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Getting a Woody........
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Nalod
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8/24/2011  3:37 PM
Woodson a Knick coach.

Already hack writing about replacing MDA.

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basketball/knicks/2011/08/24/2011-08-24_knicks_ready_to_add_former_hawks_head_coach_mike_woodson_as_defensive_coach_on_m.html

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Ira
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8/24/2011  6:02 PM

The Knicks are moving closer to hiring former Hawks head coach Mike Woodson as an assistant coach, which will fuel speculation that Woodson may one day succeed Mike D’Antoni as the team’s head coach.

Although Woodson’s last Atlanta team was criticized for its failure to make defensive adjustments when getting bombed by Orlando in the 2010 playoffs, the former first-round pick of the Knicks will join D’Antoni’s staff as a defensive coach.

The Daily News first reported in May that D’Antoni, who has resisted bringing in an outsider to his coaching staff, would be forced to hire a defensive coach because of the Knicks’ failures at that end during his first three seasons in New York.

In the past few days, Woodson had told two confidantes that he expects to join the Knicks. The move might become official next week, according to sources, when Garden and team executives return from vacation. Woodson had what he called a good meeting with D’Antoni earlier this month, but he had people above D’Antoni in his corner from the start.

Woodson’s hiring was recommended by Isiah Thomas, a long-time friend and former teammate who continues to serve as Garden chairman Jim Dolan‘s top unpaid consultant.

Woodson could be in line to move to the head coaching position in the future. D’Antoni has only one year remaining on his contract, as his requests for an extension in this off-season have been rejected by Dolan.

Woodson’s alliance with Thomas goes back more than 30 years, when he helped Hall of Fame coach Bob Knight recruit Thomas to Indiana.
Additionally, Woodson is also a former teammate of interim GM Glen Grunwald. Although there has been speculation that the Knicks are looking for a permanent, GM Grunwald is signed through the 2011-12 season. Meanwhile. the team still has made no move to replace Donnie Walsh, who was forced out as team president in a contract dispute with Dolan in June.

Markji
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8/24/2011  6:13 PM
Ira wrote:

Woodson .... he had people above D’Antoni in his corner from the start.

Woodson’s hiring was recommended by Isiah Thomas, a long-time friend and former teammate who continues to serve as Garden chairman Jim Dolan‘s top unpaid consultant.

Woodson could be in line to move to the head coaching position in the future. D’Antoni has only one year remaining on his contract, as his requests for an extension in this off-season have been rejected by Dolan.

Woodson’s alliance with Thomas goes back more than 30 years, when he helped Hall of Fame coach Bob Knight recruit Thomas to Indiana.


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loweyecue
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8/24/2011  6:24 PM
Lord Isiah strikes again? bye bye mda
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CrushAlot
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8/24/2011  6:42 PM
loweyecue wrote:Lord Isiah strikes again? bye bye mda

I thought Isiah wanted the Knicks to become Phoenix East.
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
nixluva
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8/24/2011  7:36 PM
IMO I think the Knicks are going to be much improved and more successful next season, especially if they improve defensively. This team is going to be a top offensive team already and if they improve at all on D, it's gonna mean more wins. I think it would be a mistake to promote Woodson to head coach if the team is winning at a higher rate than previous years with MDA at the helm. If anything that would support the idea that you keep both in the spots they would already have. I HATED the Hawks offense under Woodson. It was one of the ugliest things i've every seen. Let him help on D but leave MDA in control of the rest of things.
loweyecue
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8/24/2011  8:31 PM
I have no issues with us getting a defensive assistant. Or even MDA being replaced if this season is a bust. I just get irritated when the snake is mentioned. Isiah did enough damage to us already.
TKF on Melo ::....he is a punk, a jerk, a self absorbed out of shape, self aggrandizing, unprofessional, volume chucking coach killing playoff loser!!
martin
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8/24/2011  8:55 PM
loweyecue wrote:I have no issues with us getting a defensive assistant. Or even MDA being replaced if this season is a bust. I just get irritated when the snake is mentioned. Isiah did enough damage to us already.

Frank only bringing Isiah into article just to sell it some more.

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loweyecue
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8/24/2011  9:15 PM
martin wrote:
loweyecue wrote:I have no issues with us getting a defensive assistant. Or even MDA being replaced if this season is a bust. I just get irritated when the snake is mentioned. Isiah did enough damage to us already.

Frank only bringing Isiah into article just to sell it some more.

Yep I get that. Still it's a wound so deep that even a hint of vinegar anywhere around it sets it on fire. Know what I mean?

TKF on Melo ::....he is a punk, a jerk, a self absorbed out of shape, self aggrandizing, unprofessional, volume chucking coach killing playoff loser!!
arkrud
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8/24/2011  10:00 PM
Woodson... Shmudson... whatever
Who cares who will coach the season which will never be.
"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
CrushAlot
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8/24/2011  11:14 PM
I am not sure that this is going to workout well for anyone. I think if you hire D'Antoni you are all in. All of the negatives that go along with a D'Antoni coached team were known when he was hired. I don't see anyway that he embraces a defensive assistant or changes his preperation or practices unless he is forced to. Also, why is Woodson signing on to work with a staff that has a one year contract. I want the Knicks to emphasize defense. I want a different head coach. However, in this situation I think they need to fish or cut bait. I think there is a very good chance that Woodson's presence creates a power struggle and a rift in the locker room. If you are an ssol team own it and be it. I think it is a faulty style and I think the wrong coach is in place but he hasn't changed who he is. In fact I don't think he should ever be a head coach again. However, expecting him to change scouting, time alotted for practice, game day shoot arounds, what he emphasizes in practices etc., all of the things a defensive minded coach would do differently is unrealistic and a bit unreasonable. I think D'Antoni has enough of a resume to justify a firing or extension in NY. I see this move as similar to Isiah firing Dick Helm and leaving Lenny Wilkens with all Isiah guys on his staff.
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martin
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8/24/2011  11:56 PM
CrushAlot wrote:I am not sure that this is going to workout well for anyone. I think if you hire D'Antoni you are all in. All of the negatives that go along with a D'Antoni coached team were known when he was hired. I don't see anyway that he embraces a defensive assistant or changes his preperation or practices unless he is forced to. Also, why is Woodson signing on to work with a staff that has a one year contract. I want the Knicks to emphasize defense. I want a different head coach. However, in this situation I think they need to fish or cut bait. I think there is a very good chance that Woodson's presence creates a power struggle and a rift in the locker room. If you are an ssol team own it and be it. I think it is a faulty style and I think the wrong coach is in place but he hasn't changed who he is. In fact I don't think he should ever be a head coach again. However, expecting him to change scouting, time alotted for practice, game day shoot arounds, what he emphasizes in practices etc., all of the things a defensive minded coach would do differently is unrealistic and a bit unreasonable. I think D'Antoni has enough of a resume to justify a firing or extension in NY. I see this move as similar to Isiah firing Dick Helm and leaving Lenny Wilkens with all Isiah guys on his staff.

you are more negative than this economy. Only, you know, more so.

You and nix should get in a room so the rest of us can see how negative and positive come together and explode.

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CrushAlot
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8/25/2011  12:32 AM
martin wrote:
CrushAlot wrote:I am not sure that this is going to workout well for anyone. I think if you hire D'Antoni you are all in. All of the negatives that go along with a D'Antoni coached team were known when he was hired. I don't see anyway that he embraces a defensive assistant or changes his preperation or practices unless he is forced to. Also, why is Woodson signing on to work with a staff that has a one year contract. I want the Knicks to emphasize defense. I want a different head coach. However, in this situation I think they need to fish or cut bait. I think there is a very good chance that Woodson's presence creates a power struggle and a rift in the locker room. If you are an ssol team own it and be it. I think it is a faulty style and I think the wrong coach is in place but he hasn't changed who he is. In fact I don't think he should ever be a head coach again. However, expecting him to change scouting, time alotted for practice, game day shoot arounds, what he emphasizes in practices etc., all of the things a defensive minded coach would do differently is unrealistic and a bit unreasonable. I think D'Antoni has enough of a resume to justify a firing or extension in NY. I see this move as similar to Isiah firing Dick Helm and leaving Lenny Wilkens with all Isiah guys on his staff.

you are more negative than this economy. Only, you know, more so.

You and nix should get in a room so the rest of us can see how negative and positive come together and explode.

In a perfect world if this worked out like Doc and Thibs I think it would be great. However, I don't see this as that kind of move. I think Doc and Thibs were working for a common goal and their basic philosophy on basketball and how it should be played was similar. I think D'Antoni and Woodson have different philosophies on how basketball should be played that contrast with each other. They might have a common goal but their approaches are so different that expecting a molding of the two and a harmony existing between them is not very realistic in my opinion. I don't see that as being negative or pessimistic. I think if this was an area that D'Antoni wanted to address he would have done it long before he was somewhat exposed and at risk of losing his job. This has come up before and when it did in Phoenix he had the record and clout to shoot it down. He is on thin ice in NY and doesn't have Walsh anymore so he is a bit handcuffed as far as being able to reject this move from a hiring stand point. That being said, trying to integrate a defensive mindset and a balance of power between a defensive coach and a guy who was once thought of as such a tremendous offense guru that defense, scouting and preperation could be an afterthought does not seem like a match destined to workout.
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
Childs2Dudley
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8/25/2011  1:02 AM
The Hawks defense was pretty awful at times. I'm not sure about the hire. I think we passed on more capable candidates when they were available.
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SupremeCommander
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8/25/2011  3:57 AM
Childs2Dudley wrote:The Hawks defense was pretty awful at times. I'm not sure about the hire. I think we passed on more capable candidates when they were available.

I tend to agree, but I'm just happy we have a defensive assistant at all

DLeethal wrote: Lol Rick needs a safe space
nixluva
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8/25/2011  5:14 AM    LAST EDITED: 8/25/2011  5:16 AM
martin wrote:
CrushAlot wrote:I am not sure that this is going to workout well for anyone. I think if you hire D'Antoni you are all in. All of the negatives that go along with a D'Antoni coached team were known when he was hired. I don't see anyway that he embraces a defensive assistant or changes his preperation or practices unless he is forced to. Also, why is Woodson signing on to work with a staff that has a one year contract. I want the Knicks to emphasize defense. I want a different head coach. However, in this situation I think they need to fish or cut bait. I think there is a very good chance that Woodson's presence creates a power struggle and a rift in the locker room. If you are an ssol team own it and be it. I think it is a faulty style and I think the wrong coach is in place but he hasn't changed who he is. In fact I don't think he should ever be a head coach again. However, expecting him to change scouting, time alotted for practice, game day shoot arounds, what he emphasizes in practices etc., all of the things a defensive minded coach would do differently is unrealistic and a bit unreasonable. I think D'Antoni has enough of a resume to justify a firing or extension in NY. I see this move as similar to Isiah firing Dick Helm and leaving Lenny Wilkens with all Isiah guys on his staff.

you are more negative than this economy. Only, you know, more so.

You and nix should get in a room so the rest of us can see how negative and positive come together and explode.

This is an EPIC battle between Me and CrushAlot!!!

Here's one for you Crush, since you have a problem with facts, bite on this. For 3.5 years D'Antoni had a Defensive assistant coach. It was Marc Iavaroni. During his stint the team improved on D to the upper half of the league on D. Remember that during those years in PHX they didn't always have enough size to be a serious defensive team. When they finally added Shaq he was already on the decline. Technically Mike has had a defensive assistant for 6 years. They pick on him cuz the team has stunk on D, but really it's not cuz they didn't have an assistant focusing on it. It's about the make up of the team and having the team stay together long enough to really get the defensive chemistry working.

I sat down to read the book, but I made sure to read the section in the beginning that identifies the Suns' players, coaches, and staff. Here's what McCallum wrote about Iavaroni (emphasis mine):

MARC IAVARONI (I-VA-RO-NEE) - [Head Coach Mike] D'Antoni's lead assistant; handles defensive strategy; won one NBA title as a player; nobody works harder on film study but has a sense of humor.

http://thirdquartercollapse.blogspot.com/2007/05/irony-strikes.html
http://www.liquida.com/marc-iavaroni/
Marc Iavaroni - Obviously has history with D’Antoni in Phoenix, helping lead the Suns into the top half of the NBA in defensive rating.

D’Antoni is expected to add a defensive specialist to the staff, at the behest of the front office. D’Antoni called it "an option we will look at." It would not be a new concept. In Phoenix, Marc Iavaroni served as D’Antoni’s defensive coach for three and a half seasons.

After Iavaroni left, Mike hired Jay Humphries as the new defensive assistant and as we know in NY he has had his brother doing it. I still maintain that it has more to do with the make up of the roster than simply defensive schemes or not enough work on D. Defense for this team begins with making sure we have enough players willing and capable of defending. This process has been hampered by trades over the years, but now we can focus on it and it's begun already with Iman being added and maybe Jorts can give some backup help. Still this team needs a legit defensive C. We all know that means a Dalembert or Pryzbilla type.

CrushAlot
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8/25/2011  9:57 AM
For what its worth Humphries has been out of the NBA since 08 and I believe is currently coaching Steph's team in China.
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
Moonangie
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8/25/2011  11:38 AM
Players must commit to defense because they see it as the winning way (unless they skip watching the playoffs once they are out). I was very impressed with the Knicks' defensive intensity in the Boston series, until CB got hurt and the others tired out (i.e., threw in the towel). Defensive intensity springs from leadership among the top players, and commitment from them. It has MUCH less to do with the coach. I think MDA has done a good job building a high scoring team. He needs to keep them focused on that end while Woodson (or whomever) helps improve their consistency on D. But to be a contending team, the leaders (read: Stat and Melo) have to demonstrate by their example how it gets done.
nixluva
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8/25/2011  12:02 PM
Moonangie wrote:Players must commit to defense because they see it as the winning way (unless they skip watching the playoffs once they are out). I was very impressed with the Knicks' defensive intensity in the Boston series, until CB got hurt and the others tired out (i.e., threw in the towel). Defensive intensity springs from leadership among the top players, and commitment from them. It has MUCH less to do with the coach. I think MDA has done a good job building a high scoring team. He needs to keep them focused on that end while Woodson (or whomever) helps improve their consistency on D. But to be a contending team, the leaders (read: Stat and Melo) have to demonstrate by their example how it gets done.

I agree with this. In addition you need a set of core players that actually have defensive talent. All throughout NBA history teams that had a couple of players that really had defensive talent and demanded effort from their teammates have had great defense. So I ask who did the Knicks have that fit this description? It's funny how quickly the Celtics became a defensive juggernaut as soon as they got KG. We don't have a KG and if STAT and Melo don't step up and lead on that end then this team will only get so good. IMO I think this team has some decent pieces that if we can get a defensive anchor at C, it could improve a lot. CB, TD, Iman, Fields, Williams will defend! If STAT and Melo become more committed this team can be pretty good.

CrushAlot
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8/25/2011  12:19 PM
Moonangie wrote:Players must commit to defense because they see it as the winning way (unless they skip watching the playoffs once they are out). I was very impressed with the Knicks' defensive intensity in the Boston series, until CB got hurt and the others tired out (i.e., threw in the towel). Defensive intensity springs from leadership among the top players, and commitment from them. It has MUCH less to do with the coach. I think MDA has done a good job building a high scoring team. He needs to keep them focused on that end while Woodson (or whomever) helps improve their consistency on D. But to be a contending team, the leaders (read: Stat and Melo) have to demonstrate by their example how it gets done.
I have to disagree with this. I think the coach needs to have his team focused, prepared and buying into playing good defense. Last year was the first year that the Knicks employed advance scouts since D'Antoni was in NY. I think this quote from Gortat when he was traded to the Suns says a lot about how a coach prepares his team to play defense against opponents.

"I came from a team where everybody's competing and trying to do the stuff that coach is saying. We're just totally changing our rotations, changing our stuff that we set before the game. We're not playing hard enough ... The positive thing is? It can't be worse."
- Marcin Gortat on the Suns defense "It's just a little bit frustrating when you come in the locker room and people are talking about the offense," Gortat began. "That's not the way you're going to win NBA games. I don't know if it's just me, or maybe I'm just different, but I came from a team where everybody's competing and trying to do the stuff that coach is saying. We're just totally changing our rotations, changing our stuff that we set before the game. We're not playing hard enough and I've just got to tell you, there's a lot, a lot of work in front of us. The positive thing is? It can't be worse."

Gentry said the Suns are working hard in practice, but for whatever reason that hard work isn't translating into that effort being there in game situations. But we'll stick with Gortat, as he seemed to give the most honest and straightforward assessment of the team's defensive struggles.

"I just think we have to be at the gym every day for three hours," Gortat continued. "Learn the rotations, learn everything from the beginning. I mean, there are so many things we're doing bad, I just can't find an explanation. I'm trying to get some rebounds and stops, but unfortunately there's not too many opportunities for me to rebound because the team is scoring 120-something points.

"It's just frustrating; frustrating as hell. I'm not going to lie."

Gortat played in Orlando the last four seasons, on a Magic team that was elite for the last three. He knows what it takes to reach that level, and it's been quite an adjustment for him coming to a team that's near the bottom of the league defensively.

"It's kind of a reality check for me, being on a team who is winning then all of a sudden coming to a team which is losing," Gortat said. "I mean, we are the worst defensive team in the league. I don't know; we've just got to come tomorrow as early as possible and just put in work -- three hours at least."

http://www.aolnews.com/2010/12/30/marcin-gortat-rips-suns-defense-after-disappointing-loss-to-sixe/

I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
Getting a Woody........

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