By Dan FeldmanSep 2, 2016, 12:30 PM EDT

Phil Jackson reportedly told new Knicks coach Jeff Hornacek he wouldn’t have to run to the triangle offense. Hornacek said he’d include triangle principles in his scheme.

What’s really going on?

Chris Mannix of Yahoo Sports:

The message I was getting from the people around Hornacek was that he would get to coach whatever style he wanted to coach. The message I was getting from people with the Knicks was that that wasn’t necessarily true, that there would be, as you mentioned, the fingerprints of the triangle on that.

Hornacek said he’d use triangle elements. Maybe that’s more than lip service and he plans to appease Jackson (though that’s problematic because Hornacek isn’t experienced in coaching the triangle).

Or maybe Hornacek was just trying to quell controversy publicly now then run his own offense with Jackson’s approval (though that would become problematic if Jackson’s ego causes him to demand the triangle after the fact).

But if there’s a real misunderstanding how this will work, that’s already a major problem. It barely matters whether the Knicks misled Hornacek or Hornacek misinterpreted. The difference in expectations will be untenable.

This short article is part of a narrative that i've been reading and hearing all summer. I think it's extremely annoying to be honest. They often mention how Fish tried to do some of the same things Jeff has talked about and in a sense that's true but Fish was not doing a smooth blending of new concepts into the Triangle. His efforts were disjointed and I don't believe Phil liked his methods of running practice either. Jeff is much more clear on how he wants to run a practice and apply his principles to the Triangle or blend elements of the Triangle into his own system. He's got a great handle on offensive concepts and I trust his application and manor of teaching his players how to execute.

Hornacek won 48 games with this 8 man group in a tough Western Conference.

Player	        Age G  MP   PER  TS%  3PAr FTr  ORB% DRB% TRB%  AST% STL% BLK% TOV% USG% OWS DWS WS   WS/48 OBPM DBPM  BPM  VORP
Goran Dragic	27  76 2668 21.4 .604 .274 .381 2.9  7.4   5.2  28.1 2.0  0.6  14.3 24.5 8.4 2.0 10.3 .186  4.9	 -1.1  3.9  4.0
Eric Bledsoe	24  43 1416 19.6 .578 .252 .426 2.1  13.8  8.0  27.0 2.4  0.8  17.8 24.9 2.6 1.6  4.1 .140  2.3   0.6  2.9  1.8
Markieff Morris	24  81 2153 18.4 .564 .128 .387	7.3  18.0 12.6  10.9 1.6  1.8  12.9 23.2 4.0 2.4  6.4 .143  0.5   0.4  1.0  1.6
Gerald Green	28  82 2330 16.5 .585 .507 .229	2.3  10.9  6.6	 8.6 1.5  1.4  11.6 23.6 4.2 1.9  6.1 .126  2.4	 -1.4  1.0  1.8
Marcus Morris	24  82 1800 14.8 .552 .399 .244	5.2  14.6  9.9   7.6 2.0  0.8  11.6 19.9 2.3 1.8  4.2 .111  0.6  -0.5  0.2  1.0
Miles Plumlee	25  80 1964 14.6 .529 .000 .239	11.3 24.4 17.9   3.3 1.3  3.5  15.4 16.2 1.2 2.8  4.0 .098 -2.8	  1.3 -1.5  0.2
P.J. Tucker	28  81 2490 13.3 .540 .311 .327	7.3  16.6 11.9   8.1 2.2  0.7  12.7 14.2 3.3 2.8  6.1 .117  0.7   1.6  2.3  2.7
Channing Frye	30  82 2312 13.2 .555 .555 .122	3.6  16.6 10.1   6.4 1.3  2.1	9.8 17.3 2.9 2.4  5.3 .109  0.9   0.2  1.1  1.8

Derrick Rose
Courtney Lee
Carmelo Anthony
Kristaps Porzingis
Joakim Noah
Brandon Jennings
Lance Thomas
???

I think Hornacek is going to be very excited to coach this team and apply his concepts to this talent. I'm very curious to see how he blends this talent and the bench as well. The writer of the article suggests that somehow Phil might not allow Jeff to do what he wants but actually Phil didn't stop Fish from coaching how he wanted to coach. He actually let him do what he wanted for the duration of his time. He actually backed off Fish and let him coach and I expect that he'll do the same with Hornacek.

Knicks' Jeff Hornacek wants to use Kristaps Porzingis all over the floor
Jun 4, 2016
Ian Begley

Jeff Hornacek answered questions from reporters at a news conference at the New York Knicks’ practice facility on Friday. He also spoke with "The Michael Kay Show" on ESPN 98.7 FM and appeared on WFAN.

Here are a few takeaways from those interviews:

Blending the triangle: Hornacek said in the interviews that he plans to blend elements of the triangle offense with elements of the offense he ran in Phoenix. He mentioned potentially playing at a higher pace, shooting a few more 3-pointers, and running more pick-and-rolls than the Knicks have over the past two seasons. But he also plans to continue to use the triangle offense as a way to space the floor in the half-court offense.

Hornacek said team president Phil Jackson told him he can run any of the plays that he’d like to -- the plays that he’d been accustomed to running with the Suns -- out of the triangle offense. Hornacek said he’s familiar with the triangle thanks to time spent scouting the offense as a coach and player. He also believes that players will be open to his offense -- and the elements of the triangle he plans to keep -- once he’s able to explain it to the players. Many players were already anticipating Hornacek making changes to the offense. So it seems as if Hornacek’s ability to communicate his vision to the players will be important.

---

Thoughts on Porzingis and Carmelo: Hornacek expressed excitement about the prospect of coaching both Kristaps Porzingis and Carmelo Anthony. He says that he’d like to use Porzingis on the perimeter and the interior, based on his matchup. He envisions Porzingis posting up smaller defenders, which the rookie may face when teams utilize smaller lineups. Against bigger defenders, he sees Porzingis shooting more frequently from the perimeter and playing on some high pick-and-rolls to take the bigger defender out of the paint and also take advantage of Porzingis’ versatility.

Hornacek also said that Anthony is an important piece for the Knicks moving forward and he believes that the Knicks can contend for a title while Anthony is still playing at an elite level. He referred to Anthony as a “superstar” several times on Friday.

GustavBahler wrote:I think if KP is having monster games in large part due to P&R, Phil isn't going to force the issue as it will be seen as trying to fix something that ain't broke. Hornacek hasn't been a coach as long as some of his contemporaries, but long enough for Phil to have to let Jeff do his thing. This isn't Fisher we're talking about, and I think Phil understands that.

When he began coaching last season, it was Jeff Hornacek’s 2013-14 success as a rookie Suns coach that gave him inspiration and a model for how he would lead the Warriors. He said he even stole some of Hornacek’s plays for his playbook.

Part of what built Kerr's confidence and model for the job was watching Jeff Hornacek, his former 1988-89 Suns teammate, take over Phoenix last season and guide the Suns to a 48-34 season.

"Jeff and I are pretty similar personalities," Kerr said. "There's a lot of fire inside, but pretty calm and laid-back at the same time. I think players appreciate that. You don't want a huge emotional ride every single day, but you've got to have some direction and some fire. So I looked at Jeff and the job he did last year and the success he had, and I drew inspiration from that. I still watch him and watch his team with a lot of respect. They do a lot of really innovative things offensively, and they play hard."

“I’m a big fan,” Kerr said Saturday at Chesapeake Energy Arena, where he prepped his Warriors for Sunday’s Western Conference finals Game 3 against the Thunder. “I was a teammate of Jeff’s in Phoenix, played against him my whole career.

“I thought he did a phenomenal job in Phoenix. That first year he got them to within a game of the playoffs in a loaded conference in a year when they were supposed to be a high lottery team.”

“This guy has a great knowledge of the game, great feel, and he’s a really top-notch human being. I thought he was a great choice.”

nixluva wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:I think if KP is having monster games in large part due to P&R, Phil isn't going to force the issue as it will be seen as trying to fix something that ain't broke. Hornacek hasn't been a coach as long as some of his contemporaries, but long enough for Phil to have to let Jeff do his thing. This isn't Fisher we're talking about, and I think Phil understands that.

I've mentioned this before but Hornacek was an inspiration for Kerr. Kerr openly expressed that he really liked how Jeff coached the Suns and that he decided to use a lot of the things he was doing with the Suns when he took the GS job.

When he began coaching last season, it was Jeff Hornacek’s 2013-14 success as a rookie Suns coach that gave him inspiration and a model for how he would lead the Warriors. He said he even stole some of Hornacek’s plays for his playbook.

http://www.azcentral.com/story/sports/nba/suns/2016/02/10/steve-kerr-feels-jeff-hornaceks-phoenix-suns-demise/80213012/

Part of what built Kerr's confidence and model for the job was watching Jeff Hornacek, his former 1988-89 Suns teammate, take over Phoenix last season and guide the Suns to a 48-34 season.

"Jeff and I are pretty similar personalities," Kerr said. "There's a lot of fire inside, but pretty calm and laid-back at the same time. I think players appreciate that. You don't want a huge emotional ride every single day, but you've got to have some direction and some fire. So I looked at Jeff and the job he did last year and the success he had, and I drew inspiration from that. I still watch him and watch his team with a lot of respect. They do a lot of really innovative things offensively, and they play hard."

“I’m a big fan,” Kerr said Saturday at Chesapeake Energy Arena, where he prepped his Warriors for Sunday’s Western Conference finals Game 3 against the Thunder. “I was a teammate of Jeff’s in Phoenix, played against him my whole career.

“I thought he did a phenomenal job in Phoenix. That first year he got them to within a game of the playoffs in a loaded conference in a year when they were supposed to be a high lottery team.”

“This guy has a great knowledge of the game, great feel, and he’s a really top-notch human being. I thought he was a great choice.”

Thank you for posting nixluva. Your stamina is that of a demigod

nixluva wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:I think if KP is having monster games in large part due to P&R, Phil isn't going to force the issue as it will be seen as trying to fix something that ain't broke. Hornacek hasn't been a coach as long as some of his contemporaries, but long enough for Phil to have to let Jeff do his thing. This isn't Fisher we're talking about, and I think Phil understands that.

I've mentioned this before but Hornacek was an inspiration for Kerr. Kerr openly expressed that he really liked how Jeff coached the Suns and that he decided to use a lot of the things he was doing with the Suns when he took the GS job.

When he began coaching last season, it was Jeff Hornacek’s 2013-14 success as a rookie Suns coach that gave him inspiration and a model for how he would lead the Warriors. He said he even stole some of Hornacek’s plays for his playbook.

http://www.azcentral.com/story/sports/nba/suns/2016/02/10/steve-kerr-feels-jeff-hornaceks-phoenix-suns-demise/80213012/

Part of what built Kerr's confidence and model for the job was watching Jeff Hornacek, his former 1988-89 Suns teammate, take over Phoenix last season and guide the Suns to a 48-34 season.

"Jeff and I are pretty similar personalities," Kerr said. "There's a lot of fire inside, but pretty calm and laid-back at the same time. I think players appreciate that. You don't want a huge emotional ride every single day, but you've got to have some direction and some fire. So I looked at Jeff and the job he did last year and the success he had, and I drew inspiration from that. I still watch him and watch his team with a lot of respect. They do a lot of really innovative things offensively, and they play hard."

“I’m a big fan,” Kerr said Saturday at Chesapeake Energy Arena, where he prepped his Warriors for Sunday’s Western Conference finals Game 3 against the Thunder. “I was a teammate of Jeff’s in Phoenix, played against him my whole career.

“I thought he did a phenomenal job in Phoenix. That first year he got them to within a game of the playoffs in a loaded conference in a year when they were supposed to be a high lottery team.”

“This guy has a great knowledge of the game, great feel, and he’s a really top-notch human being. I thought he was a great choice.”

Really not germain to what I said. My point is, if Hornacek finds more succcess trying something other than the Triangle, be it by design, or just the way things shake out during the season. I dont believe Phil is going to say that he doesn't care if it works, he wants more Triangle. Thats what the title of your thread is about isnt it? Thought I was agreeing with you that he wont be so rigid.

nixluva wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

nixluva wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:I think if KP is having monster games in large part due to P&R, Phil isn't going to force the issue as it will be seen as trying to fix something that ain't broke. Hornacek hasn't been a coach as long as some of his contemporaries, but long enough for Phil to have to let Jeff do his thing. This isn't Fisher we're talking about, and I think Phil understands that.

I've mentioned this before but Hornacek was an inspiration for Kerr. Kerr openly expressed that he really liked how Jeff coached the Suns and that he decided to use a lot of the things he was doing with the Suns when he took the GS job.

When he began coaching last season, it was Jeff Hornacek’s 2013-14 success as a rookie Suns coach that gave him inspiration and a model for how he would lead the Warriors. He said he even stole some of Hornacek’s plays for his playbook.

http://www.azcentral.com/story/sports/nba/suns/2016/02/10/steve-kerr-feels-jeff-hornaceks-phoenix-suns-demise/80213012/

Part of what built Kerr's confidence and model for the job was watching Jeff Hornacek, his former 1988-89 Suns teammate, take over Phoenix last season and guide the Suns to a 48-34 season.

"Jeff and I are pretty similar personalities," Kerr said. "There's a lot of fire inside, but pretty calm and laid-back at the same time. I think players appreciate that. You don't want a huge emotional ride every single day, but you've got to have some direction and some fire. So I looked at Jeff and the job he did last year and the success he had, and I drew inspiration from that. I still watch him and watch his team with a lot of respect. They do a lot of really innovative things offensively, and they play hard."

“I’m a big fan,” Kerr said Saturday at Chesapeake Energy Arena, where he prepped his Warriors for Sunday’s Western Conference finals Game 3 against the Thunder. “I was a teammate of Jeff’s in Phoenix, played against him my whole career.

“I thought he did a phenomenal job in Phoenix. That first year he got them to within a game of the playoffs in a loaded conference in a year when they were supposed to be a high lottery team.”

“This guy has a great knowledge of the game, great feel, and he’s a really top-notch human being. I thought he was a great choice.”

Really not germain to what I said. My point is, if Hornacek finds more succcess trying something other than the Triangle, be it by design, or just the way things shake out during the season. I dont believe Phil is going to say that he doesn't care if it works, he wants more Triangle. Thats what the title of your thread is about isnt it? Thought I was agreeing with you that he wont be so rigid.

I can't really say that I understand your point. What i'm saying is I don't see Phil adding PG's that don't fit the typical Triangle PG he normally goes for and then adding Hornacek who is not a Triangle Coach, and somehow Phil is going to be expecting Pure Triangle. JH was brought in to CHANGE the Triangle and make it more palatable to the players and the style of the game now.

with that new coach, you still sticking to that Triangle, Phil? His answer, courtesy of ESPN’s Ian Begley, finally included some real common sense.

“The 3-point line has become our affection, because it means more when we make a 3-point shot. So the spacing has changed dramatically,” Jackson said at a promotional event with Shaquille O’Neal and ESPN’s Hannah Storm. “So the triangle can still be a part of that, but it has to adapt.”

http://uproxx.com/dimemag/phil-jackson-triangle-tweaks/

So when I read or listen to a media guy talk about Phil possibly interfering or not being on board with changes Hornacek might bring I have to laugh. Phil is not stupid. He knows exactly what he did this summer and the massive change it will bring to how the team plays. Why would he make all this change and then be upset by Hornacek making changes? It makes ZERO sense.

Your thread title is about how much autonomy Jeff will have. I agreed with you that Jeff will have the autonomy to try different things, even if it goes beyond what Phil initially envisioned.

I believe Phil wants to win, that he knows he wont be prez forever. If Jeff discovers some ancient scrolls from the bball Gods with some amazing plays, I believe Phil will let Jeff use them.

nixluva wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

nixluva wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

nixluva wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:I think if KP is having monster games in large part due to P&R, Phil isn't going to force the issue as it will be seen as trying to fix something that ain't broke. Hornacek hasn't been a coach as long as some of his contemporaries, but long enough for Phil to have to let Jeff do his thing. This isn't Fisher we're talking about, and I think Phil understands that.

I've mentioned this before but Hornacek was an inspiration for Kerr. Kerr openly expressed that he really liked how Jeff coached the Suns and that he decided to use a lot of the things he was doing with the Suns when he took the GS job.

When he began coaching last season, it was Jeff Hornacek’s 2013-14 success as a rookie Suns coach that gave him inspiration and a model for how he would lead the Warriors. He said he even stole some of Hornacek’s plays for his playbook.

http://www.azcentral.com/story/sports/nba/suns/2016/02/10/steve-kerr-feels-jeff-hornaceks-phoenix-suns-demise/80213012/

Part of what built Kerr's confidence and model for the job was watching Jeff Hornacek, his former 1988-89 Suns teammate, take over Phoenix last season and guide the Suns to a 48-34 season.

"Jeff and I are pretty similar personalities," Kerr said. "There's a lot of fire inside, but pretty calm and laid-back at the same time. I think players appreciate that. You don't want a huge emotional ride every single day, but you've got to have some direction and some fire. So I looked at Jeff and the job he did last year and the success he had, and I drew inspiration from that. I still watch him and watch his team with a lot of respect. They do a lot of really innovative things offensively, and they play hard."

“I’m a big fan,” Kerr said Saturday at Chesapeake Energy Arena, where he prepped his Warriors for Sunday’s Western Conference finals Game 3 against the Thunder. “I was a teammate of Jeff’s in Phoenix, played against him my whole career.

“I thought he did a phenomenal job in Phoenix. That first year he got them to within a game of the playoffs in a loaded conference in a year when they were supposed to be a high lottery team.”

“This guy has a great knowledge of the game, great feel, and he’s a really top-notch human being. I thought he was a great choice.”

Really not germain to what I said. My point is, if Hornacek finds more succcess trying something other than the Triangle, be it by design, or just the way things shake out during the season. I dont believe Phil is going to say that he doesn't care if it works, he wants more Triangle. Thats what the title of your thread is about isnt it? Thought I was agreeing with you that he wont be so rigid.

I can't really say that I understand your point. What i'm saying is I don't see Phil adding PG's that don't fit the typical Triangle PG he normally goes for and then adding Hornacek who is not a Triangle Coach, and somehow Phil is going to be expecting Pure Triangle. JH was brought in to CHANGE the Triangle and make it more palatable to the players and the style of the game now.

with that new coach, you still sticking to that Triangle, Phil? His answer, courtesy of ESPN’s Ian Begley, finally included some real common sense.

“The 3-point line has become our affection, because it means more when we make a 3-point shot. So the spacing has changed dramatically,” Jackson said at a promotional event with Shaquille O’Neal and ESPN’s Hannah Storm. “So the triangle can still be a part of that, but it has to adapt.”

http://uproxx.com/dimemag/phil-jackson-triangle-tweaks/

So when I read or listen to a media guy talk about Phil possibly interfering or not being on board with changes Hornacek might bring I have to laugh. Phil is not stupid. He knows exactly what he did this summer and the massive change it will bring to how the team plays. Why would he make all this change and then be upset by Hornacek making changes? It makes ZERO sense.

Your thread title is about how much autonomy Jeff will have. I agreed with you that Jeff will have the autonomy to try different things, even if it goes beyond what Phil initially envisioned.

I believe Phil wants to win, that he knows he wont be prez forever. If Jeff discovers some ancient scrolls from the bball Gods with some amazing plays, I believe Phil will let Jeff use them.

OK I got'cha now. Yeah I look forward to this season and seeing what Hornacek does with this roster. I think Phil has no choice but to let JH do his thing cuz he won't get another Coach at this point. This is it. It's Hornacek or Bust. This was an ALL IN proposition.

I agree. Jeff was on my short list of candidates, glad that Phil made the call sink or swim. Hornacek has proven he can succeed with the right roster. Thats what I wanted to see on our next coach's resume, and that's who Phil got us.

HofstraBBall wrote:Hornacek will have full control to do whatever he wants. People have short memories. How many were complaining about Phil's lack of involvement early on with Fisher? He only started getting involved towards end when Fishers inexperience and off court issues emerged. Phil is smart enough to realize Jeff is no Derek Fisher when it comes to coaching experience. Think he also realizes the mistake he made hiring someone that did not have a tested system in place. This hire was clearly about Phil choosing a system he felt comfortable with, not just a coach. Why would he then try to change it?

Jeff and Phil talked basketball for hours. It's obvious Jeff impressed Phil with his basketball mind and ideas for updating the Triangle. I'm sure Jeff talked about how he'd use KP and Melo. Phil seemed very relaxed and confident with the selection of Hornacek. It's not like Phil doesn't know what kind of coach Jeff is or what kind of changes he's going to make.

StarksEwing1 wrote:Personally i dont care what system we run as long as we win. If jeff feels he wants to use a different system that yields better results then phil needs to let him

That's pretty much how Hornacek coaches. He will coach to the strengths of his players and make the game easier for them. There's often too much emphasis on specifics of whether Jeff will use Triangle or not. He's gonna have the tam playing basketball. The most important things for him are playing smart, fast and efficient. He knows how to accomplish that. Jeff doesn't want his players out there thinking so much that they aren't able to play fast. Not fast as in running recklessly, but at a good game speed that puts a defense on its heels and unable to recover quickly enough. That's a controlled speed. All you have to do is look at how his teams in PHX played and you get the idea. Everyone was involved and in the flow.