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Poll of two PGs
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BRIGGS
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De’Aaron Fox or Frank Ntilikina
De’Aaron Fox
Frank Ntilikina
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franco12
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5/9/2017  7:09 AM
Briggs - what have you always said - we need athletes & Length.

I know this is just video clips of best moments for me - I like them both, hope we're in a position to draft either.

Frank looks like Durant in the sense that he is tall, skinny, moves like a PG and can get a floater off anywhere he wants.
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meloshouldgo
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5/9/2017  8:03 AM
I am down wit Frank
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fishmike
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5/9/2017  8:37 AM
Silly poll Briggs.. we have extensive footage of Fox. Most know where he stands and Fox is an excellent prospect I think most of us would be thrilled to get.

What does anyone know about Frank? Whats his vert? How does he look in drills? How does he look after a 60-90 minute workout? Frank is a basic mystery.

I mean if you polled OK4 vs. KP a couple years ago what would the vote have been? I am sure it would have been very pro-OK4, but that is of course because none of us really saw or knew about KP.

Frank could be the best player in the draft. He could be the Dirk type everyone passed on because they werent sure. We just dont know. Surely Fox is ranked higher, but its really just because he's a known commodity.

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
BRIGGS
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5/9/2017  10:39 AM    LAST EDITED: 5/9/2017  10:40 AM
fishmike wrote:Silly poll Briggs.. we have extensive footage of Fox. Most know where he stands and Fox is an excellent prospect I think most of us would be thrilled to get.

What does anyone know about Frank? Whats his vert? How does he look in drills? How does he look after a 60-90 minute workout? Frank is a basic mystery.

I mean if you polled OK4 vs. KP a couple years ago what would the vote have been? I am sure it would have been very pro-OK4, but that is of course because none of us really saw or knew about KP.

Frank could be the best player in the draft. He could be the Dirk type everyone passed on because they werent sure. We just dont know. Surely Fox is ranked higher, but its really just because he's a known commodity.

There is more videos on Frank?

The one thing that Frank has over Fox (and its big) is a jumpshot. In the modern NBA you have to put high emphasis on the ability to shoot. Thats not saying Fox cant shoot--but I think Frank's form is better. After that I think Fox is just as good of a defender is 2-3X better in terms of speed ability to separate finishing at the rim and better ballhandler. I think Fox is more of the natural PG although neither are great passers and neither has anything close to what Ball has in court vision. I think of Fox comes in and shows improvement on his J--he will be the superior pick.

RIP Crushalot😞
BigDaddyG
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5/9/2017  11:30 AM
I like Fox as the second best PG prospect behind Fultz. That said, I think Fox goes top 5 the way things stand now. A more realistic poll would be Frank or Dennis Smith Jr. One guys has more offensive "star" potential while the other guy has the potential to be a better fit for us and more versatile player long-term. I think we will be looking at those two lead guards at our draft position.
Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right. - The Tick
nixluva
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5/9/2017  11:34 AM
I like Fox more but I would be fine with Ntilikina. For me Fox has Elite quickness and explosion! But Fox isn't wild and out of control. Fox didn't shoot well but I think he can improve with reps and coaching on his form. Fox is patient but can take over a game when it's necessary.

Frank is younger and still growing so he has a ton of physical changes he's going to go thru. I think Frank is going to get much thicker. I don't see the Elite quickness or explosion with Frank but his lateral quickness and length does look Elite. He's gonna be a big time defender! Frank looks like a SG with PG skills but not great handles and breakdown ability. I think this limits his upside.
fishmike
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5/9/2017  11:54 AM
BRIGGS wrote:
fishmike wrote:Silly poll Briggs.. we have extensive footage of Fox. Most know where he stands and Fox is an excellent prospect I think most of us would be thrilled to get.

What does anyone know about Frank? Whats his vert? How does he look in drills? How does he look after a 60-90 minute workout? Frank is a basic mystery.

I mean if you polled OK4 vs. KP a couple years ago what would the vote have been? I am sure it would have been very pro-OK4, but that is of course because none of us really saw or knew about KP.

Frank could be the best player in the draft. He could be the Dirk type everyone passed on because they werent sure. We just dont know. Surely Fox is ranked higher, but its really just because he's a known commodity.

There is more videos on Frank?

The one thing that Frank has over Fox (and its big) is a jumpshot. In the modern NBA you have to put high emphasis on the ability to shoot. Thats not saying Fox cant shoot--but I think Frank's form is better. After that I think Fox is just as good of a defender is 2-3X better in terms of speed ability to separate finishing at the rim and better ballhandler. I think Fox is more of the natural PG although neither are great passers and neither has anything close to what Ball has in court vision. I think of Fox comes in and shows improvement on his J--he will be the superior pick.

Briggs I 100% agree with you on Fox. He looks like a really nice 2 way player and his shot may not his strength but I dont see a Rondo type guy either. He brings a whole lot to the table.

I guess my point on Frank is you dont know. We have seen Fox play for 40 minute stretches... thats when you really learn about these guys, and their ability to adjust to defense. I get what you are saying w/ Frank but I just dont think there is enough data to make *any* conclusions, be it jumper, athleticism, etc...

I mean what if we pick 3 and take Frank? Does that tell you we phucked up? Or does it tell you after having him in for workouts we saw what other team's saw, that he might be the best pick in the draft. I mean its a "what if" but my point we just dont know. So hard to tell... gotta trust the scouts and the workouts.

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Zebo13
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5/9/2017  12:30 PM
I'd be happy with either one. I'd likely prefer Foxjust because we've seen more Of him on a bigger stage. Less likely to have bust pitential. I think Frank may have more upside possibility. I think worst case scenario we can get at least Frank of those two. Slim chance we wind up with Dennis Smith who might end up being a great player too. I hope the scouting gets it right like we did with KP. Either way, it's gonna be an exciting summer league/preseason seeing what they bring.
yellowboy90
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5/9/2017  12:33 PM
I do not really like Fox at all. He has a higher bust potential because unlike Frank he doesn't have the ability to move to the off guard spot.

Honestly, Dennis Smith Jr could probably end up the better pg on both sides of the ball.
BRIGGS
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5/9/2017  12:49 PM
yellowboy90 wrote:I do not really like Fox at all. He has a higher bust potential because unlike Frank he doesn't have the ability to move to the off guard spot.

Honestly, Dennis Smith Jr could probably end up the better pg on both sides of the ball.

Another possibility to consider--Fox may be too fast for the Knicks believe it or not.

RIP Crushalot😞
nixluva
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5/9/2017  12:52 PM
yellowboy90 wrote:I do not really like Fox at all. He has a higher bust potential because unlike Frank he doesn't have the ability to move to the off guard spot.

Honestly, Dennis Smith Jr could probably end up the better pg on both sides of the ball.

OK now come on! Fox has a LOWER bust potential because he's Elite Speed and Athletic ability! He's going to be a BLUR even at the NBA level. SPEED KILLS! Especially in a PG that's about 6-3 or 6-4.
We all saw what Fox was like under pressure and he raised his level of play. He's great now and if his jumper improves he only gets better.
nixluva
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5/9/2017  12:53 PM
BRIGGS wrote:
yellowboy90 wrote:I do not really like Fox at all. He has a higher bust potential because unlike Frank he doesn't have the ability to move to the off guard spot.

Honestly, Dennis Smith Jr could probably end up the better pg on both sides of the ball.

Another possibility to consider--Fox may be too fast for the Knicks believe it or not.

NONSENSE! Jeff wants the team to play faster and look for Early Offense!
yellowboy90
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5/9/2017  12:58 PM
nixluva wrote:
yellowboy90 wrote:I do not really like Fox at all. He has a higher bust potential because unlike Frank he doesn't have the ability to move to the off guard spot.

Honestly, Dennis Smith Jr could probably end up the better pg on both sides of the ball.

OK now come on! Fox has a LOWER bust potential because he's Elite Speed and Athletic ability! He's going to be a BLUR even at the NBA level. SPEED KILLS! Especially in a PG that's about 6-3 or 6-4.
We all saw what Fox was like under pressure and he raised his level of play. He's great now and if his jumper improves he only gets better.

A lot of PGs have had elite speed. He is not great now. He is good now. If he was great now he would be talked about as a top 3 player.

The guy average under 5 ast and yet people think he is a great distributor. He has a lot of work to do. To me a Fox type player will be available in drafts to come.
martin
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5/9/2017  12:58 PM
BRIGGS wrote:
yellowboy90 wrote:I do not really like Fox at all. He has a higher bust potential because unlike Frank he doesn't have the ability to move to the off guard spot.

Honestly, Dennis Smith Jr could probably end up the better pg on both sides of the ball.

Another possibility to consider--Fox may be too fast for the Knicks believe it or not.

We don't want top picks cause they may be too good for the Knicks? WTF dude

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nixluva
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5/9/2017  1:09 PM
yellowboy90 wrote:
nixluva wrote:
yellowboy90 wrote:I do not really like Fox at all. He has a higher bust potential because unlike Frank he doesn't have the ability to move to the off guard spot.

Honestly, Dennis Smith Jr could probably end up the better pg on both sides of the ball.

OK now come on! Fox has a LOWER bust potential because he's Elite Speed and Athletic ability! He's going to be a BLUR even at the NBA level. SPEED KILLS! Especially in a PG that's about 6-3 or 6-4.
We all saw what Fox was like under pressure and he raised his level of play. He's great now and if his jumper improves he only gets better.

A lot of PGs have had elite speed. He is not great now. He is good now. If he was great now he would be talked about as a top 3 player.

The guy average under 5 ast and yet people think he is a great distributor. He has a lot of work to do. To me a Fox type player will be available in drafts to come.
BRIGGS
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5/9/2017  1:11 PM
martin wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
yellowboy90 wrote:I do not really like Fox at all. He has a higher bust potential because unlike Frank he doesn't have the ability to move to the off guard spot.

Honestly, Dennis Smith Jr could probably end up the better pg on both sides of the ball.

Another possibility to consider--Fox may be too fast for the Knicks believe it or not.

We don't want top picks cause they may be too good for the Knicks? WTF dude


lol Im not saying that--I have to wonder if Fox is too fast for KP and Willy--and maybe even the triangle. I prefer Fox myself.

RIP Crushalot😞
nixluva
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5/9/2017  1:14 PM
BRIGGS wrote:
martin wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
yellowboy90 wrote:I do not really like Fox at all. He has a higher bust potential because unlike Frank he doesn't have the ability to move to the off guard spot.

Honestly, Dennis Smith Jr could probably end up the better pg on both sides of the ball.

Another possibility to consider--Fox may be too fast for the Knicks believe it or not.

We don't want top picks cause they may be too good for the Knicks? WTF dude


lol Im not saying that--I have to wonder if Fox is too fast for KP and Willy--and maybe even the triangle. I prefer Fox myself.

Jeff wants the team to RUN! They played faster minus the vets. The team is going to get younger and more athletic by default.
yellowboy90
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5/9/2017  1:22 PM    LAST EDITED: 5/9/2017  1:23 PM
nixluva wrote:
yellowboy90 wrote:
nixluva wrote:
yellowboy90 wrote:I do not really like Fox at all. He has a higher bust potential because unlike Frank he doesn't have the ability to move to the off guard spot.

Honestly, Dennis Smith Jr could probably end up the better pg on both sides of the ball.

OK now come on! Fox has a LOWER bust potential because he's Elite Speed and Athletic ability! He's going to be a BLUR even at the NBA level. SPEED KILLS! Especially in a PG that's about 6-3 or 6-4.
We all saw what Fox was like under pressure and he raised his level of play. He's great now and if his jumper improves he only gets better.

A lot of PGs have had elite speed. He is not great now. He is good now. If he was great now he would be talked about as a top 3 player.

The guy average under 5 ast and yet people think he is a great distributor. He has a lot of work to do. To me a Fox type player will be available in drafts to come.

Do you want me to post a tweet of Justice Winslow late season numbers from college? Who cares about a 10 game sample size?
nixluva
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5/9/2017  1:56 PM
yellowboy90 wrote:
nixluva wrote:
yellowboy90 wrote:
nixluva wrote:
yellowboy90 wrote:I do not really like Fox at all. He has a higher bust potential because unlike Frank he doesn't have the ability to move to the off guard spot.

Honestly, Dennis Smith Jr could probably end up the better pg on both sides of the ball.

OK now come on! Fox has a LOWER bust potential because he's Elite Speed and Athletic ability! He's going to be a BLUR even at the NBA level. SPEED KILLS! Especially in a PG that's about 6-3 or 6-4.
We all saw what Fox was like under pressure and he raised his level of play. He's great now and if his jumper improves he only gets better.

A lot of PGs have had elite speed. He is not great now. He is good now. If he was great now he would be talked about as a top 3 player.

The guy average under 5 ast and yet people think he is a great distributor. He has a lot of work to do. To me a Fox type player will be available in drafts to come.

Do you want me to post a tweet of Justice Winslow late season numbers from college? Who cares about a 10 game sample size?


No a lot of PG's don't have ELITE speed, quickness and explosion! Thus the term ELITE is used for the few at the very top.

You really see a Winslow type situation with Fox? He's a kid that has tremendous upside IMO. Far beyond a Winslow! As for mentioning the number of Assists I think that's difficult to gauge based on the way the team functioned. Fox didn't have the ball all the time hunting for Assists.

In the NBA Fox will be more of an attack PG rather than a CP3 type. I think perhaps that's what you're underestimating about Fox. KP and Willy could flourish with a penetrating PG that actually looks for them more often than Rose did.
knicks1248
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5/9/2017  2:12 PM
nixluva wrote:
yellowboy90 wrote:I do not really like Fox at all. He has a higher bust potential because unlike Frank he doesn't have the ability to move to the off guard spot.

Honestly, Dennis Smith Jr could probably end up the better pg on both sides of the ball.

OK now come on! Fox has a LOWER bust potential because he's Elite Speed and Athletic ability! He's going to be a BLUR even at the NBA level. SPEED KILLS! Especially in a PG that's about 6-3 or 6-4.
We all saw what Fox was like under pressure and he raised his level of play. He's great now and if his jumper improves he only gets better.

If you can't shoot 3's why on earth is he even a topic of discussion, you want rose Prt 2..I don't want any player that can knock down a 3 consistently, Not in todays league, especially in this jump shooting system.

ES
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