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If the Suns keep losing we can get Nash
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knickstorrents
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11/8/2010  10:31 PM

http://valleyofthesuns.com/2010/11/08/suns-rumors-the-steve-nash-rumors-are-underway/

I didn't think this would be the case, but I think Nash is missing Amare more than the other way around. Nash loves NY and lives in Manhattan during the off-season. He has 2 years and 22 million left on his deal.

What would you guys be willing to trade to the Suns for him, and do you guys think a deal is doable or in the Knicks best interest?

Rose is not the answer.
AUTOADVERT
loweyecue
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11/8/2010  10:37 PM
I was just going to start a thread about the Nash situation. You beat me to it. I don't know if have what it would take to get him, but if we can we should definitely go for it. But if we were to trade for Melo would we have enough assets left to then trade for Nash? I don't see it happening.
TKF on Melo ::....he is a punk, a jerk, a self absorbed out of shape, self aggrandizing, unprofessional, volume chucking coach killing playoff loser!!
knickstorrents
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11/8/2010  10:59 PM
Until Melo signs an extension there's no need to trade for him. Nash has 1 year after this one left on his deal so a trade would have to be engineered to bring him over.
Rose is not the answer.
kingofelpaso
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11/9/2010  7:24 AM
As much as I love Steve Nash, I think that he's too old at this point to trade for. He is still the cornerstone of the Phoenix franchise and they will not just trade him away for nothing. Acquiring him via trade will require sending PHX some major pieces which just doesnt make sense for a player who only probably has another 3-4 years left in him.

By the time he will be available as a free agent, he will be even older and Chris Paul will (hopefully) be available by then.

As much as I hate to say it, I think the Steve Nash as a Knick ship sailed this summer when he signed that extension. Its a shame because you can see how much the Knicks could use his IQ, leadership and execution down the stretch...
knicks1248
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11/9/2010  7:39 AM    LAST EDITED: 11/9/2010  7:40 AM
Im willing to give felton a full season before i even think about trading him. He has been playing pretty well and I just think he needs time in this system before he takes off to elite status. Nash would be a nice pick up on the open market, or to top off a championship contender, but to bring him here via trade....i dont think it's even a option
ES
Knixkik
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11/9/2010  7:57 AM
I would trade Felton and another player for him as long as we were obviously still under the cap for Melo. Nash's contract is very reasonable and expires when Paul becomes a FA so we would have plenty of options. I really believe if we got Nash for a reasonable deal and signed Melo next season we would be a championship contender.
SupremeCommander
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11/9/2010  8:46 AM
I don't think we're getting Steve Nash unless we offer them everything. He's meant too much the franchise and generates too much revenue
DLeethal wrote: Lol Rick needs a safe space
Paladin55
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11/9/2010  9:10 AM
There would have to be a contract(s) exchange, and even if we just have to give up Curry's expiring, we are still taking on Nash's contract of next year ($11M+) which will make it difficult for us to pick up anything valuable during the FA season.

If Nash was the missing piece for a near-championship team, you might be willing to give up some non-Curry assets for him, but I doubt if he would put us over the top at this point, and I'd hate to give up any of our younger players for someone who may get us into Rnd 2, but nothing beyond that.

No man is happy without a delusion of some kind. Delusions are as necessary to our happiness as realities- C.N. Bovee
knickstorrents
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11/9/2010  9:53 AM
We are in a funny phase right now. One way to success is for the Knicks to actually have a bad year (If they still had their draft pick) due to an injury to Stoudemire or something, then use that pick to play along with a healthy Stoudemire next year.

This has happened several times previously - championship caliber teams were able to get picks when their big stars got injured, then they get a high draft pick... their main stars then come back to play along with that high draft pick rookie the following year.

See:
Utah in 2005 (Boozer was injured, then they drafted Deron 3rd after some trades)
Lakers in 2005 (Kobe was injured, they drafted Bynum 10th)
Spurs in 1997 (Robinson was injured, they drafted Duncan 1st)

The other avenue is through Free Agency and preservation of assets. Nash is a special case that contributes so much to wins he is more than just a 'missing piece' type of player. Those types of players are solid (I think of players like Ray Allen, Boozer, Lee, etc) but Nash is on a different level - he is a complete game changer. The only downside is his age but he has a few years left in him I feel. I think the only way we can become championship caliber in a trade for Nash is to give up Curry and little else. I'm pretty sure Phoenix would only do that next year if they felt Nash was not willing to resign.

Rose is not the answer.
GodSaveTheKnicks
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11/9/2010  10:07 AM
knickstorrents wrote:We are in a funny phase right now. One way to success is for the Knicks to actually have a bad year (If they still had their draft pick) due to an injury to Stoudemire or something, then use that pick to play along with a healthy Stoudemire next year.

This has happened several times previously - championship caliber teams were able to get picks when their big stars got injured, then they get a high draft pick... their main stars then come back to play along with that high draft pick rookie the following year.

See:
Utah in 2005 (Boozer was injured, then they drafted Deron 3rd after some trades)
Lakers in 2005 (Kobe was injured, they drafted Bynum 10th)
Spurs in 1997 (Robinson was injured, they drafted Duncan 1st)

The other avenue is through Free Agency and preservation of assets. Nash is a special case that contributes so much to wins he is more than just a 'missing piece' type of player. Those types of players are solid (I think of players like Ray Allen, Boozer, Lee, etc) but Nash is on a different level - he is a complete game changer. The only downside is his age but he has a few years left in him I feel. I think the only way we can become championship caliber in a trade for Nash is to give up Curry and little else. I'm pretty sure Phoenix would only do that next year if they felt Nash was not willing to resign.

i think houston swaps picks with us this year no?

Let's try to elevate the level of discourse in this byeetch. Please
fishmike
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11/9/2010  10:17 AM
GodSaveTheKnicks wrote:
knickstorrents wrote:We are in a funny phase right now. One way to success is for the Knicks to actually have a bad year (If they still had their draft pick) due to an injury to Stoudemire or something, then use that pick to play along with a healthy Stoudemire next year.

This has happened several times previously - championship caliber teams were able to get picks when their big stars got injured, then they get a high draft pick... their main stars then come back to play along with that high draft pick rookie the following year.

See:
Utah in 2005 (Boozer was injured, then they drafted Deron 3rd after some trades)
Lakers in 2005 (Kobe was injured, they drafted Bynum 10th)
Spurs in 1997 (Robinson was injured, they drafted Duncan 1st)

The other avenue is through Free Agency and preservation of assets. Nash is a special case that contributes so much to wins he is more than just a 'missing piece' type of player. Those types of players are solid (I think of players like Ray Allen, Boozer, Lee, etc) but Nash is on a different level - he is a complete game changer. The only downside is his age but he has a few years left in him I feel. I think the only way we can become championship caliber in a trade for Nash is to give up Curry and little else. I'm pretty sure Phoenix would only do that next year if they felt Nash was not willing to resign.

i think houston swaps picks with us this year no?

yes... but Houston is dreadful. They just lost Brooks (starting PG) for 2 months, Yao's minutes restrictions are screwing up the team, etc etc Houston is 1-5. A lot can happen but its looking like the KNicks pick will be the Knicks pick.

I think the guy to target is Rubio to be honest. Looking around its hard to clearly define our needs, but a star play maker and defensive guy in the backcourt is the easiest.

He's 6'7 and could be a part of guard rotation w/ Douglas, Felton and Fields. What Knicks should consider is trading someone who is playing well, like Chandler for Rubio's rights.

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Moonangie
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11/9/2010  10:59 AM
fishmike wrote:
GodSaveTheKnicks wrote:
knickstorrents wrote:We are in a funny phase right now. One way to success is for the Knicks to actually have a bad year (If they still had their draft pick) due to an injury to Stoudemire or something, then use that pick to play along with a healthy Stoudemire next year.

This has happened several times previously - championship caliber teams were able to get picks when their big stars got injured, then they get a high draft pick... their main stars then come back to play along with that high draft pick rookie the following year.

See:
Utah in 2005 (Boozer was injured, then they drafted Deron 3rd after some trades)
Lakers in 2005 (Kobe was injured, they drafted Bynum 10th)
Spurs in 1997 (Robinson was injured, they drafted Duncan 1st)

The other avenue is through Free Agency and preservation of assets. Nash is a special case that contributes so much to wins he is more than just a 'missing piece' type of player. Those types of players are solid (I think of players like Ray Allen, Boozer, Lee, etc) but Nash is on a different level - he is a complete game changer. The only downside is his age but he has a few years left in him I feel. I think the only way we can become championship caliber in a trade for Nash is to give up Curry and little else. I'm pretty sure Phoenix would only do that next year if they felt Nash was not willing to resign.

i think houston swaps picks with us this year no?

yes... but Houston is dreadful. They just lost Brooks (starting PG) for 2 months, Yao's minutes restrictions are screwing up the team, etc etc Houston is 1-5. A lot can happen but its looking like the KNicks pick will be the Knicks pick.

I think the guy to target is Rubio to be honest. Looking around its hard to clearly define our needs, but a star play maker and defensive guy in the backcourt is the easiest.

He's 6'7 and could be a part of guard rotation w/ Douglas, Felton and Fields. What Knicks should consider is trading someone who is playing well, like Chandler for Rubio's rights.

Assuming we don't need to use Chandler in a S&T for Melo, I 1000% agree with using him to trade for Rubio's rights. We are losing Chandler after this season anyway, and Rubio is just the sort of playmaker we need to make everyone else play at the top of their games, particularly Stat.

Rubio is good defensively and great as a playmaker. Scoring is his weakness, but he's very young, and I'd venture to say that shooting is one aspect of the game that can be learned through practice (i.e., it always gets better if you practice).

So a trade for Ricky would be an ideal use of CHandler's contract.
Nalod
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11/9/2010  11:34 AM
Nash is one of my favorite players to watch. I would love to see him in a knick uniform but I think this is not the time to do this.

I'd say next season if we have a legit contenders chance and we want to make a run.

11 mil on the cap is a big deal on this team.

Rubio is Rondo like and if we land Melo this kid can move the ball and defend it. Star quality even if his won't fill up the stat box.
smackeddog
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11/9/2010  11:48 AM    LAST EDITED: 11/9/2010  12:03 PM
I could kind of understand the Suns not wanting to pay Amar'e the full 5 years in case he got injured, but what I didn't understand is them then blowing all that money on Frye (5 years $5 to $6 mil per) , Turkoglu (terrible, terrible decision to trade for him- 4 years, $10 to $12mil per), Childress (5 years, $6.5 to $7 mil per) and Warrick (4 years $4 to $5mil per)- those contracts and palyers are going to be stinkers and unmovable come years 4 and 5, so they would have been much better off just taking the risk on amar'e- at least they could have competed for the rest of Nash's contract and then maybe rebuilt of the fly.
fishmike
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11/9/2010  11:57 AM
Nalod wrote:Nash is one of my favorite players to watch. I would love to see him in a knick uniform but I think this is not the time to do this.

I'd say next season if we have a legit contenders chance and we want to make a run.

11 mil on the cap is a big deal on this team.

Rubio is Rondo like and if we land Melo this kid can move the ball and defend it. Star quality even if his won't fill up the stat box.

Say we use AR/Gallo/Chandler/Walker and possibly Eddy's contract near the deadline. Would that be enough to get Melo and Rubio? Because this looks like a pretty sick squad on paper:
PG Douglas
SG Rubio
SF MElo
PF Amare
C Mosgov
bench: Fields, Turiaf, Rautins?

Food for thought... #1 thing no matter what is for the Knicks to play well

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
knickstorrents
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11/9/2010  12:31 PM
fishmike wrote:
Nalod wrote:Nash is one of my favorite players to watch. I would love to see him in a knick uniform but I think this is not the time to do this.

I'd say next season if we have a legit contenders chance and we want to make a run.

11 mil on the cap is a big deal on this team.

Rubio is Rondo like and if we land Melo this kid can move the ball and defend it. Star quality even if his won't fill up the stat box.

Say we use AR/Gallo/Chandler/Walker and possibly Eddy's contract near the deadline. Would that be enough to get Melo and Rubio? Because this looks like a pretty sick squad on paper:
PG Douglas
SG Rubio
SF MElo
PF Amare
C Mosgov
bench: Fields, Turiaf, Rautins?

Food for thought... #1 thing no matter what is for the Knicks to play well

We'd have no one coming off the bench... and Rubio would not be a good shooting guard.

We could have Rubio start at PG, Buke at SG, and Douglas and Turiaf come off the bench...we'd still need 1-2 more players for bench depth though.

Rose is not the answer.
Moonangie
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11/9/2010  12:53 PM    LAST EDITED: 11/9/2010  12:56 PM
fishmike wrote:
Nalod wrote:Nash is one of my favorite players to watch. I would love to see him in a knick uniform but I think this is not the time to do this.

I'd say next season if we have a legit contenders chance and we want to make a run.

11 mil on the cap is a big deal on this team.

Rubio is Rondo like and if we land Melo this kid can move the ball and defend it. Star quality even if his won't fill up the stat box.

Say we use AR/Gallo/Chandler/Walker and possibly Eddy's contract near the deadline. Would that be enough to get Melo and Rubio? Because this looks like a pretty sick squad on paper:
PG Douglas
SG Rubio
SF MElo
PF Amare
C Mosgov
bench: Fields, Turiaf, Rautins?

Food for thought... #1 thing no matter what is for the Knicks to play well

Chandler for Rubio, straight up. We keep the other talent and sign Melo as a FA in the summer. Then maybe we trade AR for a SG upgrade or just keep him on the bench.

Rubio may be 6'7", but he is not a SG because he is a limited scorer. We want him at the 1 so he can do what he does so beautifully: Orchestrate the offense like a symphony maestro. His talents would be egregiously wasted at the 2.

The squad:

1. Rubio
2. Gallo
3. Melo
4. Stat
5. Moz

Bench: Turiaf (if not renounced), AR, Fields, Douglas, Walker, Rautins

A ten player rotation would leave Rautins on the bench as insurance.

If Gallo continues to focus his offense primarily around shooting, it's conceivable that he could be the starting SG, since that's basically what he's used as right now. He would need to improve his agility and learn to come off screens more effectively, but I think he could do it and create mismatches at 6'11". That is, of course, unless we are able to trade AR for a SG upgrade.
fishmike
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11/9/2010  12:56 PM
knickstorrents wrote:
fishmike wrote:
Nalod wrote:Nash is one of my favorite players to watch. I would love to see him in a knick uniform but I think this is not the time to do this.

I'd say next season if we have a legit contenders chance and we want to make a run.

11 mil on the cap is a big deal on this team.

Rubio is Rondo like and if we land Melo this kid can move the ball and defend it. Star quality even if his won't fill up the stat box.

Say we use AR/Gallo/Chandler/Walker and possibly Eddy's contract near the deadline. Would that be enough to get Melo and Rubio? Because this looks like a pretty sick squad on paper:
PG Douglas
SG Rubio
SF MElo
PF Amare
C Mosgov
bench: Fields, Turiaf, Rautins?

Food for thought... #1 thing no matter what is for the Knicks to play well

We'd have no one coming off the bench... and Rubio would not be a good shooting guard.

We could have Rubio start at PG, Buke at SG, and Douglas and Turiaf come off the bench...we'd still need 1-2 more players for bench depth though.


Rubio would be the PG with Douglas at the SG essentially. Douglas would play off the ball on offense, but would probably defend opposing PGs because he's smaller and Rubio is 6'7
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Nalod
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11/9/2010  1:09 PM
fishmike wrote:
Nalod wrote:Nash is one of my favorite players to watch. I would love to see him in a knick uniform but I think this is not the time to do this.

I'd say next season if we have a legit contenders chance and we want to make a run.

11 mil on the cap is a big deal on this team.

Rubio is Rondo like and if we land Melo this kid can move the ball and defend it. Star quality even if his won't fill up the stat box.

Say we use AR/Gallo/Chandler/Walker and possibly Eddy's contract near the deadline. Would that be enough to get Melo and Rubio? Because this looks like a pretty sick squad on paper:
PG Douglas
SG Rubio
SF MElo
PF Amare
C Mosgov
bench: Fields, Turiaf, Rautins?

Food for thought... #1 thing no matter what is for the Knicks to play well

I cannot begin to value Rubio for a trade. His shooting is suspect and the Euroball stats are hard to digest. Jennings does little and then explodes in the NBA. MOsgov is a scrub but has shown he belongs in the NBA with upside.

If Minny is still sucking at years end looking dysfuntional then it gives Rickey a bit more leverate to say "no thanks" to that mess. He can do that anyway.

If Minny is allowed to trade him to the highest bidder that depends on Rickey. He can be reasonable and give them a list of teams he would agree to be traded to. He can be a prick and say say "Knicks or I stay in europe and you get nothing". To which Minny can also be stupid and retort "then enjoy yourself".

I don't know what Minny needs or would want. Its not a money thing, Rickey would still be on a rookie scale. Naturally his marketing out of NY would be huge. This kid has global appeal. Gillette even had him in a cameo for its razor with Federer, Henry (soccer), Tiger (puss chasing) and maybe others.

He is a pure point and no way a SG at this stage. Closest player to him is a mix of Rondo and Jason Kidd (younger version). His shot needs work, but his team does not require for him to even shoot.

He'll want the NBA at some point.
martin
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11/9/2010  1:36 PM
fishmike wrote:
knickstorrents wrote:
fishmike wrote:
Nalod wrote:Nash is one of my favorite players to watch. I would love to see him in a knick uniform but I think this is not the time to do this.

I'd say next season if we have a legit contenders chance and we want to make a run.

11 mil on the cap is a big deal on this team.

Rubio is Rondo like and if we land Melo this kid can move the ball and defend it. Star quality even if his won't fill up the stat box.

Say we use AR/Gallo/Chandler/Walker and possibly Eddy's contract near the deadline. Would that be enough to get Melo and Rubio? Because this looks like a pretty sick squad on paper:
PG Douglas
SG Rubio
SF MElo
PF Amare
C Mosgov
bench: Fields, Turiaf, Rautins?

Food for thought... #1 thing no matter what is for the Knicks to play well

We'd have no one coming off the bench... and Rubio would not be a good shooting guard.

We could have Rubio start at PG, Buke at SG, and Douglas and Turiaf come off the bench...we'd still need 1-2 more players for bench depth though.


Rubio would be the PG with Douglas at the SG essentially. Douglas would play off the ball on offense, but would probably defend opposing PGs because he's smaller and Rubio is 6'7

Ricky Rubio? He's like 6'4", no?

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