Sam is a low minutes big that puts up pretty good numbers. Last year he and Tyson had comparable years in some stats but will that translate in NY? Will he be pressed to play more minutes and will he be able to handle the load and not break down? If he can hold up can he duplicate what was a bad year for Tyson?

Enter the unknown: Will Cole play big minutes

Cole is in some circle a fan favorite. He has played pretty well in the little minutes he has gotten on every team he has played. Is he ready for the prime time? He is a former late lottery selection that has played on 4 teams in 5 years but like I said early has played well in the little time he gets. So what is the disconnect between him and coaches. Why has he been on the bench? He rebounds and blocks shots like crazy, has good form on his fts(looks funky but works), and is not devoid of offensive skills so he should be able to duplicate "Good" T. Chandler. He is the underdog fans should like and has the numbers the stats geeks like but like the "Great" Bonn (okay he is really not that great so I shouldn't say it because his post are usually the worst and sometimes he acts like he works at Top Flight security but I will use great.) "it's a small sample size". I hope he is the real deal because if Cole shows promise and plays at a quality starter level he would help solve a lot of problems going forward.

Anyway, I just thought I would make a topic because I was board and up very late/early. Hopefully it will create some discussion.

Tyson at his salary was better served as trade bait.

That said, Tyson is better than any one individual center we have and I do think he would have been ok in the triangle. Lets not kick him totally to the curb, he pretty much gave us what he had and despite his auto-Imune inconsistency he was bought in with an uneven health history and maybe lived up to that expectation. He gave us a DPOTY type season!

Dagger wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:Anyone wonder why Cuban wanted Tyson more than Calderon and Dalembert? These guys combined had on/off +/- of almost -10 last year. They both have much bigger flaws than Tyson does. It's quite rare that Cuban gets fleeced in trades.

It's very obvious why Dallas wanted Tyson and it has little to with his performance last season. Calderon plays only one half of the game and Tyson only plays one half. Except he couldn't be counted on to even do that, last year he was a 15 million deadweight malcontent loser. Dalembert could be the biggest scrub in the world but as long as he wants to be here (instead of dogging it and throwing teammates under the bus) he's a better fit than Flu Fugazi Never Made A Lay-up In My Life Tysoft Chandler

franco12 wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:Anyone wonder why Cuban wanted Tyson more than Calderon and Dalembert? These guys combined had on/off +/- of almost -10 last year. They both have much bigger flaws than Tyson does. It's quite rare that Cuban gets fleeced in trades.

maybe it will be a trade that will help both teams.

Dalembert has just this year left on his deal, and I suspect would be waived if Phil thought we had sufficient depth on front - which is an indictment of sorts on Bargs & Amar'e.

Then- you have Calderon who is atrocious on defense, but could he in sum be worse than Felton? He could lose a leg and go out and play with a wood prosthetic and he would perform better than Felton on both ends.

Bonn1997 wrote:

Dagger wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:Anyone wonder why Cuban wanted Tyson more than Calderon and Dalembert? These guys combined had on/off +/- of almost -10 last year. They both have much bigger flaws than Tyson does. It's quite rare that Cuban gets fleeced in trades.

It's very obvious why Dallas wanted Tyson and it has little to with his performance last season. Calderon plays only one half of the game and Tyson only plays one half. Except he couldn't be counted on to even do that, last year he was a 15 million deadweight malcontent loser. Dalembert could be the biggest scrub in the world but as long as he wants to be here (instead of dogging it and throwing teammates under the bus) he's a better fit than Flu Fugazi Never Made A Lay-up In My Life Tysoft Chandler

The team was much better on offense when Tyson was on the court last year though. His offensive rebounds and efficiency had a clear, statistically measurable positive impact on the team's offense. Tyson actually helps his team on the half of the court you're not giving him credit for. Calderon kills his own team on the half you're correctly identifying as a problem for him.

EnySpree wrote:Why are people so down on dalembert? Compared to Tyson, dalemberts stats are arguably better over their careers.

Because he's pretty old now and has played for a lot of bad teams. I agree that he used to be a valuable player and hope he still has some gas in the tank.

knicks1248 wrote:

fishmike wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:Anyone wonder why Cuban wanted Tyson more than Calderon and Dalembert? These guys combined had on/off +/- of almost -10 last year. They both have much bigger flaws than Tyson does. It's quite rare that Cuban gets fleeced in trades.

I do wonder... because its clear he thinks he's getting the Tyson/Felton of two years ago not last year. Since your big on quoting the Knicks as a 37 win team lets stay consistent in your musings no? Tyson: 3 straight years his minutes, scoring and FG% have gone down. 3 straight years he's missed more games that the last. So yes.. I do wonder why he would trade for a guy whos probably going to give you 8 points and 9 boards and miss a month or two. What I really *wonder* is if Cuban knows Felton came in that trade?

Well to give felton a little credit, he usually comes back pretty effective(chip on the shoulder routine) after a bad yr.

It's just more evidence that no one is untradable.

He had off the court stuff last year with the wife and guns etc, and that stuff is distracting plain and simple. Banking on him to be a starting PG is bad money at this point...

fishmike wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

fishmike wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:Anyone wonder why Cuban wanted Tyson more than Calderon and Dalembert? These guys combined had on/off +/- of almost -10 last year. They both have much bigger flaws than Tyson does. It's quite rare that Cuban gets fleeced in trades.

I do wonder... because its clear he thinks he's getting the Tyson/Felton of two years ago not last year. Since your big on quoting the Knicks as a 37 win team lets stay consistent in your musings no? Tyson: 3 straight years his minutes, scoring and FG% have gone down. 3 straight years he's missed more games that the last. So yes.. I do wonder why he would trade for a guy whos probably going to give you 8 points and 9 boards and miss a month or two. What I really *wonder* is if Cuban knows Felton came in that trade?

Well to give felton a little credit, he usually comes back pretty effective(chip on the shoulder routine) after a bad yr.

It's just more evidence that no one is untradable.

he could bounce back, but he's an athletic guy who's no longer athletic. His used to be a speed game.

He had off the court stuff last year with the wife and guns etc, and that stuff is distracting plain and simple. Banking on him to be a starting PG is bad money at this point...

we basically traded a pg who shouldn't be in the league for a moderately bad starting PG.

EnySpree wrote:

Dagger wrote:

EnySpree wrote:Why are people so down on dalembert? Compared to Tyson, dalemberts stats are arguably better over their careers.

Because he's pretty old now and has played for a lot of bad teams. I agree that he used to be a valuable player and hope he still has some gas in the tank.

well Sam is only 1 year older than Tyson so that argument is no good....

I just think it has to do with reputation....Sam had a bad rep in Philly for being stupid and lazy, yet he still put up solid numbers.

Tyson has the rep of being a champion and a leader, yet he spent a few years with us and that totally is a lie. Even the USA team thought so by benching him and he was their only true center.

I think Sam is better than Tyson...if he can survive the summer I think Sam will prove it here in NY

Bonn1997 wrote:

Dagger wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:Anyone wonder why Cuban wanted Tyson more than Calderon and Dalembert? These guys combined had on/off +/- of almost -10 last year. They both have much bigger flaws than Tyson does. It's quite rare that Cuban gets fleeced in trades.

It's very obvious why Dallas wanted Tyson and it has little to with his performance last season. Calderon plays only one half of the game and Tyson only plays one half. Except he couldn't be counted on to even do that, last year he was a 15 million deadweight malcontent loser. Dalembert could be the biggest scrub in the world but as long as he wants to be here (instead of dogging it and throwing teammates under the bus) he's a better fit than Flu Fugazi Never Made A Lay-up In My Life Tysoft Chandler

The team was much better on offense when Tyson was on the court last year though. His offensive rebounds and efficiency had a clear, statistically measurable positive impact on the team's offense. Tyson actually helps his team on the half of the court you're not giving him credit for. Calderon kills his own team on the half you're correctly identifying as a problem for him.

I don't get all of a sudden the chandler bashing. Every single player on this team last year was guilty of not being GOOD, all around.. I wasn't the biggest chandler fan, but I will say this. He gave us one of the few bigs that can play above the rim consistently ,and he gave us a defensive presence while in the game. Dalembert and cole are trash in my eyes.. two guys who should be glued to a bench somewhere... just keeping it real... NO those guys are not better than chandler...

Another thing I don't get is how the Triangles magic dust is supposed to transform carmelo.. make calderon elite, if he already isn't,and bargs a "surprise". yet it couldn't help chandler or felton.. two guys may I remind you that were on this so called GREAT 54 win team... It just makes it real hard to have a serious debate with this line of thinking....

when calderon gets blown by, who is going to protect the rim?