarding to the point where Payton picked up his fifth foul and Fizdale panicked and put Barrett at PG which opened the flood gates for the Spurs to do their damage. Fizdale needed a point guard and he should have gone to Frank right back showing confidence in him even Smith. This is what you get when you have a hack for a coach.

“I’m a leader” that’s what Fizdale claims himself to be. No man leaders never say they are.

Your basically saying frank should be able play through his mistakes, but everybody else shouldn't.

Here we are in yr 3 with frank and he is yet to score 20 points...and it's still our biggest weakness as far as the position..or ppl wouldn't be starting threads like this

That dude killed all momentum, and i knew it..

Look at DSJ, he worked on his shooting for the entire summer with the knicks coaching staff, particularly with KEITH SMART, and look at him, does in even look remotely better??

development is suspect

At this point, frank should be on par with 19 yr old RJ

knicks1248 wrote:

Vmart wrote:The PG that lost us the game was Barrett and the PG that almost won the game was Payton. Barrett is the real deal but he is not a PG and our ridiculous coach start a really bad line up and he did not learn from his very first mistake of the season which was the starting lineup of having Barrett as PG. Fast forwarding to the point where Payton picked up his fifth foul and Fizdale panicked and put Barrett at PG which opened the flood gates for the Spurs to do their damage. Fizdale needed a point guard and he should have gone to Frank right back showing confidence in him even Smith. This is what you get when you have a hack for a coach.

“I’m a leader” that’s what Fizdale claims himself to be. No man leaders never say they are.

Your basically saying frank should be able play through his mistakes, but everybody else shouldn't.

Here we are in yr 3 with frank and he is yet to score 20 points...and it's still our biggest weakness as far as the position..or ppl wouldn't be starting threads like this

That dude killed all momentum, and i knew it..

Look at DSJ, he worked on his shooting for the entire summer with the knicks coaching staff, particularly with KEITH SMART, and look at him, does in even look remotely better??

development is suspect

At this point, frank should be on par with 19 yr old RJ

You always thing the worst of Frank so you "knew it" always. Even when Frank does good, he is bad in your eyes.
Vmart brings up a good point in that while RJ was playing good with Payton. When Payton left, its when it got ugly. If its UGLY, why not go with one of you PG's. Fiz blew thru 4 of the last night. I think What Vmart is saying is you gotta go with what you have. That moment you don't have the hindsight you so brazenly possess. Frank had a pretty good off and preseason. Thru the FIBA and preseason that was the worst stretch we have seen. If so, and you extend him, then why not go back? With the hindsight I NOW possess I CAN NOW say he should have gone back to Frank because after all, WHAT WAS THERE TO LOSE? See how easy that is AFTER THE GAME?
Payton was solid as we expected.

houston20 wrote:

Knicksfan wrote:Peyton should've won the starting PG spot last night, barring more mad scientist antics from Fiz.

BUT

We need a backup PG to step up from Dennis and Frank. Its RIDICULOUS that we are looking for a backup PG out of either of them. They SHOULD have been the two guys making it tough on Fiz to start them because they BOTH were delivering. Instead, we just need solid play from one of them to just keep the ship sailing.

Dennis doesn't look ok. Is it his back still affecting him? Is it just being out of rhythm? His shot looks broken and that's scary. The offense looks like a mess with him out there. What will get him fixed? He is the most upside PG to actually at any point claim the starting nod down the road or at least become a super sub from the bench. But there is something wrong. He doesn't look right.

Frank was actually most disappointing to me. Fiz has been treating him like he is in his doghouse, but then he gets the chance and craps the bed. Looked overwhelmed by the moment the same way we have seen him look in other down times. He should bring great D and stable playmaking from the bench. Small sample, but pretty terrible still.

Who will stand up? They both make me miss Kadeem Allen, and that is sad considering the talent they have. Its just game 1 of 82, but their issues are well reported and old by now.

I think the knicks have a couple option it either trade for solid back up like kris dunn of the bulls average 11 points, 6 assist, 4 rebounds and shot 42 percent from field and 35 percent from three last season. I would trade frank for kris dunn the bulls don't want him anymore and he needs a change of scenery just like frank does. The other trade would do is call charlotte ask if malik monk is on the trading the one thing about monk he isn't going to be afraid to shot the ball and has better jump shot then frank and dsj. Or last option is you play kadeem allen if things don't go well as plan and i mean in a hurry if both dsj and frank look like total trash in the next couple of weeks.

Nalod wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

Vmart wrote:The PG that lost us the game was Barrett and the PG that almost won the game was Payton. Barrett is the real deal but he is not a PG and our ridiculous coach start a really bad line up and he did not learn from his very first mistake of the season which was the starting lineup of having Barrett as PG. Fast forwarding to the point where Payton picked up his fifth foul and Fizdale panicked and put Barrett at PG which opened the flood gates for the Spurs to do their damage. Fizdale needed a point guard and he should have gone to Frank right back showing confidence in him even Smith. This is what you get when you have a hack for a coach.

“I’m a leader” that’s what Fizdale claims himself to be. No man leaders never say they are.

Your basically saying frank should be able play through his mistakes, but everybody else shouldn't.

Here we are in yr 3 with frank and he is yet to score 20 points...and it's still our biggest weakness as far as the position..or ppl wouldn't be starting threads like this

That dude killed all momentum, and i knew it..

Look at DSJ, he worked on his shooting for the entire summer with the knicks coaching staff, particularly with KEITH SMART, and look at him, does in even look remotely better??

development is suspect

At this point, frank should be on par with 19 yr old RJ

You always thing the worst of Frank so you "knew it" always. Even when Frank does good, he is bad in your eyes.
Vmart brings up a good point in that while RJ was playing good with Payton. When Payton left, its when it got ugly. If its UGLY, why not go with one of you PG's. Fiz blew thru 4 of the last night. I think What Vmart is saying is you gotta go with what you have. That moment you don't have the hindsight you so brazenly possess. Frank had a pretty good off and preseason. Thru the FIBA and preseason that was the worst stretch we have seen. If so, and you extend him, then why not go back? With the hindsight I NOW possess I CAN NOW say he should have gone back to Frank because after all, WHAT WAS THERE TO LOSE? See how easy that is AFTER THE GAME?
Payton was solid as we expected.

I'm just tired of you guys always cuddling frank like he's kind of some baby that needs burping..

The kid is avg 5 points and shooting horrendous, and because he played well against the worst USA team that was ever assembled, you want to toot his horn.

well he needs to earn every minute like everyone else, he doesn't get special treatment because he's just a defender, I'm sorry there's more to the game than that...A lot more.

If he is playing well,and the team is winning, i would have brought his jersey, but he's not, and he's making the coaches job very difficult

Knixkik wrote:I know Frank only played a few minutes, but he really continues to disappoint me. He plays with zero confidence and conviction. It's not a talent issue, but he can't play when he looks like such a deer in the headlights still in year 3.

Yes, I agree with you it was disappointing to see the lazy passes. You can say he is playing not to make a mistake. Usually that’s when mistakes occur. But what everyone will won’t see including Fizdale is the four to six points that weren’t scored or registered in the scoring column. Blown goaltending, and the missed dunk on a pass from Frank. Everyone will see 0-6. Turn over happen and are part of the game. There were years where Magic Johnson lead the league in them as well as Mark Jackson. Fizdale is poor coach who tends to over react to situations. He is a mark of a poor coach because he had an opportunity to coach up Frank.

Good coaches would have sent Frank right back out there and said young fella you’re going to make mistakes get back out there and show me what you got.

CrushAlot wrote:

Vmart wrote:

houston20 wrote:

Vmart wrote:The PG that lost us the game was Barrett and the PG that almost won the game was Payton. Barrett is the real deal but he is not a PG and our ridiculous coach start a really bad line up and he did not learn from his very first mistake of the season which was the starting lineup of having Barrett as PG. Fast forwarding to the point where Payton picked up his fifth foul and Fizdale panicked and put Barrett at PG which opened the flood gates for the Spurs to do their damage. Fizdale needed a point guard and he should have gone to Frank right back showing confidence in him even Smith. This is what you get when you have a hack for a coach.

“I’m a leader” that’s what Fizdale claims himself to be. No man leaders never say they are.

Frank give up 6 points in 2 minutes of action in the 4 quarter he needed to be bench and also payton won the starting job last night.

He had a bad game I will be the first to admit it but our coach needed to go back to him when Payton picked up the fifth foul. Barrett is our sg and he is good at it and was thriving as the sg.

I don’t think Fiz thought the way Frank was playing that he could go back to him. It wasn’t the second quarter.

Didn’t matter what he thought because they still lost. He didn’t give his team the best opportunity to win.

CrushAlot wrote:

Vmart wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Vmart wrote:

houston20 wrote:

Vmart wrote:The PG that lost us the game was Barrett and the PG that almost won the game was Payton. Barrett is the real deal but he is not a PG and our ridiculous coach start a really bad line up and he did not learn from his very first mistake of the season which was the starting lineup of having Barrett as PG. Fast forwarding to the point where Payton picked up his fifth foul and Fizdale panicked and put Barrett at PG which opened the flood gates for the Spurs to do their damage. Fizdale needed a point guard and he should have gone to Frank right back showing confidence in him even Smith. This is what you get when you have a hack for a coach.

“I’m a leader” that’s what Fizdale claims himself to be. No man leaders never say they are.

Frank give up 6 points in 2 minutes of action in the 4 quarter he needed to be bench and also payton won the starting job last night.

He had a bad game I will be the first to admit it but our coach needed to go back to him when Payton picked up the fifth foul. Barrett is our sg and he is good at it and was thriving as the sg.

I don’t think Fiz thought the way Frank was playing that he could go back to him. It wasn’t the second quarter.

Didn’t matter what he thought because they still lost. He didn’t give his team the best opportunity to win.

Keeping Frank in would not have given them the best chance to win. Frank’s run was like watching a reliever come in and get shelled.

You can’t say that with certainty. But I can because the results are in on Fizdale’s decision.