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JohnWallace44
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3/28/2009  6:32 PM
I have a Seinfeld question for you;

What's the deal with Thabeet on offense?

Those of you that have watched him for years now, please explain what's going on there.

When Syracuse had Craig Forth, he was one of the most awkward players on offense that I've ever seen. He missed layups with regularity, but they would still dump it down to him pretty often considering his lack of skill. A 7 footer can always do some sort of damage with the ball down low.

With UConn, it doesn't look so much like Thabeet isn't aggressive. It looks like he's schemed out of his own offense. Is that the case?

This year I've seen Calhoun do things that fly in the face of logic, but the Huskies still are about to make the final four.

In the Syracuse 6OT game, the way that he allowed the Cuse to bait Thabeet out to the perimeter while Flynn was obviously setting him up to blow by him was astounding having watched Calhoun beat Syracuse with talent and schemes so many times in past years.

I don't get the way that they use Thabeet. It doesn't make a whole lot of sense on either end.

That said, what do you UConn fans see for him on the next level? Can he develop into an offensive threat? Can he be used better in the pros on both ends? Or is there something I'm not seeing that could continue to hold him back at the next level?
Alan Hahn: Nate Robinson has been on a ridonkulous scoring tear lately (remember when he couldn't hit Jerome James with a Big Mac in early January?)
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Caseloads
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3/28/2009  7:09 PM
thabeet sucks. dude was invisible today
BRIGGS
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3/28/2009  7:32 PM
Posted by JohnWallace44:

I have a Seinfeld question for you;

What's the deal with Thabeet on offense?

Those of you that have watched him for years now, please explain what's going on there.

When Syracuse had Craig Forth, he was one of the most awkward players on offense that I've ever seen. He missed layups with regularity, but they would still dump it down to him pretty often considering his lack of skill. A 7 footer can always do some sort of damage with the ball down low.

With UConn, it doesn't look so much like Thabeet isn't aggressive. It looks like he's schemed out of his own offense. Is that the case?

This year I've seen Calhoun do things that fly in the face of logic, but the Huskies still are about to make the final four.

In the Syracuse 6OT game, the way that he allowed the Cuse to bait Thabeet out to the perimeter while Flynn was obviously setting him up to blow by him was astounding having watched Calhoun beat Syracuse with talent and schemes so many times in past years.

I don't get the way that they use Thabeet. It doesn't make a whole lot of sense on either end.

That said, what do you UConn fans see for him on the next level? Can he develop into an offensive threat? Can he be used better in the pros on both ends? Or is there something I'm not seeing that could continue to hold him back at the next level?

When he gets in FT he is tentative and throws him off. He had two bad sequences on offense and he didnt get enough FGA's. Nevertheless 13 rebounds and solid defensive presence played a big role despite foul trouble.
RIP Crushalot😞
JohnWallace44
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3/28/2009  7:58 PM
So Briggs, what's your ultimate take on Thabeet? If Derozan, Jennings, and Thabeet are sitting there for us to pick somehow and you can only take one, who would you go with?

Does Thabeet have a lot more potential than this, or is Calhoun maximizing it right now and its pretty much what we see is what we get?
Alan Hahn: Nate Robinson has been on a ridonkulous scoring tear lately (remember when he couldn't hit Jerome James with a Big Mac in early January?)
BRIGGS
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3/28/2009  8:01 PM
Posted by JohnWallace44:

So Briggs, what's your ultimate take on Thabeet? If Derozan, Jennings, and Thabeet are sitting there for us to pick somehow and you can only take one, who would you go with?

Does Thabeet have a lot more potential than this, or is Calhoun maximizing it right now and its pretty much what we see is what we get?

Id like to get Blake Griffin:) If not then guys like evans and derozan. Im not interested in a smallish guard like Jennings.
RIP Crushalot😞
JohnWallace44
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3/28/2009  8:12 PM
so Derozan above Thabeet?

I like Derozan, but I think we have to come out of the draft with either a PG or a Center of the future.
Alan Hahn: Nate Robinson has been on a ridonkulous scoring tear lately (remember when he couldn't hit Jerome James with a Big Mac in early January?)
CrushAlot
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3/29/2009  12:34 AM
Rebuilding teams almost always need a franchise player at the point or at center. The funny thing is that is exactly what was needed last year also and if you look at the talent that was passed over it makes it hard to think that anything rational will be done this year by the Knicks in the draft.
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
JohnWallace44
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3/29/2009  11:05 AM
Posted by CrushAlot:

Rebuilding teams almost always need a franchise player at the point or at center. The funny thing is that is exactly what was needed last year also and if you look at the talent that was passed over it makes it hard to think that anything rational will be done this year by the Knicks in the draft.

I didn't like the Gallo pick then or now, but I can see that they came into a team with no accurate outside shooting and took the most accurate outside shooter in the draft. I can see how you'd come to make that pick.

If Thabeet comes in here he's got to be able to run pick and roll, something that UConn never does with him, but you'd think he could score on easily. Does Calhoun just think that it would be cheating to score so easily? Its really a mystery to me how the team uses him.
Alan Hahn: Nate Robinson has been on a ridonkulous scoring tear lately (remember when he couldn't hit Jerome James with a Big Mac in early January?)
Bippity10
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3/30/2009  1:21 PM
Posted by JohnWallace44:
Posted by CrushAlot:

Rebuilding teams almost always need a franchise player at the point or at center. The funny thing is that is exactly what was needed last year also and if you look at the talent that was passed over it makes it hard to think that anything rational will be done this year by the Knicks in the draft.

I didn't like the Gallo pick then or now, but I can see that they came into a team with no accurate outside shooting and took the most accurate outside shooter in the draft. I can see how you'd come to make that pick.

If Thabeet comes in here he's got to be able to run pick and roll, something that UConn never does with him, but you'd think he could score on easily. Does Calhoun just think that it would be cheating to score so easily? Its really a mystery to me how the team uses him.

It's a combination of things. First of all Thabeet doesn't score as easy as it appears sometimes. He has horrible hands, gets stripped a lot, and is known for regularly getting the ball feet from the basket and not being able to finish. He's the fourth option on offense and rightfully so. How can you argue with this, when the team is now in the final four and lost 4 games all year. He has a ways to go in order to improve his game, but he has come amazingly far in 3 years so who knows where his offensive game will be.

Number 2: I think this set of Uconn guards is the worst in my years of being associated with Uconn, at feeding the post. None of them do it well.

Number 3: Because of his lack of experience Thabeet is not great at establishing position and many times will take himself out of the offense.

Personally I think he's being used properly. I think there are times when there are mismatches and we could target him more, but that's on our PG's to recognize the mismatches and make it occur. As for his role in the offense. Right now he simply isn't a very good post player so he should not be the focus of this offense. As for the pick and roll. It's been a staple in the Calhoun offense since he got to Uconn. They use it against zone and against man to man. Unfortunately our big guys don't run it very well.
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JohnWallace44
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3/30/2009  2:54 PM
Thanks for the response Bip. If that's the case then I guess we shouldn't pick him up. Being limited offensively is one thing, but if he can't roll to the basket and score off of a lob, then we should pass on him. Our center at least has to be able to do that much.
Alan Hahn: Nate Robinson has been on a ridonkulous scoring tear lately (remember when he couldn't hit Jerome James with a Big Mac in early January?)
JamaicanJetFan
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3/30/2009  3:03 PM
Posted by JohnWallace44:

Thanks for the response Bip. If that's the case then I guess we shouldn't pick him up. Being limited offensively is one thing, but if he can't roll to the basket and score off of a lob, then we should pass on him. Our center at least has to be able to do that much.

You speak as if this is not learn-able.
JohnWallace44
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3/30/2009  3:15 PM
Posted by JamaicanJetFan:
Posted by JohnWallace44:

Thanks for the response Bip. If that's the case then I guess we shouldn't pick him up. Being limited offensively is one thing, but if he can't roll to the basket and score off of a lob, then we should pass on him. Our center at least has to be able to do that much.

You speak as if this is not learn-able.

Just looking for UConn fan opinions. I've seen the guy play probably 25 games in his years at UConn, and he's gotten better, but I've never seen a team completely shy away from using a seven footer on offense even to set up other things.

If the guy happens to be available in or around our draft slot, I was wondering if the UConn fans who have seen him for years feel that he could still learn offensive skills, or if he is what he is.

Seems like the answer is that what you see is what you get.
Alan Hahn: Nate Robinson has been on a ridonkulous scoring tear lately (remember when he couldn't hit Jerome James with a Big Mac in early January?)
Bippity10
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3/30/2009  5:00 PM
I think Thabeet has improved more in 3 years than any player I have ever seen. Despite his flaws, his hands have gotten better and he finishes better around the rim. He still obviously has a long way to go. But seeing how much he has improved in 3 years, why can't he improve this much in 3 more? And if he does, he is going to be a very good player. If Dalembert can do it, no reason why Thabeet can't.

If he can become average on offense. Just good enough to rebound and finish he will be a starter for someone for the next 15 years. Watch Uconn. They lead the NCAA in the fewest fouls committed. Why is that? Because Thabeet is so dominant defensively that teams do not go to the basket. They are terrified of him. You can't downplay that. If he was a 30 point per game scorer who played no D we'd be saying how great he is. Well he's as dominant on that side of the ball as any 30 point scorer is on the offensive side. He just has to learn to be average on offense.
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nyk4ever
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3/30/2009  11:01 PM
Posted by Bippity10:

I think Thabeet has improved more in 3 years than any player I have ever seen. Despite his flaws, his hands have gotten better and he finishes better around the rim. He still obviously has a long way to go. But seeing how much he has improved in 3 years, why can't he improve this much in 3 more? And if he does, he is going to be a very good player. If Dalembert can do it, no reason why Thabeet can't.

If he can become average on offense. Just good enough to rebound and finish he will be a starter for someone for the next 15 years. Watch Uconn. They lead the NCAA in the fewest fouls committed. Why is that? Because Thabeet is so dominant defensively that teams do not go to the basket. They are terrified of him. You can't downplay that. If he was a 30 point per game scorer who played no D we'd be saying how great he is. Well he's as dominant on that side of the ball as any 30 point scorer is on the offensive side. He just has to learn to be average on offense.

Bip, I agree abuot Thabeet's progress so far, it's been sensational.

With that said though.. every time I see Thabeet get a rebound or get the ball in the post, he brings the ball down to his waist instead of holding it up high. I've seen Calhoun say numerous times that he drills Thabeet ALL THE TIME and he's still not learning. If he ever wants to move on, this is surely something he needs to work on.
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BRIGGS
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3/31/2009  12:07 AM
I just want him to play 2 hard solid games and stay out of foul trouble. To be honest I could care less about the NBA right now--we have all the marbles on the table and we need Hash to have TWO very BIg games--solid games. I want to see two 16-13-5 games --if he does that--if he does what he is capable of--the rest of the guys can finish it off. We are doing this without our 2 guard and very poor 3 point shooting--this team is the polar opposite of how MDA plays. Yes they try to break when they can--but this team is based on strong defense/rebounding and taking high % shots.
The theory is if you can lock a team down--out rebound them and shoot an efficient FG% you will have a great chance of winning.

MDA's theory is outscoring the other team. But the problem is you need almost perfect type of personnel because you cant fall back on your defense and rebounding to win.
RIP Crushalot😞
JohnWallace44
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3/31/2009  10:12 AM
Briggs, when I see Thabeet and how well he moves at 7'4", I just think that he should be able to throw down lob after lob after lob from Duhon or whoever we have in there, and then get back on defense on the other end, being a deterrent that would allow Chandler, Hughes and Nate to be better perimeter defenders.

The point of this thread though is that he is being completely ignored on offense by a hall of fame coach, so if that's because he can't handle the offense then maybe he's not a player we should try for.

I can't imagine why he can't be utilized more in the offense, but I'm sure Calhoun has tried.
Alan Hahn: Nate Robinson has been on a ridonkulous scoring tear lately (remember when he couldn't hit Jerome James with a Big Mac in early January?)
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3/31/2009  10:24 AM
Posted by BRIGGS:

I just want him to play 2 hard solid games and stay out of foul trouble. To be honest I could care less about the NBA right now--we have all the marbles on the table and we need Hash to have TWO very BIg games--solid games. I want to see two 16-13-5 games --if he does that--if he does what he is capable of--the rest of the guys can finish it off. We are doing this without our 2 guard and very poor 3 point shooting--this team is the polar opposite of how MDA plays. Yes they try to break when they can--but this team is based on strong defense/rebounding and taking high % shots.
The theory is if you can lock a team down--out rebound them and shoot an efficient FG% you will have a great chance of winning.

MDA's theory is outscoring the other team. But the problem is you need almost perfect type of personnel because you cant fall back on your defense and rebounding to win.


Why are you comparing a CBB team to the way MDA's NBA team? So if UCONN wins the Chip, does that in some twisted way justify your theory that MDA's style is not a winning one? If thats the case, what if UNC wins it all. They play an uptempo brand of ball aswell. If they win, does that debunk your ill-fated theory?
BRIGGS
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3/31/2009  10:45 AM
Posted by Uptown:
Posted by BRIGGS:

I just want him to play 2 hard solid games and stay out of foul trouble. To be honest I could care less about the NBA right now--we have all the marbles on the table and we need Hash to have TWO very BIg games--solid games. I want to see two 16-13-5 games --if he does that--if he does what he is capable of--the rest of the guys can finish it off. We are doing this without our 2 guard and very poor 3 point shooting--this team is the polar opposite of how MDA plays. Yes they try to break when they can--but this team is based on strong defense/rebounding and taking high % shots.
The theory is if you can lock a team down--out rebound them and shoot an efficient FG% you will have a great chance of winning.

MDA's theory is outscoring the other team. But the problem is you need almost perfect type of personnel because you cant fall back on your defense and rebounding to win.


Why are you comparing a CBB team to the way MDA's NBA team? So if UCONN wins the Chip, does that in some twisted way justify your theory that MDA's style is not a winning one? If thats the case, what if UNC wins it all. They play an uptempo brand of ball aswell. If they win, does that debunk your ill-fated theory?

I dont care if it's pros CBB etc.. defense and rebounding =rings. If you don't believe me go look up Magic Johnson or Michael Jordan and ask them about it.
RIP Crushalot😞
Allanfan20
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3/31/2009  10:49 AM
Defense, rebounding and solid, smart and timely offense, and not to mention CLUTCH. People always seem to think it's only defense and rebounding, but it's all three. Not only the first two.

[Edited by - Allanfan20 on 31-03-2009 10:50 AM]
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SupremeCommander
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3/31/2009  10:51 AM
He's so good at the college level because he is so much more physically imposing than anyone else in the NCAA. I think he'll be good at the next level, which is why these questions get raised. Having said that, he is dominant at his niche at the college level and teams truly have to alter their approach against UConn. Right now, defensively, Thabeet is a game changer
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