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If we dont get Bosh James or Wade and the whole deal
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BRIGGS
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11/15/2009  12:42 PM    LAST EDITED: 11/15/2009  12:45 PM
My feeling is we should be very conservative--perhaps doing what Detroit did--spending less for two quality players and holding the cap space until we really get a worthy max free agent. We have to be very smart, opportunistic and reasonable with who gets what. If we have to pass-we pass. I accept that we are in full rebuilding mode and it will be 3-4 years unless we hit a miracle on the river.

I think Detroit got Gordon for 11mm and CV for 7mm and look at their production + they are winning without Prince and Rip.

Id rather go slow and build strong--then going overboard on non-worthy players. I think it's in the team best intersts for NO short cuts after this. We have atleast 2 promising young players--I would like to see more of Hill as well. Chandler is a ? He has never been consistent healthy or not--kind of stuck between a F and G as well. Doesnt bring it enough--I would be willing to move him--example Portland lost both SF--I like Bayless and I think he would well here--I would be willing to do Chandler for Bayless--I'd be willing to trade any vet on a last year contract for deals like this as well.

I accept at this point this is full rebulding--I have 0 expectation for the year except development and opportunistic trades. No screaming from me anymore--although the one serious area of concern is the coach--I think he has to be flexible in the way he does several things on the court.


The bottom line is you dont go from this horror to a 50 win team overnight. We dont seem to have luck--so it's going to be brick by brick.

And we can do nothing about the lost pick. I think we have two two's one of which should be like a low 1. Instead of a pick we will[Im sure get atleast one nice piece in FA--that will be our lost lottery pick 3-4 days later]

RIP Crushalot😞
AUTOADVERT
oohah
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11/15/2009  12:45 PM
BRIGGS wrote:I would be willing to do Chandler for Bayless

Gross.

oohah

Good luck Mike D'Antoni, 'cause you ain't never seen nothing like this before!
BRIGGS
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11/15/2009  12:48 PM    LAST EDITED: 11/15/2009  12:48 PM
oohah wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:I would be willing to do Chandler for Bayless

Gross.

oohah

Bayless reminds me of what we saw against GS --build up a supply of players like Bayless TD and you will have 3-5 guards able to shoot pass and playmake.

RIP Crushalot😞
oohah
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11/15/2009  12:50 PM
BRIGGS wrote:
oohah wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:I would be willing to do Chandler for Bayless

Gross.

oohah

Bayless reminds me of what we saw against GS --build up a supply of players like Bayless TD and you will have 3-5 guards able to shoot pass and playmake.

I was joking BRIGGS. I would trade Chandler - who is not as good as Gerald Wilkins was - for Bayless in an instant.

oohah

Good luck Mike D'Antoni, 'cause you ain't never seen nothing like this before!
Uptown
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11/15/2009  12:52 PM
Totally agree. If Lebron, Wade or Bosh are not available, I would try to hold the space for Paul, etc rather than throw all of our money at a second tier player. But most Knick fans are very impatient and have already seen some say 2010 or bust....we shall see...
TheGame
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11/15/2009  1:23 PM
Totally agree. Take it slow and make smart longterm moves.
Trust the Process
Finestrg
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11/15/2009  1:49 PM
As far as Golden State, we're never getting Curry or Randolph. At least I don't see it. However, the guys we could possibly have a shot at on that team in a trade are Anthony Morrow, CJ Watson, Acie Law and maybe Brandon Wright. I think those 4 guys could help us - any deal would have to revolve around Lee or Hill (and it's doubtful Lee ever approves a trade to go there). However now with Azubuike going down last night, they might want to hang on to Morrow for awhile unless we dangle Chandler and they have some interest in Wilson...

Portland looks like a logical team for us to deal with, even moreso now that Travis Outlaw just went down with a broken foot and is expected to miss 6-8 weeks. I could now see them interested in Lee more than ever and even Chandler on the Blazers makes some more sense now with Outlaw down. Lee and Chandler for Bayless, Fernandez and an injuried Outlaw. That's a trade I make as soon as Lee is allowed to be dealt by NBA/CBA rules. No hesitation..
Paladin55
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11/15/2009  2:37 PM
The problem with using Chandler as trade material this year is that his value is at a low point. Coming off an injury, terrible shooting stats... Don't hear many people speaking about him lovingly around here anymore, calling him the "Mayor," or thinking about him as Shawn Marion lite.

GS just saw him play, by the way, and he did not exactly impress them, I would think. He may have injuries, but he still makes bad decisions-injuries don't affect that.

Chandler for Bayless would be intriguing. Don't know if Walsh/MDA still have the same feelings about Wilson's upside as they had in the past, and I don't know if Portland thinks Bayless has a future with them, but this might be something that can be done.

No man is happy without a delusion of some kind. Delusions are as necessary to our happiness as realities- C.N. Bovee
Anji
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11/15/2009  10:55 PM
BRIGGS wrote:
I accept at this point this is full rebulding--I have 0 expectation for the year except development and opportunistic trades. No screaming from me anymore--although the one serious area of concern is the coach--I think he has to be flexible in the way he does several things on the court.


The bottom line is you dont go from this horror to a 50 win team overnight. We dont seem to have luck--so it's going to be brick by brick.

And we can do nothing about the lost pick. I think we have two two's one of which should be like a low 1. Instead of a pick we will[Im sure get atleast one nice piece in FA--that will be our lost lottery pick 3-4 days later]


I think bargain bin shopping is probably the best plan right now because I don't believe they are going to get a top 3 FA. TD, Gallo and Hill are future right now. I would move Lee, Chandler and Duhon.

Darko is a guy I would look to keep cheap. Craig Smith and Amir Johnson are other cheap front court players I think can play around hill and grow.

Signing a vet 2 guard cheap like Roger Mason, Maurice Evans or Raja Bell to start would help.

And I would sell out on Raymond Felton. The guy can move the ball, get to the front of the rim at will.

"Really, all Americans want is a cold beer, warm p***y, and some place to s**t with a door on it." - Mr. Ford
franco12
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11/15/2009  11:07 PM
Briggs- you've changed your medications?

3-4 years if we are lucky, and I agree with you and have said as much before.

I tend to think the 2010 plan is a long shot at best. I'd also be VERY Careful with giving Lee any kind of long term contract. I'd rather lose him for nothing than be stuck with him and not be able to move him.
orangeblobman
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Nauru
11/15/2009  11:14 PM
If we don't get the big stuff, then we gotta be patient. The last thing we need is another hurried 'rebuild'. But we also gotta have a team that will fight to the death out there!
WE AIN'T NOWHERE WITH THIS BUM CHOKER IN CARMELO. GIVE ME STARKS'S 2-21 ANY DAY OVER THIS LACKLUSTER CLUSTEREFF.
BRIGGS
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11/16/2009  12:41 AM
Paladin55 wrote:The problem with using Chandler as trade material this year is that his value is at a low point. Coming off an injury, terrible shooting stats... Don't hear many people speaking about him lovingly around here anymore, calling him the "Mayor," or thinking about him as Shawn Marion lite.

GS just saw him play, by the way, and he did not exactly impress them, I would think. He may have injuries, but he still makes bad decisions-injuries don't affect that.

Chandler for Bayless would be intriguing. Don't know if Walsh/MDA still have the same feelings about Wilson's upside as they had in the past, and I don't know if Portland thinks Bayless has a future with them, but this might be something that can be done.

If we could get Bayless for Chandler I would be thrilled. Seems like a very fair trade on surface--Portland needs a SF we need a G salaries are close both are young etc... It's kind of a waste having Bayless on the bench when they have Miller Webster Roy Fernadez signed long term + sounds like they want Blake back. Bayless is buried.

RIP Crushalot😞
TMS
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11/16/2009  2:12 AM
if we miss out on the bigname free agents the last thing i wanna do is to lock up max dollars on 2nd & 3rd tier vets just to say we signed someone & because we have the flexibility to do it... so i'm with u on this... if we can't land the Lebrons, Wades, Boshs, Amares or Dirks, i say we stay conservative, sign up a mid tier guy or 2 at reasonable deals, & then keep our options open for 2011 & beyond.

no Joe Johnson's, Carlos Boozer's or Rudy Gay's to max deals!

After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
Bonn1997
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11/16/2009  6:39 AM
I'm surprised no one's complaining about Bosh being thrown in with Wade and Lebron. Bosh is finally getting some respect!
Finestrg
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11/16/2009  6:55 AM    LAST EDITED: 11/16/2009  6:56 AM
I like Bosh as a player a lot. What's not to like? What irked me just a little is the snicker & comments he had for some reporter when asked about possibly coming to NY as a FA. I mean what the hell's so funny Chris? In the same interview (it may have been something someone posted on their twitter page somewhere), he also lost patience, got a little short with the reporter & had some comments that kinda indicated NY was a joke to him if I remember right.. I mean if that's the case, I big fat FU to Chris Bosh. You don't wanna be here, don't come here. I don't want you then. Anyone else remember reading this? Kinda pissed me off a little at the time. I remember thinking, wow, who's this prima donna? Instead of being flattered and saying the right things, he chose to disrespect us a little bit. Funny how Colangelo said recently that he may not even be part of Toronto's plans if he wants max. money -- be careful what you say and who you laugh at Bosh, NY might wind up being your best or only shot at getting the kind of money you want...
PresIke
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11/16/2009  7:02 AM
i agree with tms.

look, do i hope we get (a) top guy(s) this off-season?

yes, but i fear some folks are feeling it is an "all in" move with no hope otherwise.

the goal is to be cap flexible.

that means no vastly overpaid guys.

problem is our roster is in transition and we still have eddy and jeffries for another season after this as it stands.

so, if we whiff this off-season for the most part on the top guys, it's not a good thing, but it ain't the end of days either, as long as we look to use the space carefully.

Forum Po Po and #33 for a reason...
Finestrg
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11/16/2009  7:23 AM    LAST EDITED: 11/16/2009  8:38 AM
Finestrg wrote:I like Bosh as a player a lot. What's not to like? What irked me just a little is the snicker & comments he had for some reporter when asked about possibly coming to NY as a FA. I mean what the hell's so funny Chris? In the same interview (it may have been something someone posted on their twitter page somewhere), he also lost patience, got a little short with the reporter & had some comments that kinda indicated NY was a joke to him if I remember right.. I mean if that's the case, I big fat FU to Chris Bosh. You don't wanna be here, don't come here. I don't want you then. Anyone else remember reading this? Kinda pissed me off a little at the time. I remember thinking, wow, who's this prima donna? Instead of being flattered and saying the right things, he chose to disrespect us a little bit. Funny how Colangelo said recently that he may not even be part of Toronto's plans if he wants max. money -- be careful what you say and who you laugh at Bosh, NY might wind up being your best or only shot at getting the kind of money you want...

Check that, my bad - it was a conversation Bosh had with his agent Ismail Humet on the phone. Apparently this dude Humet went to Hofstra & is a huge Knick fan. When he posed the idea to his client, Bosh laughed it off. I think the conversation was supposedly on ustream.com at one point but I can't seem to locate it. Here's a link to the articles:

http://www.nypost.com/p/blogs/bosh_laughs_at_idea_of_knicks_pu6lL8sinew7i4MXiimaNI

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/morning-jolt/07/23/morning_jolt/index.html

What do you guys think about this?
SupremeCommander
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11/16/2009  8:45 AM
I don't think anything stated here was a new interpretation. The goal has always been flexibility and acquiring players at an appropriate salary for their skill--so they're tradeable assets. And to sign players to appropriate durations so the team can add pieces when necessary. The entire cap structure needed reworking. The idea was never to wipe the cap clean and then throw a bunch of **** to the wall and see what sticks
DLeethal wrote: Lol Rick needs a safe space
NYKBocker
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11/16/2009  9:16 AM
If we don't get a MAX type player like LeBron or Wade, we can still sign 1 almost MAX player(Joe Johnson, Bosh?) and still have money next year for Melo and other MAX type players. Eddy and Fishlips contract end for 2011.
JohnWallace44
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11/16/2009  9:29 AM
If we don't get those guys, the media will explode on the Knicks. They will go from laughing stock, to legendary failure.

The pressure on Walsh would be so immense. No draft pick, a roster of Gallo, Hill, Chandler, Douglas. Maybe John Wall across the river (East or Hudson).

Options at that point aside from doing something creative, which he seems incapable of, would be trying to sign "one last hurrah" type guys like Redd, or minor stars like TJ Ford... and are you going to give anyone a multi-year deal if you don't get the big guns?

First of all, if there wasn't a back door deal, then I believe that the risk of these completely lost seasons is too great. So if he doesn't end up signing them... that's pretty rough already.

What we would need to look for in that scenario would be trades to take on salary from other teams in order to gain assets like picks or prospects. If we could facilitate a signing for another team by absorbing the last year of some albatross contract to get a pick to take an impact player, then that would be a start.

Alan Hahn: Nate Robinson has been on a ridonkulous scoring tear lately (remember when he couldn't hit Jerome James with a Big Mac in early January?)
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If we dont get Bosh James or Wade and the whole deal
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