But the Pacers are just an example of how far away we are from being elite. Our guys are just old, weak- mentally, physically, skills-wise.

I appreciate the patience of our owner- I just wish he had been patient 10 years ago when he started his win now mantra, traded draft picks away and always excused the bad moves as you can't rebuild in NYC.

I don't see how we can put the kind of supporting cast Melo needs and deserves.

If this organization resigns him, I don't see anything but mediocrity ahead. I hope Mr Analysis Steve Mills sees that, and convinces Dolan.

To me, it just seems to make so much more sense to blow this up now. Yes, we might make the play offs. Heck, we might win our first round match up.

And blowing it up almost assures our pick is a lotto pick to Denver.

But that deal is done. It certainly adds to our disgrace.

I also think blowing it up now vs. waiting gives us a number of advantages

1. if our organization confronts the reality now, it gives us a clear path moving forward

2. most importantly, I think teams that are positioned now to win are most likely to pay a higher price for whatever talent we can move now.

sealy wrote:Minus some small moves, this should be the team until next season is over when they have money to spend. It's just too bad I have no faith in the guys spending it.

So will 24 other NBA teams--and if we sign CA to a max--we wont even have enough to pay 1 max player.

The way it looks now I feel there are teams out there who are liking the mediocre status so they might not want trade as mediocre may lead to playoffs or a miss leads to a deep draft class. Trading partners will be few at best. Wait for off season and start making moves to better the team and coaching staff.

BRIGGS wrote:

franco12 wrote:Sure we beat Miami. But then so did the Nets and the Wizards.

But the Pacers are just an example of how far away we are from being elite. Our guys are just old, weak- mentally, physically, skills-wise.

I appreciate the patience of our owner- I just wish he had been patient 10 years ago when he started his win now mantra, traded draft picks away and always excused the bad moves as you can't rebuild in NYC.

I don't see how we can put the kind of supporting cast Melo needs and deserves.

If this organization resigns him, I don't see anything but mediocrity ahead. I hope Mr Analysis Steve Mills sees that, and convinces Dolan.

To me, it just seems to make so much more sense to blow this up now. Yes, we might make the play offs. Heck, we might win our first round match up.

And blowing it up almost assures our pick is a lotto pick to Denver.

But that deal is done. It certainly adds to our disgrace.

I also think blowing it up now vs. waiting gives us a number of advantages

1. if our organization confronts the reality now, it gives us a clear path moving forward

2. most importantly, I think teams that are positioned now to win are most likely to pay a higher price for whatever talent we can move now.

The realistic point--there is not much to sell.

Disagree entirely Briggs. If this team wanted to do a true rebuild there is plenty to sell....Melo, Tyson, Shump can get good returns. OR you can package the garbage on this team with one of the (JR, Felton, etc).

I still think that signing Melo at less than Max is the optimal way to go, but that won't happen.

Nalod wrote:
Teams have to have a plan, even when you blow it up.

Bargs trade was a ploy to keep Melo happy. Don't trade picks if your planning to blow it up.
If you want to blow it up, play Murry and let him develop. You do this if you think he can grow. You don't blow it up when you are paying a guy like Priggy and promised him minutes if he resigns. He did.

You don't blow it up with a roster full of Metta, Kmarts and Stats.

Sorry, you get the team healthy and make a play off run. It may not work, but blowing it up in a year you don't have a pick and all the above does not ensure any success either.

Than make a plan. Start where you are, and see what direction you want to go. Melo presents a dilemma. If he leaves, we are in a bind. If he stays, we are in a bind. Better to let him go and start again. We will gnash our teeth, but the dollar that becomes available will allow us to make future moves. Chandler is in decline. Some team wants him. Maybe we get draft picks for him. A first and a second anyone? Be smart in what we take back for him. If it's a bad contract, at least get a decent player with it. It's also time to get a different coach. Someone with a real defensive identity. There are several of them out there. Let's not drag this out 'til 2015. Get on it before the trade deadline, and start the makeover now.

Sangfroid wrote:

Nalod wrote:
Teams have to have a plan, even when you blow it up.

Bargs trade was a ploy to keep Melo happy. Don't trade picks if your planning to blow it up.
If you want to blow it up, play Murry and let him develop. You do this if you think he can grow. You don't blow it up when you are paying a guy like Priggy and promised him minutes if he resigns. He did.

You don't blow it up with a roster full of Metta, Kmarts and Stats.

Sorry, you get the team healthy and make a play off run. It may not work, but blowing it up in a year you don't have a pick and all the above does not ensure any success either.

Than make a plan. Start where you are, and see what direction you want to go. Melo presents a dilemma. If he leaves, we are in a bind. If he stays, we are in a bind. Better to let him go and start again. We will gnash our teeth, but the dollar that becomes available will allow us to make future moves. Chandler is in decline. Some team wants him. Maybe we get draft picks for him. A first and a second anyone? Be smart in what we take back for him. If it's a bad contract, at least get a decent player with it. It's also time to get a different coach. Someone with a real defensive identity. There are several of them out there. Let's not drag this out 'til 2015. Get on it before the trade deadline, and start the makeover now.

I think this is the big issue - if Melo leaves during the summer, we're screwed. We might be able to get some decent value back and maintain cap flexibility moving forward.

Heck - if all we could get (and I'm not saying we would only be able to) is a second round pick for Melo and Chandler- those are two picks we don't have today!

djsunyc wrote:knicks have no assets to blow up.

nobody wants jr smith or bargs or the yield will be worse than what you already have.

shump = no value.

you're highest valued player right now might by haradway jr - may get you a late 1st.
chandler may get you a late 1st also.

melo wants to be a FA so it's a rental package - which is nothing.

amare's expiring next summer is almost impossible to move - when has a $20 mil expiring deal every been dealt?

Good take!!!!

BLow it up after a bad game is child banging his head against the wall and having a "fit". The reality is tough to swallow. Enjoy the league and celebrate the rest of January with the NBA in praise of David Stern!

BRIGGS wrote:

sealy wrote:Minus some small moves, this should be the team until next season is over when they have money to spend. It's just too bad I have no faith in the guys spending it.

So will 24 other NBA teams--and if we sign CA to a max--we wont even have enough to pay 1 max player.

If Melo takes all that money that means he is not interested in winning a championship. He should take his money on the back end. I'm quite sure that Melo will take less money if it means bringing in a super star.