[ IMAGES: Images ON turn off | ACCOUNT: User Status is LOCKED why? ]

Knickerblogger Article: Move Along. Nothing to See Here. (And that's just fine)
Author Thread
CrushAlot
Posts: 59764
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 7/25/2003
Member: #452
USA
5/7/2016  10:22 AM
God. People are about to make me—a dyed in the wool hater of the 90s Bulls—defend Big Chief Triangle. This coaching search has brought out the absolute worst in NY media, and in many Knicks fans. The hissy-fits. The foot-stomping. The limp-bodied collapse in the middle of the grocery store checkout line, complete with wailing, tears, and snot.

And that’s just Berman and Isola.

The Daily News/Post brigade can’t even settle on why it’s mad anymore. It’s the triangle they hate. It’s not getting Steve Kerr. (Coffee is for closers Jackson.) It’s that Jackson’s ego is out of control. And, how dare he leave for LA?

I expect that from them.

But this afternoon’s absolute garbage post at USA Today’s “The Big Lead,” by Jason McIntyre has me writing my first Knickerblogger post here in I don’t even know how long. No link, because the headline, “Phil Jackson on Vacation During the Knicks Coaching Search Means He Probably Has Somebody in Mind” is—by far—the most coherent thing in the post. Yet, nothing about it appears until line 23 (of 28):

Surely Jackson’s vacation means he has a plan, right? Like maybe he’s got an assistant coach from one of the teams still in the playoffs on his radar? Gosh I hope so.

You know what though. I’m not even really that mad. Instead, I’m hating myself for only now seeing the awful truth. Phil Jackson isn’t the problem. Everyone else is. You know why this coaching search has been so controversial? It’s a placebo effect. Much like in studies where people drink non-alcoholic beer but think they’re actually drunk, they get slurred speech, slowed reactions, problems with balance—all the hallmarks of intoxication.

The notion that the Knicks are a cheap punchline has become so second nature no matter what they do it is assumed to be dumb. Most of us think they’re incapable of basic orthodoxy, much less doing something intelligent.

So what we are seeing is increasingly hysterical reaction to an orthodox—if deliberate—coaching search; one that barely even qualifies as quirky. People who should know better are acting like Phil is demanding that candidates hold their hand over a flame and recite a blood oath in Latin to the triangle. Thing is, there’s really no compelling argument to be made that it’s been poorly managed.

Does that mean that Phil didn’t make a mistake by letting Thibs get away? I don’t know. Thibs is obviously the most accomplished candidate on the market this cycle.

But let’s look at the barrage of claims about why this is “worst coaching search ever” one-by-one, shall we?

Claim #1. Phil is only gonna talk to his “triangle cronies!”

This has undergone a number of permutations.

First it was: This is all just window dressing so he can hire his buddy Rambis. The arrogance. The insatiable ego.

Now it’s: Thiiiiibbs!!! See. Phil’s still got an axe to grind with Van Gundy! Ah. Ah. Aaaaaahhhhh! Fire!

Look. There is a reasonable concern to be raised about Phil’s openness to contrasting approaches to the game. I get it. That Thibs was evidently never a serious candidate is worrisome and potentially a huge mistake. However, this legit concern has been pushed to ridiculous lengths to incite an atmosphere of hysteria. Few GMs would strongly consider a coach whose core ideas about the best way to play are nearly antithetical to his own. If Pop dropped dead today I’d bet an amount of money that matters that the San Antonio brass isn’t calling Mike Woodson to install iso-ball.

No matter how much some of us want Phil to “reject and denounce” Tex Winter’s offense as some sort of litmus test, he’s not going to. Yet, he’s objectively done enough to assuage concerns that he’s dismissive of other approaches. At this point I’d argue that Phil’s being far less dogmatic on this issue than many of his critics. As many times as he has said “system basketball,” paired with his initial efforts to hire Kerr, and his apparent interest in David Blatt and Luke Walton, the question seems settled. Phil is committed to a system that emphasizes weak side movement. He’s not going to consider a coach with a screen-roll dominant approach to the game.

It’s not an unassailable stance, but the old man might actually be onto something. Consider that putting Melo in a pass and cut offense resulted in his most complete season. Also consider the unspeakable atrocity the Toronto and OKC offenses can devolve into at times, despite their talent.

Claim #2. This coaching search lacks any semblance of transparency!

This claim is true. It’s not even a strawman argument like the triangle hysteria. Yet, this is what “normal” NBA searches look like in large part because there IS no normal in NBA coaching searches. NBA coaches come from all over. So it’s always hard to confirm the entire consideration set. You don’t get a complete list, even if you identify the presumptive leading candidate. That is the status quo for searches. We likely won’t know much about who Larry Bird considered in Indiana until after they’ve announced the new coach, maybe not even then. Yet no one will bat an eye if Bird hires Nate Macmillan, but then we hear months later that Rick Pitino was also in the consideration set.

At least for the time being, this is also the new normal at MSG. You know what it looks like when your beloved franchise doesn’t have a million leaks putting everything out in the street before it even happens? Well, sometimes it looks like nobody is doing anything, and that’s making some people anxious, some physically ill. But this is a good thing. They’ll get used to it.

Claim #3. Vacation?!? Not a sabbatical. Not a sabbatical. Not a leave of absence. Vacation.

People should shut the hell up about a 70-something year old man taking care of his health and sanity by going on vacation. Some of y’all need to try it. People are out here giving billions of dollars back to companies by leaving vacation on the table, based in many instances entirely on peer pressure. It’s insanity. From a basketball standpoint there’s just nothing to discuss about Vacation-gate, as the Knicks have already been in touch with Vogel’s people. Evidently, Jackson delegates well, owns a phone, or both.

So here’s the thing Knicks fans. This is what a grown-up rebuild looks like. It’s slow. It’s frustrating. A lot of the time it looks like nothing is happening. Yet this is exactly what many supposed smart Knicks fans called for.

Is Phil quirky? Sure, but you knew that. Has he made some missteps? Absolutely. I haven’t loved every move and his intuition about the kind of coach the team needs may well be wrong. But in the broad brush strokes, Knicks fans are largely getting what they should expect out of a reasonably well-run rebuild. Phil has gotten a more complete Melo than any other leadership team. He’s found reasonable talent, and put those guys into roles where they could excel, like Rolo and Derrick Williams, and obviously he drafted/traded for Porzingis and Grant. We need more of the same from Phil, because this is a James Dolan-sized hole.

Recent Comments

http://knickerblogger.net/move-along-nothing-to-see-here-and-thats-just-fine/
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
AUTOADVERT
CrushAlot
Posts: 59764
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 7/25/2003
Member: #452
USA
5/7/2016  10:28 AM
God. People are about to make me—a dyed in the wool hater of the 90s Bulls—defend Big Chief Triangle. This coaching search has brought out the absolute worst in NY media, and in many Knicks fans. The hissy-fits. The foot-stomping. The limp-bodied collapse in the middle of the grocery store checkout line, complete with wailing, tears, and snot.
And that’s just Berman and Isola
.
Very well said.
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
nixluva
Posts: 56258
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 10/5/2004
Member: #758
USA
5/7/2016  10:46 AM
BRAVO!!! Great article. This media witch hunt has been embarrassing. It just never ends. Thank goodness there are some who see the hypocrisy in this crap.
wargames
Posts: 22833
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 5/27/2015
Member: #6053

5/7/2016  10:49 AM    LAST EDITED: 5/7/2016  10:50 AM
Yep this whole coaching thing has NY Knicks beat writers (minus Herring, Begley, and Hahn) all looking pretty damn foolish

The only legit critique was the idea of Rambis as a HC but its definitely snowballed into bad comedy these last few weeks.

The algorithm gives and the algorithm takes away
newyorker4ever
Posts: 26515
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 5/19/2014
Member: #5816

5/7/2016  10:59 AM
CrushAlot wrote:
God. People are about to make me—a dyed in the wool hater of the 90s Bulls—defend Big Chief Triangle. This coaching search has brought out the absolute worst in NY media, and in many Knicks fans. The hissy-fits. The foot-stomping. The limp-bodied collapse in the middle of the grocery store checkout line, complete with wailing, tears, and snot.

And that’s just Berman and Isola.

The Daily News/Post brigade can’t even settle on why it’s mad anymore. It’s the triangle they hate. It’s not getting Steve Kerr. (Coffee is for closers Jackson.) It’s that Jackson’s ego is out of control. And, how dare he leave for LA?

I expect that from them.

But this afternoon’s absolute garbage post at USA Today’s “The Big Lead,” by Jason McIntyre has me writing my first Knickerblogger post here in I don’t even know how long. No link, because the headline, “Phil Jackson on Vacation During the Knicks Coaching Search Means He Probably Has Somebody in Mind” is—by far—the most coherent thing in the post. Yet, nothing about it appears until line 23 (of 28):

Surely Jackson’s vacation means he has a plan, right? Like maybe he’s got an assistant coach from one of the teams still in the playoffs on his radar? Gosh I hope so.

You know what though. I’m not even really that mad. Instead, I’m hating myself for only now seeing the awful truth. Phil Jackson isn’t the problem. Everyone else is. You know why this coaching search has been so controversial? It’s a placebo effect. Much like in studies where people drink non-alcoholic beer but think they’re actually drunk, they get slurred speech, slowed reactions, problems with balance—all the hallmarks of intoxication.

The notion that the Knicks are a cheap punchline has become so second nature no matter what they do it is assumed to be dumb. Most of us think they’re incapable of basic orthodoxy, much less doing something intelligent.

So what we are seeing is increasingly hysterical reaction to an orthodox—if deliberate—coaching search; one that barely even qualifies as quirky. People who should know better are acting like Phil is demanding that candidates hold their hand over a flame and recite a blood oath in Latin to the triangle. Thing is, there’s really no compelling argument to be made that it’s been poorly managed.

Does that mean that Phil didn’t make a mistake by letting Thibs get away? I don’t know. Thibs is obviously the most accomplished candidate on the market this cycle.

But let’s look at the barrage of claims about why this is “worst coaching search ever” one-by-one, shall we?

Claim #1. Phil is only gonna talk to his “triangle cronies!”

This has undergone a number of permutations.

First it was: This is all just window dressing so he can hire his buddy Rambis. The arrogance. The insatiable ego.

Now it’s: Thiiiiibbs!!! See. Phil’s still got an axe to grind with Van Gundy! Ah. Ah. Aaaaaahhhhh! Fire!

Look. There is a reasonable concern to be raised about Phil’s openness to contrasting approaches to the game. I get it. That Thibs was evidently never a serious candidate is worrisome and potentially a huge mistake. However, this legit concern has been pushed to ridiculous lengths to incite an atmosphere of hysteria. Few GMs would strongly consider a coach whose core ideas about the best way to play are nearly antithetical to his own. If Pop dropped dead today I’d bet an amount of money that matters that the San Antonio brass isn’t calling Mike Woodson to install iso-ball.

No matter how much some of us want Phil to “reject and denounce” Tex Winter’s offense as some sort of litmus test, he’s not going to. Yet, he’s objectively done enough to assuage concerns that he’s dismissive of other approaches. At this point I’d argue that Phil’s being far less dogmatic on this issue than many of his critics. As many times as he has said “system basketball,” paired with his initial efforts to hire Kerr, and his apparent interest in David Blatt and Luke Walton, the question seems settled. Phil is committed to a system that emphasizes weak side movement. He’s not going to consider a coach with a screen-roll dominant approach to the game.

It’s not an unassailable stance, but the old man might actually be onto something. Consider that putting Melo in a pass and cut offense resulted in his most complete season. Also consider the unspeakable atrocity the Toronto and OKC offenses can devolve into at times, despite their talent.

Claim #2. This coaching search lacks any semblance of transparency!

This claim is true. It’s not even a strawman argument like the triangle hysteria. Yet, this is what “normal” NBA searches look like in large part because there IS no normal in NBA coaching searches. NBA coaches come from all over. So it’s always hard to confirm the entire consideration set. You don’t get a complete list, even if you identify the presumptive leading candidate. That is the status quo for searches. We likely won’t know much about who Larry Bird considered in Indiana until after they’ve announced the new coach, maybe not even then. Yet no one will bat an eye if Bird hires Nate Macmillan, but then we hear months later that Rick Pitino was also in the consideration set.

At least for the time being, this is also the new normal at MSG. You know what it looks like when your beloved franchise doesn’t have a million leaks putting everything out in the street before it even happens? Well, sometimes it looks like nobody is doing anything, and that’s making some people anxious, some physically ill. But this is a good thing. They’ll get used to it.

Claim #3. Vacation?!? Not a sabbatical. Not a sabbatical. Not a leave of absence. Vacation.

People should shut the hell up about a 70-something year old man taking care of his health and sanity by going on vacation. Some of y’all need to try it. People are out here giving billions of dollars back to companies by leaving vacation on the table, based in many instances entirely on peer pressure. It’s insanity. From a basketball standpoint there’s just nothing to discuss about Vacation-gate, as the Knicks have already been in touch with Vogel’s people. Evidently, Jackson delegates well, owns a phone, or both.

So here’s the thing Knicks fans. This is what a grown-up rebuild looks like. It’s slow. It’s frustrating. A lot of the time it looks like nothing is happening. Yet this is exactly what many supposed smart Knicks fans called for.

Is Phil quirky? Sure, but you knew that. Has he made some missteps? Absolutely. I haven’t loved every move and his intuition about the kind of coach the team needs may well be wrong. But in the broad brush strokes, Knicks fans are largely getting what they should expect out of a reasonably well-run rebuild. Phil has gotten a more complete Melo than any other leadership team. He’s found reasonable talent, and put those guys into roles where they could excel, like Rolo and Derrick Williams, and obviously he drafted/traded for Porzingis and Grant. We need more of the same from Phil, because this is a James Dolan-sized hole.

Recent Comments

http://knickerblogger.net/move-along-nothing-to-see-here-and-thats-just-fine/

Well looky here, a writer that knows how to speak the truth and say how it really is. Ok Phil haters lets see you do your best to pick this article apart like you do so well but never make sense while doing it.

crzymdups
Posts: 52018
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 5/1/2004
Member: #671
USA
5/7/2016  11:03 AM
That article sucks and is not well written and has fewer facts than a Berman article. But I'm glad it made some of you feel better.
¿ △ ?
CrushAlot
Posts: 59764
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 7/25/2003
Member: #452
USA
5/7/2016  11:05 AM
crzymdups wrote:That article sucks and is not well written and has fewer facts than a Berman article. But I'm glad it made some of you feel better.
None of the coaching speculation articles/phil bashing articles have had any facts in them.
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
nixluva
Posts: 56258
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 10/5/2004
Member: #758
USA
5/7/2016  11:17 AM
crzymdups wrote:That article sucks and is not well written and has fewer facts than a Berman article. But I'm glad it made some of you feel better.

Wow! You actually don't see the points in this article as being right on target? The media and some fans have really gone overboard with their reactions to Phil. Phil's moves have been pretty measured and logical. He's put the team in a more future leaning position. His drafts have been full of added picks.

His coaching search is slow and deliberate. There are more good coaches coming free as he waits to make his final decision. People need to get over Thibs or JVG not getting an interview.

newyorker4ever
Posts: 26515
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 5/19/2014
Member: #5816

5/7/2016  11:27 AM
crzymdups wrote:That article sucks and is not well written and has fewer facts than a Berman article. But I'm glad it made some of you feel better.

Hahahaha, welcome hater #1.

DrAlphaeus
Posts: 23751
Alba Posts: 10
Joined: 12/19/2007
Member: #1781

5/7/2016  1:10 PM
Yea I want to hear what was factually wrong and what about the writing made it not well written.
Baba Booey 2016 — "It's Silly Season"
DrAlphaeus
Posts: 23751
Alba Posts: 10
Joined: 12/19/2007
Member: #1781

5/7/2016  1:11 PM
I have a problem with beat writers not reporting and essentially fantasizing and blogging. I don't hold a blogger to the same standard as Berman. It's an editorial.
Baba Booey 2016 — "It's Silly Season"
StarksEwing1
Posts: 32671
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 12/28/2012
Member: #4451

5/7/2016  3:12 PM
Unless its a positive article about the knicks it has no facts i guess
nixluva
Posts: 56258
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 10/5/2004
Member: #758
USA
5/7/2016  4:04 PM
StarksEwing1 wrote:Unless its a positive article about the knicks it has no facts i guess

You have to admit that a lot of these mostly negative articles are unsubstantiated rumors and flat out guesses and assumptions! They then find out they were wrong and instead of admitting it they change the argument and keep up the negative angle. It's a joke.

StarksEwing1
Posts: 32671
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 12/28/2012
Member: #4451

5/7/2016  4:11 PM
nixluva wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:Unless its a positive article about the knicks it has no facts i guess

You have to admit that a lot of these mostly negative articles are unsubstantiated rumors and flat out guesses and assumptions! They then find out they were wrong and instead of admitting it they change the argument and keep up the negative angle. It's a joke.

some are i agree with you. However some make pretty fair points even if they arent flattering. Like i have said millions of time the knicks are my favorite sports team BUT im not afraid to be critical when they deserve criticism. I respect the optimistic crowd but sometimes i feel like they are afraid to criticize the knicks even when its true
CrushAlot
Posts: 59764
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 7/25/2003
Member: #452
USA
5/7/2016  4:14 PM
StarksEwing1 wrote:Unless its a positive article about the knicks it has no facts i guess
I liked these quotes.
So what we are seeing is increasingly hysterical reaction to an orthodox—if deliberate—coaching search; one that barely even qualifies as quirky. People who should know better are acting like Phil is demanding that candidates hold their hand over a flame and recite a blood oath in Latin to the triangle. Thing is, there’s really no compelling argument to be made that it’s been poorly managed.

So here’s the thing Knicks fans. This is what a grown-up rebuild looks like. It’s slow. It’s frustrating. A lot of the time it looks like nothing is happening. Yet this is exactly what many supposed smart Knicks fans called for.

What do you think Starks?
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
StarksEwing1
Posts: 32671
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 12/28/2012
Member: #4451

5/7/2016  4:18 PM    LAST EDITED: 5/7/2016  4:19 PM
CrushAlot wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:Unless its a positive article about the knicks it has no facts i guess
I liked these quotes.
So what we are seeing is increasingly hysterical reaction to an orthodox—if deliberate—coaching search; one that barely even qualifies as quirky. People who should know better are acting like Phil is demanding that candidates hold their hand over a flame and recite a blood oath in Latin to the triangle. Thing is, there’s really no compelling argument to be made that it’s been poorly managed.

So here’s the thing Knicks fans. This is what a grown-up rebuild looks like. It’s slow. It’s frustrating. A lot of the time it looks like nothing is happening. Yet this is exactly what many supposed smart Knicks fans called for.

What do you think Starks?
kinda proves my point crush as long as its a positive thing about phil or the knicks its all fine. Look i HATE negative articles about the knicks but like i told nix some do make fair points even if i dislike the negativity
Malcolm
Posts: 21469
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 8/10/2015
Member: #6131

5/7/2016  4:27 PM
newyorker4ever wrote:Is Phil quirky? Sure, but you knew that. Has he made some missteps? Absolutely. I haven’t loved every move and his intuition about the kind of coach the team needs may well be wrong. But in the broad brush strokes, Knicks fans are largely getting what they should expect out of a reasonably well-run rebuild. Phil has gotten a more complete Melo than any other leadership team. He’s found reasonable talent, and put those guys into roles where they could excel, like Rolo and Derrick Williams, and obviously he drafted/traded for Porzingis and Grant. We need more of the same from Phil . . .
My only concern about Jackson is . . . what the hell he could have been thinking when he hired Fisher.

Without the Fisher hire . . . I give him a B(+).

Lopez, Anthony, Porzingis, Williams -- all very good moves.

Grant and Thomas -- may still work out.

Afflalo and Calderon were mistakes -- but reasonable tries.

Shved was probably a significant mistake (related to Fisher mistake).

Fisher was a BIG mistake.

Overall: I give Jackson a B(-) grade . . .

foosballnick
Posts: 21546
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 6/17/2010
Member: #3148

5/7/2016  4:34 PM
Criticizing Phil for a move he made that didn't work out makes sense. Criticizing Phil based on speculation of a move that he has not made seems silly.
nixluva
Posts: 56258
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 10/5/2004
Member: #758
USA
5/7/2016  4:37 PM
Malcolm wrote:
newyorker4ever wrote:Is Phil quirky? Sure, but you knew that. Has he made some missteps? Absolutely. I haven’t loved every move and his intuition about the kind of coach the team needs may well be wrong. But in the broad brush strokes, Knicks fans are largely getting what they should expect out of a reasonably well-run rebuild. Phil has gotten a more complete Melo than any other leadership team. He’s found reasonable talent, and put those guys into roles where they could excel, like Rolo and Derrick Williams, and obviously he drafted/traded for Porzingis and Grant. We need more of the same from Phil . . .
My only concern about Jackson is . . . what the hell he could have been thinking when he hired Fisher.

Without the Fisher hire . . . I give him a B(+).

Lopez, Anthony, Porzingis, Williams -- all very good moves.

Grant and Thomas -- may still work out.

Afflalo and Calderon were mistakes -- but reasonable tries.

Shved was probably a significant mistake (related to Fisher mistake).

Fisher was a BIG mistake.

Overall: I give Jackson a B(-) grade . . .

With Fisher he saw a natural leader. Raw but with a veteran staff and with Phil's help, it was hoped they could develop Fish into a very good coach. That's how Phil explained it. It didn't work as he hoped. They weren't on the same page as much as Phil thought they were.

Fish didn't really hurt that much. The 17 win season was meaningless. Last year isn't going to leave any lasting damage. He simply wasn't here long enough and after he left they simply went deeper into the Triangle. Since the system is remaining it limits any long term impact on the players IMO.

CrushAlot
Posts: 59764
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 7/25/2003
Member: #452
USA
5/7/2016  4:45 PM
Malcolm wrote:
newyorker4ever wrote:Is Phil quirky? Sure, but you knew that. Has he made some missteps? Absolutely. I haven’t loved every move and his intuition about the kind of coach the team needs may well be wrong. But in the broad brush strokes, Knicks fans are largely getting what they should expect out of a reasonably well-run rebuild. Phil has gotten a more complete Melo than any other leadership team. He’s found reasonable talent, and put those guys into roles where they could excel, like Rolo and Derrick Williams, and obviously he drafted/traded for Porzingis and Grant. We need more of the same from Phil . . .
My only concern about Jackson is . . . what the hell he could have been thinking when he hired Fisher.

Without the Fisher hire . . . I give him a B(+).

Lopez, Anthony, Porzingis, Williams -- all very good moves.

Grant and Thomas -- may still work out.

Afflalo and Calderon were mistakes -- but reasonable tries.

Shved was probably a significant mistake (related to Fisher mistake).

Fisher was a BIG mistake.

Overall: I give Jackson a B(-) grade . . .

I think this is fair. I also think there is more to the fisher firing. Fisher could have easily been moved upstairs after the season and it was speculated that he would end up in an nba front office after his handling of the lockout etc.
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
Knickerblogger Article: Move Along. Nothing to See Here. (And that's just fine)

©2001-2025 ultimateknicks.comm All rights reserved. About Us.
This site is not affiliated with the NY Knicks or the National Basketball Association in any way.
You may visit the official NY Knicks web site by clicking here.

All times (GMT-05:00) Eastern Time.

Terms of Use and Privacy Policy