Obviously I'm not such a self-important ass that I believe what I or any of you "think" matters to the fortunes of or future moves made by this so-called franchise, but it's worth noting, if even as a collective therapy session, that:

1.) Knicks did NOT have their 2016 pick, duh. So re-signing or not re-signing Melo really didn't matter because tanking WITHOUT him would have been just as fruitless as tanking with. In fact, you can make the argument that retaining his overrated but still valuable services was better in the short-term, because

A.) He's still an All-Star, they don't grow on trees.

and B.) If by some miracle the Knicks ever committed to a full and true rebuild circa later 80's, they could POSSIBLY move Melo, unfortunately with his permission, to some team, on some draft night...ugh, possibly. Ok, so that'll never happen for logistical reasons, but there's still like a 5% chance. Maybe next summer the 14th lottery team gets a lucky ping pong, and gives up the 5th pick for Melo ala Ray Allen. There's a chance, right? Point is, people focus too much angst on the whole Melo deal, and get shortsighted on the trees, rather than the forest.

2.) Truth is, you probably won't even sniff the Finals without a top 3 player. History repeats itself. People need to pull their collective head out of their ass and realize - WHO CARES if we get "Paul Milsap" or "Danny Green". Solid foundational players, but nonetheless, still shortsighted. The only hope is that Karl Towns or Okafor or Brandon Roy 2.0 turn into studs REAL QUICK. And please don't use the Spurs as a model - the Spurs don't even come from this planet. Gregg Popovich has battle scars like the dude from Avatar. How the hell are we gonna compete with that?

3.) Even if they draft right AND get lucky, Melo's knee isn't jello, they hit a triple in FA, and Fisher grows a pair, it's the Knicks dude. Somehow they'll **** it up.

So basically, do what I do. Don't even pay for merch or tickets, guilt longtime Garden employees into giving you free Knicks tickets. Or Liberty tickets, whatever.

brybry wrote:So, as a headnote, you could retitle this - "The Knicks are ****ed if they do, and ****ed if they don't"...

Obviously I'm not such a self-important ass that I believe what I or any of you "think" matters to the fortunes of or future moves made by this so-called franchise, but it's worth noting, if even as a collective therapy session, that:

1.) Knicks did NOT have their 2016 pick, duh. So re-signing or not re-signing Melo really didn't matter because tanking WITHOUT him would have been just as fruitless as tanking with. In fact, you can make the argument that retaining his overrated but still valuable services was better in the short-term, because

A.) He's still an All-Star, they don't grow on trees.

and B.) If by some miracle the Knicks ever committed to a full and true rebuild circa later 80's, they could POSSIBLY move Melo, unfortunately with his permission, to some team, on some draft night...ugh, possibly. Ok, so that'll never happen for logistical reasons, but there's still like a 5% chance. Maybe next summer the 14th lottery team gets a lucky ping pong, and gives up the 5th pick for Melo ala Ray Allen. There's a chance, right? Point is, people focus too much angst on the whole Melo deal, and get shortsighted on the trees, rather than the forest.

2.) Truth is, you probably won't even sniff the Finals without a top 3 player. History repeats itself. People need to pull their collective head out of their ass and realize - WHO CARES if we get "Paul Milsap" or "Danny Green". Solid foundational players, but nonetheless, still shortsighted. The only hope is that Karl Towns or Okafor or Brandon Roy 2.0 turn into studs REAL QUICK. And please don't use the Spurs as a model - the Spurs don't even come from this planet. Gregg Popovich has battle scars like the dude from Avatar. How the hell are we gonna compete with that?

3.) Even if they draft right AND get lucky, Melo's knee isn't jello, they hit a triple in FA, and Fisher grows a pair, it's the Knicks dude. Somehow they'll **** it up.

So basically, do what I do. Don't even pay for merch or tickets, guilt longtime Garden employees into giving you free Knicks tickets. Or Liberty tickets, whatever.

Lol. Entertaining post! and Welcome. Your logic is sound to me. I can still dream of a Detroit like championship by putting together a good core and maybe a year or two from now, we can trade for our Rasheed Wallace to put us over the top.

brybry wrote:So, as a headnote, you could retitle this - "The Knicks are ****ed if they do, and ****ed if they don't"...

Obviously I'm not such a self-important ass that I believe what I or any of you "think" matters to the fortunes of or future moves made by this so-called franchise, but it's worth noting, if even as a collective therapy session, that:

1.) Knicks did NOT have their 2016 pick, duh. So re-signing or not re-signing Melo really didn't matter because tanking WITHOUT him would have been just as fruitless as tanking with. In fact, you can make the argument that retaining his overrated but still valuable services was better in the short-term, because

A.) He's still an All-Star, they don't grow on trees.

and B.) If by some miracle the Knicks ever committed to a full and true rebuild circa later 80's, they could POSSIBLY move Melo, unfortunately with his permission, to some team, on some draft night...ugh, possibly. Ok, so that'll never happen for logistical reasons, but there's still like a 5% chance. Maybe next summer the 14th lottery team gets a lucky ping pong, and gives up the 5th pick for Melo ala Ray Allen. There's a chance, right? Point is, people focus too much angst on the whole Melo deal, and get shortsighted on the trees, rather than the forest.

2.) Truth is, you probably won't even sniff the Finals without a top 3 player. History repeats itself. People need to pull their collective head out of their ass and realize - WHO CARES if we get "Paul Milsap" or "Danny Green". Solid foundational players, but nonetheless, still shortsighted. The only hope is that Karl Towns or Okafor or Brandon Roy 2.0 turn into studs REAL QUICK. And please don't use the Spurs as a model - the Spurs don't even come from this planet. Gregg Popovich has battle scars like the dude from Avatar. How the hell are we gonna compete with that?

3.) Even if they draft right AND get lucky, Melo's knee isn't jello, they hit a triple in FA, and Fisher grows a pair, it's the Knicks dude. Somehow they'll **** it up.

So basically, do what I do. Don't even pay for merch or tickets, guilt longtime Garden employees into giving you free Knicks tickets. Or Liberty tickets, whatever.

I think we need to worry more about just building a decent team that can make deep playoff runs. A title is so far away from this team right now that I can't be upset about the low chances of it happening. 40 Years of fandom and now i'm gonna worry about the relatively low chances of the team winning a title? It's always like that way. So few teams have won't the title. You have to go into this with an open mind. The Hawks look like they have a shot, in a similar way that the Pistons and Mavs did it with good overall talent rather than a big 3.

The Knicks have to hope for the best in the draft and making smart moves in Free Agency and then go from there. Let's just hope for a winning season first before we worry about winning a title.

I wonder how long it will be before the funny pics start appearing...

brybry wrote:

nixluva wrote:I think we need to worry more about just building a decent team that can make deep playoff runs. A title is so far away from this team right now that I can't be upset about the low chances of it happening. 40 Years of fandom and now i'm gonna worry about the relatively low chances of the team winning a title? It's always like that way. So few teams have won't the title. You have to go into this with an open mind. The Hawks look like they have a shot, in a similar way that the Pistons and Mavs did it with good overall talent rather than a big 3.

The Knicks have to hope for the best in the draft and making smart moves in Free Agency and then go from there. Let's just hope for a winning season first before we worry about winning a title.

No...it's not "like that way". You sound like a easily manipulated pushover. You either get busy winning, or get busy losing. Winning isn't everything, it's the only thing. You don't set the bar at "eh, kinda good". You set the freakin bar at championship. Even if you don't GET THERE, that's where the bar is set; no one loves the 90's Knicks any less just b/c they didn't get a ring; they pushed it to the limit; that's all you can ask.

Btw The Hawks have no shot btw, NONE. They're not an elite defensive team, nor do they have a go-to player in crunchtime. The Pistons had both. The Hawks don't even have a top 10 player in the league realistically; Pistons did. Hawks are having problems with the damn Nets, the NETS. THE NETS.

And 40 years? Jesus how old are you. If when I'm whatever age you are, I hope to God I'm not posting online about a sports team; I'd hope to be raising grandkids and summering in the Hamptons and working on my memoirs.

The bar has been set so low for next season, that there a fans that are okay with marginal improvement, then they talk about changing the culture, and that we have to take season by season.

Management has 3 yrs in any sport to see massive improvements, everyone here knows that, but think phil and fisher are an exception to the rules because they came in with ZERO experience in the positions they are holding.

foosballnick wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:^^^brybry you sound like you have been here before. Guys don't usually start their 8th posts off with, 'you sound like an easily manipulated pushover' in response to others.

Didn't take long for Splat to come back.

Welcome back, Splat, ya douchebag.

<rant>
As for whether or not you will be posting on this (or any) MB when you are an old dude, why wait? Just move on now.

There are all ages here, including many (like myself) who remember our last championship season. This is a MB for fans, not "young" fans. Your attitude has "ahole" written all over it.

</rant>

fishmike wrote:

foosballnick wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

brybry wrote:

nixluva wrote:I think we need to worry more about just building a decent team that can make deep playoff runs. A title is so far away from this team right now that I can't be upset about the low chances of it happening. 40 Years of fandom and now i'm gonna worry about the relatively low chances of the team winning a title? It's always like that way. So few teams have won't the title. You have to go into this with an open mind. The Hawks look like they have a shot, in a similar way that the Pistons and Mavs did it with good overall talent rather than a big 3.

The Knicks have to hope for the best in the draft and making smart moves in Free Agency and then go from there. Let's just hope for a winning season first before we worry about winning a title.

No...it's not "like that way". You sound like a easily manipulated pushover. You either get busy winning, or get busy losing. Winning isn't everything, it's the only thing. You don't set the bar at "eh, kinda good". You set the freakin bar at championship. Even if you don't GET THERE, that's where the bar is set; no one loves the 90's Knicks any less just b/c they didn't get a ring; they pushed it to the limit; that's all you can ask.

Btw The Hawks have no shot btw, NONE. They're not an elite defensive team, nor do they have a go-to player in crunchtime. The Pistons had both. The Hawks don't even have a top 10 player in the league realistically; Pistons did. Hawks are having problems with the damn Nets, the NETS. THE NETS.

And 40 years? Jesus how old are you. If when I'm whatever age you are, I hope to God I'm not posting online about a sports team; I'd hope to be raising grandkids and summering in the Hamptons and working on my memoirs.

The bar has been set so low for next season, that there a fans that are okay with marginal improvement, then they talk about changing the culture, and that we have to take season by season.

Management has 3 yrs in any sport to see massive improvements, everyone here knows that, but think phil and fisher are an exception to the rules because they came in with ZERO experience in the positions they are holding.

The myths you continue to spread on these boards are pretty funny. There is an incapability of some to not see nor understand the reality of a situation. The Knicks have pretty much sucked for the better part of 25 years. They sucked last year with a significant amount of older guys & expiring contracts. They really sucked this year with or without the older & expiring players. Based on all that...and regardless of the President, GM or coach, to put a 3 year time limit on a team for a championship after it has been stripped bare except for basically one player is fcking retarded.

At this point he's joined a couple posters here who think by saying the same thing over and over its true. Then they say things like "people say" and "management believes" but really they are just quoting their own opinions.

at some point, im starphuching myself? Sorta feels ok on one end.

fishmike wrote:

Nalod wrote:

fishmike wrote:

foosballnick wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

brybry wrote:

nixluva wrote:I think we need to worry more about just building a decent team that can make deep playoff runs. A title is so far away from this team right now that I can't be upset about the low chances of it happening. 40 Years of fandom and now i'm gonna worry about the relatively low chances of the team winning a title? It's always like that way. So few teams have won't the title. You have to go into this with an open mind. The Hawks look like they have a shot, in a similar way that the Pistons and Mavs did it with good overall talent rather than a big 3.

The Knicks have to hope for the best in the draft and making smart moves in Free Agency and then go from there. Let's just hope for a winning season first before we worry about winning a title.

No...it's not "like that way". You sound like a easily manipulated pushover. You either get busy winning, or get busy losing. Winning isn't everything, it's the only thing. You don't set the bar at "eh, kinda good". You set the freakin bar at championship. Even if you don't GET THERE, that's where the bar is set; no one loves the 90's Knicks any less just b/c they didn't get a ring; they pushed it to the limit; that's all you can ask.

Btw The Hawks have no shot btw, NONE. They're not an elite defensive team, nor do they have a go-to player in crunchtime. The Pistons had both. The Hawks don't even have a top 10 player in the league realistically; Pistons did. Hawks are having problems with the damn Nets, the NETS. THE NETS.

And 40 years? Jesus how old are you. If when I'm whatever age you are, I hope to God I'm not posting online about a sports team; I'd hope to be raising grandkids and summering in the Hamptons and working on my memoirs.

The bar has been set so low for next season, that there a fans that are okay with marginal improvement, then they talk about changing the culture, and that we have to take season by season.

Management has 3 yrs in any sport to see massive improvements, everyone here knows that, but think phil and fisher are an exception to the rules because they came in with ZERO experience in the positions they are holding.

The myths you continue to spread on these boards are pretty funny. There is an incapability of some to not see nor understand the reality of a situation. The Knicks have pretty much sucked for the better part of 25 years. They sucked last year with a significant amount of older guys & expiring contracts. They really sucked this year with or without the older & expiring players. Based on all that...and regardless of the President, GM or coach, to put a 3 year time limit on a team for a championship after it has been stripped bare except for basically one player is fcking retarded.

At this point he's joined a couple posters here who think by saying the same thing over and over its true. Then they say things like "people say" and "management believes" but really they are just quoting their own opinions.

at some point, im starphuching myself? Sorta feels ok on one end.

and on the other?

THe great debate right? LIke a prostate exam. Hurts going in but feels good coming out?
That confuses me. I think its because the pain stops, and thus is feels good to not have pain. Or.........

foosballnick wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

brybry wrote:

nixluva wrote:I think we need to worry more about just building a decent team that can make deep playoff runs. A title is so far away from this team right now that I can't be upset about the low chances of it happening. 40 Years of fandom and now i'm gonna worry about the relatively low chances of the team winning a title? It's always like that way. So few teams have won't the title. You have to go into this with an open mind. The Hawks look like they have a shot, in a similar way that the Pistons and Mavs did it with good overall talent rather than a big 3.

The Knicks have to hope for the best in the draft and making smart moves in Free Agency and then go from there. Let's just hope for a winning season first before we worry about winning a title.

No...it's not "like that way". You sound like a easily manipulated pushover. You either get busy winning, or get busy losing. Winning isn't everything, it's the only thing. You don't set the bar at "eh, kinda good". You set the freakin bar at championship. Even if you don't GET THERE, that's where the bar is set; no one loves the 90's Knicks any less just b/c they didn't get a ring; they pushed it to the limit; that's all you can ask.

Btw The Hawks have no shot btw, NONE. They're not an elite defensive team, nor do they have a go-to player in crunchtime. The Pistons had both. The Hawks don't even have a top 10 player in the league realistically; Pistons did. Hawks are having problems with the damn Nets, the NETS. THE NETS.

And 40 years? Jesus how old are you. If when I'm whatever age you are, I hope to God I'm not posting online about a sports team; I'd hope to be raising grandkids and summering in the Hamptons and working on my memoirs.

The bar has been set so low for next season, that there a fans that are okay with marginal improvement, then they talk about changing the culture, and that we have to take season by season.

Management has 3 yrs in any sport to see massive improvements, everyone here knows that, but think phil and fisher are an exception to the rules because they came in with ZERO experience in the positions they are holding.

The myths you continue to spread on these boards are pretty funny. There is an incapability of some to not see nor understand the reality of a situation. The Knicks have pretty much sucked for the better part of 25 years. They sucked last year with a significant amount of older guys & expiring contracts. They really sucked this year with or without the older & expiring players. Based on all that...and regardless of the President, GM or coach, to put a 3 year time limit on a team for a championship after it has been stripped bare except for basically one player is fcking retarded.

why don't you give me an example of a coach that made it through a rebuilding process..

Let pay melo 25 million so he can be part of a rebuilding era that takes the length of his contract, either the knicks were stupid, or naive

knicks1248 wrote:

foosballnick wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

brybry wrote:

nixluva wrote:I think we need to worry more about just building a decent team that can make deep playoff runs. A title is so far away from this team right now that I can't be upset about the low chances of it happening. 40 Years of fandom and now i'm gonna worry about the relatively low chances of the team winning a title? It's always like that way. So few teams have won't the title. You have to go into this with an open mind. The Hawks look like they have a shot, in a similar way that the Pistons and Mavs did it with good overall talent rather than a big 3.

The Knicks have to hope for the best in the draft and making smart moves in Free Agency and then go from there. Let's just hope for a winning season first before we worry about winning a title.

No...it's not "like that way". You sound like a easily manipulated pushover. You either get busy winning, or get busy losing. Winning isn't everything, it's the only thing. You don't set the bar at "eh, kinda good". You set the freakin bar at championship. Even if you don't GET THERE, that's where the bar is set; no one loves the 90's Knicks any less just b/c they didn't get a ring; they pushed it to the limit; that's all you can ask.

Btw The Hawks have no shot btw, NONE. They're not an elite defensive team, nor do they have a go-to player in crunchtime. The Pistons had both. The Hawks don't even have a top 10 player in the league realistically; Pistons did. Hawks are having problems with the damn Nets, the NETS. THE NETS.

And 40 years? Jesus how old are you. If when I'm whatever age you are, I hope to God I'm not posting online about a sports team; I'd hope to be raising grandkids and summering in the Hamptons and working on my memoirs.

The bar has been set so low for next season, that there a fans that are okay with marginal improvement, then they talk about changing the culture, and that we have to take season by season.

Management has 3 yrs in any sport to see massive improvements, everyone here knows that, but think phil and fisher are an exception to the rules because they came in with ZERO experience in the positions they are holding.

The myths you continue to spread on these boards are pretty funny. There is an incapability of some to not see nor understand the reality of a situation. The Knicks have pretty much sucked for the better part of 25 years. They sucked last year with a significant amount of older guys & expiring contracts. They really sucked this year with or without the older & expiring players. Based on all that...and regardless of the President, GM or coach, to put a 3 year time limit on a team for a championship after it has been stripped bare except for basically one player is fcking retarded.

why don't you give me an example of a coach that made it through a rebuilding process..

Let pay melo 25 million so he can be part of a rebuilding era that takes the length of his contract, either the knicks were stupid, or naive

Brad Stevens even by his own admission said last season he was in over his head as a rookie coach. Celts make playoffs second year.
BRooks in OKC.
The ATL coach of the year.
Wittmen in DC.
Williams in NOLA.

This is just recent history. IM sure Im leaving out some.