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knicks1248
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10/27/2009  10:49 AM
http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/book/091027

whats your take

ES
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arkrud
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10/27/2009  11:01 AM    LAST EDITED: 10/27/2009  11:01 AM
This is history. May be sad in a way.
But if this history is sad the current reality is a monsterous joke.
Players we have are known for their antics more that for their qualities.
Our best man is coach and best player on the game is play-by-play commenter.
"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
orangeblobman
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Nauru
10/27/2009  11:02 AM
no mvp :(
WE AIN'T NOWHERE WITH THIS BUM CHOKER IN CARMELO. GIVE ME STARKS'S 2-21 ANY DAY OVER THIS LACKLUSTER CLUSTEREFF.
JohnWallace44
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10/27/2009  11:28 AM
Originally Published: October 22, 2009
The Book of Basketball
Simmons By Bill Simmons
Special to ESPN.com


Editor's note: The following is excerpted from Bill Simmons' new book, "The Book of Basketball: The NBA According to the Sports Guy," copyright 2009 by Bill Simmons. Reprinted by permission of ESPN Books and Ballantine Books.

This excerpt is from a section called "The Hall of Fame Pyramid," where I blow up the Basketball Hall of Fame and recreate it as an Egyptian pyramid with levels (five in all). I ranked Ewing at No. 39, as a Level Two guy. Here's why.

Why Patrick Ewing Was the 39th Best Player Ever

Resume: 17 years, 11 quality, 12 All-Stars … '86 Rookie of the Year … top 5 MVP ('90), top 10 ('88, '89, '91, '92, '93, '97) … best player on 1 runnerup ('94 Knicks) … 2- year peak: 28-11, 3.6 BPG, 53% FG … '90 Playoffs: 29-11 (10 G) … '94, '95 playoffs: 2011, 2.8 BPG, 45% FG (36 G) … member of '92 Dream Team … 20K- 10K Club

Knicks fans did their damnedest to talk themselves into the Patrick Ewing era.97 Everyone believed Ewing was the Evolutionary Russell, a destructive defensive force who would own the league someday. Only it didn't happen … and it didn't happen … and then it seemed like it was happening, only it turned out to be a tease … and it didn't happen … and at some point everyone except for the delusional Knicks fans realized that it was never going to happen. You know those movie scenes where a male character dies in a hospital bed and his wife stands over him talking like he didn't die, and everyone else in the room feels awkward, and then finally someone comes over and says, "Honey, he's gone" and tries to pull her away, so she starts screaming, "Nooooooo! Nooooo, he's fine! He's gonna wake up!" and then she collapses and has a crying seizure? That was every Knicks fan from 1995 to 1999. When Hakeem turned Ewing into ground beef in the '94 Finals, Ewing dropped dead in a "This guy's carrying us to a title someday" sense. But the Knicks fans kept standing there over the hospital bed waiting for him to wake up.

Eventually they decided that Ewing's career was either "frustrating" (the glass-half-full take) or "phenomenally disappointing" (the glass-half-empty take). He peaked during the '90 season, averaging a 29-11 with 4 blocks and 55 percent shooting for a 45-win Knicks team, saving the Knicks with a 44-13 in a must-win Game 4 against Boston, then leading them to a shocking upset in the decisive fifth game (31 points). Sitting in the Garden as Ewing took over and swished an improbable backbreaking three, I remember thinking, "He's putting it all together; we're in serious trouble." But Detroit easily dispatched them in the second round and Ewing was never that good again. Why? Because of his knees. College Ewing prowled the paint like a tiger, jumped around like House of Pain and contested every shot within fifteen feet of the rim. NBA veteran Ewing picked his spots, jogged with huge strides and crouched before every jump. Never a great rebounder98 or passer, never someone with a treasure chest of low-post moves, that subtle erosion of athleticism turned him into an elite center who did everything well and nothing great. Actually, it was a little sad. Poor Ewing perfected his "intense" game face, bellowed at the MSG crowd, pounded his chest after big plays, played up the whole "I'm a warrior!" angle in interviews and even made a clumsy effort to become an intimidating enforcer. All of it kind of worked … but not really. The sophisticated Knicks fans saw right through him, endlessly debating his virtues and repeatedly coming back to the same conclusion: As long as this is our best guy, we probably can't win the title.

That's when Pat Riley nearly salvaged Ewing's superstardom, remaking the Knicks into Bad Boys II, adopting thugball tactics to exact as much as he could from his secretly limited center (and nearly ruining basketball in the process). They lost back-to-back slugfests to Chicago before catching a break with Jordan's "baseball sabbatical," reaching the Finals behind a monster effort from Ewing in Game 7 (22-20-7 with 5 blocks and the winning tip against Indiana) before squandering a disheartening Finals. The following year, Reggie Miller ripped out their hearts in the Eastern Semis, with Ewing missing a series-deciding 6-foot bunny. And just like that the Ewing window had closed, although it took a few more years for everyone to realize it.99 Before the 2001 season, the Knicks finally cut the cord (and inadvertently destroyed their future) by turning Ewing's expiring deal into a slew of horrendous contracts; then we watched Ewing slog through the "fifteen-year-old poodle with cataracts who starts going to the bathroom in the house and needs to be put to sleep" stage. Did we ever figure out why centers age in dog years once they hit their late thirties? They always have one final season where they gain 20 pounds, lose all hand-eye coordination, run in slow motion, and jump like their shoes are loaded with razor blades; all they have left is their turnaround jumper. It's like an automobile being completely stripped except for the radio, which is left behind for some reason. That's the turnaround jumper. For Ewing, that season happened twice, in Seattle and Orlando. And then he was done.

He hasn't endured for a few reasons. Ewing lacked charisma and may have been the most uncomfortable postmerger interview other than Moses Malone.100 He had some legitimate weaknesses -- horrendous hands, shaky at crunch time, dubious rebounder, awful passer out of double-teams, couldn't make his teammates better -- and he lacked a fanfriendly game that wouldn't exactly be remembered fondly. Even Ewing's shining moment (the '94 Finals) turned into a train wreck: Ewing averaged 18.9 points and shot 36 percent, while Hakeem averaged a 27-9 with 3.9 blocks and 50 percent shooting. And it wasn't even THAT close. Ewing ranks this highly because you could build a contender around him in his prime, and because he absolutely could have won the '94 championship playing with Richmond, Rice, Miller, or really any good two-guard other than John Starks. Much like fellow Dream Team players Drexler, Robinson and Malone, we'll remember Ewing as a second banana masquerading as a first banana, even if Knicks fans never wanted to admit it at the time. Now they do.101

One last Ewing thought: When I was writing for my old website, a reader named Dave Cirilli sent in his elaborate Ewing Theory, which centered around the inexplicable phenomenon that both the Hoyas and Knicks seemed to play better every time Ewing was sitting on the bench. After tinkering with it and finding various examples,102 Dave emailed me and we honed the language over the next few weeks, eventually deciding that two crucial elements were needed for any situation to qualify for Ewing status: a star athlete receives an inordinate amount of media attention and fan interest, yet his teams never win anything substantial with him; and that same athlete leaves his team (either by injury, trade, graduation, free agency, or retirement) and both the media and fans immediately write off the team for the near future (for either the rest of the season or the following season). I wrote about the theory and had some fun with it.103 A few months later, Ewing tore an Achilles tendon during Game 2 of the '99 Eastern Finals. The heavily favored Pacers seemed like a mortal lock … only with Ewing himself involved, suddenly this had become the ultimate test of the Ewing Theory. Heading into Game 3, Dave was oozing with confidence and predicting in no uncertain terms, "Ewing's injury is the best thing that ever could have happened to the Knicks; they're definitely making the Finals now." Incredibly, the Knicks won three of the next four and advanced to the Finals as I was playing up Dave's Ewing theory prediction on my website! My three thousand readers at the time couldn't have been more impressed. From there, Ewing Theory instances kept happening -- Mo Vaughn ('99 Red Sox), Barry Sanders ('99 Lions), Trent Green ('99 Rams), Griffey and A-Rod ('00 and '01 Mariners), Dan Marino ('00 Dolphins) -- and I finally unveiled Dave's Ewing Theory to a national audience on ESPN.com in 2001, predicting that Drew Bledsoe was the single most logical Ewing Theory candidate for the future. Only a few months later, Bledsoe went down, the '02 Patriots won their first Super Bowl without him and I looked like Nostrasimbo. You have to admit, that was amazing. Since then, we've had some other classics (Nomar and the '04 Red Sox and Tiki and the '07 Giants being the best ones), but none could have happened without the great Patrick Ewing.

Here's my point: If your prime inspired a sports theory that hypothesized why your teams played better without you, you probably shouldn't crack the top thirty-five of a Hall of Fame Pyramid.

FOOTNOTES

97. I have multiple New York friends who swear that Knicks fans were subconsciously predisposed to root against Ewing because so many Knicks fans love St. John's and that was the height of the Johnnies-Hoyas Big East rivalry back then.

98. Ewing never cracked the top three in rebounding and currently has the 57th-highest career rebounding average, just ahead of Jack Sikma (60th), Bill Laimbeer (61st) and Rony Seikaly (70th).

99. Notice how I avoided any mention of the excruciating Knicks-Heat playoff battles? I always wanted a Bizarro ESPN Classic channel that featured programming like NBA's Greatest Games: Miami 65, New York 56; SportsCentury and Beyond: Rusty Hilger; The Very Best of the Magic Hour; Games That Ended Prematurely Because Somebody Died; Actors Who Threw Like Women (hosted by Tim Robbins); Best Magic Johnson Comebacks; Inside Schwartz; and NHL Instant Classic: Columbus at Minnesota.

100. When Ewing became head of the Players Association, it was like finding out that Flavor Flav had been named the president of Viacom.

101. My favorite Ewing moment: When an Atlanta strip joint (Gold Club) was busted for drugs and prostitution, a number of celebs were revealed as pay-for-play customers in the ensuing trial, including Ewing, who made the following testimony: "The girls danced, started fondling me, I got aroused, they performed oral sex. I hung around a little bit and talked to them, then I left." As Marv Albert would say, yes!

102. His original examples: Donyell Marshall ('95 UConn), Peyton Manning ('98 Tennessee), Keith Van Horn ('98 Utah), Don Mattingly ('96 Yankees), Bret Hart ('97 WWF).

103. Some enjoyable pop culture examples: Shannen Doherty (90210), David Lee Roth (Van Halen), Shelley Long (Cheers), David Caruso (NYPD Blue), Sonny Corleone (the Corleones), Craig Kilborn (Daily Show).

Alan Hahn: Nate Robinson has been on a ridonkulous scoring tear lately (remember when he couldn't hit Jerome James with a Big Mac in early January?)
Nalod
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10/27/2009  11:40 AM
Its been a few years since I tried to denegrate the ewing years but my writing talent is not top notch nor do I have the stats at my finger tips. And I don't get paid for posting.

This guy kind of sets the record straight in my eyes that we were not as good as many remember and we loved ewing despite his shortcomings. Distance makes the heart grow fonder so the more we remember the bigger those teams got. When I read (recently) what a good coach Starks would make by a poster its evident not too many remember when he took his golf clubs on a playoff trip to Indy and was lambasted for it. Or when LJ could barely walk with his bad back, or Oakly stifling the offense as if Ewing never throwing an outlet pass was bad enough! Charlie Ward was never a good leader and Camby was always hurting somehow!

Ewing was a warrior but he put himself above the team and never admitted his pain levels afraid the team would hold it against him in contract negotiations and if he sat out the team would move on without him. Come playoff time he was usually just flat out worn out! Enter the finger roll miss against Indy. He could not elevate to dunk it and finish the series!!!

Not trying to hate on Ewing, Oak, LJ or the rest but I appreciate him mentioning the Riley years and the low scoring games that might have been defensive masterpieces but there were times were it was hard to watch. what do you expect when you have Ewing-Mourning and PJ Brown and Oak down low? Watching JVG dark circles downing Diet Cokes looking like death was upon his 35 year old body was motivation enough to somtimes question what the hell we are doing on a beautiful Sunday spring day locked up inside with JVG instead of playing golf, riding a bike, or gettin buck naked and chasing wild game!

Sometimes it was almost a relief when the knicks go eliminated so we did not have to go thru any more JVG exaust or another ewing promise unfulfilled!

It was what it was. Close but no cigar!

JohnWallace44
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10/27/2009  12:01 PM
Yeah, during the ugliest of those years I rooted for the Knicks no matter what because they were my team, but I watched the Sonics for entertainment value.
Alan Hahn: Nate Robinson has been on a ridonkulous scoring tear lately (remember when he couldn't hit Jerome James with a Big Mac in early January?)
CrushAlot
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10/27/2009  12:06 PM
I have to say I disagree. What Ewing brought is everything that has been missing since he left. He was a superstar who led by his intense on the court play. He was the reason that the Knicks had the success that they had, not why they didn't get over the hump. Ewing never had a legitimate second star on the team in his career and yet the teams he was on always outworked their opponents to be successful. Ewing wasn't as good as Hakeem but for his time he was the second best center during a period when there were alot of good ones. I also disagree about how emotional those Knicks series were with Ewing's teams. That was passion and it is great to be able to have and feel passionate about a team that competes and succeeds at a high level. Simmons is very good at spinning things to make his anti-Knick point but those 90's Knicks teams are what keep me watching today.
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
sebstar
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10/27/2009  12:07 PM
Absurd article, he murdered his own piece by admitting the obvious --- if Ewing had a legit number two option, in his prime, he would have won a chip more than likely.

Ewing didnt make people better, with all the average-to-below average talent he dragged to ECF's and Finals appearances? C'mon son.

Of course Ewing was flawed and he did get lit up by the Dream in the Finals but this just another NY slant piece by the Boston homer.

My saliva and spit can split thread into fiber and bits/ So trust me I'm as live as it gets. --Royce Da 5'9 + DJ Premier = Hip Hop Utopia
Bippity10
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10/27/2009  12:36 PM
sebstar wrote:Absurd article, he murdered his own piece by admitting the obvious --- if Ewing had a legit number two option, in his prime, he would have won a chip more than likely.

Ewing didnt make people better, with all the average-to-below average talent he dragged to ECF's and Finals appearances? C'mon son.

Of course Ewing was flawed and he did get lit up by the Dream in the Finals but this just another NY slant piece by the Boston homer.

I have to agree with everything you said. We can point out all the flaws regarding Ewing and cry about not winning a title, but there is one fact that is often left out. It's the only one that matters to me. Before Ewing we were one of the worst teams in the league. After Ewing we've had 10 years of embarrassment, ridicule and at our best, mediocrity. In between those two time periods, we competed every year.

I just hope that people will like me
Nalod
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10/27/2009  12:38 PM

Its tough for some fans to digest some aspects. Its not to say we were not emotional about the team or rooted for them heavy. Ewing did not have the second fiddle but I think the article was saying that by 94' he was in decline and his rebounding, passing and blocked shots were really not that good for a center we hold in such high regard.

Ewing his first 5 years was on some really bad teams with the knicks and by 91' was not the same as his college game when he was an athletic freak who could run the floor, rebound and block shots.

39th best center statistically and no. 1 in many of knick fans hearts!

Nobody is taking away your knick memories. We are the homers and we saw things thru an emotional fans eyes.

Simmons ain't telling us there is no santa or Jesus was a hack, just some other views and some points to back that Knick fans have placed the era on a higher plane than it perhaps deserved.

Bippity10
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10/27/2009  12:44 PM
Nalod wrote:
Its tough for some fans to digest some aspects. Its not to say we were not emotional about the team or rooted for them heavy. Ewing did not have the second fiddle but I think the article was saying that by 94' he was in decline and his rebounding, passing and blocked shots were really not that good for a center we hold in such high regard.

Ewing his first 5 years was on some really bad teams with the knicks and by 91' was not the same as his college game when he was an athletic freak who could run the floor, rebound and block shots.

39th best center statistically and no. 1 in many of knick fans hearts!

Nobody is taking away your knick memories. We are the homers and we saw things thru an emotional fans eyes.

Simmons ain't telling us there is no santa or Jesus was a hack, just some other views and some points to back that Knick fans have placed the era on a higher plane than it perhaps deserved.

Judging by the views and the constant criticism that Ewing received I think Simmons is way off track in thinking that Knick fans place this era on some high plane. Just because Simmons said it, doesn't make it so. Was it Knick fans who rated him #39 player of all time or someone else?

Remember Ewing was basically run out of town here. The reality is we all know he was flawed, we all know he failed in his ultimate goal to bring us a title and we still wish it was different. Regardless Knick fans appreciate the effort and love him. I'm just not sure I agree with anyone who says he was overrated.

I just hope that people will like me
Bippity10
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10/27/2009  12:47 PM
I personally look at the facts on the ground. Forget the stats, forget the flaws, forget the selfishness, forget the post game interviews. The only thing I believe in is winning, and we sucked before and after he was here and we competed for Conference championships and titles while he was here. The rest doesn't matter to me. But even with my extreme man love for Ewing I would never place him in the sphere with Jordan and the big time title winners. I don't know anyone who does.
I just hope that people will like me
Nalod
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10/27/2009  12:49 PM
He did make the "Space Jam" all star team with Charles, Mugsy, LJ and others!!!!!
Bippity10
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10/27/2009  12:59 PM
Nalod wrote:He did make the "Space Jam" all star team with Charles, Mugsy, LJ and others!!!!!

This alone explains his worth.

I just hope that people will like me
jimimou
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10/27/2009  1:12 PM
its hard for a knicks fan to be objective about this topic. ewing wes the heart of nyc for the years he played on th eknicks. he embodied the working class, blue collar spirit this town was built on and THATS why we embraced him. yes, he had flaws, yes, he didnt have a robin to compliment his batman, yes he talked a little too much guarantees each year....

BUT BUT BUT, name me one player on this team today, or in the post ewing era for that matter, that had the same fire, heart, intensity and passion this guy had - give me ewing with 2 busted knees, a torn achilles and a busted wrist over the current roster of rejects the knicks have employed since the turn of the 21st century anyday of the week.

buddapaw
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10/27/2009  1:41 PM
jimimou wrote:its hard for a knicks fan to be objective about this topic. ewing wes the heart of nyc for the years he played on th eknicks. he embodied the working class, blue collar spirit this town was built on and THATS why we embraced him. yes, he had flaws, yes, he didnt have a robin to compliment his batman, yes he talked a little too much guarantees each year....

BUT BUT BUT, name me one player on this team today, or in the post ewing era for that matter, that had the same fire, heart, intensity and passion this guy had - give me ewing with 2 busted knees, a torn achilles and a busted wrist over the current roster of rejects the knicks have employed since the turn of the 21st century anyday of the week.

Preach!!

"Low Percentage Shots r US, these are our Knicks" "NY KNICKS the cure for basketball fanatic"
NYKBocker
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10/27/2009  3:04 PM
Bill Simmons is a jackass and Boston homer. Sebstar nailed it ..
Ewing didnt make people better, with all the average-to-below average talent he dragged to ECF's and Finals appearances? C'mon son.

Ewing made a lot of people better. Idiots like Bill Simmons just can't seem to see that.

kam77
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10/27/2009  3:10 PM
How many of Mark Jackson's assists were to Ewing. Jack will go to the HoF on Ewing back!
lol @ being BANNED by Martin since 11/07/10 (for asking if Mr. Earl had a point). Really, Martin? C'mon. This is the internet. I've seen much worse on this site. By Earl himself. Drop the hypocrisy.
oohah
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10/27/2009  3:55 PM
kam77 wrote:How many of Mark Jackson's assists were to Ewing. Jack will go to the HoF on Ewing back!

Oh no you didn't.

Ewing was never better than when he played with Mark Jackson. After Jackson's second season they were anointed the best 1-2 punch in the east. With Jackson Ewing was all dunks and layups. After Jackson he was 50% fadeaways.

Ewing and Jackson helped each other. After the trade, nobody ever set up Ewing the way Jackson did. All of Ewing's bucket cost twice the effort after Jackson. Losing Jackson added years to Ewings body because he had to work so hard!

Jackson was one of the greatest passers in the history of the game. This really can't be argued. Ewing was one of the best scoring centers of his time. It was a match made in heaven. But Jackson led the league in assists after the Knicks and probably got a hell of a lot more assists from throwing the ball to Reggie Miller.

oohah

Good luck Mike D'Antoni, 'cause you ain't never seen nothing like this before!
kam77
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10/27/2009  4:17 PM
probably got a hell of a lot more assists from throwing the ball to Reggie Miller..

stats?

lol @ being BANNED by Martin since 11/07/10 (for asking if Mr. Earl had a point). Really, Martin? C'mon. This is the internet. I've seen much worse on this site. By Earl himself. Drop the hypocrisy.
ewing intersting

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