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What is the plan if Lebron James does NOT come here?
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BRIGGS
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1/13/2010  3:14 PM
I really wonder? Give J Johnson money until he is 36--that never works out after the first year or two for some reason--then you are stuck paying a 30+ YO 3-4 years at max.

Id rather do what Oklahoma did--use the cap space to acquire assets--they did it quickly and well. Im only spending on true value

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martin
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1/13/2010  3:15 PM
BRIGGS wrote:I really wonder? Give J Johnson money until he is 36--that never works out after the first year or two for some reason--then you are stuck paying a 30+ YO 3-4 years at max.

Id rather do what Oklahoma did--use the cap space to acquire assets--they did it quickly and well. Im only spending on true value

same.

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nyk4ever
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1/13/2010  3:22 PM
I absolutely agree with you Briggs - I have no interest in Joe Johnson for 2 years before he begins breaking down.

This question is for anyone who can tell me the answer. If we sign LeBron to a max deal and give Lee a deal starting at 10.5 million, then let all the other guys expire that are expiring after NEXT year, how much capspace would we have going into next summer?

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Panos
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1/13/2010  3:30 PM
BRIGGS wrote:I really wonder? Give J Johnson money until he is 36--that never works out after the first year or two for some reason--then you are stuck paying a 30+ YO 3-4 years at max.

Id rather do what Oklahoma did--use the cap space to acquire assets--they did it quickly and well. Im only spending on true value

I've been saying this all along. Use the money wisely. Get players and good value that allow us to trade for other assets. Don't put ourselves in a situation where no one wants what we have at the prices we're paying.
AnubisADL
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1/13/2010  3:33 PM
BRIGGS wrote:I really wonder? Give J Johnson money until he is 36--that never works out after the first year or two for some reason--then you are stuck paying a 30+ YO 3-4 years at max.

Id rather do what Oklahoma did--use the cap space to acquire assets--they did it quickly and well. Im only spending on true value

I agree but we both know Dolan isn't going to let that happen. He wants fans in the seats. We will likely overpay for someone and I'd prefer if that person was on the other side of 25.

Im not in love with Rudy Gay but he'd be a piece that we could move in the future if need be.

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stanleybostitch
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1/13/2010  3:44 PM
I don't know that Dolan will have the opp't to let this team get out of control again; given Walsh in charge, I believe the Knicks will be guided to a long-term sustainable winning model, not the capped out hell hole of the 00's.
The new new core: Randle, RJ, IQ. Maybe Mitch. Future pick. Future trade. Future FA.
fishmike
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1/13/2010  4:08 PM
the cap space is HUGE. We can get a pick AND a bad contract. Teams will be looking to do that to 1) save money and 2) get the trade exception. It makes 3 way trades very easy because teams will give up a good player just to dump salary and get a trade exception. So many options.

Worst case is resign Lee and upgrade the PG spot. Then you have cap space to swing deals. You have JJ and Curry's expiring deals as well. We are in a good position here

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
oohah
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1/13/2010  4:13 PM
The plan is to do the same thing the Knicks always do: Pay for a big name to sell tickets, make headlines, and pin Knicks' fans hopes on to an absurd and unrealistic level.

The Joe Johnson scenario is the one I fear the most...Allan Houston all over again, except I think Allan Houston was a better player. Johnson has bigger numbers, but Houston could keep a team respectable almost all by himself. (He just needed a decent big like Kurt Thomas).

oohah

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iSergio
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1/13/2010  4:21 PM
We are back in 2002 if we just sign Joe Johnson.

There really isn't a plan B. It's LeBron James or bust. As in wait until next summer for Carmelo Anthony. I hope Donnie Walsh doesn't do a Detroit and just signs mediocre players just to do something.
fishmike
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1/13/2010  4:27 PM
oohah wrote:The plan is to do the same thing the Knicks always do: Pay for a big name to sell tickets, make headlines, and pin Knicks' fans hopes on to an absurd and unrealistic level.

The Joe Johnson scenario is the one I fear the most...Allan Houston all over again, except I think Allan Houston was a better player. Johnson has bigger numbers, but Houston could keep a team respectable almost all by himself. (He just needed a decent big like Kurt Thomas).

oohah


that is not consistent with current management. If that was the plan Knicks would have stuck w/ the Crawford/Zach team last year because that team was going to the playoffs.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
crzymdups
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1/13/2010  4:30 PM
i bet most knicks fans are excited about the roster by the end of july.
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fishmike
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1/13/2010  4:35 PM
crzymdups wrote:i bet most knicks fans are excited about the roster by the end of july.
the only thing we are missing is a high pick. No matter what happens the core of Lee/Gallo/Chandler is very good and getting better every day. Those are 3 good players build a rotation around. Add cap space to that. Add JJ/Curry's expiring contracts to that. Add a good coach and competent GM to that. Knicks are heading in a good direction.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
oohah
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1/13/2010  4:39 PM
fishmike wrote:that is not consistent with current management. If that was the plan Knicks would have stuck w/ the Crawford/Zach team last year because that team was going to the playoffs.

It is consistent with current management A.K.A whatever Dolan wants, which always involves landing stars to boost revenue. Losing Randolph and Crawford was a means to an end which was landing superstar LeBron James. Randolph is a very good player, even a star, but not a superstar, and Crawford is only a star in a chucking competition. They don't sell tickets.

If the Knicks don't get Lebron, superstar coach D'Antoni will want a star player and owner James Dolan will want a star player. Donnie Walsh is not in control of the team as much as folks want to believe.

oohah

Good luck Mike D'Antoni, 'cause you ain't never seen nothing like this before!
fishmike
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1/13/2010  4:46 PM
oohah wrote:
fishmike wrote:that is not consistent with current management. If that was the plan Knicks would have stuck w/ the Crawford/Zach team last year because that team was going to the playoffs.

It is consistent with current management A.K.A whatever Dolan wants, which always involves landing stars to boost revenue. Losing Randolph and Crawford was a means to an end which was landing superstar LeBron James. Randolph is a very good player, even a star, but not a superstar, and Crawford is only a star in a chucking competition. They don't sell tickets.

If the Knicks don't get Lebron, superstar coach D'Antoni will want a star player and owner James Dolan will want a star player. Donnie Walsh is not in control of the team as much as folks want to believe.

oohah

facts based on your opinions. Knicks dont need a star to sell tickets. Never have. If the Knicks are winning games they will sell out. What you see is what you get.

Most who follow the NBA would agree you need a star player to win a title. Do the Knicks have a better shot at getting that star than massing cap space this offseason?

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
oohah
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1/13/2010  4:52 PM
fishmike wrote:facts based on your opinions. Knicks dont need a star to sell tickets. Never have. If the Knicks are winning games they will sell out. What you see is what you get.

Facts based on my opinions? no Fishmike, based on history. How do you think the term "starphuching" came about on this site?

Are we discussing what you "hope" or what you "think"? The Knicks always want a face who is the savior to sell tickets. That might be a coach, a GM, or a player. This is not my opinion but a fact that can be easily proven if you look at the history.

fishmike wrote:Most who follow the NBA would agree you need a star player to win a title. Do the Knicks have a better shot at getting that star than massing cap space this offseason?

Remember, the original question is what will happen if LeBron does NOT come here.

But to answer your question, yes the Knicks need a star to win a title. but that star is not Joe Johnson.

oohah

Good luck Mike D'Antoni, 'cause you ain't never seen nothing like this before!
misterearl
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1/13/2010  4:56 PM
No to Joe

Johnson is not the answer for the Knicks in temperment or talent

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AnubisADL
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1/13/2010  4:56 PM
oohah wrote:
fishmike wrote:that is not consistent with current management. If that was the plan Knicks would have stuck w/ the Crawford/Zach team last year because that team was going to the playoffs.

It is consistent with current management A.K.A whatever Dolan wants, which always involves landing stars to boost revenue. Losing Randolph and Crawford was a means to an end which was landing superstar LeBron James. Randolph is a very good player, even a star, but not a superstar, and Crawford is only a star in a chucking competition. They don't sell tickets.

If the Knicks don't get Lebron, superstar coach D'Antoni will want a star player and owner James Dolan will want a star player. Donnie Walsh is not in control of the team as much as folks want to believe.

oohah

+1

Pretty much sums up my feelings. We are getting somebody in 2010 the question is who.

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TMS
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1/13/2010  4:57 PM    LAST EDITED: 1/13/2010  4:58 PM
if we don't get Lebron or Bosh, i would just re-sign Lee & keep our flexibility to target Melo in 2011, but as we all know Dolan expects some big things to happen this offseason... i think the Knicks will sign up at least 1 max FA regardless of the name... likely Joe Johnson or Amare Stoudamire if we miss out on Lebron or Bosh.
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djsunyc
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1/13/2010  5:00 PM
if the knicks aren't able to attract lebron or wade or bosh...then what's the difference between them and any midwest expansion team?
oohah
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1/13/2010  5:00 PM
djsunyc wrote:if the knicks aren't able to attract lebron or wade or bosh...then what's the difference between them and any midwest expansion team?

Spike Lee.

oohah

Good luck Mike D'Antoni, 'cause you ain't never seen nothing like this before!
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