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The Melo Contingent's "Told Ya So"
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Melo2NYK
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12/17/2010  10:07 PM
I think this past Heat game (and Celtics game to an extent) presents a strong case of the need for Melo. As much as I hear all this talk of us being an elite offensive team, we can be stopped at critical junctures of a basketball game. I don't think that this could be more evident than the 3rd quarter of this past Heat game. If we are not whizzing past people on a break, we are a one trick pony in the half-court game; utilizing the pick-and-roll between Amar'e and Felton. That is fine and dandy against the bottom feeders and middling teams of the NBA during the regular season but the elite can and will shut that down in the playoffs. I like Gallo but if we expect to truely be contenders, we need Melo- plain and simple.
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TMS
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12/17/2010  10:11 PM
i agree... i think you had to expect this to happen... it wasn't reasonable to expect Amare to keep producing at that crazy pace... he had to slow down eventually... that's when having another go to scorer on the team can really keep your team from going through such long scoring droughts & turn close games into blowout losses.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
FistOfOakley
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12/17/2010  10:13 PM
the heat are a great defensive team. melo would've struggled against them also.

and the heat also shot 55%. you can't win too often when they shoot that well.
Vmart
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12/17/2010  10:16 PM
There is no doubting that. But lets be fair games like this happen to team that are not quite there.
Vmart
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12/17/2010  10:19 PM
FistOfOakley wrote:the heat are a great defensive team. melo would've struggled against them also.

and the heat also shot 55%. you can't win too often when they shoot that well.

That is on MDA. defense will always be the thorn in his side. Until he starts to get with the program and utilize a defensive minded center other teams will always shoot a great percentage vs the Knicks. Lack of interior defense is basically a product of being undersized.
TMS
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12/17/2010  10:23 PM
FistOfOakley wrote:the heat are a great defensive team. melo would've struggled against them also.

and the heat also shot 55%. you can't win too often when they shoot that well.

the Spurs are a great defensive team too but Melo went off on them the other night... i agree it's hard to beat teams when they shoot 55%, but it's also hard to win when you only have 1 reliable guy to get you points in crunchtime... the strategy for teams to beat the Knicks is to stop Amare, because they don't respect any of our other players' ability to carry the load... Melo changes things dramatically.

After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
Melo2NYK
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12/17/2010  10:24 PM
Vmart wrote:
FistOfOakley wrote:the heat are a great defensive team. melo would've struggled against them also.

and the heat also shot 55%. you can't win too often when they shoot that well.

That is on MDA. defense will always be the thorn in his side. Until he starts to get with the program and utilize a defensive minded center other teams will always shoot a great percentage vs the Knicks. Lack of interior defense is basically a product of being undersized.

The problem in the Heat game wasn't our interior defense. The problem became the fact that the Heat simply are just as good, if not better, at our running game (if they get the opportunity to run) but can also play excellent half-court defense.
TMS
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12/17/2010  10:26 PM    LAST EDITED: 12/17/2010  10:28 PM
Melo2NYK wrote:
Vmart wrote:
FistOfOakley wrote:the heat are a great defensive team. melo would've struggled against them also.

and the heat also shot 55%. you can't win too often when they shoot that well.

That is on MDA. defense will always be the thorn in his side. Until he starts to get with the program and utilize a defensive minded center other teams will always shoot a great percentage vs the Knicks. Lack of interior defense is basically a product of being undersized.

The problem in the Heat game wasn't our interior defense. The problem became the fact that the Heat simply are just as good, if not better, at our running game (if they get the opportunity to run) but can also play excellent half-court defense.

i agree, the interior defense wasn't the big problem tonight... the Heat just beat us at our own game & they put the clamps on our best player downlow... we had no answer for that... when you have Lebron going off in the 2nd half, w/role players like Arroyo hitting uncontested 3's & Wade doing his thing off the dribble, there's only so much u can do to match that kind of onslaught w/the talent we have on our roster.

After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
Melo2NYK
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12/17/2010  10:28 PM
FistOfOakley wrote:the heat are a great defensive team. melo would've struggled against them also.

and the heat also shot 55%. you can't win too often when they shoot that well.

Based on what? We were neck-and-neck with them midway into the 3rd. The problem became the fact that they were able to slow our offensive game to a half-court one and we had no ability to get to the rim. No one on the Heat (or the league) could cover Melo straight up, which they would have had to do if they expected to continue to double (and sometimes triple) Amar'e. If they let up on the pressure with Amar'e, he obviously wouldn't have had the difficulties scoring that he did; which is exactly why Melo is so important. Melo offers a pick-your-posion option that no one else on the Knicks could do throughout this game.
nixluva
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12/17/2010  10:31 PM
This was a complicated game to really pin down to just one thing. For one thing, the Heat are NOT 20 points better than us. That's how the game went cuz we had a bad night from our 2 best players. IF we played them 10 times I guarantee you they don't have a bunch of blowouts against us.

However, the Knicks are not a complete team and we do in fact need another scorer. The way we play now we need help at C, SG and PG. That's a lot of holes. We really won't be a match for the best teams in a series if we can't make some additions. MAYBE we can get AR going, but that won't be enough. AT some point Donnie is gonna have to do something. I just don't think he can get Denver to make the deal without giving up a ton for Melo. IF that's how they play it, then we're looking at a couple of lesser deals like Mayo etc.
FistOfOakley
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12/17/2010  10:34 PM
TMS wrote:
FistOfOakley wrote:the heat are a great defensive team. melo would've struggled against them also.

and the heat also shot 55%. you can't win too often when they shoot that well.

the Spurs are a great defensive team too but Melo went off on them the other night... i agree it's hard to beat teams when they shoot 55%, but it's also hard to win when you only have 1 reliable guy to get you points in crunchtime... the strategy for teams to beat the Knicks is to stop Amare, because they don't respect any of our other players' ability to carry the load... Melo changes things dramatically.

danilo was doing a great job in the first half. and guys were hitting open shots when they were open. there weren't open that often though.
Bonn1997
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12/17/2010  10:35 PM
nixluva wrote:This was a complicated game to really pin down to just one thing. For one thing, the Heat are NOT 20 points better than us.

I think they are about 20 points better than us. Lebron and Wade are a FAR better two-man combo than anything we have and probably than any other team has with the possible exception of Kobe and Pau. And then I don't any other team's 3rd man is better than Bosh.
Melo2NYK
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12/17/2010  10:36 PM
TMS wrote:
Melo2NYK wrote:
Vmart wrote:
FistOfOakley wrote:the heat are a great defensive team. melo would've struggled against them also.

and the heat also shot 55%. you can't win too often when they shoot that well.

That is on MDA. defense will always be the thorn in his side. Until he starts to get with the program and utilize a defensive minded center other teams will always shoot a great percentage vs the Knicks. Lack of interior defense is basically a product of being undersized.

The problem in the Heat game wasn't our interior defense. The problem became the fact that the Heat simply are just as good, if not better, at our running game (if they get the opportunity to run) but can also play excellent half-court defense.

i agree, the interior defense wasn't the big problem tonight... the Heat just beat us at our own game & they put the clamps on our best player downlow... we had no answer for that... when you have Lebron going off in the 2nd half, w/role players like Arroyo hitting uncontested 3's & Wade doing his thing off the dribble, there's only so much u can do to match that kind of onslaught w/the talent we have on our roster.

Exactly. We are a one trick pony and if we get slowed down to a half-court game, all we have is the pick and roll. If you stop that pick and roll, we're left with nothing which became evident in this game. The 3rd quarter was punctuated by the Knicks holding the ball while widdling the shot-clock down to inevitably take an ill-fated jumper. That is not winning basketball but the only alternative option we have offensively. Melo is a one-man wrecking crew offensively, however, and could have taken over this game had he had him. Without him, we're first round fodder in the playoffs because the elite teams will get up on that pick and roll.
FistOfOakley
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12/17/2010  10:37 PM
Melo2NYK wrote:
The problem in the Heat game wasn't our interior defense. The problem became the fact that the Heat simply are just as good, if not better, at our running game (if they get the opportunity to run) but can also play excellent half-court defense.

i dunno what you were watching but they scored 46 points in the paint and yet another frontcourt player destroyed us, this time his name was bosh.
martin
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12/17/2010  10:38 PM
FistOfOakley wrote:
Melo2NYK wrote:
The problem in the Heat game wasn't our interior defense. The problem became the fact that the Heat simply are just as good, if not better, at our running game (if they get the opportunity to run) but can also play excellent half-court defense.

i dunno what you were watching but they scored 46 points in the paint and yet another WEAKASS PUSSY frontcourt player destroyed us, this time his name was bosh.

fixed.

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Melo2NYK
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12/17/2010  10:38 PM
FistOfOakley wrote:
TMS wrote:
FistOfOakley wrote:the heat are a great defensive team. melo would've struggled against them also.

and the heat also shot 55%. you can't win too often when they shoot that well.

the Spurs are a great defensive team too but Melo went off on them the other night... i agree it's hard to beat teams when they shoot 55%, but it's also hard to win when you only have 1 reliable guy to get you points in crunchtime... the strategy for teams to beat the Knicks is to stop Amare, because they don't respect any of our other players' ability to carry the load... Melo changes things dramatically.

danilo was doing a great job in the first half. and guys were hitting open shots when they were open. there weren't open that often though.

Yeah but where was Gallo in the 2nd half aka the half when games are won? The guy is not fit to be our no.2 scorer. He simply can not create for himself or others.
martin
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12/17/2010  10:40 PM
Melo2NYK wrote:
FistOfOakley wrote:
TMS wrote:
FistOfOakley wrote:the heat are a great defensive team. melo would've struggled against them also.

and the heat also shot 55%. you can't win too often when they shoot that well.

the Spurs are a great defensive team too but Melo went off on them the other night... i agree it's hard to beat teams when they shoot 55%, but it's also hard to win when you only have 1 reliable guy to get you points in crunchtime... the strategy for teams to beat the Knicks is to stop Amare, because they don't respect any of our other players' ability to carry the load... Melo changes things dramatically.

danilo was doing a great job in the first half. and guys were hitting open shots when they were open. there weren't open that often though.

Yeah but where was Gallo in the 2nd half aka the half when games are won? The guy is not fit to be our no.2 scorer. He simply can not create for himself or others.

Did you see how many times he took it to the rim against BOSTON? And did you see him get fouled as he tried to cram the rim against Miami? Refs robbed him in Miami game.

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OldFan
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12/17/2010  10:41 PM
Melo2NYK wrote:
Vmart wrote:
FistOfOakley wrote:the heat are a great defensive team. melo would've struggled against them also.

and the heat also shot 55%. you can't win too often when they shoot that well.

That is on MDA. defense will always be the thorn in his side. Until he starts to get with the program and utilize a defensive minded center other teams will always shoot a great percentage vs the Knicks. Lack of interior defense is basically a product of being undersized.

The problem in the Heat game wasn't our interior defense. The problem became the fact that the Heat simply are just as good, if not better, at our running game (if they get the opportunity to run) but can also play excellent half-court defense.

And Melo helps our 1/2 court defense how?

We are not an elite team. Melo would be great at the right price. But I have a couple of concerns - how much we give up and is he the right player for this team. You may need more stars to win but that does not mean any two stars will win. All the teams we need to beat have stars that are multi-dimensional. I thing amare is great. But he's not a great rebounder, defender or passer. Melo is a great scorer and very good rebounder but pretty bad on defense.

Notice how most of the elite teams we want to compete against have stars who play defense:

2009-10
Dwight Howard, Orlando
Kobe Bryant, LA Lakers
LeBron James, Cleveland
Rajon Rondo, Boston
Gerald Wallace, Charlotte
Tim Duncan, San Antonio
Dwyane Wade, Miami
Thabo Sefolosha, Oklahoma City
Josh Smith, Atlanta
Anderson Varejao, Cleveland

2008-09
Dwight Howard, Orlando
Kobe Bryant, LA Lakers
LeBron James, Cleveland
Chris Paul, New Orleans
Kevin Garnett, Boston

Tim Duncan, San Antonio
Dwyane Wade, Miami
Rajon Rondo, Boston
Shane Battier, Houston
Ron Artest, Houston

2007-08
Kevin Garnett, Boston
Kobe Bryant, LA Lakers
Marcus Camby, Denver
Bruce Bowen, San Antonio
Tim Duncan, San Antonio

Shane Battier, Houston
Chris Paul, New Orleans
Dwight Howard, Orlando
Tayshaun Prince, Detroit
Raja Bell, Phoenix
Melo2NYK
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12/17/2010  10:41 PM
FistOfOakley wrote:
Melo2NYK wrote:
The problem in the Heat game wasn't our interior defense. The problem became the fact that the Heat simply are just as good, if not better, at our running game (if they get the opportunity to run) but can also play excellent half-court defense.

i dunno what you were watching but they scored 46 points in the paint and yet another frontcourt player destroyed us, this time his name was bosh.


Once again "the problem became the fact that teh Heat simply are just as good, if not better, at our running game(if they get the opportunity to run)." You run, you get points in the paint. You play uptempo, you get points in the paint. The Heat ran the ball and that's why they were proficient in that regard.
Melo2NYK
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12/17/2010  10:43 PM
martin wrote:
Melo2NYK wrote:
FistOfOakley wrote:
TMS wrote:
FistOfOakley wrote:the heat are a great defensive team. melo would've struggled against them also.

and the heat also shot 55%. you can't win too often when they shoot that well.

the Spurs are a great defensive team too but Melo went off on them the other night... i agree it's hard to beat teams when they shoot 55%, but it's also hard to win when you only have 1 reliable guy to get you points in crunchtime... the strategy for teams to beat the Knicks is to stop Amare, because they don't respect any of our other players' ability to carry the load... Melo changes things dramatically.

danilo was doing a great job in the first half. and guys were hitting open shots when they were open. there weren't open that often though.

Yeah but where was Gallo in the 2nd half aka the half when games are won? The guy is not fit to be our no.2 scorer. He simply can not create for himself or others.

Did you see how many times he took it to the rim against BOSTON? And did you see him get fouled as he tried to cram the rim against Miami? Refs robbed him in Miami game.

I did and he hardly if ever finished. His best in that regard, is Melo's worse. And you better believe Melo will get his calls.
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