crzymdups wrote:It was a terrible trade. I said so at the time and never wanted to trade Shumpert.

You know what would take up less cap space? Not making yet another terrible trade to acquire Jose Calderon - he makes more than JR and Shump combined.

To not get a number one pick for two of Cleveland's best players is horrendous.

I guess Phil can make up for it by drafting Willie Cauley Stein in some folks' mind - a player who at best is a clone of Tyson Chandler, who Phil also gave away for a second round pick and Calderon's albatross contract.

Right right, we needed a culture change. The team finished 16-4 in 2013-14 with Melo, Tyson, JR, Shumpert, Amare, Pablo (hey, gave him away, too!) and Woodson coaching once they were finally healthy... but we needed a culture change... or Phil had to prove the Triangle could work, even though it made no sense with our personnel and the system has never worked if it didn't have two all-time great hall of fame players running it.

You can sign Shump as a free agent if you want him back

crzymdups wrote:It was a terrible trade. I said so at the time and never wanted to trade Shumpert.

You know what would take up less cap space? Not making yet another terrible trade to acquire Jose Calderon - he makes more than JR and Shump combined.

To not get a number one pick for two of Cleveland's best players is horrendous.

I guess Phil can make up for it by drafting Willie Cauley Stein in some folks' mind - a player who at best is a clone of Tyson Chandler, who Phil also gave away for a second round pick and Calderon's albatross contract.

Right right, we needed a culture change. The team finished 16-4 in 2013-14 with Melo, Tyson, JR, Shumpert, Amare, Pablo (hey, gave him away, too!) and Woodson coaching once they were finally healthy... but we needed a culture change... or Phil had to prove the Triangle could work, even though it made no sense with our personnel and the system has never worked if it didn't have two all-time great hall of fame players running it.

Yes because everyone was saying "we can get a first for JR and Shump!", the agreed value on these boards at the time was a 2nd rounder for Shump, and that JR had anti-value and you'd have to give up a pick to get rid of him. Which is exactly the trade we did. Do you really think lots of teams were out there wanting to give up 1st round picks for those to? If so why didn't we trade them to those teams. Oh thats right- no one was offering that. Phil should have made them? Ridiculous.

crzymdups wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

crzymdups wrote:It was a terrible trade. I said so at the time and never wanted to trade Shumpert.

You know what would take up less cap space? Not making yet another terrible trade to acquire Jose Calderon - he makes more than JR and Shump combined.

To not get a number one pick for two of Cleveland's best players is horrendous.

I guess Phil can make up for it by drafting Willie Cauley Stein in some folks' mind - a player who at best is a clone of Tyson Chandler, who Phil also gave away for a second round pick and Calderon's albatross contract.

Right right, we needed a culture change. The team finished 16-4 in 2013-14 with Melo, Tyson, JR, Shumpert, Amare, Pablo (hey, gave him away, too!) and Woodson coaching once they were finally healthy... but we needed a culture change... or Phil had to prove the Triangle could work, even though it made no sense with our personnel and the system has never worked if it didn't have two all-time great hall of fame players running it.

Yes because everyone was saying "we can get a first for JR and Shump!", the agreed value on these boards at the time was a 2nd rounder for Shump, and that JR had anti-value and you'd have to give up a pick to get rid of him. Which is exactly the trade we did. Do you really think lots of teams were out there wanting to give up 1st round picks for those to? If so why didn't we trade them to those teams. Oh thats right- no one was offering that. Phil should have made them? Ridiculous.

Shump and Smith were both coming off injury. Phil sold low. The Spurs and Thunder and Clippers all supposedly offered first round picks for Shumpert at the 2014 trade deadline. You know, because the Spurs and Thunder and Clippers are actual basketball teams that can identify actual basketball players. But I digress, back to the Knicks.

And we could of gotten late 1st, early second for Shump (newsflash: we got a second)- but we had to lose that value to get rid of JRs contract. Or would you rather have kept JRs contract on the books. And the fact they were both injured is why we traded them- what happened last year when we held on to Shump? He got injured at the last minute so we couldn't trade him at the deadline. JR had a plantar fascia tear- notoriously troublesome. At the time, Phil made the right call- get rid of them before they get injured again. GMs can't travel forward in time and see whether a player gets injured or not, and then travel back in time and decide when to trade them.

crzymdups wrote:I just realized the Knicks have already traded away their own 2015, 2016, 2017, 2018 and 2019 second round picks.

I guess it's a good thing we got one (1) back for JR and Shump, two rotation players on an NBA Finalist and potential champion.

This is truly the worst run team in professional sports.

If it's any consolation, we got 2 2nd rounders for Prigs.

crzymdups wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

crzymdups wrote:I just realized the Knicks have already traded away their own 2015, 2016, 2017, 2018 and 2019 second round picks.

I guess it's a good thing we got one (1) back for JR and Shump, two rotation players on an NBA Finalist and potential champion.

This is truly the worst run team in professional sports.

If it's any consolation, we got 2 2nd rounders for Prigs.

Here's the issue I have with all this - when Chandler, Shumpert and JR Smith were all traded for a pile of dog poop, we were told we needed to rebuild. When we draft in a month, I can pretty much guarantee you we will hear that we need to compete right away and we don't have time to draft a project.

You wanna know the funny thing - Phil is saying we need a defensive big man and some guards who can drive.

You wanna know another funny thing - we wouldn't be able to sign Chandler, JR and Shump with all the vaunted cap room we have this off-season. (that's if they wanted to come back here, which they obviously do not because it is the worst run team in pro sports)

This is the definition of idiotic management.

edit: And, I mean, talking about idiotic management, we haven't even gotten to the part where they won their last two road games to completely FUCK the draft aka the entire reason they supposedly gave away Tyson, JR, and Iman for nothing. Oh that's right, they thought that giving away Tyson would help them make the playoffs. Say it with me now - idiotic management.

You cant keep blaming idiotic management...When you have an idiot owner...If you were an owner with a bottomless pit of money, you cant put all this blame on management every year....You have to look in the mirror and ask whos the common denominator? Dolan is the biggest idiot. He has enough money to hire the best management employees in the world.....Its his management selections that put us in a 20yr hole. Cant blame phil or fisher.....thats like blaming Mudiay for a bad season, if he leads us to another lottery season. Bad apples fall from the top....not the bottom.