The issue is not that Rambis did a bad job - it was a bad roster. The question is whether the Triangle is for a team that is learning how to play the game and learning how to win. Or whether it makes more sense for a veteran team that is ready to take the next step. I have a feeling the Triangle would work wonders in OKC. Does it makes sense for NYK?

“He didn’t have the veteran, experienced team that runs the system he wanted to run,” the Minnesota staffer said. “The style of system is not conducive to total rebuilding situations, as the Knicks are. Total rebuilding situations should emphasize maniacal, in-your-face defense and a simplistic offense and try to grind games out.”

Rambis also became too obsessed with the triangle.

“He wanted the triangle to be perfect,” the former Wolves staffer added. “One night, after we gave up 120 points, he’s walking off with the coaching staff and he says, ‘We got to work on our offense.’ It sucks so much time in preparation. It required more of a veteran team like the ones Jackson had [with the Lakers and Bulls].”

http://nypost.com/2016/04/24/inside-rambis-t-wolves-fiasco-kevin-love-friction-triangle-clash/?utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=site%20buttons&utm_campaign=site%20buttons

What Phil is trying to do is hard. I admire this.

nyknickzingis wrote:The Knicks are re-building, but they have blocks that aren't rookies alone. This is a team with some age and experience. Melo has been in the league 13 years, Lopez has been in the league 7 years and Calderon has been in the league 11 years. That's 3 of your top 7 players next season, if they all return. They you have some youth with Porzingis (1 year) and Grant (1 year). That leaves about 2 spots for our top 7, which we will likely fill through capspace. It could be between 18-32 million, depending on what happens with Afflalo/Williams. I don't think Phil Jackson will be able or want to sign rookies with that capspace. It will likely be guys right in the prime of their careers, with 5+ years of experience in the league such as Lopez was. So if you break that down, the only real youth that falls under the Minnesota label would be Porzingis and Grant. Well KP showed he is born to play the Triangle. Has a great jumpshot, can play multiple positions. Showed progress in his post game and passing. Moves comfortably off the ball. Only thing missing for him is harder screen setting which is important. Grant definitely suffered at first not knowing the Triangle or having to play in it, but as the season wore on he became better and better. He finished very strong.

I don't know if the media and these guys really know the Knicks situation for next season. They'll have 5 of their top 7 players, who will likely be players who have been in the league many years. They'll have 5 of their top 7 players (Including the 2 rookies here) who already have played a year in the Triangle. Too much made about the Triangle like usual, and not enough said about the actual talent. Which is not that good, based on last year's team.

If Calderon is one of our top 7 players next season, we're in serious trouble.

fishmike wrote:this is a case of coach and FO not on the same page. I mean in Minn the triangle was Kurt's system. In NY is the Knicks system and guys that are slow to learn are going to get extra help. I also took a peek at those rosters and my god they were pretty terrible.

They were pretty damn bad, but rambis still has the same philosophy, and still has the some of the same issue here in NY as far as the roster.

We don't have anyone on the roster that knows the ins and outs of the triangle, everyone of phils former player have laughed at the thought of the knicks running the triangle, it's become the biggest joke of the league.

The elephant in the room is the question of how or why a winning team would implement a new system given the success the team may be having. That's why this critic's opinion is so worthless.

As for JVG who is a bit of a disingenuous character, he was overheard saying something to the effect of, "Why keep trying the same thing over and over and expecting a different result.", I think in snide reference to the Knicks. This, btw, a quote attributed to Einstein.

What JVG doesn't quite get is that Phil has won multiple rings with said system and is is expecting the same result with the Knicks - another ring. The fact that the system is being poorly executed by a first year rebuilding team isn't the system's fault.

JVG. Now I remember why I didn't miss him.

nyknickzingis wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

nyknickzingis wrote:The Knicks are re-building, but they have blocks that aren't rookies alone. This is a team with some age and experience. Melo has been in the league 13 years, Lopez has been in the league 7 years and Calderon has been in the league 11 years. That's 3 of your top 7 players next season, if they all return. They you have some youth with Porzingis (1 year) and Grant (1 year). That leaves about 2 spots for our top 7, which we will likely fill through capspace. It could be between 18-32 million, depending on what happens with Afflalo/Williams. I don't think Phil Jackson will be able or want to sign rookies with that capspace. It will likely be guys right in the prime of their careers, with 5+ years of experience in the league such as Lopez was. So if you break that down, the only real youth that falls under the Minnesota label would be Porzingis and Grant. Well KP showed he is born to play the Triangle. Has a great jumpshot, can play multiple positions. Showed progress in his post game and passing. Moves comfortably off the ball. Only thing missing for him is harder screen setting which is important. Grant definitely suffered at first not knowing the Triangle or having to play in it, but as the season wore on he became better and better. He finished very strong.

I don't know if the media and these guys really know the Knicks situation for next season. They'll have 5 of their top 7 players, who will likely be players who have been in the league many years. They'll have 5 of their top 7 players (Including the 2 rookies here) who already have played a year in the Triangle. Too much made about the Triangle like usual, and not enough said about the actual talent. Which is not that good, based on last year's team.

If Calderon is one of our top 7 players next season, we're in serious trouble.

Calderon was far from this team's worst guard. If you look up the game to game production, the impact on the court, Calderon was much better than Grant or Gallo, and he was better than Afflalo as well. If we can get better players than Afflalo at 2 guard, Grant can be a better player next year (sort of like how he closed the season) and we get another guard to replace Galloway, I see no reason why Calderon can't be a decent top 7 or 8 player on a good team. All the Knicks need from Calderon is to make good passes, shoot the open 3 and give a good effort. He's a leader on the floor. What they need is more talent around him, players far better than Afflalo at finishing and making shots.

Calderon can absolutely contribute. I'm hoping Afflalo gets a better offer. I'd be nice to see Prigs back here next year as a deep bench player (13-15) - he'd be a great influence.

StarksEwing1 wrote:

nixluva wrote:I'll tell what is BS about this! The offense was originally used in College and High School before ever reaching the NBA!!! There are still schools using it. So basically ... MEH!

i agree anything thats not 150 percent positive knick articles must be BS

You didn't address the fact that the creator of the offense started out using it to win on the college level!!!

Tex learned the offense from Sam Barry his coach at USC back in the 40's. Tex used the Triple Post Offense in a successful college career:

In 1952, Winter began a two-year stint as head coach at Marquette University, becoming the youngest coach in major college basketball. In 1954 Winter returned to Kansas State.[4][5] Winter served as Kansas State's head coach for the following 15 years, posting a 261-118 (.689) record. He still owns the record for most league titles (eight) in school history and twice led the Wildcats to the Final Four (1958 and 1964). Winter guided K-State to postseason play seven times overall, including six trips to the NCAA Tournament, and boasts one of the highest winning percentages in K-State's history.

Winter was named UPI National Coach of the Year in 1958 after he led Kansas State to the Final Four by knocking off Oscar Robertson and second-ranked Cincinnati in an 83-80 double-overtime thriller. Junior center Bob Boozer was one of three Wildcats to be named a first team All-America, along with teammates Jack Parr and Roy DeWitz. K-State advanced to their fourth Final Four in 1964. Winter’s Wildcats knocked off Texas Western and Wichita State to reach Municipal Auditorium in Kansas City, Missouri. Two-time Big Eight selection Willie Murrell averaged 25.3 points per game during the run, which ended in a 90-82 loss to eventual national champion UCLA.

In 1962, Winter also wrote the book, entitled The Triple-Post Offense, on the triangle offense – the offense which he utilized with such success at Kansas State. Following his leaving Kansas State to his assistant Cotton Fitzsimmons, Winter served shorter stints as head coach at the University of Washington (where he was hired by then Athletic Director Joseph Kearney), Northwestern University, and Long Beach State. In 1982, LSU’s Dale Brown, who Winter befriended when Brown was a high school coach, hired him as an assistant for one year 1983-84.[6] In total, Winter won 454 games at the collegiate level.

fwk00 wrote:What's actually very sad about so many Knicks threads is this compulsive, obsessive criticism of the Triangle offense. I personally just don't get it on a technical level. On a political level I understand it as nothing less than a blunt instrument to batter the Knicks management with.

It's like a myopic body of fans whose joy in life are self-inflicted anxieties.

do you have any critical opinions or is everything always roses?

Only negative may be silly but only positive is straight up insane especially since there has been very little positive for 25 years.

Keep the faith though ... faith is awesome and it allows the belief and hope for magic and miracles.

smackeddog wrote:Since when are minnesota staffers considered basketball experts?

how about if they were on the rambis staff and saw that drunken ship up close?