If you trade your entire team for a player they need to be a superstar. That’s why you trade for a center that puts up 45pts 23rbs and is a defensive force. Not a guy that stunts team basketball and has to issue a vendetta that he is “going to play defense” because he is sick of a team that made Boris Diaw look like an all NBA performer (Btw 0pts again last night).

It’s not early fellas. Every team is playing under the same conditions, with injuries. You have two superstars you don’t lose to the Bobcats, Raptors, Warriors, Grizzles and go to the final seconds vs Washington. None of those teams are making the playoffs. I mean the Sixers play great team ball, but when it’s a big win to beat a team that is going to be the 6 seed in your own building we are really lowering the bar.

Shumpert not getting love, Barkley is too hard on us, Chad Ford and Hollinger don’t like us. The Knicks are a poorly constructed team, that’s going to half ass it consistently, not show up, talk tough and then tell you they have no idea why they didn’t play hard out of the gates.

This isn't even debatable

MS wrote:It’s about time some of you guys face facts and stop complaining about all the fair coverage this team gets. At the end of the day the Knicks suck; and are the biggest disappointment in the entire NBA. They have played the easiest schedule in the entire league and are barely above .500. Everything is an apology, they haven’t been together, they need time to mess and more embarrassing our team isn’t whole yet (yes Baron Davis is the key to our success). Christ what happens if he signed elsewhere.

If you trade your entire team for a player they need to be a superstar. That’s why you trade for a center that puts up 45pts 23rbs and is a defensive force. Not a guy that stunts team basketball and has to issue a vendetta that he is “going to play defense” because he is sick of a team that made Boris Diaw look like an all NBA performer (Btw 0pts again last night).

It’s not early fellas. Every team is playing under the same conditions, with injuries. You have two superstars you don’t lose to the Bobcats, Raptors, Warriors, Grizzles and go to the final seconds vs Washington. None of those teams are making the playoffs. I mean the Sixers play great team ball, but when it’s a big win to beat a team that is going to be the 6 seed in your own building we are really lowering the bar.

Shumpert not getting love, Barkley is too hard on us, Chad Ford and Hollinger don’t like us. The Knicks are a poorly constructed team, that’s going to half ass it consistently, not show up, talk tough and then tell you they have no idea why they didn’t play hard out of the gates.

This isn't even debatable

Hmm...Tell us how you really feel

Bonn1997 wrote:People have to stop calling me the most negative poster on the board now!

You're a bucket of roses compared to MS

raven wrote:

MS wrote:It’s about time some of you guys face facts and stop complaining about all the fair coverage this team gets. At the end of the day the Knicks suck; and are the biggest disappointment in the entire NBA. They have played the easiest schedule in the entire league and are barely above .500. Everything is an apology, they haven’t been together, they need time to mess and more embarrassing our team isn’t whole yet (yes Baron Davis is the key to our success). Christ what happens if he signed elsewhere.

If you trade your entire team for a player they need to be a superstar. That’s why you trade for a center that puts up 45pts 23rbs and is a defensive force. Not a guy that stunts team basketball and has to issue a vendetta that he is “going to play defense” because he is sick of a team that made Boris Diaw look like an all NBA performer (Btw 0pts again last night).

It’s not early fellas. Every team is playing under the same conditions, with injuries. You have two superstars you don’t lose to the Bobcats, Raptors, Warriors, Grizzles and go to the final seconds vs Washington. None of those teams are making the playoffs. I mean the Sixers play great team ball, but when it’s a big win to beat a team that is going to be the 6 seed in your own building we are really lowering the bar.

Shumpert not getting love, Barkley is too hard on us, Chad Ford and Hollinger don’t like us. The Knicks are a poorly constructed team, that’s going to half ass it consistently, not show up, talk tough and then tell you they have no idea why they didn’t play hard out of the gates.

This isn't even debatable

In case you haven't noticed, people around here don't want to debate anymore.

There is a few simple truth that you have to agree with if you want to be a true fan:

1- We are contenders

2- Melo is a superstar and the trade we did last year was the best thing we had to do

3- The coach sucks, he'S the reason Melo doesn't look interested all the time, Amare doesn't have any fundamentals, Chandler has no post moves after 10 years in the league, Shumpert chucked last night, Douglas can't play the point, Davis has a bad back, Fields plays like the second round pick he is, etc.

4- We did not overpay for an unidimensional center with no offensive game whatsoever that only had one good playoff run in his whole career

5- Shumpert is ROY after 3 games and is the best rookie drafted by the Knicks over the last 10 years or so.

Stick to this, and everything should be fine.

Fact is the few teams we have beaten were:
- bad
- shorthanded
- tired (lol @ the guy saying the win against the sixers was legit although we were fresh and they had played 3 games in 3 nights)

My belief: Walsh had a vision and played long term, and Dolan made us go backward again.

This team is garbage, has no future, no cap space, no plan, no identity.

But since I'm not a true fan, who cares about what I think?

MS wrote:If you trade your entire team for a player they need to be a superstar. That’s why you trade for a center that puts up 45pts 23rbs and is a defensive force. Not a guy that stunts team basketball and has to issue a vendetta that he is “going to play defense” because he is sick of a team that made Boris Diaw look like an all NBA performer (Btw 0pts again last night).

Yes, and then you could be complaining about your center's crap free throw percentage and how your team is still shit.
And a star center who's managed how many chips in his career so far?

Preach it!

MS wrote:I just don’t see a lot of positives with this team. We took a tremendous risk trading all our assets for Carmelo. Denver has actually gotten better and they don’t even have Wilson Chandler. Were our assets stars, no, but they were learning how to play well together. Everyone is quick to bring up the fact that we weren’t going anywhere with those guys. Not right away, but as they improve you fill in the pieces.

Denver has beaten LA (on a back to back, and we've already established in other posts that beating a good team (Philly) when they're tired obviously doesn't mean sheet. Other than that, how have they gotten better? By beating Utah, Sac, and the Nyets? Are they really more than a 1st round and out in a flat division with one actual contender in it? How is that better? They were a more exciting and dangerous team back with the freak show that was Melo Birdman Chauncey and China's finest citizen, JR Smith.

Gallo's averaging 17 pts a game, Moz isn't doing shit, and Felton is about as relevant at this point in Knicks history as Chris Duhon. The trade was almost two years ago. We now have a scorer who can take over games. Did you see the jumper over Iggy the other night? Was Gallo going to do that? Really? What did we have with the previous crew? Dreams and potential? Cap space for what?

Please find something else.

raven wrote:

MS wrote:It’s about time some of you guys face facts and stop complaining about all the fair coverage this team gets. At the end of the day the Knicks suck; and are the biggest disappointment in the entire NBA. They have played the easiest schedule in the entire league and are barely above .500. Everything is an apology, they haven’t been together, they need time to mess and more embarrassing our team isn’t whole yet (yes Baron Davis is the key to our success). Christ what happens if he signed elsewhere.

If you trade your entire team for a player they need to be a superstar. That’s why you trade for a center that puts up 45pts 23rbs and is a defensive force. Not a guy that stunts team basketball and has to issue a vendetta that he is “going to play defense” because he is sick of a team that made Boris Diaw look like an all NBA performer (Btw 0pts again last night).

It’s not early fellas. Every team is playing under the same conditions, with injuries. You have two superstars you don’t lose to the Bobcats, Raptors, Warriors, Grizzles and go to the final seconds vs Washington. None of those teams are making the playoffs. I mean the Sixers play great team ball, but when it’s a big win to beat a team that is going to be the 6 seed in your own building we are really lowering the bar.

Shumpert not getting love, Barkley is too hard on us, Chad Ford and Hollinger don’t like us. The Knicks are a poorly constructed team, that’s going to half ass it consistently, not show up, talk tough and then tell you they have no idea why they didn’t play hard out of the gates.

This isn't even debatable

In case you haven't noticed, people around here don't want to debate anymore.

There is a few simple truth that you have to agree with if you want to be a true fan:

1- We are contenders

2- Melo is a superstar and the trade we did last year was the best thing we had to do

3- The coach sucks, he'S the reason Melo doesn't look interested all the time, Amare doesn't have any fundamentals, Chandler has no post moves after 10 years in the league, Shumpert chucked last night, Douglas can't play the point, Davis has a bad back, Fields plays like the second round pick he is, etc.

4- We did not overpay for an unidimensional center with no offensive game whatsoever that only had one good playoff run in his whole career

5- Shumpert is ROY after 3 games and is the best rookie drafted by the Knicks over the last 10 years or so.

Stick to this, and everything should be fine.

Fact is the few teams we have beaten were:
- bad
- shorthanded
- tired (lol @ the guy saying the win against the sixers was legit although we were fresh and they had played 3 games in 3 nights)

My belief: Walsh had a vision and played long term, and Dolan made us go backward again.

This team is garbage, has no future, no cap space, no plan, no identity.

But since I'm not a true fan, who cares about what I think?

your wrong. I would love to debate.

What in this thread is up for debate? Did MS make a single intellegent remark. He just bitched and moaned Nobody cares about that kind post.

THIS THREAD IS GARBAGE, and thanks to these kinds of repeat daily threads this forum is becoming garbage also.

MS... what should the Knicks do? Who should they target? What adjustments need to happen? Oh wait... thats too much thought. Much easier to say they suck and its not up for debate.

My retort is simple. You suck. You mom sucks, and that ugly dog that dumps pisses on your neighbor's flowers sucks too. These things are not up for debate. Just face it.

See? These threads DO INDEED inspire good discussion!

MSG3 wrote:

jrodmc wrote:

MS wrote:I just don’t see a lot of positives with this team. We took a tremendous risk trading all our assets for Carmelo. Denver has actually gotten better and they don’t even have Wilson Chandler. Were our assets stars, no, but they were learning how to play well together. Everyone is quick to bring up the fact that we weren’t going anywhere with those guys. Not right away, but as they improve you fill in the pieces.

Denver has beaten LA (on a back to back, and we've already established in other posts that beating a good team (Philly) when they're tired obviously doesn't mean sheet. Other than that, how have they gotten better? By beating Utah, Sac, and the Nyets? Are they really more than a 1st round and out in a flat division with one actual contender in it? How is that better? They were a more exciting and dangerous team back with the freak show that was Melo Birdman Chauncey and China's finest citizen, JR Smith.

Gallo's averaging 17 pts a game, Moz isn't doing shit, and Felton is about as relevant at this point in Knicks history as Chris Duhon. The trade was almost two years ago. We now have a scorer who can take over games. Did you see the jumper over Iggy the other night? Was Gallo going to do that? Really? What did we have with the previous crew? Dreams and potential? Cap space for what?

Please find something else.

Felton is playing lights out right now.

But I don't disagree with the sentiment of your post. I'm very angry with how this team is playing. But we need to see them with a PG. Managment took a calculated risk by getting rid of Billups for Tyson, hoping that with a PG this team is ready. That may still be the case. We jsut don't know. STAT is the one hurting us the most right now because he's lost without someone feeding him the ball where he can operate.

I heard Zach Randolph was playing great last year as well. Is Felton really going to lead anyone to ChipLand?

My posts are more about all this incessant, never-ending whining over what was given up for Melo. Giving up an aging "Tired of being a mentor at the end of my career" Billups for a true defensive center (which everyone was crying for pre-signing of Tyson) is a win every day IMHO.

We were supposed to all be patient with the "culture" and the "cap space" and the "potential" of the old roster. Just wait, Gallo will be a superstar, Felton won't be fat to start seasons off, and Chandler will stop disappearing in 3rd and 4th quarters. Moz! Moz is going to become Love East! Just you wait!

I don't understand all this patience with invisible midlevel exception folks and 10 games into the starphuch season we are to abandon this f-ing ship and buy O-town season tickets because DHoward misses 18 foulshots in one game.

I love Donnie Walsh, but isn't he dead already?

Yeah, I know that's cold but phuck the past already.

Fields doesn't have the gunslinger mentality or the shooting touch to be a starting SG. I thought he could make up for it with the intangibles he contributes but there isn't enough of that anymore to justify a starting job.

Shumpert has the gunslinger mentality but he's playing out of position and at times doesn't know when to stop shooting. Getting a green light to shoot isn't a green light to pass up open teammates and jack up one bad shot after another. I know he's a rookie but last night's performance was a ****ing disgrace by Shumpert, and D'Antoni for not benching him. Saying 'oops my bad" after the fact isn't good enough. Not repeating that kind of selfish play will be.

Unless Baron Davis can get Stat and Melo to work better when they're on the floor (at the same time) by the end of the season, then trades should be explored for Stat. We have no post game and Chandler needs to have a PG draw his defender away from him to score in the paint.

Part of the lack of a post game is by design but it doesn't matter because the Knicks will likely need a post player next season. I'm guessing that Steve Nash coming to NY is all that's going to save D'Antoni's job if the Knicks don't go deep in the playoffs and right now I don't see that happening. Hope I'm wrong.

In the meantime I think Bibby should get more minutes unless he's hurting. He seems to get teammates to do a better job of passing the ball when he is on the floor. I know Bibby has his liabilities but I'd rather he brought up the ball and moved the ball around instead of Shumpert or Douglas, he's better at it. I would also try to find some minutes for Novak. He's making good use of what little minutes he's getting on both ends of the floor.