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Nary a word spoken about KP slump. Is the Bubble Bursting ?
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meloanyk
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12/13/2015  6:35 PM
Is it sacrilegious to discuss the recent mediocre play of our savior who has already been anointed as the team leader, NBA rook of year, 15 year All Star, and HOFer ??????

A few games ago while he was still playing well, I said I saw a differences in his bounce and defensive reactions and that Fischer should be careful not to overplay him. as he's still a developing rookie. The avg minutes he played in prior Euroleague years were 7, 15 and then 21 in 2014-15 yet here he was given ever increasing minutes amongst ever increasing attention, being thrown out there for 35 minutes or more several times with a high of 41 minutes agaisnt Houston. Yeh, he's the gate attraction but he's also a kid competing against a higher level of play while becoming the focus of D's and physicality given his hype and Melo's erractic play.

The minutes and travel miles accumulated and kid simply wore a bit, not only physically but also mentally given all the media and it has begun to show in many ways whether it be awkward movements, lack of rebounding or sloppy fouls.

Is the bubble bursting ??? NAH but it should be a lesson to the Knick org and fellow fans that this kid while very good should not be expected to be Superman and handle all chores in his initial year. He isnt physically ready to play 5 full time or bang for 38 minutes many nights. Fischer and the org should nurture him and manage his minutes better to keep him fresh and his development on right path. Mu guess 20-25 mins a game

We arent winning any titles this year. Glad to see Oquinn playing and being productive, his DNP's still perplex.. Jackson assembled a decent bench of frontcourt players and Fischer should be using ALL to allow KP AND a still ecovering Melo to play minutes appropiate to the schedule and their physical state.

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nixluva
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12/13/2015  7:15 PM
It's really not that big of a deal from what I see. KP just missed some shots and lost some focus and confidence. ALL players and not just rookies get fatigued during the long NBA season. I don't see KP being any different than anyone else. It's just a natural up and down over the course of the long season IMO. Not to mention it's coming during a road trip and the entire team was struggling too. A few days of rest, some home games and he may return to his normal output.

Just for reference here are KP's last 5 games. 4 of them are road games which can easily skew the results for a young player as well.


G Date Tm Opp GS MP FG FGA FG% 3P 3PA 3P% FT FTA FT% ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TOV PF PTS
21 2015-12-05 NYK @MIL L (-15) 21:44 4 8 .500 0 1 .000 4 4 1.000 3 4 7 1 0 0 5 5 12
22 2015-12-07 NYK DAL L (-7) 35:17 13 18 .722 2 4 .500 0 0 0 2 2 1 1 2 2 1 28
23 2015-12-09 NYK @UTA L (-21) 13:16 2 8 .250 0 2 .000 0 0 1 2 3 0 0 0 1 2 4
24 2015-12-10 NYK @SAC L (-2) 33:55 4 11 .364 1 2 .500 4 5 .800 2 5 7 2 2 3 3 4 13
25 2015-12-12 NYK @POR W (+2) 19:12 0 6 .000 0 0 0 0 0 3 3 0 2 0 2 3 0
meloanyk
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12/13/2015  7:27 PM
nixluva wrote:It's really not that big of a deal from what I see. KP just missed some shots and lost some focus and confidence. ALL players and not just rookies get fatigued during the long NBA season. I don't see KP being any different than anyone else. It's just a natural up and down over the course of the long season IMO. Not to mention it's coming during a road trip and the entire team was struggling too. A few days of rest, some home games and he may return to his normal output.

Just for reference here are KP's last 5 games. 4 of them are road games which can easily skew the results for a young player as well.


G Date Tm Opp GS MP FG FGA FG% 3P 3PA 3P% FT FTA FT% ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TOV PF PTS
21 2015-12-05 NYK @MIL L (-15) 21:44 4 8 .500 0 1 .000 4 4 1.000 3 4 7 1 0 0 5 5 12
22 2015-12-07 NYK DAL L (-7) 35:17 13 18 .722 2 4 .500 0 0 0 2 2 1 1 2 2 1 28
23 2015-12-09 NYK @UTA L (-21) 13:16 2 8 .250 0 2 .000 0 0 1 2 3 0 0 0 1 2 4
24 2015-12-10 NYK @SAC L (-2) 33:55 4 11 .364 1 2 .500 4 5 .800 2 5 7 2 2 3 3 4 13
25 2015-12-12 NYK @POR W (+2) 19:12 0 6 .000 0 0 0 0 0 3 3 0 2 0 2 3 0
babyKnicks
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12/13/2015  9:09 PM
http://m.nydailynews.com/sports/basketball/knicks/knicks-kristaps-porzinigis-hit-rookie-wall-article-1.2464743

Has Knicks’ Kristaps Porzinigis hit rookie wall?

PORTLAND – Call it a rookie wall. A physical threshold. An empty tank.

However you define the point of fatigue, Kristaps Porzingis slammed into it during a three-game road trip that played out mostly on the bench for the Latvian.

“I guess my legs weren’t feeling as good as they should feel,” he said.

It makes sense considering Porzingis – as well as the vast majority of those just drafted -- have never played this many games in such a short period of time. For Porzingis, the adjustment may be even more dramatic and taxing than a player out of college.

LUPICA: KNICKS ARE BECOMING KRISTAPS PORZINGIS' TEAM

The 20-year-old played just 50 games last season in Spain over nearly seven months. According to basketball-reference.com, he totaled 1,072 minutes last season -- a mark that he’s already about 2/3 of the way reaching in the NBA.

“I would say it wears you down being on the road, playing game after game,” Porzingis said. “But I think I’ve prepared myself, I did the recovery. Obviously you can still feel your legs are not 100 percent. But I try to at the best shape possible. But it’s tough.”

NYC PAPERS OUT. Social media use restricted to low res file max 184 x 128 pixels and 72 dpiHoward Simmons
Knicks rookie Kristaps Porzingis sees a slip in his production and spends the entire fourth quarter of Saturday's win in Portland on the bench.

The three games were ugly for Porzingis, who left the Garden on such a high last week after dueling Dirk Nowitzki in a fourth-quarter explosion, and who returns for Wednesday’s game against the T-Wolves searching for answers to a slump.

His pop and spring had disappeared in Saturday’s victory over the Trailblazers, as coach Derek Fisher left his forward on the bench for the entire fourth quarter. Porzingis was dunked on by Damian Lillard. He was nearly posterized Mo Harkless.

The rookie went scoreless for the first time in his NBA career, finishing a road trip with averages of 5.7 points and 4.3 rebounds on 24 percent shooting.

“Every player goes through it in our league in different levels. I think a number of our players went through it (Saturday) being the third game in four nights and the intensity of our schedule. So, for sure, rookies are going to feel it the most,” Fisher said. “They’re accustomed to playing the number of games we’ve played already through the course of the entire course of the college season. Or international play, one or two games a week is nowhere near what this is. But he’ll be able to come back and give us the energy. He helps us even when he’s not jumping off the charts and so we won’t make a habit of him not being on the floor. We just did what we thought was best (Saturday).”

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Porzingis has been the toast of the Garden this season, but is starting to show signs of fatigue.Elsa/Getty Images
Porzingis has been the toast of the Garden this season, but is starting to show signs of fatigue.

There’s also the nightly adjustments to Porzingis, the increased pressure from the defenses responding to his early success. He felt it Saturday from Portland forward Noah Vonleh.

“I think (Vonleh) was playing tighter on me, was closer to me – was really paying attention to what I was doing,” Porzingis said. “That’s how teams are going to play me now if I keep making shots. Obviously today, I was missing. But that’s the defense I’m going to have to play against.”

On Wednesday, Porzingis will again have the marquee matchup against fellow Rookie of the Year candidate Karl-Anthony Towns. Following his previous dud in Utah last week, Porzingis repeated a motivational quote from his oldest brother and mentor, Janis, about the importance of forgetting struggles.

“Champions have short memories,” he said.

But now he’s searching for something else. A cure for exhaustion.

“I’ve got to find a quote now to bounce back finally. I’ve been having bad games,” he said. “But yeah, that’s my mentality again. I have some time off.”

He needs it.

Let's go Knicks. That's amare
WaltLongmire
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12/13/2015  9:12 PM
meloanyk wrote:Is it sacrilegious to discuss the recent mediocre play of our savior who has already been anointed as the team leader, NBA rook of year, 15 year All Star, and HOFer ??????

A few games ago while he was still playing well, I said I saw a differences in his bounce and defensive reactions and that Fischer should be careful not to overplay him. as he's still a developing rookie. The avg minutes he played in prior Euroleague years were 7, 15 and then 21 in 2014-15 yet here he was given ever increasing minutes amongst ever increasing attention, being thrown out there for 35 minutes or more several times with a high of 41 minutes agaisnt Houston. Yeh, he's the gate attraction but he's also a kid competing against a higher level of play while becoming the focus of D's and physicality given his hype and Melo's erractic play.

The minutes and travel miles accumulated and kid simply wore a bit, not only physically but also mentally given all the media and it has begun to show in many ways whether it be awkward movements, lack of rebounding or sloppy fouls.

Is the bubble bursting ??? NAH but it should be a lesson to the Knick org and fellow fans that this kid while very good should not be expected to be Superman and handle all chores in his initial year. He isnt physically ready to play 5 full time or bang for 38 minutes many nights. Fischer and the org should nurture him and manage his minutes better to keep him fresh and his development on right path. Mu guess 20-25 mins a game

We arent winning any titles this year. Glad to see Oquinn playing and being productive, his DNP's still perplex.. Jackson assembled a decent bench of frontcourt players and Fischer should be using ALL to allow KP AND a still ecovering Melo to play minutes appropiate to the schedule and their physical state.


I think I commented on that other thread of yours and, surprisingly (if I remember correctly), I was in a minority in agreeing with you about him possibly being used too much.

You can get caught up in the flush of success and not understand the consequences, but KP's play was helping us win, and it looked like we needed him on the court to be at our best. Add to this the fact that both KOQ and Williams were very up and down, and you had a situation where Fisher was willing to play KP more than any of us expected him to play

He had the strong finish vs Dallas, but he looked lethargic in the next game against Utah, showed some defensive backbone vs the Kings, but not as effective on offense, and was out of it vs Portland.

At the very least, Porzingis' minutes should be monitored.

By the way, if you look at that game chart- his two worst games in that 5 game stretch followed games where he had played 35 and 34 minutes.

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Knixkik
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12/13/2015  11:01 PM
The bubble is not bursting. This is a rookie. The only bubble bursting is those saying this is KP's team right now. He is a rookie. We live and die with melo. He is our guy until KP is ready, maybe by next season. Did i mention he is a rookie? I wish so many people didnt overhype him and say he's an allstar right now. He's a rookie. But he will be a star in no time.
Nalod
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12/13/2015  11:09 PM
Play the rook until he hits the wall is not a coaching mistake, its reality.

More important that KP understand there are limits and he need be aware of them.
Most rooks hit this wall. Kid has been flying high. Now he knows what the wall feels like.

franco12
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12/14/2015  12:09 AM
its too bad Fisher started him from the beginning of the season. I would have preferred to limit his minutes a bit more than they have. He's young, he should get through this.

I also think the coaching staff needs to do a better job of running plays for him and not forcing things.

herkyJerky
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12/14/2015  1:19 AM
I'd rather he hit the wall now than later. I want to see him finish the season strong and looking good and confident so he'll be hyped up and more experienced for next year. If he has to stare at that wall for a few more games right now in order to get that result, so be it. Hopefully the media won't be too harsh on him in the meantime.
If it ain't broke, don't break it. - Charles 'The REAL Sir Charles' Oakley.
WaltLongmire
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12/14/2015  2:05 AM
herkyJerky wrote:I'd rather he hit the wall now than later. I want to see him finish the season strong and looking good and confident so he'll be hyped up and more experienced for next year. If he has to stare at that wall for a few more games right now in order to get that result, so be it. Hopefully the media won't be too harsh on him in the meantime.

If playing KP more rather than less would mean getting into the playoffs, you would have to do it, but assuming that we aren't making the playoffs...if reduced minutes would mean more consistent play without the peaks and valleys in his performance...what would people want, and which is better for his development?
EnySpree: Can we agree to agree not to mention Phil Jackson and triangle for the rest of our lives?
DrAlphaeus
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12/14/2015  2:22 AM    LAST EDITED: 12/14/2015  2:24 AM
Remember reading something about Porzingis having issues with chronic fatigue due to anemia when first becoming a pro. I don't think it's a coincidence that he is hitting this wall on his first extended road trip at elevations much higher than he has ever played — something noted on UK by other posters around the Utah game.

That, all the flights, and the media attention I'm sure has worn the kid out. But some home cooking at sea level I'm sure will snap him out of his funk. The medical staff just need to keep an eye on him make sure he stays healthy.

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Knicks1969
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12/14/2015  6:25 AM
Knixkik wrote:The bubble is not bursting. This is a rookie. The only bubble bursting is those saying this is KP's team right now. He is a rookie. We live and die with melo. He is our guy until KP is ready, maybe by next season. Did i mention he is a rookie? I wish so many people didnt overhype him and say he's an allstar right now. He's a rookie. But he will be a star in no time.

Couldn't agree with you more. The media will build you up to sell their garbage and tear you down for the same reason. Specially the vultures in NY

Thank God Fisher is no longer our coach, now let's get Calderon out of here:)
Dagger
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12/14/2015  7:00 AM    LAST EDITED: 12/14/2015  7:01 AM
How is this a lesson to "fellow fans and the media"? Any sensible fan knew this was coming. A rookie can be great and still hit a rookie wall, it doesn't mean the sky is falling, the bubble is bursting, the dream is shattered, or whatever exaggerated rhetoric people vomit out at the slightest hint of adversity. As for the media, they are just doing the same thing they always do, playing suckers like a violin, hyping up the new shiny toy for the sole purpose of tearing him down to sell papers to those blind enough to not see this whole disingenuous cycle for what it is.
Gudris
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12/14/2015  7:02 AM
I think he gave up all his energy on game vs Cousins and couldnt really refresh after that game, thats it, i hope on Wednesday he is back us new :)
Nalod
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12/14/2015  8:15 AM

if Fish did not play him some of you would be screaming "why is coach holding him back". There is no perfection except in hindsight.
H1AND1
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12/14/2015  9:32 AM
Rookies gonna rook
NYKBocker
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12/14/2015  9:53 AM
Nalod wrote:Play the rook until he hits the wall is not a coaching mistake, its reality.

More important that KP understand there are limits and he need be aware of them.
Most rooks hit this wall. Kid has been flying high. Now he knows what the wall feels like.

this

GustavBahler
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12/14/2015  4:53 PM
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basketball/knicks/knicks-kristaps-porzingis-denies-hitting-rookie-wall-article-1.2465695

Something clearly was amiss with Kristaps Porzingis during the Knicks’ recently completed three-game West Coast trip. He admitted as much, saying his legs weren’t feeling in top shape.

He was undoubtedly in a rut, but the 20-year-old shot down the idea that he has hit a rookie wall 25 games into his NBA career.

“I don’t think so,” Porzingis said Monday after the Knicks practiced at their training facility in Greenburgh. “A couple of bad games, it happens. It happens to all of us, not only rookies. I’m just looking forward to the next game and preparing myself as good as I can. I don’t really know what a rookie wall is. So it’s ups and downs. Obviously this is my rookie season.”

Porzingis’ rough road trip culminated with the first point-less game of his young career in Portland on Saturday. He shot 0-for-6 from the field and didn’t get to the free-throw line in 19 minutes. For the trip, Porzingis scored 17 points on 6-for-25 shooting while grabbing 13 rebounds.

That he stumbled for a few games early in the season isn’t an indication that there’s a long-term issue brewing, according to Carmelo Anthony.

“It’s December,” he said. “It’s 20-something games into the season. I hope (Porzingis isn’t) thinking that he hit a wall just because of a couple of off days. There’s no such thing as a wall.”

Everyone sang the same tune on Monday. Derek Fisher doesn’t believe Porzingis is gassed. He thinks the rookie’s poor performance, which began with a four-point, three-rebound effort in 13 minutes on Wednesday against the Jazz, is just part of the ebbs and flows of an NBA campaign.

“You just have to kind of continue to work your way through them and not assume that it means any particular thing,” Fisher said.

Increased defensive pressure on Porzingis has clearly been a factor. The Latvian’s dazzling play in the New York spotlight for the majority of the season has made him a phenomenon, and teams are clearly trying to make life on the court more difficult for the 7-foot-3 forward.

“A few of the games I felt more attention on me,” Porzingis said. “Guys were playing tighter on me on the perimeter. That’s some of the things I have to be ready for and whatever comes, I still got to be aggressive. I’ve still got to help the team offensively.”

Just two days before the road trip, Porzingis had one of his best games of the season, sinking a career-high 13 field goals on 18 shots for 28 points in his duel against Dirk Nowitzki and the Mavericks. Now the No. 4 overall pick — who revealed he once broke a finger while boxing as a teenager during a conditioning session — returns to the Garden on Wednesday for a matchup against No. 1 selection and Jersey native Karl-Anthony Towns.

Towns is shooting 53.1 percent while averaging 14.9 points and 9.2 rebounds for the Timberwolves, who will be playing the Knicks in the second game of a back-to-back after hosting Denver on Tuesday. Porzingis, meanwhile, is shooting 44.1 percent and averaging 13.6 points and 8.4 boards per contest.

Porzingis got to know Towns some during the draft process and said he was a “great guy” while praising his game. “He’s really playing at a good level and I can’t wait to play against him,” Porzingis said.

The Knicks will hope Porzingis can bounce back and play at a similar level on Wednesday.

“A couple of off days, a couple of off games, we all have them,” Anthony said. “I’ve been telling ya’ll that from the beginning. He’ll be all right.”

crzymdups
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12/14/2015  4:58 PM
He hit a wall. He'll get a second wind. Might need to limit his minutes a little bit in the coming weeks. He'll be fine.
¿ △ ?
GustavBahler
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12/14/2015  4:59 PM
crzymdups wrote:He hit a wall. He'll get a second wind. Might need to limit his minutes a little bit in the coming weeks. He'll be fine.

OK Mom.

Nary a word spoken about KP slump. Is the Bubble Bursting ?

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