yellowboy90 wrote:Is this really necessary to continue making thread after thread after thread on the same topic?

It took me a few years to realize why he makes so many threads.....But its very hard to explain without being disrespectful. I was always told, if you have nothing nice to say, don't say anything at all.

So I'll take the high road.....

Hiring Walton is like hiring Fisher all over again. He's unproven and a risk. This team needs to stop with these experiments. We are heading into Chicago Cubs territory. I can see if we were on our first rebuild....or 5 years removed from a championship. But it's time to put experience players in lead positions. And rookies in backup positions. The games have to stop.

Trading Melo is not the problem.....It's always been a combination of the coach and management. We need new age experience players, regardless of their age. Even if they come from college. We paid two rookies like they were veterans.....It keeps money in Dolans pockets, but drives fans crazy.....Enough is enough!

crzymdups wrote:I think it would be possible to keep Melo and compete - but we need 2-3 much higher level guards. And a much better coach.

It certainly seems like Melo is getting fed up waiting on it.

I agree about the guards and coach.....But Melo being fed up is bull ****. He knew what he was getting himself into. He thinks like Dolan ......He's trying to build a brand and he's using the attention from the NY media / press to build it. Unfortunately for him, he's receiving a black eye for his basketball legacy, as far as building a championship team around him. But thats the risk he signed up for. Nobody twisted his arm to come or stay. I was hoping he would go to Chicago personally. But now that he's here, I have no pitty for Melo. If anything, the fact that he wasn't able to attract other nba stars is another black eye on him......I've heard more people say they would love to play with KP more than Melo......That says a lot. I think players would love to add Melo to their team, but doesn't want to be on a team where Melo is the alpha dog.......just my personal opinion.

blkexec wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:Is this really necessary to continue making thread after thread after thread on the same topic?

It took me a few years to realize why he makes so many threads.....But its very hard to explain without being disrespectful. I was always told, if you have nothing nice to say, don't say anything at all.

So I'll take the high road.....

Hiring Walton is like hiring Fisher all over again. He's unproven and a risk. This team needs to stop with these experiments. We are heading into Chicago Cubs territory. I can see if we were on our first rebuild....or 5 years removed from a championship. But it's time to put experience players in lead positions. And rookies in backup positions. The games have to stop.

Trading Melo is not the problem.....It's always been a combination of the coach and management. We need new age experience players, regardless of their age. Even if they come from college. We paid two rookies like they were veterans.....It keeps money in Dolans pockets, but drives fans crazy.....Enough is enough!

You just describes the New York Knicks we already have vets all over our roster. Just the opposite we've never rebuilt the team not once we've done what you suggested the last 15 years hired I thomas Larry brown dantoni traded picks for vets. Nope hasn't worked. We have a good young player we need to be aggressive acquiring multiple young guards we need a young coach to grow who understands how the nba works and we can and should

Batum and DeRozen. That works with KP Grant, Galloway. If Williams, Thomas bolt, and if we stretch Calderon, can we get a 10-20 first round guard? Hernangomez in the rotation. Sasha gone, Seraphin gone. Afflalo Gone.

Roster

G: Grant/(Rose)/or Pick
G. Galloway Batum
SF - DeRozen, Batum,
PF. Portis/ KP (Taj G)
C. KP/ Hernangomez

If Rose TG and Portis can be done then DeRozen can't and either way to secure DeRozen would require a 3D party.
Let Thibs run this young team

crzymdups wrote:I think it would be possible to keep Melo and compete - but we need 2-3 much higher level guards. And a much better coach.

It certainly seems like Melo is getting fed up waiting on it.

Is the remainder of Melo's prime worth building around when what we trade him for could build a potential contender for 10+ year?

BRIGGS wrote:trade melo for draft picks and a good young G
With the draft picks from melo the young player traded for and next year pick. Completely rebuild the backcourt with 5-6 new guys we have the bigs now we put in the process of the backcourt. There is no one year fix in the nba. Hire like Walton he's young smart and he's been involved with a great team. No more rigid triangle bs. Good ball movement based on spacing and a diversity of guards with our quality bigs

I think it's becoming clear that Fisher wasn't the (sole) problem; what was behind him on the bench might be. We are an appreciably worse team with Rambis, which doesn't surprise me in the slightest given his days in MIN. I actually want to give Phil's coaching tree one last time before I recommend scrapping the idea altogether. Luke Walton would be a terrific start in that regard....we just need to find him better assistants than Fisher had (i.e. fire Rambis).

I actually like the idea of hiring Jeff Hornacek to be lead assistant. I can"t quite see him getting a head coaching job next season, so this would be a nice side gig until those aspirations materialise in the future. In the interim, he'd provide us with a blueprint to help speed up the triangle and open up opportunities for quicker and a higher volune of shots like he did in PHO. And given that much of his success was attributed to blending bit-players with unique skillsets that caused mismatches, I think he'd be a perfect fit for the type of team we'd like to have. He'd kind of be what Alvin Gentry was to the Warriors under Kerr.

HofstraBBall wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:trade melo for draft picks and a good young G
With the draft picks from melo the young player traded for and next year pick. Completely rebuild the backcourt with 5-6 new guys we have the bigs now we put in the process of the backcourt. There is no one year fix in the nba. Hire like Walton he's young smart and he's been involved with a great team. No more rigid triangle bs. Good ball movement based on spacing and a diversity of guards with our quality bigs

Here goes.....again. On the risk you just deem it as ridiculous due to it being a contrary view.

1- We will get no good value or good PG for Melo as the NTC makes it so he has to choose where he would want to go. Therefore giving the Knicks a weak hand in negotiations. Opposing GM's will not give much if they know that is the only desired destination for Melo. And again, Draft picks are not a guarantee. Specially in this weak upcoming draft.
2- Which 5 to 6 guys for the back court. Vazquez. Not any good unrestricted free agents or D league except for same scraps we have now.
And what good PG would want to come to the limited Triangle?
3- We have solid bigs? Rolo rarely plays big minutes now. Reason? KP has struggled after break. Due to fatigue? He is 20? Or is it because of adjustments made by opposing teams? Adjustments that will increase if he is main guy on offense next year.
4- Walton a young mind? A monkey could of sat on the bench at GS and looked like a good young mind? If he comes here he will just be another Phil puppet with limited in game experience.

IMO of course.

Were the T'Wolves shortchanged when they wanted to trade KG, who had a NTC? Were the Celtics shortchanged when they received 3 lottery picks in trading him to the Nets, in spite of his NTC? Why do you insist on talking in absolutes, when this is a gray-matter?

blkexec wrote:

crzymdups wrote:I think it would be possible to keep Melo and compete - but we need 2-3 much higher level guards. And a much better coach.

It certainly seems like Melo is getting fed up waiting on it.

I agree about the guards and coach.....But Melo being fed up is bull ****. He knew what he was getting himself into. He thinks like Dolan ......He's trying to build a brand and he's using the attention from the NY media / press to build it. Unfortunately for him, he's receiving a black eye for his basketball legacy, as far as building a championship team around him. But thats the risk he signed up for. Nobody twisted his arm to come or stay. I was hoping he would go to Chicago personally. But now that he's here, I have no pitty for Melo. If anything, the fact that he wasn't able to attract other nba stars is another black eye on him......I've heard more people say they would love to play with KP more than Melo......That says a lot. I think players would love to add Melo to their team, but doesn't want to be on a team where Melo is the alpha dog.......just my personal opinion.

"risk"?!? the notion of risk is not tenable at all. melo helped create an impossible scenario where winning would not be an option, not once but twice!!! like i said, we got 25-30 fantastic games this season from a guy who had already logged 31,000 minutes by the time he got his second knicks contract.

HofstraBBall wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:trade melo for draft picks and a good young G
With the draft picks from melo the young player traded for and next year pick. Completely rebuild the backcourt with 5-6 new guys we have the bigs now we put in the process of the backcourt. There is no one year fix in the nba. Hire like Walton he's young smart and he's been involved with a great team. No more rigid triangle bs. Good ball movement based on spacing and a diversity of guards with our quality bigs

Here goes.....again. On the risk you just deem it as ridiculous due to it being a contrary view.

1- We will get no good value or good PG for Melo as the NTC makes it so he has to choose where he would want to go. Therefore giving the Knicks a weak hand in negotiations. Opposing GM's will not give much if they know that is the only desired destination for Melo. And again, Draft picks are not a guarantee. Specially in this weak upcoming draft.
2- Which 5 to 6 guys for the back court. Vazquez. Not any good unrestricted free agents or D league except for same scraps we have now.
And what good PG would want to come to the limited Triangle?
3- We have solid bigs? Rolo rarely plays big minutes now. Reason? KP has struggled after break. Due to fatigue? He is 20? Or is it because of adjustments made by opposing teams? Adjustments that will increase if he is main guy on offense next year.
4- Walton a young mind? A monkey could of sat on the bench at GS and looked like a good young mind? If he comes here he will just be another Phil puppet with limited in game experience.

IMO of course.

Were the T'Wolves shortchanged when they wanted to trade KG, who had a NTC? Were the Celtics shortchanged when they received 3 lottery picks in trading him to the Nets, in spite of his NTC? Why do you insist on talking in absolutes, when this is a gray-matter?

Agreeed, all a gray matter. What forums are for. Don't think we can find find 3 lottery picks for him. As there is only one Prokhorov. But if we did get 3 guaranteed lottery picks, then of course I would be in favor. Just don't see it. And as mentioned in other posts, knee issues will also factor in to offers.

3 lottery picks is an extreme but your position is on the other end of the spectrum. I don't know why but Knick fans continually seem to devalue our assets, only to see their potential realized elsewhere. "Zach Randolph's a black hole"....and he then becomes a multi-season allstar for the Grizzlies. "Jamal Crawford is a cancer"...and then becomes a perennial 6th man of the year candidate and a "good lockerroom guy".

We're talking about a guy, in Melo, that just falls short of being a generational talent like he has no value despite being just 31 years old and in his prime. We can and should get a return on something like that. The question is what should we settle for.