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ar up for grabs! anthony randolph on the block!
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Caseloads
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12/20/2008  8:40 PM
Don nelson via realgm told AR to seek a trade. This guy would fit well here! I'd do gallinari for AR. What or who do you suggest?
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TMS
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12/20/2008  11:42 PM
there's gotta be some severely bad attitude issues there... why else would they wanna get rid of a kid they drafted #14 overall a year after?
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Knicksfan
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12/20/2008  11:45 PM
Posted by TMS:

there's gotta be some severely bad attitude issues there... why else would they wanna get rid of a kid they drafted #14 overall a year after?

Could be, but could also be that Nelson is simply crazy. That we know its true so maybe the kid isn't the problem.


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Allanfan20
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12/20/2008  11:46 PM
Posted by TMS:

there's gotta be some severely bad attitude issues there... why else would they wanna get rid of a kid they drafted #14 overall a year after?

It's called him being 19 years old. They are gonna look real real real stupid at times. Teams relying on skinny 19 year young big men are gonna be dissapointed 9 times out of 10. Teams who phase them in gradually over time, have a higher chance of being happy about their pick.

Don Nelson isn't the most patient of people either, the way I see it. He loves his vets.
“Whenever I’m about to do something, I think ‘Would an idiot do that?’ and if they would, I do NOT do that thing.”- Dwight Schrute
TMS
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12/21/2008  12:00 AM
Posted by Allanfan20:
Posted by TMS:

there's gotta be some severely bad attitude issues there... why else would they wanna get rid of a kid they drafted #14 overall a year after?

It's called him being 19 years old. They are gonna look real real real stupid at times. Teams relying on skinny 19 year young big men are gonna be dissapointed 9 times out of 10. Teams who phase them in gradually over time, have a higher chance of being happy about their pick.

Don Nelson isn't the most patient of people either, the way I see it. He loves his vets.

the Warriors have not been relying on AR at all this season... he's been a spot bit role player all year averaging 13 mpg... if he doesn't have the maturity to deal w/his limited role then why would u guys think he would be any different in the same role here? i don't got anything against AR at all, but u gotta think there's some red flags there if they wanna get rid of him so quickly.
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Allanfan20
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12/21/2008  12:06 AM
Oh I don't disagree with you at all. I'm just saying he's 19 and he might just be overwhelmed. Would it be worse in NY? Probably, but I'd take a risk on him. He's got a LOT of talent.
“Whenever I’m about to do something, I think ‘Would an idiot do that?’ and if they would, I do NOT do that thing.”- Dwight Schrute
TMS
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12/21/2008  12:20 AM
i think a change of coaching approach could definitely help him mature a bit... MDA is all about building up his players & not tearing them down, so if anyone could reach this kid i guess it wouldn't hurt to see if MDA could... personally i'd rather not give up on Gallo so soon tho... kid's got a tremendous attitude from the looks of it & in the short action we've seen so far in Summer Leagues he's got a nice J & has the ability to create his own shot... he's also looking to set up teammates at all times, which i think will translate well to this system... i think we need to give this kid a shot in some real games before we decide to part ways... that's just how i look at it.
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Allanfan20
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12/21/2008  1:14 AM
I never said we had to trade Gallo for him. WOULD I? Yes, in all honesty, I would. have I given up on him? No. I just like AR better.

What do I think it would take to get AR? I would say most likely David Lee. Not sure if I would go that far though. I'd rather get a sure thing for Lee.
“Whenever I’m about to do something, I think ‘Would an idiot do that?’ and if they would, I do NOT do that thing.”- Dwight Schrute
CrushAlot
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12/21/2008  1:20 AM
He is not a Euro so Nelson was probably be against the pick. If he has the influence they are reporting, a Gallo for Randolph trade could probably be done straight up if Golden State agreed to waive the physical.
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TMS
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12/21/2008  1:35 AM
Posted by Allanfan20:

I never said we had to trade Gallo for him. WOULD I? Yes, in all honesty, I would. have I given up on him? No. I just like AR better.

What do I think it would take to get AR? I would say most likely David Lee. Not sure if I would go that far though. I'd rather get a sure thing for Lee.

David Lee? no way dude... only way i'd trade Lee for AR is if they threw in their 1st rounder along w/it... AR is still a completely unproven commodity while D Lee is a guaranteed double double every night & still a young player himself... i MIGHT go for a Wilson Chandler for AR & a 2nd rounder if they wanted to do it only because this team needs a shotblocker in the worst way & that 2nd rounder can be a relatively high pick if GS keeps struggling this season, but definitely not D Lee in a straight up swap... Gallo for AR is a tough call because i think both kids have potential but i would really not like to give up on Gallo before at least seeing what he can do at this level playing in this system.
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12/21/2008  4:05 AM
Posted by TMS:

there's gotta be some severely bad attitude issues there... why else would they wanna get rid of a kid they drafted #14 overall a year after?

Its Nellie. Don also gave up on Chris Webber after about a year and traded him for Tom Gugliatta, or whatever the hell his name is
My saliva and spit can split thread into fiber and bits/ So trust me I'm as live as it gets. --Royce Da 5'9 + DJ Premier = Hip Hop Utopia
Finestrg
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12/21/2008  6:06 AM
Posted by TMS:
Posted by Allanfan20:

I never said we had to trade Gallo for him. WOULD I? Yes, in all honesty, I would. have I given up on him? No. I just like AR better.

What do I think it would take to get AR? I would say most likely David Lee. Not sure if I would go that far though. I'd rather get a sure thing for Lee.

David Lee? no way dude... only way i'd trade Lee for AR is if they threw in their 1st rounder along w/it... AR is still a completely unproven commodity while D Lee is a guaranteed double double every night & still a young player himself... i MIGHT go for a Wilson Chandler for AR & a 2nd rounder if they wanted to do it only because this team needs a shotblocker in the worst way & that 2nd rounder can be a relatively high pick if GS keeps struggling this season, but definitely not D Lee in a straight up swap... Gallo for AR is a tough call because i think both kids have potential but i would really not like to give up on Gallo before at least seeing what he can do at this level playing in this system.

I think you got something here. I like the idea of trying to get Golden State's 2nd rounder. I totally agree with you - you can get a player at that spot.

How about something like this:

David Lee and Roberson for Marcus Williams, Marco Belinelli and their 2009 2nd rounder. Maybe we don't look to get too greedy here by asking for Anthony Randolph and their 1st rounder - maybe that scares them off. I think this would be a fair trade. Essentially we get a brand new young backcourt for the future - we're gonna NEED a PG for the future and a 2-guard as well. Williams hasn't done much and wouldn't command too much money to reup (even if we had to reup this kid in the $3 mil. per range, that's over 100% more than what he's getting now - $1.2 million) but he's young and a good passer that can shoot the 3 as well and with increased PT, Belinelli's really coming on strong now as a shooter/scorer. Still want Randolph? Then you go all in by throwing them Chandler for Randolph. Both trades were successful with the trade checker over at Realgm.com btw. That could work. It's obvious Don Nelson doesn't like or appreciate Williams, Belinelli or now even Randolph - I would think all three would come in here and fill some gapping holes. Odds are these guys would excel under MDA & be the cost-effective, salary-controlled guys we're looking to re-load with w/o interfering too much with our 2010 cap plan.

Then we use our 2009 1st to draft Cole Aldrich and the 2nd rounder we just acquired to grab Taj Gibson. Brand new frontcourt right there. So not even counting Randolph (who we could get by sweetening the deal by including Chandler) we could potentially add 4 really nice players here:

Marcus Williams
Marco Belinelli
Cole Aldrich
Taj Gibson

AND possibly Anthony Randolph if we had to have him by included Wilson Chandler

Brand new dynamic frontline with enough talent left over to cover the 3 (Gallinari, with Harrington and Q still in the mix for next year) AND a brand new talented backcourt for the future. Aldrich looks to be a legit center that will contribute in the NBA, Gibby's had a fine season so far and would come in here and more than cover for the departed David Lee (Taj just had 10 pts., 18 rebs. & 3 blocks in a USC win yesterday) and like I said, Williams is capable of running the show and scoring and Belinelli is really starting to contribute with additional PT. Nelson gets to clear guys out that he's obvious not satisfied with and gets a guy in Lee that's coveted around the league right now and that they could definitely use. Nelson also gets to decide if he wants Wilson Chandler over Randolph. I'd do both trades if I'm the Knicks - they're not gonna get anything better for David Lee IMHO. Hopefully that might be enough positive turnover to lure a LeBron in 2010 or at least appear to be a step in the right direction...


[Edited by - finestrg on 12-21-2008 06:31 AM]
Knicksfansince94
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12/21/2008  6:18 AM
I wouldn't give up Gallo for him.

But Lee, yea, in some type of combination.

Randolph is averaging 6/4/ and a block in just 13 minutes and he's 19. I don't think we have anyone averaging a block in 30 minutes.

This kid is going to be a great basketball player. As far as Nelson wanting to get rid of him, Nelson is crazy; there's not much more to it.

[Edited by - knicksfansince94 on 12-21-2008 06:18 AM]
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Ira
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12/21/2008  7:15 AM
He's done very well in some ways, but it's hard to see where to play him. He doesn't have a good enough shot to play small forward and he'll get physically abused at power forward. If AR can either learn to hit a 3 or find a way to put on weight, he'll have a very nice career. But each of those things seem like major issues for him.
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12/21/2008  7:21 AM
He'll beef up, man, it's not hard to do. He might be a little bit of a project, I guess, but it's a project worth taking up at this point for the Knicks. By 2010, he can be a good contributor. And our leading blocker averages .9 in 33 minutes. I think that D'Antoni can find a way to play him somewhere, if only for 13 minutes. But what do we replace Lee with if he goes?
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Ira
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12/21/2008  7:35 AM
Posted by Knicksfansince94:

He'll beef up, man, it's not hard to do. He might be a little bit of a project, I guess, but it's a project worth taking up at this point for the Knicks. By 2010, he can be a good contributor. And our leading blocker averages .9 in 33 minutes. I think that D'Antoni can find a way to play him somewhere, if only for 13 minutes. But what do we replace Lee with if he goes?

It's not hard for me to put on weight - just the opposite. That's the way it is for most people. But some people just can't do it. Everyone's different. I'm sure AR has been doing everything he can to put on weight and he hasn't made much progress. So I'm very skeptical on that issue.

I'm not completely down on the guy. To the contrary, he's done some things very well - much better than I expected. He's boarded well, he blocks some shots and seems to have a good first step for a guy his size. I think his chances of developing a jump shot and becoming a three are much better than his chances of putting enough weight to play the four.
Knicksfansince94
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12/21/2008  7:42 AM
All people can put on weight, man. You just have to take in more calories than you expend. I don't think that he has been trying, because he would have packed something on by now. Also, it's hard to do during the season because you've got to play and run and practice, all high calorie burning things. He needs a dedicated weight gain program, like in the off season, and it will happen. It wouldn't be crazy to see a 15 pound gain on him next summer.

And the jumper and stuff, as you say, can be done no problem.

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TMS
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12/21/2008  8:06 AM
putting on weight is not that easy for everyone... take it from me, i've had an extremely high metabolism my whole life & taking weight gaining supplements like high calorie protein shakes mixed w/creatine while working out regularly doesn't do much for me at all... the most i've ever been able to gain is 15 lbs. in a 6 month period & that was all water weight pretty much that quickly dissipated in the span of a few days after slowing down my workout regimen... i dunno how dedicated AR is to putting on mass or not but if it was so easy to do it guys like Tayshaun Prince & Allen Iverson would all look like Dwight Howard right about now.
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TMS
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12/21/2008  8:14 AM
Posted by Finestrg:
Posted by TMS:
Posted by Allanfan20:

I never said we had to trade Gallo for him. WOULD I? Yes, in all honesty, I would. have I given up on him? No. I just like AR better.

What do I think it would take to get AR? I would say most likely David Lee. Not sure if I would go that far though. I'd rather get a sure thing for Lee.

David Lee? no way dude... only way i'd trade Lee for AR is if they threw in their 1st rounder along w/it... AR is still a completely unproven commodity while D Lee is a guaranteed double double every night & still a young player himself... i MIGHT go for a Wilson Chandler for AR & a 2nd rounder if they wanted to do it only because this team needs a shotblocker in the worst way & that 2nd rounder can be a relatively high pick if GS keeps struggling this season, but definitely not D Lee in a straight up swap... Gallo for AR is a tough call because i think both kids have potential but i would really not like to give up on Gallo before at least seeing what he can do at this level playing in this system.

I think you got something here. I like the idea of trying to get Golden State's 2nd rounder. I totally agree with you - you can get a player at that spot.

How about something like this:

David Lee and Roberson for Marcus Williams, Marco Belinelli and their 2009 2nd rounder. Maybe we don't look to get too greedy here by asking for Anthony Randolph and their 1st rounder - maybe that scares them off. I think this would be a fair trade. Essentially we get a brand new young backcourt for the future - we're gonna NEED a PG for the future and a 2-guard as well. Williams hasn't done much and wouldn't command too much money to reup (even if we had to reup this kid in the $3 mil. per range, that's over 100% more than what he's getting now - $1.2 million) but he's young and a good passer that can shoot the 3 as well and with increased PT, Belinelli's really coming on strong now as a shooter/scorer. Still want Randolph? Then you go all in by throwing them Chandler for Randolph. Both trades were successful with the trade checker over at Realgm.com btw. That could work. It's obvious Don Nelson doesn't like or appreciate Williams, Belinelli or now even Randolph - I would think all three would come in here and fill some gapping holes. Odds are these guys would excel under MDA & be the cost-effective, salary-controlled guys we're looking to re-load with w/o interfering too much with our 2010 cap plan.

Then we use our 2009 1st to draft Cole Aldrich and the 2nd rounder we just acquired to grab Taj Gibson. Brand new frontcourt right there. So not even counting Randolph (who we could get by sweetening the deal by including Chandler) we could potentially add 4 really nice players here:

Marcus Williams
Marco Belinelli
Cole Aldrich
Taj Gibson

AND possibly Anthony Randolph if we had to have him by included Wilson Chandler

Brand new dynamic frontline with enough talent left over to cover the 3 (Gallinari, with Harrington and Q still in the mix for next year) AND a brand new talented backcourt for the future. Aldrich looks to be a legit center that will contribute in the NBA, Gibby's had a fine season so far and would come in here and more than cover for the departed David Lee (Taj just had 10 pts., 18 rebs. & 3 blocks in a USC win yesterday) and like I said, Williams is capable of running the show and scoring and Belinelli is really starting to contribute with additional PT. Nelson gets to clear guys out that he's obvious not satisfied with and gets a guy in Lee that's coveted around the league right now and that they could definitely use. Nelson also gets to decide if he wants Wilson Chandler over Randolph. I'd do both trades if I'm the Knicks - they're not gonna get anything better for David Lee IMHO. Hopefully that might be enough positive turnover to lure a LeBron in 2010 or at least appear to be a step in the right direction...


[Edited by - finestrg on 12-21-2008 06:31 AM]

i do like Marco Bellinelli for this system & i think he'd be a nice fit... if we could get AR & the paisan for Wilson Chandler i'd probably do it, but Chandler's doing a fine job so far so why should we look to give up on him now? why do we as Knick fans always covet unproven players on other teams so much more than players that are putting up better stats on our own? it's puzzling to me... i have zero interest in Marcus Williams, the guy hasn't been able to prove himself anywhere since he's been in the NBA... maybe he just isn't all that good to begin with? plenty of players have looked great in the college ranks & haven't lived up to their hype at the pro level... in my mind Marcus Williams isn't worth giving up anything more than a 2nd round pick at this point.
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Knicksfansince94
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12/21/2008  8:27 AM
Posted by TMS:

putting on weight is not that easy for everyone... take it from me, i've had an extremely high metabolism my whole life & taking weight gaining supplements like high calorie protein shakes mixed w/creatine while working out regularly doesn't do much for me at all... the most i've ever been able to gain is 15 lbs. in a 6 month period & that was all water weight pretty much that quickly dissipated in the span of a few days after slowing down my workout regimen... i dunno how dedicated AR is to putting on mass or not but if it was so easy to do it guys like Tayshaun Prince & Allen Iverson would all look like Dwight Howard right about now.

you didn't do it right. i am a hard gainer too but if you stick to a plan, it works.

tayshaun and allen don't need to gain weight. as long as you're happy/doing good, it's not necessary. AR probably should because of his lack of skill set and everyone's desire to play as a pf.
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ar up for grabs! anthony randolph on the block!
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