REAL nice win last night, INCRDIBLE 3rd quarter run, but we clearly need more at the point. Frank had some nice moments -- hit a couple of long jumpers, had some nice passes, but then struggled mightily handling the ball against Lowry/VanVleet. And Jack just looks shot, a shell of what he used to be - not that he was ever that great to begin with, but I remember a much more capable offensive player, a guy who used to KILL the Knicks in fact! Now, it's like we're 4-5 out there offensively with Jack...and Frank too for the most part. I like Frank and am rooting hard for him but I'm just not sure on him at all. I mean a good part of me thinks Gary Payton II will turn out to be a better player and is probably a better player right now.

So alternatives... You know to get anything halfway decent in a trade right now would cost an arm and a leg. The best alternative I can think of would be Cat Barber. He's got everything we're currently lacking at the position -- namely speed, breakdown ability and overall offensive punch. VERY GOOD offensive player here...Plus, he's got all the other things we need in a PG--solid ball-handler, good enough passer and he's ok defensively (definitely no worse than Jack or Sessions, that's for sure). If it were up to me, I'd look to unload either Jack or Sessions (probably Sessions because we've been winning with Jack but either or, even if we only got cash for either) and import Barber over from Italy. CLEARCUT young upgrade at the position w/o surrendering a single asset. I'd bring him in, give him a week or so to get acclimated, then I'd have him take over the position from Jack and eventually have Barber in the first unit, Frank continue as backup with Jack serving as mentor/standby 3rd PG where he belongs. Barber's a ton of BANG for very little buck.. I mean who's better--Cat Barber or Fred VanVleet? I think Barber's the better, more talented player with more upside and VanVleet was a 1st round pick...

If no one's feeling Barber (and tell me why please, I'm curious -- I think he'd be perfect for us), throw out some cost-effective alternatives we can consider.

Seeing Trey & Timmy in the same backcourt again could be fun.

martin wrote:Your underlying premise is not correct: in fact, the Knicks are a very strong/efficient offensive team, with Jack organizing and leading them (obviously not from a scoring perspective).

All games, top 11 in league: http://stats.nba.com/teams/advanced/?sort=OFF_RATING&dir=-1&Season=2017-18&SeasonType=Regular%20Season

With Jack starting, top 6: http://stats.nba.com/teams/advanced/?sort=OFF_RATING&dir=-1&Season=2017-18&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&LastNGames=14

Can the Knicks get more production while maintaining the flow/execution? Absolutely.

Continuity matters. So does growth. KP, Kanter, ThJr and even Lee are playing the BEST ball they all have ever seen; attribute that to team, coach, individual development and some to Jack for his contribution as a PG.

Agreed

BRIGGS wrote:Jarrett jack has done more than fine-- he's just not the long term solution

Yeah I can deal with this more than disregarding him and wanting to dump him just because. Jack is old... but he's just as important to us as Frank is. The two go hand in hand

I will say we do need a scoring point guard in the mix. I'm all in on Trey Burke. I think he has the potential to jump in and do that... he's got to wait his turn. Injuries happen. We expect Frank to pass Jack sooner or later. When that happens, we'll need a Trey Burke or Cat Barber type to step in.

Right now we are doing fine. There's no urgency

meloshouldgo wrote:This obsession people have with "SCORING" is unreal. We are getting very good play at PG. On our team their role is setting up the offense and its NOT scoring. But somehow that's all people care to look at...scoring, scoring, scoring. Can we please stop salivating over score first PGs that never win anything?

None of this is happening in this thread.

TLover wrote:Right now Jack & Frankie are giving us stability at the pg position. If the Knicks are looking at anyone it is Trey Burke in Westchester (Timmy’s backcourt mate at Michigan). Seems like he’s going a similar route that Timmy went - being humbled by playing in the D-league and then coming back to the nba with a vengeance.

Seeing Trey & Timmy in the same backcourt again could be fun.

Good point. I hope this is what they’re doing and that it works. Burke was a good prospect. I hope he learns defense.

TripleThreat wrote:

colorfl1 wrote:I think Jared Jack is coming back from a serious injury and is still not quite back to his old game and feel yet.
However, his PG mind is still as sharp as ever.
If he does not break down again -- he should continue to improve offensively as the season progresses.

Jarrett Jack is actually pretty tragic to me as a fan of the game. He's playing a much more functional version of team ball because

A) He's at the end of his career and he wants to hang on a little longer
B) Like a lot of NBA veterans, he's basically broke and needs the money
C) His physical decline is forcing him to stop being a Me First type chucker, which is the reason he's bounced around so many times to so many teams.

He could have had a much better career, probably longer, and with more stability, and likely would have earned more, but it wasn't until his back was to the wall that he stopped being a chucker.

I'm glad he's playing well for the Knicks, but he's another test case that non guaranteed contracts are the way to go to improve league play all around the board. Dudes hungry and fighting each day to stay each day breeds the best in every player.

I do agree with the Jack analysis. And also with the assertion that non-guaranteed contracts lead to better day-in-day-out effort and conditioning. But maybe work against team play. Players would be more-than-ever trying to stand out for that next deal/option pick-up. So I see good and bad in terms of the potential product. Also in an industry where there is so much injury risk, it just seems the right thing to allow guaranteed contracts. That said, I’m sure there’s a good balance that can be a struck. Not sure the players would give-back anything at this point though. But that’s a different story.

(I really cringe at the NFL system where a guy can just lose his contract 100% at the will of the team. Seems unfair to me).