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GKFv2
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7/19/2009  3:15 AM
I re-post this from the SL thread:

You really must be joking to think anyone could have done better with the absolute garbage Isiah Thomas left behind. You look at the roster right now and you say "wow, look at where we are" and the sad thing it's a hell of a lot better than where were 1 year ago today. That's just the truth. Is this a good team? No. Is that Donnie's fault? No. Nobody could have done better than Donnie with what was left behind. He cleared a lot of salary and got us under the cap, something we haven't been under in 14 years. It's not his fault your boy and former prodigy Eddy Curry and Jared Jeffries are wasting $20 million in salary cap space in 2010. If they weren't, Lee and Nate would already be re-signed (not that I want that but ok). He's going about this the right way.

People sit here and call Gallinari a bust. Hold your horses. The only reason you can call him that is because he was injured. He has the talent. He has loads of it. But he's not a bust at all. Wait a while before you bring out the bust tag. Hell, people are already throwing out the bust tag on Hill. Then again, they labeled Gallo a bust the minute after he was drafted so there you go.

While it is frustrating, remember Donnie has nothing to do with the decade-long failure of the franchise. He's coming here to clean up the mess. I want to have a good team too but it's obvious we don't have good players. Our "best players" don't even have a contract offer from anyone in the country. The roster sucks. I don't think this roster will attract any free agents but the thought process in getting under the cap was the best way in going about rebuilding this team. This is what we all wanted(besides the Isiah starphuck fans), this is what we're getting. I'm not complaining. We may not sign anyone in 2010 but I'll tell you this - it will STILL be better than what we have seen all these years. We'll still have cap space and have our picks back again. Curry and Jeffries will be expiring. We wont be in a bad position at all.
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Cosmic
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7/19/2009  7:56 AM
To those that don't like the plan, don't feel it will succeed, and will probably explode if Wade/Bron sign extensions soon...all I gotta say is what was the alternative? Should we beg the Hawks and Grizzlies to give us Zach and Craw back? Re-sign Marbs? Then use other expirings to go after Baron Davis?

Then win 32 games again because of total chaos and dysfunction?

Because...that's the argument "you guys" are making when you get down on Walsh's plan.

Walsh's plan is simple: Using expirings to add another big name player whose team doesn't want anymore to the present mix of players would result in the same thing: A bad team full of dysfunction and chaos.

So, scratch that, and you are left with the only other option: Strip down Isiah's team and start over.

Problem: Some of "you guys" think Walsh added Harrington and Hughes and thought he was building a playoff team by doing so. Fact: He acquired them for their contracts. If they showed something, fine, they stay, if they did not, fine, they go and so do their cap crippling deals.

Fact: It takes time to tear down a team that had 143M in committed payroll many of the big offenders stretching into 2011.

So, where are we? Yes, lined up with over 50M expirings for 2010.

What happens in 2010? About a dozen very attractive players are free agents.

What happens in 2010? We have the flexibility to sign any number of players and start building a new winning team.

What happens if Bron and Wade and Bosh aren't available to us? I think we need to PANIC!!! ... no. We need to understand you can't control that and that they aren't the only players available.

Those making this Bron or bust are losing their minds or never had them collected in the first place.

This is about a very simple process:

1) Strip down the trash.
2) Create flexibility and responsible spending.
3) Use that flexibility and start building a new team.
4) Start adding to that new foundation.
5) Compete.

Know where we are? Still with one foot in (1) and one foot in (2).

Know when (3) begins? Summer of 2010. Know where "you guys" think it began or should have? June 2008. Why? You're hooked on the Isiah rebuild on the fly plan. Why are "you guys" foolish for wanting that? You can't seem to learn from five years of absolute disaster and the 3 more years of disaster it created after the fact.

But, yes, by all means, flame Walsh, crave the Isiah plan of madness, lament trading Crawful and Zachass, and pretend Walsh put together today's roster to win the 2009 NBA Championship. Whatever makes the boredom go away I suppose.

.....Bottom line? You can't criticize Walsh's overall plan until it actually takes root and gives you a legitiment reason to criticize it. Know when that date is? Late summer 2010. And even then, if we strike out, it's not our doing, it's the available players making different decisions. Even then we still have all the flexibility in the world to acquire players.

One last side note: If all the big names sign extensions THIS summer - guess what? Quit crying. Why? We have 50M+ in expirings to pull off the classic Isiah trades "you guys" covet! More expirings than any other team. Several great young kids to trade as well!

So what are you crying about? Why today?

Until February 2010 deadline we have infinite resources and numerous options to pursue here. We could trade for 3 max free agents anytime from now until Feb 2010 deadline.

So please, stop crying like it's already October 2010 and we are going to war with our SL roster.
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JayNYC
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7/19/2009  9:43 AM
First off, let me just say that there are a lot of good points in this post. I am in FAVOR of Donnie Walsh as NYK head man! I think he should be applauded for creating an identity, changing the poor Knick culture around the league amongst management, and especially his moves towards cap relief thus far. At times, as an avid Knicks fan can often be... I become over-anxious and question why we are not making a bigger splash in the headlines, MORE SO after witnessing several of the "big names in free agency" moving about so frequently; but then I am quickly reminded of the 2010 plan. For that I remain steady, patience is key. 2010-2011 is supposed to be the start of our end to NYK disaster. I will add that Donnie Walsh's success is pending on the execution of his grand 2010 plan.

SOMETHING ELSE DOES BOTHER ME THOUGH.

(Maybe I'm biased because I truly liked #11 as a kid, watching with my dad) But I can't help but notice, how Zeke is villified on these threads. It seems to go unnoticed/rarely ever mentioned... "the negative impact spawn from Layden's regime". While Isiah Thomas did contribute to the cap situation, it was SCOT LAYDEN that CREATED this downward spiral of NYK ineptitude for the past 8 years... almost a decade!

All he needed to do was keep PE#33 in the fold. But NO!!! We had to send him out to Seattle on a quest for Luc Longley and Glen Rice. Not to mention signing albatross contracts for Shannon Anderson and Howard Eisley, perennial backups getting starter funding. Then to top it off... we outbid ourselves in my opinion, for an offer to Allan Houston (who believe it or not was one of my favorite NYK players) at max deal for 100 mil. The flaw was there were no other major suitors; Especially at that kind of cash, we over paid! That's when this defunct in New York Knick basketball became evident. Believe what you want, but Isiah actually attempted to make this team more competitive. His problem was again OVER PAYING for marginal talent. However... if you compare the rosters from the Layden Era to the Zeke years, its hard to argue that at least on paper, the team had'nt seemingly been improved!

AGAIN THAT'S NOT TO SAY THAT ISIAH DIDN'T CONTRIBUTE TO THE KNICK FIASCO, I'M MERELY SAYING THAT HE WAS NOT THE INITIAL CAUSE. Layden and Zeke should both be linked in that regard, IMO.

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JohnWallace44
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7/19/2009  10:05 AM
The Camby trade was one of the worst ever in the NBA in terms of taking a contending team and completely leveling them down to rebuilding for ten years mode.

Isiah rolled the dice about five times on high risk-reward moves and lost every time. You would think chances are that you'd win one of those times... but no.

Actually Zach wasn't bad considering how much Portland wanted him out of there. He was productive as heck for us.

Crawford, Eddie, Jeffries... no. Balkman... not really.

If we had never hired Larry Brown I wonder where this team would be at. We'd still have Ariza and would never have gotten Zach.

In regards to Walsh, his big mistake that I will never forget is that he didn't go all the way with the 2010 plan. To me, either go all in, or don't do it. He half arsed it because he didn't package our assets to move Jeffries at the trade deadline. He should have used Nate to move him but he punted on that one and now we may lose Nate for nothing to Greece. There were articles before the trade deadline stating how low the salary cap could drop in 2010. I wrote about it on the board. I'm sure Walsh knew. Why didn't he make a move with Jeffries?

If he trades Nate to move Jeffries we probably lose a couple more games and then we're sitting here with maybe a better prospect than the safe Jordan Hill pick.

We also seem to be getting out maneuvered by all the young punk GM's. Warkentein, Pritchard, Presti, Morey, they're all making slick moves with lots of moving pieces and it seems like we're just taking a nap for the Summer.

Getting used by Jason Kidd to get his salary raised was just sad as a Knick fan. I'm afraid that LeBron and Wade are doing the same thing right now. Using us as leverage to get their teams to obtain free agents, but they don't intend to leave anyway.
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fishmike
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7/19/2009  10:14 AM
Jay.. your 100% that Layden started it. Then Zeke went took Layden's lesson to heart because totally one upped him. Houston, Spoon, Eisley and Anderson were all coming off the books the same year. If Zeke had any patience at all he would have had a clean slate to work with, cap space and all. Instead he gave 5 year deals to guys like Jerome James and Jared Jefferies. He took on long contracts like Marbury and Zach. He gave Crawford a 6 year deal when nobody was offering him the MLE. He traded 2 years of lottery picks for a center that does care enough about basketball to show up in shape.

Anyway.. I agree with the gist of this post. I am not saying its going to happen but at least we are in a position to acquire a bigtime player next year and actually build something following a plan.

Bottom line to me is you can never micro analyze every move a GM makes. You have to look at his body of work. DW gets 3-4 years. Plain and simple. This is the start of his 2nd.
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Bippity10
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7/19/2009  10:34 AM
Here is the big difference between the Laymas/Walsh plans. When the plans of Layden and Isiah didn't work we were stuck with long contracts and could not make trades, we traded future draft picks and were unable to sign free agents.

If Walsh's plan doesn't work, we still have cap space to try to sign a free agent the next year, our team will be bad enough to get another high draft pick(after 2010 which of course was traded away) and we will have reasonable contracts that we can trade.

Why can't some people see that.
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TMS
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7/19/2009  10:37 AM
Posted by Cosmic:

To those that don't like the plan, don't feel it will succeed, and will probably explode if Wade/Bron sign extensions soon...all I gotta say is what was the alternative? Should we beg the Hawks and Grizzlies to give us Zach and Craw back? Re-sign Marbs? Then use other expirings to go after Baron Davis?

Then win 32 games again because of total chaos and dysfunction?

Because...that's the argument "you guys" are making when you get down on Walsh's plan.

Walsh's plan is simple: Using expirings to add another big name player whose team doesn't want anymore to the present mix of players would result in the same thing: A bad team full of dysfunction and chaos.

So, scratch that, and you are left with the only other option: Strip down Isiah's team and start over.

Problem: Some of "you guys" think Walsh added Harrington and Hughes and thought he was building a playoff team by doing so. Fact: He acquired them for their contracts. If they showed something, fine, they stay, if they did not, fine, they go and so do their cap crippling deals.

Fact: It takes time to tear down a team that had 143M in committed payroll many of the big offenders stretching into 2011.

So, where are we? Yes, lined up with over 50M expirings for 2010.

What happens in 2010? About a dozen very attractive players are free agents.

What happens in 2010? We have the flexibility to sign any number of players and start building a new winning team.

What happens if Bron and Wade and Bosh aren't available to us? I think we need to PANIC!!! ... no. We need to understand you can't control that and that they aren't the only players available.

Those making this Bron or bust are losing their minds or never had them collected in the first place.

This is about a very simple process:

1) Strip down the trash.
2) Create flexibility and responsible spending.
3) Use that flexibility and start building a new team.
4) Start adding to that new foundation.
5) Compete.

Know where we are? Still with one foot in (1) and one foot in (2).

Know when (3) begins? Summer of 2010. Know where "you guys" think it began or should have? June 2008. Why? You're hooked on the Isiah rebuild on the fly plan. Why are "you guys" foolish for wanting that? You can't seem to learn from five years of absolute disaster and the 3 more years of disaster it created after the fact.

But, yes, by all means, flame Walsh, crave the Isiah plan of madness, lament trading Crawful and Zachass, and pretend Walsh put together today's roster to win the 2009 NBA Championship. Whatever makes the boredom go away I suppose.

.....Bottom line? You can't criticize Walsh's overall plan until it actually takes root and gives you a legitiment reason to criticize it. Know when that date is? Late summer 2010. And even then, if we strike out, it's not our doing, it's the available players making different decisions. Even then we still have all the flexibility in the world to acquire players.

One last side note: If all the big names sign extensions THIS summer - guess what? Quit crying. Why? We have 50M+ in expirings to pull off the classic Isiah trades "you guys" covet! More expirings than any other team. Several great young kids to trade as well!

So what are you crying about? Why today?

Until February 2010 deadline we have infinite resources and numerous options to pursue here. We could trade for 3 max free agents anytime from now until Feb 2010 deadline.

So please, stop crying like it's already October 2010 and we are going to war with our SL roster.

i think u just about covered it for me... the only criticism i would have for Donnie is not trading Lee & Nate at the deadline last year... other than that, i think he's done as good a job as anyone could have hoped for... our team is now in a position to have real cap flexibility for the first time in over a decade... we have some good young talent to help facilitate the rebuild with... we are only missing a real franchise guy, which is obviously the main goal that Donnie came in here with & why he's targetting the cap flexibility in 2010 to begin with.

all these wannabe draft gurus on this forum who sit in their underwear scratching their balls & posting at their computers pretending like they know more about judging NBA talent then someone like Walsh who's been doing it professionally for most of our lifetimes are a joke... how u can judge any pick or give final grades to, whether it be Gallinari or Jordan Hill, based off of an incomplete rookie season where injuries severely limited their play, or 3 SL games in limited action????... any prospect should be given at least a couple years to show if they got the goods to make it or not in the NBA... not every young player that comes into the league is gonna be a Lebron or Shaq & dominate from day one... but of course the know it alls think they got this draft class pegged already before they even play a single game in the NBA... they call Jordan Hill a bust already because he wasn't the guy they wanted the Knicks to pick just like they did with Gallo last year... let's all look forward to another season of other teams' prospects being heiled as the second coming of Christ while ours are trashed & thrown in the dumpster as usual... these idiots must be so bored w/their lives & have nothing else to do but complain & pretend like they know how to better run an NBA franchise than the people who have a proven successful track record of doing so.

[Edited by - TMS on 07-19-2009 07:40 AM]
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SupremeCommander
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7/19/2009  10:58 AM
Posted by JayNYC:


SOMETHING ELSE DOES BOTHER ME THOUGH.

(Maybe I'm biased because I truly liked #11 as a kid, watching with my dad) But I can't help but notice, how Zeke is villified on these threads. It seems to go unnoticed/rarely ever mentioned... "the negative impact spawn from Layden's regime". While Isiah Thomas did contribute to the cap situation, it was SCOT LAYDEN that CREATED this downward spiral of NYK ineptitude for the past 8 years... almost a decade!

Maybe Isiah didn't start the malaise but he effectively threw gasoline on the fire. This team was in such bad shape from player personnel to public relations to organizational behavior. Hell, Isiah Thomas was so bad he moved into mainstream pop culture--you can chant "Fire Isaiac" inside the arena in Grand Theft Auto IV when watching the Los Santos Shakers play the Liberty City Checks. Isiah was so terrible and so diluted his awfulness moved into discussion outside the basketball world
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Cosmic
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7/19/2009  11:52 AM
Posted by SupremeCommander:
Posted by JayNYC:


SOMETHING ELSE DOES BOTHER ME THOUGH.

(Maybe I'm biased because I truly liked #11 as a kid, watching with my dad) But I can't help but notice, how Zeke is villified on these threads. It seems to go unnoticed/rarely ever mentioned... "the negative impact spawn from Layden's regime". While Isiah Thomas did contribute to the cap situation, it was SCOT LAYDEN that CREATED this downward spiral of NYK ineptitude for the past 8 years... almost a decade!

Maybe Isiah didn't start the malaise but he effectively threw gasoline on the fire. This team was in such bad shape from player personnel to public relations to organizational behavior. Hell, Isiah Thomas was so bad he moved into mainstream pop culture--you can chant "Fire Isaiac" inside the arena in Grand Theft Auto IV when watching the Los Santos Shakers play the Liberty City Checks. Isiah was so terrible and so diluted his awfulness moved into discussion outside the basketball world

Layden was Dolan's puppet. Dolan came right out and said he dumped the previous regime because he wanted to try his hands at things...and then here comes his puppet in Layden.

Isiah took Layden's disaster, of which had 0 on the cap for 2007-2008 and converted it into 143M in guaranteed trash on the cap for 2007-2008.

Why would we ever absolve Isiah of wrongdoing? Isiah was in good shape to do just the Marbury trade and run with him and Layden's blue collar guys while he waiting for all the 07 trash to come off the books all at once. Instead he kept signing MLE bums, and trading expirings and picks for everyone's castaways and giving them huge long contracts.

Why let the guy off the hook for that? Because he was a good player? Yeah well he was a disaster of a GM and deserves to get reamed out for it.

Now, Donnie, who is trying is hardest to NOT repeat those mistakes, and taking the absolute proper and needed road to erase those mistakes, is getting hammered for not putting a winning team on the court in 08 and now 09?

I just don't get that.

What is more of a question is how the Walsh haters can complain we won't have a winner for a while when they know that Isiah filled the roster up with terrible players with long contracts - of which will simply continue to take time to remove before we can move forward.

I just don't understand that. Their argument is also based on an opinion of what might happen 12-15 months down the road in the free agent market.

Well, how about waiting until that time passes before judging him?

I guess that's no fun.
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djsunyc
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7/19/2009  1:03 PM
layden had a plan but the dice gamble ultimately did him in.
isiah had a plan but his management skills (or lack thereof) did him in.

walsh has a plan too. now knicks fans must sit back and wait to see it play out.

the previous 2 gm's made mistakes in the lottery and traded away high picks. walsh's lottery selections are tbd but he also refused to be a buyer in a buyer's market. so let's see who the FA will be next summer. if it's lebron or wade then walsh would go down as the 2nd best gm in knicks history. if it's anybody else it would've been a waste of time b/c the team could've been a big time winner now.
TMS
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7/19/2009  1:05 PM
if it's lebron or wade then walsh would go down as the 2nd best gm in knicks history. if it's anybody else it would've been a waste of time b/c the team could've been a big time winner now.

how do u figure? cuz we coulda been buyer's on guys like Boozer, Odom & Andre Miller? are those guys who are gonna lead us to a championship?
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djsunyc
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7/19/2009  1:09 PM
Posted by TMS:
if it's lebron or wade then walsh would go down as the 2nd best gm in knicks history. if it's anybody else it would've been a waste of time b/c the team could've been a big time winner now.

how do u figure? cuz we coulda been buyer's on guys like Boozer, Odom & Andre Miller? are those guys who are gonna lead us to a championship?

lebron hasn't lead a team to the championship either. the championship or bust mentality is flawed. there is ALOT of success for a franchise other than winning a title. did you think a team with hedo + shard at the PF would get to the finals? knicks fans expectations for 2010 are ludicrous.
BasketballJones
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7/19/2009  1:12 PM
SOMETHING ELSE DOES BOTHER ME THOUGH.

(Maybe I'm biased because I truly liked #11 as a kid, watching with my dad) But I can't help but notice, how Zeke is villified on these threads. It seems to go unnoticed/rarely ever mentioned... "the negative impact spawn from Layden's regime". While Isiah Thomas did contribute to the cap situation, it was SCOT LAYDEN that CREATED this downward spiral of NYK ineptitude for the past 8 years... almost a decade!

Yeah! People forget that it has only been five years since Scott Layden's catastrophic stewardship almost sank the Knicks. That's not nearly enough time to recover. Isiah Thomas actually saved the Knicks from sinking, but will forever be vilified because he was left to deal with with the Layden dregs.

As soon as Isiah got here, he started making dynamic moves. He brought in Stephon Marbury - the hometown hero from Coney Island - to lead the new crew, and big Eddy Curry to anchor the new regime. After determining that every other coach was either too incompetent or disloyal to lead the crew he'd assembled, Isiah finally took the helm himself. He added the final piece with Zach Randolph, the southpaw. There followed an era that will go down as one of the most entertaining in Knick history.

Cap'n Zeke steered the ship through stormy seas and led us to calmer waters. Walsh is now the beneficiary, and now the ungrateful populace is vilifying this great leader.
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TMS
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7/19/2009  1:17 PM
Posted by djsunyc:
Posted by TMS:
if it's lebron or wade then walsh would go down as the 2nd best gm in knicks history. if it's anybody else it would've been a waste of time b/c the team could've been a big time winner now.

how do u figure? cuz we coulda been buyer's on guys like Boozer, Odom & Andre Miller? are those guys who are gonna lead us to a championship?

lebron hasn't lead a team to the championship either. the championship or bust mentality is flawed. there is ALOT of success for a franchise other than winning a title. did you think a team with hedo + shard at the PF would get to the finals? knicks fans expectations for 2010 are ludicrous.

dude, w/o Dwight that Magic team is just another playoff wannabe... no, neither Lebron nor Dwight have led their teams to championships, but the point is that in order to win a championship, u really do need a franchise calibre player anchoring ur team like those guys... it's been proven so many times in past champions... Donnie's sole focus is on landing a franchise guy to build around... u don't give up that plan to go out & lock up supplementary guys like Boozer, Odom or Miller to longterm cap killing deals until u've secured urself that foundation player to build around... the Knicks are in no position to be buyers yet until they get the piece they're looking for... whether we swing & miss on Lebron or not the plan is still the right course of action to take... spending big dollars on guys like Boozer & Odom is just rehashing the same exact mistakes this franchise has been making for the past decade... i don't understand how u wanna repeat that same old cycle.
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djsunyc
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7/19/2009  1:23 PM
i'm not sure why you keep bringing up boozer + odom + miller. walsh became gm 2 years ago. other players he could've targeted over that time frame.

and even teams that get a franchise player don't always build a winning team with them.

like i said, walsh has a plan so we sit back and see it come to fruition. he should not give it up. but the situation in the nba has changed dramatically over the past 2 years where we see some high caliber stars moved for nothing.
djsunyc
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7/19/2009  1:27 PM
just saw this:
If LeBron James ultimately decides to stay in Cleveland, the Knicks have a number of fallback options to target in the next few summers.

In 2011, guys like Carmelo Anthony and Kevin Durant are expected to hit the free agent market.

If Anthony and Durant don't move to New York, then Chris Paul and Deron Williams could become options in the summer of 2012.

lol @2011 and 2012...
Marv
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7/19/2009  1:29 PM
Posted by djsunyc:

just saw this:
If LeBron James ultimately decides to stay in Cleveland, the Knicks have a number of fallback options to target in the next few summers.

In 2011, guys like Carmelo Anthony and Kevin Durant are expected to hit the free agent market.

If Anthony and Durant don't move to New York, then Chris Paul and Deron Williams could become options in the summer of 2012.

lol @2011 and 2012...

only losers think like that.

i'm focusing on wall in 2015.
TMS
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7/19/2009  1:50 PM
Posted by djsunyc:

i'm not sure why you keep bringing up boozer + odom + miller. walsh became gm 2 years ago. other players he could've targeted over that time frame.

and even teams that get a franchise player don't always build a winning team with them.

like i said, walsh has a plan so we sit back and see it come to fruition. he should not give it up. but the situation in the nba has changed dramatically over the past 2 years where we see some high caliber stars moved for nothing.

i bring those guys up cuz u were talking about us passing on a buyers' market this year... who was available for us to acquire last year w/the assets Donnie had at his disposal? guys like Baron Davis? Vince Carter? Michael Redd? is there really a difference there either?

no, teams w/a franchise star don't always win titles, but almost always the team that wins the title does have a true franchise star... the plan is to acquire that franchise star & Donnie has maintained from the very beginning that there are a select few players who he would be willing to nix the 2010 plan to go after... that means he is not dead set on Lebron or Wade, so everyone who keeps rehashing this "Lebron, Wade or bust" mentality are off on this one.
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BigC
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7/19/2009  1:54 PM
Posted by Marv:
Posted by djsunyc:

just saw this:
If LeBron James ultimately decides to stay in Cleveland, the Knicks have a number of fallback options to target in the next few summers.

In 2011, guys like Carmelo Anthony and Kevin Durant are expected to hit the free agent market.

If Anthony and Durant don't move to New York, then Chris Paul and Deron Williams could become options in the summer of 2012.

lol @2011 and 2012...

only losers think like that.

i'm focusing on wall in 2015.
Why focus on 2015 when you can have real goals and objectives in 2020.

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McK1
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Member: #964
7/19/2009  1:59 PM
at this point I just don't trust Walsh's ability to

a) evaluate the climate of the NBA

* I believe like Wallace at the trade deadline in 04, there would have been a market for a motivated Steph (it was a contract year for him a guy who hadn't played much the last 2 seasons) in February but he let the stooge owner and chuckling coach embarass and humiliate Steph and he had no clue it was even happpening. Steph has given everyone past and present a reason to hate him but that should never come before the business side of ways to improve the Knicks. A guy with Steph's ability out to prove he should get a new contract from someone plus the 21 mil in cap relief associated with him is an asset at least till February.

* To Isiah's credit he did use NY's ability to take on salary to acquire 1st rounders.
Bulls were desperate to move Hughes. We gave them major cap relief and didn't even get a 2nd.
A team like the Jazz would've been prime for such a plucking as well. I'm sure by the trade deadline last season they knew they knew Boozer wasn't in the future plans, they would have to ante up big to keep Milsap and they knew the money it would cost the owner. Did Walsh even put in a call to the Jazz?

* how realistic is it guys will leave 20-30 mil on the table? what is the contingency? what assets has Walsh stockpiled in the case a team agrees to do a sign and trade or NY gets noone at all? extra picks...no, drafted players who an organization can sell to its fanbase as stars moving forward...no.

b) evaluate a roster and build a competitive team

* Lee and Nate. don't know what number Walsh has Nate at and if he isreally in the future plans but if he has Lee at 8 mil and wants to keep him, why didn't he extend him last year. Did he not know coming in Lee is a double double guy regardless of "system"?

* Grant Hill and Kidd are both approaching 40. this team is going nowhere. why were we even considering using the mid on them?

* We didn't trade for hughes to get a pick out of chi so why was the move made? I guess he and his staff stopped watching the nba the last couple years or he nor his people ever googled larry hughes and saw the website dedicated to him: www.pleasestopshooting...

* Gallo and Hill. I like gallo's skill level but if Kiki knew about the back issues didn't NY? Going deeper when evaluating the available face up bigs, I wonder what they projected Randolph out to be?
Hill: pfft. re-sign Wilcox on the cheap and leave a guard draft with one of the top 7 guard prospects.

* Douglas. nice fine should be a good 3rd point/4th guard. Definitely not a reason NY shouldn't pay Nate.

* Sessions. D'Antoni's brother was talking him up and now a Milwaukee journalist thinks we're going to try and get him and sign him longterm. SMH. Can this be read as an admittance the 010 plan to sign 2 max FA's wasn't well constructed?
Furthermore you just spent a year clearing the contracts of overpriced talent and now they are considering give long term money to a dunking Duhon with no 3 point shot....why?

And yes i wrote this bored, in my draws, scratching my balls. I thought this was ultimateknicks not ultimatenazis.com! I don't have to wait for the popular forum vote to judge. The capspace in 010 is great. IMO personnel wise the game has passed Walsh by and NY needs a younger FO guy to lead New York into the next decade.

the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
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