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Another dumb Dolan move with Carmelo strangles the team again
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BRIGGS
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2/17/2016  11:22 PM
Jim Dolan has done the same thing with Carmelo as he did with isiah. He made a terrible trade that hamstrung the team twice once with the original and second with bargain. Now his idiot move to give a ntc has stuck is in the mid with him He could've left for clev and we would've had multi assets to improve which is what we needed to do. So were stuck with him and will be forced. By him to over pay for a pro pg either through free agency or trade and it still Wong be near enough
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nixluva
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2/17/2016  11:57 PM
I see you're a bit upset about the prospect of the Knicks not making a trade. It's really not the end of the world if there's no trade made tomorrow. The worst thing would be another BAD TRADE. So no trade isn't always the worst thing. Besides there's still hours to go before the deadline so...
crzymdups
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2/17/2016  11:59 PM
There will be a lot of opportunity to upgrade the team this summer.

Now's just a time to take stock and see how well they can play by the end of the season.

Trading any of our pieces now would be trading them when their value was at a low point.

¿ △ ?
callmened
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2/18/2016  12:35 AM
i agree with BRIGGS on this one. Carmelo has handcuffed the team. we wont be able to make any major moves until he releases his no trade clause
Knicks should be improved: win about 40 games and maybe sneak into the playoffs. Melo, Rose and even Noah will have some nice moments however this team should be about PORZINGUS. the sooner they make him the primary player, the better
martin
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2/18/2016  12:54 AM
How many other high level all stars get moved in a non contract year? Are the Knicks really that ham strung or is it just impatience to an Nth degree again?
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franco12
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2/18/2016  1:25 AM
resigning Melo was partly so we didn't lose an asset. If he and his team wanted a ntc, we should have asked and required some kind of give back. That is how a negotiation work, I guess, unless you're dealing with a hostage taker.

Whether we could move him or not is irrelevant to the fact that we can't without his permission.
Vmart
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2/18/2016  5:18 AM
franco12 wrote:resigning Melo was partly so we didn't lose an asset. If he and his team wanted a ntc, we should have asked and required some kind of give back. That is how a negotiation work, I guess, unless you're dealing with a hostage taker.

Whether we could move him or not is irrelevant to the fact that we can't without his permission.

Melo is a liability all because of NTC. We cannot view him as an asset. His rate of depreciation is staggering with each passing year. The return rate of his service has diminished as a result of poor numbers and injury history which is starting to pile on. Even if the Knicks were to trade they would be luck to yield a top 5 pick. At best your looking at multiple mid to late round picks for him if he desires a change of scenery.

Melo has the Knicks basically held hostage. He knows he is no longer a top player and he knows the downside has started. Right now he doesn't even desire a championship or a run.
meloshouldgo
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2/18/2016  6:39 AM
Vmart wrote:
franco12 wrote:resigning Melo was partly so we didn't lose an asset. If he and his team wanted a ntc, we should have asked and required some kind of give back. That is how a negotiation work, I guess, unless you're dealing with a hostage taker.

Whether we could move him or not is irrelevant to the fact that we can't without his permission.

Melo is a liability all because of NTC. We cannot view him as an asset. His rate of depreciation is staggering with each passing year. The return rate of his service has diminished as a result of poor numbers and injury history which is starting to pile on. Even if the Knicks were to trade they would be luck to yield a top 5 pick. At best your looking at multiple mid to late round picks for him if he desires a change of scenery.

Melo has the Knicks basically held hostage. He knows he is no longer a top player and he knows the downside has started. Right now he doesn't even desire a championship or a run.


Agree with the first part he is a liability. But you can't trade liabilities unless you do a swap meaning you as acquire other liabilities. Or you can just write them off. We don't have any good options.

Mistake 1 - resigning Melo
MISTAKE 2 - NTC
Mistake 3 - Overpaying by anout 140%

Only the Knicks can make three mistake in one transaction. Huge fail on Dolan/ Phil

I cannot teach anybody anything. I can only try to make them think - Socrates
Bonn1997
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2/18/2016  7:15 AM
Yeah, this was another case of bidding against ourselves. Giving him $30 mil more than any other team wasn't enough?! We had to include the NTC too. Jeez.
GoNyGoNyGo
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2/18/2016  8:16 AM
If the team makes the playoffs it will be because of Melo. If not, he will be smart to re-evaluate and ask for a trade to a contender. Either way it is good for NY.

Next season there will be 3 stars on the team and as it is built now, decent role players. Depending on who that other star is, will decide how far they go.

Patience.
fishmike
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2/18/2016  8:28 AM
Bonn1997 wrote:Yeah, this was another case of bidding against ourselves. Giving him $30 mil more than any other team wasn't enough?! We had to include the NTC too. Jeez.
it wanst $30mm more. It was the extra year because he was already here. Allan Houston was bidding against ourselves. Melo had max contract offers (Lakers/Rockets) and the Bulls option to mull as well. Jeez
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
fishmike
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2/18/2016  8:37 AM
meloshouldgo wrote:
Vmart wrote:Melo is a liability all because of NTC. We cannot view him as an asset. His rate of depreciation is staggering with each passing year. The return rate of his service has diminished as a result of poor numbers and injury history which is starting to pile on. Even if the Knicks were to trade they would be luck to yield a top 5 pick. At best your looking at multiple mid to late round picks for him if he desires a change of scenery.

Melo has the Knicks basically held hostage. He knows he is no longer a top player and he knows the downside has started. Right now he doesn't even desire a championship or a run.


Agree with the first part he is a liability. But you can't trade liabilities unless you do a swap meaning you as acquire other liabilities. Or you can just write them off. We don't have any good options.

Mistake 1 - resigning Melo
MISTAKE 2 - NTC
Mistake 3 - Overpaying by anout 140%

Only the Knicks can make three mistake in one transaction. Huge fail on Dolan/ Phil

so when you remove the liability what is the Knicks record? And with the liability? Do you guys even think before you post? Are you Knick fans?

VMart can you quantify the bold statement? Melo's shot has been off, but this is his best year defensively, he's at his career high for rebounds and is above his career high in assists, oh.. and the team cant win without him on the floor. Kind of makes your liability statement look not so clever.

You guys are like grumpy monkeys. This shiny object isn't fun to play with anymore. You need a new shiny object.

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
StarksEwing1
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2/18/2016  8:41 AM
fishmike wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:
Vmart wrote:Melo is a liability all because of NTC. We cannot view him as an asset. His rate of depreciation is staggering with each passing year. The return rate of his service has diminished as a result of poor numbers and injury history which is starting to pile on. Even if the Knicks were to trade they would be luck to yield a top 5 pick. At best your looking at multiple mid to late round picks for him if he desires a change of scenery.

Melo has the Knicks basically held hostage. He knows he is no longer a top player and he knows the downside has started. Right now he doesn't even desire a championship or a run.


Agree with the first part he is a liability. But you can't trade liabilities unless you do a swap meaning you as acquire other liabilities. Or you can just write them off. We don't have any good options.

Mistake 1 - resigning Melo
MISTAKE 2 - NTC
Mistake 3 - Overpaying by anout 140%

Only the Knicks can make three mistake in one transaction. Huge fail on Dolan/ Phil

so when you remove the liability what is the Knicks record? And with the liability? Do you guys even think before you post? Are you Knick fans?

VMart can you quantify the bold statement? Melo's shot has been off, but this is his best year defensively, he's at his career high for rebounds and is above his career high in assists, oh.. and the team cant win without him on the floor. Kind of makes your liability statement look not so clever.

You guys are like grumpy monkeys. This shiny object isn't fun to play with anymore. You need a new shiny object.


had a feeling fishmike or jrdomc would lead the melo bridgade. Listen I personally have been happy with melo this year and im ok if he stays. However I still feel a trade would be beneficial for both sides. Melo can have a chance to win a title and we can use the picks/assets to continue to build around KP
knicks1248
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2/18/2016  8:45 AM
BRIGGS wrote:Jim Dolan has done the same thing with Carmelo as he did with isiah. He made a terrible trade that hamstrung the team twice once with the original and second with bargain. Now his idiot move to give a ntc has stuck is in the mid with him He could've left for clev and we would've had multi assets to improve which is what we needed to do. So were stuck with him and will be forced. By him to over pay for a pro pg either through free agency or trade and it still Wong be near enough

Assets??? your going to give a player a max contract and then trade him a yr later (if he didn't have the NTC)how assinine would that look.

You act as if Melo is a overrated, or a bad influence..relax brigg

ES
fishmike
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2/18/2016  8:48 AM
StarksEwing1 wrote:
fishmike wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:
Vmart wrote:Melo is a liability all because of NTC. We cannot view him as an asset. His rate of depreciation is staggering with each passing year. The return rate of his service has diminished as a result of poor numbers and injury history which is starting to pile on. Even if the Knicks were to trade they would be luck to yield a top 5 pick. At best your looking at multiple mid to late round picks for him if he desires a change of scenery.

Melo has the Knicks basically held hostage. He knows he is no longer a top player and he knows the downside has started. Right now he doesn't even desire a championship or a run.


Agree with the first part he is a liability. But you can't trade liabilities unless you do a swap meaning you as acquire other liabilities. Or you can just write them off. We don't have any good options.

Mistake 1 - resigning Melo
MISTAKE 2 - NTC
Mistake 3 - Overpaying by anout 140%

Only the Knicks can make three mistake in one transaction. Huge fail on Dolan/ Phil

so when you remove the liability what is the Knicks record? And with the liability? Do you guys even think before you post? Are you Knick fans?

VMart can you quantify the bold statement? Melo's shot has been off, but this is his best year defensively, he's at his career high for rebounds and is above his career high in assists, oh.. and the team cant win without him on the floor. Kind of makes your liability statement look not so clever.

You guys are like grumpy monkeys. This shiny object isn't fun to play with anymore. You need a new shiny object.


had a feeling fishmike or jrdomc would lead the melo bridgade. Listen I personally have been happy with melo this year and im ok if he stays. However I still feel a trade would be beneficial for both sides. Melo can have a chance to win a title and we can use the picks/assets to continue to build around KP
seriously do you have something to say on the topic? Is Melo a liability as mentioned?

There is no Melo brigade. When Briggs posts about trading Lopez for a 2nd round pick I treat that foolishness the same way as I do what was posted above.

When Melo will waive his NTC things change. If he didn't have it options would be different so that's a moot point. Chime in! We are all wondering what you are thinking!

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
SwishAndDish13
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2/18/2016  8:51 AM
fishmike wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:Yeah, this was another case of bidding against ourselves. Giving him $30 mil more than any other team wasn't enough?! We had to include the NTC too. Jeez.
it wanst $30mm more. It was the extra year because he was already here. Allan Houston was bidding against ourselves. Melo had max contract offers (Lakers/Rockets) and the Bulls option to mull as well. Jeez

+1 Fish! Anybody talking about the contract after last year's FA spending and the cap going up again is clearly delusional. Contract is not a huge issue.
StarksEwing1
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2/18/2016  8:52 AM
fishmike wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
fishmike wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:
Vmart wrote:Melo is a liability all because of NTC. We cannot view him as an asset. His rate of depreciation is staggering with each passing year. The return rate of his service has diminished as a result of poor numbers and injury history which is starting to pile on. Even if the Knicks were to trade they would be luck to yield a top 5 pick. At best your looking at multiple mid to late round picks for him if he desires a change of scenery.

Melo has the Knicks basically held hostage. He knows he is no longer a top player and he knows the downside has started. Right now he doesn't even desire a championship or a run.


Agree with the first part he is a liability. But you can't trade liabilities unless you do a swap meaning you as acquire other liabilities. Or you can just write them off. We don't have any good options.

Mistake 1 - resigning Melo
MISTAKE 2 - NTC
Mistake 3 - Overpaying by anout 140%

Only the Knicks can make three mistake in one transaction. Huge fail on Dolan/ Phil

so when you remove the liability what is the Knicks record? And with the liability? Do you guys even think before you post? Are you Knick fans?

VMart can you quantify the bold statement? Melo's shot has been off, but this is his best year defensively, he's at his career high for rebounds and is above his career high in assists, oh.. and the team cant win without him on the floor. Kind of makes your liability statement look not so clever.

You guys are like grumpy monkeys. This shiny object isn't fun to play with anymore. You need a new shiny object.


had a feeling fishmike or jrdomc would lead the melo bridgade. Listen I personally have been happy with melo this year and im ok if he stays. However I still feel a trade would be beneficial for both sides. Melo can have a chance to win a title and we can use the picks/assets to continue to build around KP
seriously do you have something to say on the topic? Is Melo a liability as mentioned?

There is no Melo brigade. When Briggs posts about trading Lopez for a 2nd round pick I treat that foolishness the same way as I do what was posted above.

When Melo will waive his NTC things change. If he didn't have it options would be different so that's a moot point. Chime in! We are all wondering what you are thinking!

I was trying to make a point to you. You should respect other peoples opinions even if they differ from your own.
SwishAndDish13
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2/18/2016  8:52 AM
People continue to whine about this deal as if it was legit. I strongly doubt Boston was interested in losing ground in the gap btwn them and Cleveland to acquire Max Love. If people here think Melo's deal is bad, how bad are Love and Thompson's deals?
ChuckBuck
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2/18/2016  8:59 AM
Melo is a liability, simple and plain. We won't come close to competing for a championship under his current contract, so why not move on for both parties? Each season that he's here hurts the team more than he helps. It's like buying a new car from the dealership, instant depreciation the moment you drive off the lot. No return on investment from Carmelo.

BUT BUT he's passing the ball the now! N# please, everyone knows the Knicks will never ever raise a banner while he's still here. The NTC and max contract is the worst move in recent history next to Amare and Allan Houston's contracts. They should've let him go to LA, Houston, or Chicago so they could've done a proper rebuild.

Hate half ass measures. Go full renovation/rebuild if you're going to do it. Got this fake "competitive" team that'll win 34 wins with a Batman(KP) and Alfred the Butler(Melo), not even Robin. If there was no NTC, at least we could've parlayed Melo into role players or picks to build around Porzingis. Now we're just stuck with him, and will be forced to play and pay him the next 3 years....

Phil/Dolan phucked up major with this move...
fishmike
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2/18/2016  9:07 AM
knicks1248 wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:Jim Dolan has done the same thing with Carmelo as he did with isiah. He made a terrible trade that hamstrung the team twice once with the original and second with bargain. Now his idiot move to give a ntc has stuck is in the mid with him He could've left for clev and we would've had multi assets to improve which is what we needed to do. So were stuck with him and will be forced. By him to over pay for a pro pg either through free agency or trade and it still Wong be near enough

Assets??? your going to give a player a max contract and then trade him a yr later (if he didn't have the NTC)how assinine would that look.

You act as if Melo is a overrated, or a bad influence..relax brigg

more of the same from the same posters over and over and over. At least Guns cant write about his concerns regarding any young players developing.

Lets recap this thread:
Knicks cant win a game without Melo, but he's a liability.
Melo's play is dropping at an incredible rate, but he's at career highs in rebounding and assists and defense.

Am I missing anything?

I actually have no problem trading Melo either. His health is a factor as is his age. I do think (especially after seeing the changes in his game this year) that he can be a highly effective player as he gets older (*IF* he is healthy). Also look at KP's confidence when Melo is on the floor. Melo has a very positive influence on this team on the court and off. That's just using one's eyes. Liability. Wow.

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
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Another dumb Dolan move with Carmelo strangles the team again
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