EnySpree wrote:I don't get it...are the knicks trying to win a championship or run a developmental team?

Did you actually read my post?

Championship teams are are a combination of All Stars, veterans, and youth that work together to play defense and score while trying to prevent their opposition from doing the same. Most of the championship teams in the history of the sport feature several players that are within the first two or three years of their pro careers. Most of those same teams feature an all star or near all star level player that they drafted (or traded for on draft day) that is a center piece of the team.

So it's just a basic blueprint that has always worked in the pro game. I can't think of a team off the top of my head that has won a ring in the better part of the last two decades that was compiled of only veterans and only acquired via free agency. I'd love it the Knicks could be that team in the next three years, but the odds and history are very against them.

grillco wrote:

DurzoBlint wrote:wow, another Lin buthurt thread. Are the Mods going to do anything or, are they OK turning this into a site that has nothing but negative threads by guys grieving over a guy who is no longer a Knick. Might as well change the name to EmoFan4-former-Knicks.com

Nope. You're wrong and being myopic. I know he's gone and I actually like Felton. I hated that they got rid of him in the Melo trade so I'm glad he's back and fine with Lin being gone, that crap is over. I'm strictly sticking to the facts that the Knicks have essentially turned their back on the notion of developing young talent and incorporating into their team.

So stop projecting your crap onto my words and take them at face value. This actually predates Dolan and Lin is only one piece, albeit the most recent and most visible, in this recurring pattern.

Lin as the linchpin of your argument = buthurt

DurzoBlint wrote:

grillco wrote:

DurzoBlint wrote:wow, another Lin buthurt thread. Are the Mods going to do anything or, are they OK turning this into a site that has nothing but negative threads by guys grieving over a guy who is no longer a Knick. Might as well change the name to EmoFan4-former-Knicks.com

Nope. You're wrong and being myopic. I know he's gone and I actually like Felton. I hated that they got rid of him in the Melo trade so I'm glad he's back and fine with Lin being gone, that crap is over. I'm strictly sticking to the facts that the Knicks have essentially turned their back on the notion of developing young talent and incorporating into their team.

So stop projecting your crap onto my words and take them at face value. This actually predates Dolan and Lin is only one piece, albeit the most recent and most visible, in this recurring pattern.

Lin as the linchpin of your argument = buthurt

Dense.

grillco - always a pleasure to read Cliff notes by an evacuee from The World's Greatest Knicks Forum at the NYT.

Sadly, the delicate mix of yoots, All-Stars and grizzled veterans is elusive when patience is thin as tissue paper. In the case of the 2012-13 Knicks, it is critical that both the Knicks and Rangers play meaningful games in the Spring, to coincide with the renovation of The Worlds Most Famous Arena. The fact that Amar'e Stoudemire is he longests tenured Knicks tells us something about the lack of continuity. Everyone is on roller skates and every trade deadline has more rumors than an episode of Mob Wives.

The only thing we can hope is that our:
- new lead guards stay healthy and wise...
- forwards can pick up some scoring responisibility when Carmelo sits...
- centers are are still standing on bouncy legs by the Playoffs...
- head coach endures the panic and gnashing of teeth after the first three game losing streak...
- Summer League invites can bring more than comic relief to the party.

This season has more intrigue and plot twists to come. It is never what we expect.

We Know Drama.

grillco wrote:

EnySpree wrote:I don't get it...are the knicks trying to win a championship or run a developmental team?

Did you actually read my post?

Championship teams are are a combination of All Stars, veterans, and youth that work together to play defense and score while trying to prevent their opposition from doing the same. Most of the championship teams in the history of the sport feature several players that are within the first two or three years of their pro careers. Most of those same teams feature an all star or near all star level player that they drafted (or traded for on draft day) that is a center piece of the team.

So it's just a basic blueprint that has always worked in the pro game. I can't think of a team off the top of my head that has won a ring in the better part of the last two decades that was compiled of only veterans and only acquired via free agency. I'd love it the Knicks could be that team in the next three years, but the odds and history are very against them.

The knicks are playing in a very small window and need to win now....they don't have 3 years to develop young players....so the mix of players you talk about can't happen here. It just so Happens kidd, Camby, kt, Pablo are on they're way out. At the same time they all have Alot of basketball in them. Knicks have a decent mix of talent. We actually have strengths now....

smackeddog wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:An all things Lin sticky thread might not be a bad thing.

Yep, an official Jeremy Lin butt-hurt thread may be needed- we have to learn from that Gallo trade experience, where every thread was a lament for the next nba superstar, Gallo. The thing is I really liked Gallo and Wilson Chandler, and I liked Lin, but eventually I get so fed up of people banging on about them, I grow to resent them!

this guys deserves the medal. Please, please sticky these Lin threads. Like the above poster said, its become too much.

grillco wrote:Year after year without fail for the better part of two decades the Knicks have either traded their youngest players or let them walk. As the wife and I were discussing last night it seems most championship teams play good defense, break down the opponent's D, have a star/HoF player or two (barring the Pistons from relatively recent winners), have a a few veterans coming through with last gasps, great coaching, AND a young talent that is being nurtured and allowed some real run time.

Have the Knicks have any stellar out of the box draftees? No, but Lin was close. Gallo and Chandler were great players for NY. Fields was having trouble adapting to continuous line up changes, finding his place with Melo and Stat (although they were both out enough last season to make that difficult), and a huge coaching change.

And between the Melo trade and this off-season's moves we traded away a bunch of potential for a group of 40 year old. Felton is the only guy that could play another 5-10 years. Kidd, Camby, and Thomas will be lucky to be worth 25% or their deals in a two years...although I hope I'm wrong about that.

Anyway, the cycle continues. I want them to win, but as we also used to say in the NY Times Knicks forum " house cleaning starts at the top". Unfortunately Big Daddy Dolan is too busy with the real family business to care about the mess his son has made or to mandate that he clean it up. As others were saying in the Ichiro thread, at least I got the Yanks.

Hard to have a bevy of young & talented guys when you don't have any first round picks. They were all traded away, first by Isiah, then Walsh. As afar as the guys you listed, Gallo is a nice NBA player so far, but is being paid over $10 million per year. Wilson has only shown to be a complimentary player at best. Fields as you pointed out, had trouble adapting, and some of that has to fall on him, plus he is making a large salary for someone who is still questionable. Mozgov has really done squat thus far. Felton is back with the Knicks. Jorts and Jordan I believe were already cut by the Rockets. Lin is getting paid highly for a relatively unknown commodity. IMO, the Knicks still have the best young talent on their roster, Shumpert.

The Melo trade hurt not so much in the players given up, but rather in roster flexibility for other potential moves.