So whats to stop other FA's to really looking at that situation and saying, hey if they keep lee do SnT for a another All Star and sign a LBJ or Wade that the oppertunity to win a ring won't be the case next season.

We gutted our roster in the hope that we can sign players, thats the difference. What is the plan b?

TMS wrote:Ray Allen & KG were both traded to the Celtics, let's get that straight... neither one of those guys signed with them in free agency... Boston gave up a TON of assets to bring Ray Allen & KG to Boston, including the rights to Jeff Green who they picked #5 overall that summer, Al Jefferson who was already putting up 16 / 11 / 1.5 production for them the year prior, & 2 future 1st round picks... they also gave up Gerald Green & Delonte West who they had picked in the 1st round in years' prior & Wally Sczerbiak who they had traded for in '06 from the T'Wolves.

I guess it's not so bad trading away the farm when you know what you are getting back. But maybe we do know...

earthmansurfer wrote:

TMS wrote:Ray Allen & KG were both traded to the Celtics, let's get that straight... neither one of those guys signed with them in free agency... Boston gave up a TON of assets to bring Ray Allen & KG to Boston, including the rights to Jeff Green who they picked #5 overall that summer, Al Jefferson who was already putting up 16 / 11 / 1.5 production for them the year prior, & 2 future 1st round picks... they also gave up Gerald Green & Delonte West who they had picked in the 1st round in years' prior & Wally Sczerbiak who they had traded for in '06 from the T'Wolves.

I guess it's not so bad trading away the farm when you know what you are getting back. But maybe we do know...

that is what we have to lay our hopes on basically... hopefully Donnie's got some under the table consigliere insider info on Lebron or Wade's intentions this summer.

s3231 wrote:

TMS wrote:Ray Allen & KG were both traded to the Celtics, let's get that straight... neither one of those guys signed with them in free agency... Boston gave up a TON of assets to bring Ray Allen & KG to Boston, including the rights to Jeff Green who they picked #5 overall that summer, Al Jefferson who was already putting up 16 / 11 / 1.5 production for them the year prior, & 2 future 1st round picks... they also gave up Gerald Green & Delonte West who they had picked in the 1st round in years' prior & Wally Sczerbiak who they had traded for in '06 from the T'Wolves.

100% on the money.

I think a lot of people have this belief that LeBron and/or Bosh will just magically sign with the Knicks without us giving up any assets. I don't see that happening at all. If LeBron does come here, does everyone really think he is going to screw Cleveland over 100% and just come without a sign and trade? Say goodbye to at least Wilson Chandler, Bill Walker, etc.

Which is why I was pretty concerned when Donnie put all of those assets in that Hill trade. Still, I'm hoping he must know something we don't to overpay to that degree.

exactly why i think it might have been better to hold onto our picks & Jordan Hill for possible sign & trade scenarios... i can only hope DW has something up his sleeve for the summer, cuz if he went all in like this without even knowing who we'll be signing this summer it's a pretty bad risk to take, especially considering how much of a reach it is to assume guys like Lebron & Wade are just going to leave their franchises in the lurch by signing with us outright & leaving that extra year of max salary on the table in the process... i don't think that has much chance of happening personally, but hopefully DW knows something we don't.

s3231 wrote:I think a lot of people have this belief that LeBron and/or Bosh will just magically sign with the Knicks without us giving up any assets. I don't see that happening at all. If LeBron does come here, does everyone really think he is going to screw Cleveland over 100% and just come without a sign and trade? Say goodbye to at least Wilson Chandler, Bill Walker, etc.

Which is why I was pretty concerned when Donnie put all of those assets in that Hill trade. Still, I'm hoping he must know something we don't to overpay to that degree.

I guess that would depend on your perspective.

All of the guys that are top tier are earning somewhere in the $13M+ per for at least 3 years. If all they want is the most amount of money in their contracts (near term winning championship, city, long term winning potential aside), they would stay with their current teams. Right? Cause they can offer the most. If it's the contract and the money they want, they could have signed long ago (if management indeed has offered). Kobe just signed, no reason LeBron couldn't have along with the rest. Perhaps Wade is the lone exception cause there is great uncertainly with that roster, but for the most part, each of the other guys - LeBron, Johnson, Amare, Dirk, Yao, Bosh - their teams (for all practical purposes) are pretty much locked in roster-wise.

So why haven't they signed extensions? Perhaps they are not 100% content with the championship potential (both short and long term) or just want change; the flip side is that they want to put pressure on management to upgrade roster (nearly impossible in most of the cases re my point above).

If there is a chance any of them want to move teams (and still want their new teams to be the best that they can), I don't know how or why they would want to entertain sign-and-trades that would drain their new team of young players (assets) or feel sorry for their old team VERSUS CONSIDERING just outright signing with their new team, especially with NY with their gobs of cap space. Like I said, if it's the long term money, just stay with your old team (but that hasn't happened). If it's for the potential of a better long term team, no reason to force your new team to give up players.

My premise and thinking is that most of these guys have already earned a butt-load of money and are more interested in the championship thing than outright maximizing money with next contract (which IMHO are a little bit contradictory except with Jordan, Kobe, Duncan situations).

martin wrote:

s3231 wrote:I think a lot of people have this belief that LeBron and/or Bosh will just magically sign with the Knicks without us giving up any assets. I don't see that happening at all. If LeBron does come here, does everyone really think he is going to screw Cleveland over 100% and just come without a sign and trade? Say goodbye to at least Wilson Chandler, Bill Walker, etc.

Which is why I was pretty concerned when Donnie put all of those assets in that Hill trade. Still, I'm hoping he must know something we don't to overpay to that degree.

I guess that would depend on your perspective.

All of the guys that are top tier are earning somewhere in the $13M+ per for at least 3 years. If all they want is the most amount of money in their contracts (near term winning championship, city, long term winning potential aside), they would stay with their current teams. Right? Cause they can offer the most. If it's the contract and the money they want, they could have signed long ago (if management indeed has offered). Kobe just signed, no reason LeBron couldn't have along with the rest. Perhaps Wade is the lone exception cause there is great uncertainly with that roster, but for the most part, each of the other guys - LeBron, Johnson, Amare, Dirk, Yao, Bosh - their teams (for all practical purposes) are pretty much locked in roster-wise.

So why haven't they signed extensions? Perhaps they are not 100% content with the championship potential (both short and long term) or just want change; the flip side is that they want to put pressure on management to upgrade roster (nearly impossible in most of the cases re my point above).

If there is a chance any of them want to move teams (and still want their new teams to be the best that they can), I don't know how or why they would want to entertain sign-and-trades that would drain their new team of young players (assets) or feel sorry for their old team VERSUS CONSIDERING just outright signing with their new team, especially with NY with their gobs of cap space. Like I said, if it's the long term money, just stay with your old team (but that hasn't happened). If it's for the potential of a better long term team, no reason to force your new team to give up players.

My premise and thinking is that most of these guys have already earned a butt-load of money and are more interested in the championship thing than outright maximizing money with next contract (which IMHO are a little bit contradictory except with Jordan, Kobe, Duncan situations).

They havent resigned because they want 30% of the salary cap. Bosh, Wade, and Lebron will have 7 yrs in the NBA as of this summer. Do you think it is coincidence? The only way for a MAX player to make more money is to make sure he is out of contract as soon as he is eligible for a larger percentage of the cap.

Extension also cannot exceed 5yrs including the years remaining on the current deal. So if they resigned now they would be cheating themselves out of the 6th year.
Source: http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm#Q51

These guys can never have enough money. Kobe could have taken a smaller extension so more help could be brought in but he didnt.

Source: http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm

kam77 wrote:Is this the game thread?

no

martin wrote:

Marv wrote:

AnubisADL wrote:When are people going to realize this summer is ALL about the money with these guys this summer. This could be the last big deal for alot of these guys. Do you really expect Wade or Joe Johnson to get max deals after their contracts this summer? Lebron and Bosh will be 30 yrs old at the end of a 6 year deal. So maybe they take less. However I doubt Bosh, who wears a knee brace, forgos that 6th yr to play with Lebron if he can go somewhere else he likes and get that 6th yr. I see Bosh having a Jermaine Oneal fall off in a few years due to his suspect knee.

you're talking about a POTENTIAL salary differential for one year of their careers. they may indeed be willing to put that up on the board for the chance to play for at least 5 years with a fellow star player in nyc.

right, not to mention a player opt after 3 years, and a shiny, new max deal.

as long as the union doesnt roll over and accept some of the proposed ownership backed cba changes... that could play a role in how long/where guys sign.