"I needed some motivation today, and I just received it. Thank you @NBAonESPN"

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/7100076/nba-player-rankings-11-15

Stupid rankings imho.

nixluva wrote:Gasol? I just can't see how this guy is ahead of Melo and STAT. Gasol is VERY good, but i'd have to put him behind Melo and STAT. Gasol has shriveled in big situations at times IMO. He's gotten GREAT support from being on a stacked team.

Not for me. Gasol is VERY solid on defense and is prob one of the best passing big men in the league. For me that separates him from the likes of STAT and Melo.

martin wrote:

nixluva wrote:Gasol? I just can't see how this guy is ahead of Melo and STAT. Gasol is VERY good, but i'd have to put him behind Melo and STAT. Gasol has shriveled in big situations at times IMO. He's gotten GREAT support from being on a stacked team.

Not for me. Gasol is VERY solid on defense and is prob one of the best passing big men in the league. For me that separates him from the likes of STAT and Melo.

I understand Gasol's skills, but he tends to float thru games rather than impact them IMO. Big's like him are in such a unique situation. They get over by virtue of the scarcity of big man talent, so that if you have any real talent it's magnified. However, players like STAT and Melo tend to really take over on a more consistent basis. It's debatable but IMO Gasol is lucky to be 7' cuz he's not having to go against the best talent pool in the NBA as opposed to the other positions on the floor.

STAT led the league in 4th qtr scoring and was clutch. Melo is one of the most clutch players in the league. Both reach higher highs than Gasol does when they really turn it up. I just can't put Gasol in that category. Gasol is one of those middle of the game players. Those kinds of guys stack up statistics, but are not the guys that take over games.

Silverfuel wrote:It depends on which Gasol shows up. If its the Gasol from last year then Amare is better. Gasol's defense wasn't as good last year. Also, Amare is a MUCH better offensive player (25ppg vs 19ppg)

Not for me. Gasol is VERY solid on defense and is prob one of the best passing big men in the league. For me that separates him from the likes of STAT and Melo.

RonRon wrote:stats are very misleading. I would have Durant over Melo, no doubt. Gasol didn't finish last year good but he has is a true 7 footer with a lot of different skill set. In the end, Durant and Gasol do things that can make their team better. Melo and Stat have shown to be just scorers. Sure they probably cant win it alone, but Kobe can't either. Kobe's best year where he dropped 50-80+ points on numerous games didn't translate to a playoff spot.

A lot of Melo's rebounds are because he doesn't guard his man and is looking to grab the rebound. Durant is a way better defender and his has way more range. Gasol is one of the best passing big men in the league, if not the best. He is a true 7footer and has great reach to go with it. He is a way better defender than Stat.

Durant is a great young player, but he's not that much ahead or behind Melo IMO. Every analysis i've ever seen backs up my view that these 2 guys are very close. One thing tho, just look at how Melo has done head to head against the other guys like Durant and Lebron. Melo consistently has great performances against these guys. Melo has a winning record against Durant and Lebron.

Head to head, they've played 11 times. Carmelo's team's record against Durant is 10-1. Carmelo has outscored him (29.6 to 26.8) and has shot better from the field (.502 to .423). Durant has a slight edge in rebounding (6.8 to 6.5), while Carmelo—surprisingly—has dished more dimes (3.8 to 3.0).

(And in case you're wondering, Carmelo's record against LeBron is 9-4. Yet, for some reason, players who play the same position and guard each other when they play are never compared in their head-to-head battles when trying to determine who is "better." Isn't there valuable data here? Does Carmelo not merit any credit for completely owning LeBron and Durant? Doesn't a combined 19-5 record mean anything?)

nixluva wrote:Gasol? I just can't see how this guy is ahead of Melo and STAT. Gasol is VERY good, but i'd have to put him behind Melo and STAT. Gasol has shriveled in big situations at times IMO. He's gotten GREAT support from being on a stacked team.

Pau has had put himself in more big moments than Stat.

He still has two rings and Bynum was not always there.

Lets hope Stat's back holds. Otherwise he is a bloated contract.

Stat needs his athletic advantage to be effective.

Bonn1997 wrote:

Silverfuel wrote:

Nalod wrote:

nixluva wrote:Gasol? I just can't see how this guy is ahead of Melo and STAT. Gasol is VERY good, but i'd have to put him behind Melo and STAT. Gasol has shriveled in big situations at times IMO. He's gotten GREAT support from being on a stacked team.

Pau has had put himself in more big moments than Stat.

He still has two rings and Bynum was not always there.

Lets hope Stat's back holds. Otherwise he is a bloated contract.

Stat needs his athletic advantage to be effective.

Pau had Kobe which is why he won rings. The other poster brought up Bynum to point out how it makes Pau's defense look better not comparing how many more rings he has.

Comparing Pau's rings to Amare's rings is like comparing apples and oranges.

I have to agree with Nalod here. Pau took a mediocre team and turned it into a championship-level team. Maybe Amare hasn't had the same opportunity but that doesn't mean you should ignore what Pau did. Amare has had the very rare privilege of playing with a 2 time league MVP and several all-stars.

Regarding Amare, look at Phoenix's record this season. Compare their record to last season. Where was the two time MVP? Not that valuable without Amare was he?

Bonn1997 wrote:

Silverfuel wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Silverfuel wrote:

Nalod wrote:

nixluva wrote:Gasol? I just can't see how this guy is ahead of Melo and STAT. Gasol is VERY good, but i'd have to put him behind Melo and STAT. Gasol has shriveled in big situations at times IMO. He's gotten GREAT support from being on a stacked team.

Pau has had put himself in more big moments than Stat.

He still has two rings and Bynum was not always there.

Lets hope Stat's back holds. Otherwise he is a bloated contract.

Stat needs his athletic advantage to be effective.

Pau had Kobe which is why he won rings. The other poster brought up Bynum to point out how it makes Pau's defense look better not comparing how many more rings he has.

Comparing Pau's rings to Amare's rings is like comparing apples and oranges.

I have to agree with Nalod here. Pau took a mediocre team and turned it into a championship-level team. Maybe Amare hasn't had the same opportunity but that doesn't mean you should ignore what Pau did. Amare has had the very rare privilege of playing with a 2 time league MVP and several all-stars.

I don't know if you are kidding or if you are serious. Are you suggesting Pau is the reason the Lakers won championships?

The reason? There's no such thing as "the reason" a team wins a championship. You seem stuck in "single causality" thinking. He was the biggest change by far though in the team's transformation from mediocrity to championship level, though.

Cause when you say "Pau took a mediocre team and turned it into a championship-level team," it seems like you are saying he is the best player on that team and not Kobe.

Regarding Amare, look at Phoenix's record this season. Compare their record to last season. Where was the two time MVP? Not that valuable without Amare was he?

Your comment would be justifiable if I were arguing Amare did not help his team. But I'm not. Of course he did and of course the team is worse without him.

Regarding the two-time MVP, he's old and slow now. Those awards were from 5 and 6 seasons ago.