dk7th wrote:very upsetting material. the author's couching of the situation is upsetting. melo's take on matters is upsetting.

2 things I thought were weird. Melo complaining about all the new players coming and going, knowing the Knicks cap situation and plans for free agency. The second was alternating between coming to NY to win and make money. Everything else seemed reasonable.

As far as the writer, thought it was a pretty straight forward Q&A. Nothing out of the ordinary about the questions IMO.

dk7th wrote:very upsetting material. the author's couching of the situation is upsetting. melo's take on matters is upsetting.

Are you blaming melo again??

This franchise was all over the place before melo got here. 12 yrs of pure bull ****, with 1 yr of mild success through it all.

From draft picks, GM's, Trades, Coaches, star players, role players, it's been a revolving fkng door.

Melo is about to have the longest tenure( 5 measly yrs) as a knick player, since allan houston 13 yrs ago. WTH does that tell you about this franchise, great coach, wrong players, right players wrong coach, and round and round we go.....cant get the sht right to save theirs lives.

You get some solid players and put a bafoon coaching staff together, and then try and teach players to play like it's 1999, then call yourself changing the culture.

Nobody on this team plays like they are having fun, they play like this is their job, a boring 9-5 that is about as redundant as taking out the garbage every tuesday at 8pm.

You got that guy in melo, get him a real coach, and some energy players.

IF ANYBODY BELIEVES WE LEAD THE LEAGUE IN MID RANGE SHOT ATTEMPTS because of the players, you deserve a open hand slap in the face, cause you need to wake up.

nyknickzingis wrote:Phil Jackson can do what every other GM in the last 20 years would do - trade draft picks, heck maybe even trade Porzingis for an all-star, and it would just repeat the same trend.

Knicks become good for a year, then they realize the team they have isn't good enough to win a championship and regret trading draft picks and investing so much in veteran all-stars who are on decline.

Melo needs help? He's had help in his career. He had help in Denver, he chose to go to NY. He had help in NY, and he didn't do much with it. Now it's about re-building the team for the longterm. If he can't accept that, if it's not going to work out for him, he can waive his NTC and we can some young players.

Is Phil building the team for the long term sake of the Knicks or his own legacy and philosophy?

DrAlphaeus wrote:

nyknickzingis wrote:Phil Jackson can do what every other GM in the last 20 years would do - trade draft picks, heck maybe even trade Porzingis for an all-star, and it would just repeat the same trend.

Knicks become good for a year, then they realize the team they have isn't good enough to win a championship and regret trading draft picks and investing so much in veteran all-stars who are on decline.

Melo needs help? He's had help in his career. He had help in Denver, he chose to go to NY. He had help in NY, and he didn't do much with it. Now it's about re-building the team for the longterm. If he can't accept that, if it's not going to work out for him, he can waive his NTC and we can some young players.

Is Phil building the team for the long term sake of the Knicks or his own legacy and philosophy?

Sure he believes in the Triangle, he believes in a certain style of play. However he has yet to make transactions or moves that have shown to be harmful to the longterm stability of the franchise. Every move he's made virtually has been with a longterm view point. In 3-4-5 years Phil may not be a Knick president, and we may not be running the Triangle. I promise you though, if Porzingis is the player he can be, if some of the picks we make in these years turn out to be good, and we sign 1 or 2 star free agents between 2016-2018, you all will be looking back and saying thank god for Phil's patience and approach. The Triangle is just a way of setting up a team on offense. Rarely do we even run it exclusively or with the type of approach some think. We go into isolations with Melo, we go into pick and rolls. Post dumps. Lots of stuff. It's about having the talent in place that can make shots, that can defend. We just don't have that talent right now.

nyknickzingis wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:

nyknickzingis wrote:Phil Jackson can do what every other GM in the last 20 years would do - trade draft picks, heck maybe even trade Porzingis for an all-star, and it would just repeat the same trend.

Knicks become good for a year, then they realize the team they have isn't good enough to win a championship and regret trading draft picks and investing so much in veteran all-stars who are on decline.

Melo needs help? He's had help in his career. He had help in Denver, he chose to go to NY. He had help in NY, and he didn't do much with it. Now it's about re-building the team for the longterm. If he can't accept that, if it's not going to work out for him, he can waive his NTC and we can some young players.

Is Phil building the team for the long term sake of the Knicks or his own legacy and philosophy?

Jerian Grant, Kristaps Porzingis and preserving picks in 2017 and 2018 are not for his legacy. Hernangomez is another solid pick. These are all moves that will likely pay dividends (maybe not all of them, but some of them) well after Phil is retired or reduced to a consultant role. He won't be working at this level 5 years from now, but guys like Porzingis may be the face of the franchise and guys that were drafted could be playing with him. In free agency we've literally got boat loads of capspace in 2017 if we want to use it then, and have considerable this summer as well.

Sure he believes in the Triangle, he believes in a certain style of play. However he has yet to make transactions or moves that have shown to be harmful to the longterm stability of the franchise. Every move he's made virtually has been with a longterm view point. In 3-4-5 years Phil may not be a Knick president, and we may not be running the Triangle. I promise you though, if Porzingis is the player he can be, if some of the picks we make in these years turn out to be good, and we sign 1 or 2 star free agents between 2016-2018, you all will be looking back and saying thank god for Phil's patience and approach. The Triangle is just a way of setting up a team on offense. Rarely do we even run it exclusively or with the type of approach some think. We go into isolations with Melo, we go into pick and rolls. Post dumps. Lots of stuff. It's about having the talent in place that can make shots, that can defend. We just don't have that talent right now.

Glad you see things half full under Phil. How many more years does he get a pass for the type of talent he has brought here so far?

We have and old PG who should be coming off the bench or retired.
A formerly retired SG who is not a machine.
An old Aflalo who does not know the meaning of the word PASS
A young 7'3 rookie that thinks he is a SG and has hit a wall.(Other teams knowing how to play him)
An All Star with bad knees that is being played to the ground.
An inconsistent Center who dissappears way too often.
A D league level back court as back ups. And no Grant not giving me any hope.
Several journeyman that play as well as any minimum salary guy in the NBA.
So...lots of old guys, D league talent and minimum salary players.

Phil has to be judged like any other GM. And so far the direction is not any better than when he arrived. We have 3 or 4 players, that would be contributors on a solid NBA team. And one of them has has hit a wall and needs to improve a lot more before we start calling him the new face of the franchise. Specially when teams have plenty of scouting reports and are now familiar with his game. Melo has been playing beter team ball but has bad knees. You would think Phil would limit his minutes as he is not going anywhere and we need him to be healthy next year. Lastly, we have Rolo, who has shown signs of being a solid contributor but also shown why he was sat so often by the Blazers.

And keep thinking that the triangle is just a way of setting up. Not smart to ignore the fact many NBA players have stated and feel it is not a system they will want to play in. Wait a minute,.. this response has totally depressed me. Lmao Your probably right, were gonna kill it next year!
Go Knicks!

DrAlphaeus wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

nyknickzingis wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:

nyknickzingis wrote:Phil Jackson can do what every other GM in the last 20 years would do - trade draft picks, heck maybe even trade Porzingis for an all-star, and it would just repeat the same trend.

Knicks become good for a year, then they realize the team they have isn't good enough to win a championship and regret trading draft picks and investing so much in veteran all-stars who are on decline.

Melo needs help? He's had help in his career. He had help in Denver, he chose to go to NY. He had help in NY, and he didn't do much with it. Now it's about re-building the team for the longterm. If he can't accept that, if it's not going to work out for him, he can waive his NTC and we can some young players.

Is Phil building the team for the long term sake of the Knicks or his own legacy and philosophy?

Jerian Grant, Kristaps Porzingis and preserving picks in 2017 and 2018 are not for his legacy. Hernangomez is another solid pick. These are all moves that will likely pay dividends (maybe not all of them, but some of them) well after Phil is retired or reduced to a consultant role. He won't be working at this level 5 years from now, but guys like Porzingis may be the face of the franchise and guys that were drafted could be playing with him. In free agency we've literally got boat loads of capspace in 2017 if we want to use it then, and have considerable this summer as well.

Sure he believes in the Triangle, he believes in a certain style of play. However he has yet to make transactions or moves that have shown to be harmful to the longterm stability of the franchise. Every move he's made virtually has been with a longterm view point. In 3-4-5 years Phil may not be a Knick president, and we may not be running the Triangle. I promise you though, if Porzingis is the player he can be, if some of the picks we make in these years turn out to be good, and we sign 1 or 2 star free agents between 2016-2018, you all will be looking back and saying thank god for Phil's patience and approach. The Triangle is just a way of setting up a team on offense. Rarely do we even run it exclusively or with the type of approach some think. We go into isolations with Melo, we go into pick and rolls. Post dumps. Lots of stuff. It's about having the talent in place that can make shots, that can defend. We just don't have that talent right now.

Glad you see things half full under Phil. How many more years does he get a pass for the type of talent he has brought here so far?

We have and old PG who should be coming off the bench or retired.
A formerly retired SG who is not a machine.
An old Aflalo who does not know the meaning of the word PASS
A young 7'3 rookie that thinks he is a SG and has hit a wall.(Other teams knowing how to play him)
An All Star with bad knees that is being played to the ground.
An inconsistent Center who dissappears way too often.
A D league level back court as back ups. And no Grant not giving me any hope.
Several journeyman that play as well as any minimum salary guy in the NBA.
So...lots of old guys, D league talent and minimum salary players.

Phil has to be judged like any other GM. And so far the direction is not any better than when he arrived. We have 3 or 4 players, that would be contributors on a solid NBA team. And one of them has has hit a wall and needs to improve a lot more before we start calling him the new face of the franchise. Specially when teams have plenty of scouting reports and are now familiar with his game. Melo has been playing beter team ball but has bad knees. You would think Phil would limit his minutes as he is not going anywhere and we need him to be healthy next year. Lastly, we have Rolo, who has shown signs of being a solid contributor but also shown why he was sat so often by the Blazers.

And keep thinking that the triangle is just a way of setting up. Not smart to ignore the fact many NBA players have stated and feel it is not a system they will want to play in. Wait a minute,.. this response has totally depressed me. Lmao Your probably right, were gonna kill it next year!
Go Knicks!

I may be too pedantic, but Mills is the GM. Phil is the President. That's part of what I'm still trying to figure out. We want to judge Phil like any other GM, but he's not the GM, and no one says boo about Mills. This Phil thing is working out great for Mills! I never hear anyone talk about him.

DrAlphaeus wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

nyknickzingis wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:

nyknickzingis wrote:Phil Jackson can do what every other GM in the last 20 years would do - trade draft picks, heck maybe even trade Porzingis for an all-star, and it would just repeat the same trend.

Knicks become good for a year, then they realize the team they have isn't good enough to win a championship and regret trading draft picks and investing so much in veteran all-stars who are on decline.

Melo needs help? He's had help in his career. He had help in Denver, he chose to go to NY. He had help in NY, and he didn't do much with it. Now it's about re-building the team for the longterm. If he can't accept that, if it's not going to work out for him, he can waive his NTC and we can some young players.

Is Phil building the team for the long term sake of the Knicks or his own legacy and philosophy?

Jerian Grant, Kristaps Porzingis and preserving picks in 2017 and 2018 are not for his legacy. Hernangomez is another solid pick. These are all moves that will likely pay dividends (maybe not all of them, but some of them) well after Phil is retired or reduced to a consultant role. He won't be working at this level 5 years from now, but guys like Porzingis may be the face of the franchise and guys that were drafted could be playing with him. In free agency we've literally got boat loads of capspace in 2017 if we want to use it then, and have considerable this summer as well.

Sure he believes in the Triangle, he believes in a certain style of play. However he has yet to make transactions or moves that have shown to be harmful to the longterm stability of the franchise. Every move he's made virtually has been with a longterm view point. In 3-4-5 years Phil may not be a Knick president, and we may not be running the Triangle. I promise you though, if Porzingis is the player he can be, if some of the picks we make in these years turn out to be good, and we sign 1 or 2 star free agents between 2016-2018, you all will be looking back and saying thank god for Phil's patience and approach. The Triangle is just a way of setting up a team on offense. Rarely do we even run it exclusively or with the type of approach some think. We go into isolations with Melo, we go into pick and rolls. Post dumps. Lots of stuff. It's about having the talent in place that can make shots, that can defend. We just don't have that talent right now.

Glad you see things half full under Phil. How many more years does he get a pass for the type of talent he has brought here so far?

We have and old PG who should be coming off the bench or retired.
A formerly retired SG who is not a machine.
An old Aflalo who does not know the meaning of the word PASS
A young 7'3 rookie that thinks he is a SG and has hit a wall.(Other teams knowing how to play him)
An All Star with bad knees that is being played to the ground.
An inconsistent Center who dissappears way too often.
A D league level back court as back ups. And no Grant not giving me any hope.
Several journeyman that play as well as any minimum salary guy in the NBA.
So...lots of old guys, D league talent and minimum salary players.

Phil has to be judged like any other GM. And so far the direction is not any better than when he arrived. We have 3 or 4 players, that would be contributors on a solid NBA team. And one of them has has hit a wall and needs to improve a lot more before we start calling him the new face of the franchise. Specially when teams have plenty of scouting reports and are now familiar with his game. Melo has been playing beter team ball but has bad knees. You would think Phil would limit his minutes as he is not going anywhere and we need him to be healthy next year. Lastly, we have Rolo, who has shown signs of being a solid contributor but also shown why he was sat so often by the Blazers.

And keep thinking that the triangle is just a way of setting up. Not smart to ignore the fact many NBA players have stated and feel it is not a system they will want to play in. Wait a minute,.. this response has totally depressed me. Lmao Your probably right, were gonna kill it next year!
Go Knicks!

I may be too pedantic, but Mills is the GM. Phil is the President. That's part of what I'm still trying to figure out. We want to judge Phil like any other GM, but he's not the GM, and no one says boo about Mills. This Phil thing is working out great for Mills! I never hear anyone talk about him.

Think we can all agree that Mills, when it comes to player personnel decisiona, has as much power as the guy selling beer.

CrushAlot wrote:

Q: The odds are that you are going to see another coach …
Anthony: “Yeah. Yeah. And more players. I just shake my head to it. Someone asked me, ‘Why haven’t you complained about it?’ Complaining doesn’t get me anywhere. I always feel like I can get through the situation and make it better.”

I am a bit worried that this isn't going to happen. It seems right now that Phil being comfortable with the coach may be more important than the coach being competent. Maybe things change but considering Rambis for next year the way things have gone seems ridiculous. It isn't working and Melo seems to be moving on from the guy already. If Phil hires a competent coach (i.e. Thibs) it sends a message to Melo and free agents that the Knicks want to win. If he keeps Rambis, coaches home games etc., I think it shows he is not willing to move away from the triangle or his small circle of guys that coached for him. I don't think that is a good look and I don't think it translates to long term success. Maybe a Walton hire works out.

Good post. That's how I feel--both about the players Phil will target as well as the next coach. How open-minded and flexible will he be? That's the million dollar question. If the answer's 'not much' then we're in big trouble.