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need to position oursleves for a reasonably high draft pick somehow
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BRIGGS
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8/20/2004  11:47 AM
we have to put it in our hands to find an athletic big man--the way i see it being done is acquiring an ending contract over 5mm and trading it to the Suns for their rights to the Bulls pick. the suns have shown they will sell their picks. like dallas did with eshmeyer i could care less if eisley was back here as long as it became apparent thatwe would get a high pick. this means we have to find an ending contract sometime during the year.hopefully KT will be enough for a draft pick+ ending contract and then move it on to the suns.
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BigSm00th
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8/20/2004  11:48 AM
I'd say KT could yield you an expiring contract AND a late first rounder from a contender, and then dealing that expiring contract for Eisley and the Bulls' first rounder puts the Knicks in good position with 3 first round draft picks.
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fishmike
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8/20/2004  12:09 PM
Lammond Murray and Tor's #1 for KT.

Maybe we can finally buy out Shandon
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
BRIGGS
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8/20/2004  1:42 PM
im looking and dont see any quality big men available in the pros. thats why i wanted to swipe David Harrison and let him develop-and why I didnt want Lampe thrown away. Its going to be very hard finding a C that doesnt sck.
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CTKnicksfan
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8/20/2004  1:52 PM
Not sure Dallas even wants KT anymore now that they have Dampier, but if they do, would thay take KT for Alan Henderson (8mm expiring) and a 2nd round pick? We could then move that contract to Phx for the Bulls pick and Eisley.
Rich
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8/20/2004  3:08 PM
It's not out of the question that the Knicks will tank this season, and they will have their own lottery pick.
Rich
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8/20/2004  3:10 PM
btw, I don't expect it, but it's possible.
Bonn1997
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8/20/2004  4:14 PM
Posted by Rich:

It's not out of the question that the Knicks will tank this season, and they will have their own lottery pick.
Out of the thirty teams in the NBA, I think the Knicks would be the least likely to do that.
EnySpree
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8/20/2004  4:14 PM
Man leave those darn draft picks alone!

Yeah the Knicks need some youth up front and are too capped out to sign one but what the heck?!?!

Look at the team as is....the Knicks are getting better believe it or not....Isiah is not finnished if you guys are thinking that you are nuts....

There are guys out there that haven't been signed yet and there are guys that were on the bubble to be traded last Feb but all of a sudden are off the radar....

It's probably nothing but why did Washington pick up Etan Thomas? He signed an offer sheet with the Bucks and they matched it. Kwame Brown? Kwame Brown? Kwame Brown?

Isiah is not done....this is gonna be a daily thing with him.....he will not stop adding and tinkering till we get a Championship....It's not gonna come through the draft unless we keep picking up Trevor Ariza's every year....
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Bonn1997
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8/20/2004  4:23 PM
Posted by EnySpree:

Man leave those darn draft picks alone!

Yeah the Knicks need some youth up front and are too capped out to sign one but what the heck?!?!

Look at the team as is....the Knicks are getting better believe it or not....Isiah is not finnished if you guys are thinking that you are nuts....

There are guys out there that haven't been signed yet and there are guys that were on the bubble to be traded last Feb but all of a sudden are off the radar....

It's probably nothing but why did Washington pick up Etan Thomas? He signed an offer sheet with the Bucks and they matched it. Kwame Brown? Kwame Brown? Kwame Brown?

Isiah is not done....this is gonna be a daily thing with him.....he will not stop adding and tinkering till we get a Championship....It's not gonna come through the draft unless we keep picking up Trevor Ariza's every year....
Agreed. I'm not interested in giving up significant assets for draft picks.
fishmike
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8/20/2004  4:23 PM
Posted by Rich:

It's not out of the question that the Knicks will tank this season, and they will have their own lottery pick.
how could they? Even if we have injury problems, the chemistry sucks, etc this is still a .500 team. To much depth in a terrible conference.

I think its more realistic to use and expiring deal, take back a bad one and trade up in the process... something like that.

On the flip side looking at the draft in recent years the selection on bigs is pretty bad. Your almost better off drafting a project late like a Lampe or Ramos type and just overpaying for someone like Ratliff or Dampier (like Dallas did).
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Bonn1997
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8/20/2004  4:27 PM
Posted by fishmike:
Posted by Rich:

It's not out of the question that the Knicks will tank this season, and they will have their own lottery pick.
how could they? Even if we have injury problems, the chemistry sucks, etc this is still a .500 team. To much depth in a terrible conference.

I think its more realistic to use and expiring deal, take back a bad one and trade up in the process... something like that.

On the flip side looking at the draft in recent years the selection on bigs is pretty bad. Your almost better off drafting a project late like a Lampe or Ramos type and just overpaying for someone like Ratliff or Dampier (like Dallas did).
Exactly. I'd rather use our $45 mil in expiring contracts to get a solid center and even one more player next summer and forget about draft picks. I'd actually be more inclined to trade the player we draft in the first round next summer if it helps us get a center.
BigSm00th
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8/20/2004  4:43 PM
Why would you be inclined to trade a drafted player for a solid C, as you say?

What solid Cs are there?

Shaq (not happening), Ilgauskas (could be a possibility), Duncan, Dampier (attitude and effort are questionable), I mean, the list is so short what C are you going to acquire??? And what team is going to give this player up for expiring contracts?

If the Knicks can move up to the late lottery/teens to get a guy like Johan Petro (7 footer who can run, from what I've read), or Kosta Perovic from Serbia, Vasquez from Spain or Samardzkiski (http://nbadraft.net/profiles/predragsamardziski.asp), why not trade KT at the deadline and maybe suffer for a few months, but in the long run get a young 7 footer when there are virtually none available in the NBA. This makes far more sense to me.

I like the Marbury to KT off the pick and roll, but if Sweetney, JYD, Baker, and Mohammed are all playing well, I'm trying my best to deal KT for a contract and a pick. Even if they're hurt soon, the possibility of adding a young C who can ball and to bring him up in your own system with Abdul-Jabbar and Aguirre (could there be two better teachers?) and send him to Newel's Big Man camp every year, why would you not want to do this?
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fishmike
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8/20/2004  4:57 PM
there's about 20 other teams that want to improve the center spot also.

I think you have to target one guy and aquire the assets it will take to get him.

I mentioned Diop, Dalembert.. another possibility is Kwame Brown.
At 6'11 250 and 23 years I think he's worth a major risk.

The big xfactor for is Sweetney. If he's showing signs of being anything like the kind of scorer he was in college it totally changes your needs at the center spot.

If Sweet (I'm 90% convinced he will be, just not sure how long it will take) becomes a Zach type player, you can just team him with a defensive type of guy at the 5. Someone like Haywood would fit nicely. Use Nazr and our #1 to get Haywood who's a beast and an excellent shot blocker in a sign and trade. Then over pay to get Ratliff w/ a 6 year MLE offer and you have 2 nice defensive players at center, w/ Sweetney featured as your post scorer.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Nalod
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8/20/2004  5:04 PM
Isiah is not finnished if you guys are thinking that you are nuts....


Isiah is not done....this is gonna be a daily thing with him.....he will not stop adding and tinkering till we get a Championship....It's not gonna come through the draft unless we keep picking up Trevor Ariza's every year....

An Isiahs job is never done. Not until the championships are won and Payroll is 200mil!

The Kool-Aid. For some, it is very very sweet!
RonRon
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8/20/2004  5:05 PM
i agree with briggs on this one, the next big centers coming out of their contracts will be shaq and yao. We have no chance in acquiring yao. no chance unless, shaq pulls a payton n malone. With our current team, I see us being a playoff contender or very close to it. I dont see how we can grab a big man with our predicted picks, therefore we will have to look at acquiring other teams picks. Big men is too rare, I dont see how teams are going to give up FA if they are proved useful. However, I think we should still take a crack with the rest of our midlevel on a big man like Keon Clark? 1-3 year deal? We need greater shot blocking and defense then what we have right now. Although Clark is a ? he can answer some of our problems if healthy. With the contracts all the big men have been getting, I think he can be a steal if we can get him for the rest of mle if hes healthy.


Dont 4get if we really are planning to acquire a big man from draft, it will take a min of 3 years to develop him. If marbary is really part of our future, we will have to do it b4 he turns in to a jason kiddd with his 2 ankles. I would like a marbary in his prime.
BRIGGS
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8/20/2004  5:19 PM
thats the big problem. marbury TT and Nazr will al be 28 during the season. that sure isnt old--but if they dont acquire something in the frontcourt in the next year--the cycle and all of this spending went for nothing. Thats why some people did not want to trade for Marbury kept Lampe Sweetney +FW together --bring in a jamal crawford who is 24 use more draft picks on young gusy liek jeffersona nd josh smith each year for the next 2 years we couldve built up an exciting team that couldve stayed together a LONg time. I wanted to build a core of guys all 24-25 years and younger and put them together with a couple of nice vets. I know that its not the popular choice but i wouldve never done that marbury deal unless it was just for expiring contracts and 1 pick. no lampe no vujonic no second pick. if antwan jamison went for pick 5 and jerry stackhouse, then we shouldnt hav given up so much for a backcourt player who hasnt won anywhere.
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BigSm00th
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8/20/2004  5:28 PM
Exactly, not only did the Knicks help the Suns financial situation but they helped them basically rebuild with 2 picks and 2 prospects. No way that much should've been given up, helping their financial situation should've been enough, maybe a pick, maybe a prospect, but those 4 things (give them Vujanic and a pick, and keep Lampe and the other pick) was too much.
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BRIGGS
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8/20/2004  6:47 PM
the one guy that i have seen that sticks out to me is chris taft. he's got just tremendous footwork and a beautiful touch around the rim hes athletic and a main ingredient he's pitbull tough a real gamer. Now hes not 7-0 hes probably something more in kwame browns size, but to me thats fine. thats the guy im looking at and we'll keep an eye on randolph morris from kentucky this year. Josh Boone to me is more of a PF as is Sean May. Also the kid from GT Luke Sceschner really came on and is real smooth around the basket at 7-2. there are some other potential guys but IMHO Taft is the guy who stands out by a mile for domescti guys.
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Bonn1997
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8/20/2004  7:08 PM
Posted by BigSm00th:

Exactly, not only did the Knicks help the Suns financial situation but they helped them basically rebuild with 2 picks and 2 prospects. No way that much should've been given up, helping their financial situation should've been enough, maybe a pick, maybe a prospect, but those 4 things (give them Vujanic and a pick, and keep Lampe and the other pick) was too much.
ten years from now, Vaginic is gonna still be playing abroad and Isiah critics are gonna still be calling him a top prospect
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need to position oursleves for a reasonably high draft pick somehow
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