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Why the United States Can't Leave Iraq
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playa2
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5/9/2008  10:37 PM
Too much money has been pumped for the war in Iraq. If the US people chooses the new president who supported to continue in the war, then US is going to face devastation. With too much Dollars printed, the value of dollars will be just like a piece of blank papers. It has been five years the war is still happening, but the arrogant, ignorance, boastful & a great liar President Bush still says that the war in Iraq is a victory. A war cannot be regarded as victory if US is still sending more troops there. A victory means there is complete withdrawal of US troops & the administration of Iraq had been handed over to the Iraqi people. By now Iraq should had been a peaceful place while rebuilding of infrastructures are happening throughout Iraq. But after five years situation in Iraq are still not secured.
JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
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playa2
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5/10/2008  5:07 PM

America through their greedy, out of control, capitalist system has cut it's own throat .

The Arab countries have only to wait while US bleeds herself to death.an What we are witnessing are the wealthy land grabbers, power hungry corporations and wealth hording top two percent that have destroyed and made a mockery of the free enterprise system where all americans are supposed to benefit.

When is enough, enough for them. The politicians, special interest lobbyists and unconscientious corporations in their stupidness have destroyed America.

Now these same groups are deserting the US for more lucrative opportunities where they can monopolise industry and wreck havoc eventually. The american people have not had the ability to see through the deceptive political leadership in the past,hopefully they can salvage what's left of an insolvent financial system by electing Honest, Just, Sincere and Dedicated Humanitarians to critical areas of government.
JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
Nalod
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5/11/2008  10:54 PM
Playa be cutting and pasteing the hate.
playa2
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5/12/2008  7:19 AM
http://www.aljazeera.com/news/newsfull.php?newid=106992

This is where you hear from people all over the world and how they view america and it's goverment and policy.


Thank me later, get informed stop letting cnn, fox teach you their propaganda drama .
JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
Nalod
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5/13/2008  12:25 AM
Getting unbias reporting from Aljazeera?

that's a joke, right?
playa2
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5/13/2008  6:23 AM
Read the forum on the bottom of the page, these are people posting from the united states and all over the world. Get a clue!
JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
Solace
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5/13/2008  8:37 AM
Posted by Nalod:

Getting unbias reporting from Aljazeera?

that's a joke, right?

LOL. That is hilarious.
Wishing everyone well. I enjoyed posting here for a while, but as I matured I realized this forum isn't for me. We all evolve. Thanks for the memories everyone.
playa2
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5/13/2008  8:59 AM
Nalon is showing his ignorance on how the rest of the world outside of Iraq and Iran view us.

Even american soldiers post there:

Matt from USA 20/04/2008 10:22:34 PM IP


We too
Christopher King's article expertly discusses the heart breaking situation in Iraq. I spent fourteen months stationed there in the United States Air Force. Bush and his friends have also crippled America. You would not believe the number of American families living in over crowded homeless shelters or the number of people living in tents wherever they can find a place. Of course you know our economy has been shattered as well as Constitutional rights and conservation laws. The only ones prospering are those connected with the war machine and homeland security. Hopefully this situation will be corrected with this falls elections.


Nalod thinks listening to fox in bang on.

[Edited by - playa2 on 13-05-2008 09:02]
JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
playa2
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5/13/2008  9:19 AM
Bush will not be held accountable for his actions and even if he were, it would not stop his self-righteousness.


Bush is a neo-conservative follower who most likely believes a majority of what he's saying.

That is what most scares me and should most scare the American people.

Someone commented on "isn't it obvious by now that he committed crimes," the answer is no. It's not obvious.

Almost all international publications offer more information on Americans and what is done on their behalf than America does.

In some cases its chosen ignorance; it is simpler not to know. Other times it's forced ignorance; the information is hidden and covered up by major media outlets.

Most American's have a warped understanding of the Middle East, particularly Palestine and Israel.

As an American I'd like to apologize. But where would I begin? I'm sorry.

Kristina from USA


JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
nykshaknbake
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5/18/2008  11:52 AM
http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=609

These evil things that we must be aware that our gov't is doing
Nalod
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5/18/2008  3:47 PM
Playa, this is a big discussion.

I don't believe everything I read. Comments from Kooks are not always valid. I think the worst conservative bull crap I have read comes form local editorials. These would be bush supporters.

I can't really argue all points but please understand I vote democratic about 80% of the time and think Fox and CNN are both crap. I personally like the BBC. Aljazzer is fiction.

I also believe that we are not perfect and fail at times. I also could care less about what other people think about the US. I have traveled a lot and many seem fine towards americans. Are traveling americans often obnoxious, sure they are. But not all are. Does a socialist left struggling waiter in Paris who has contempt for the US matter? No.

The US is often open for critique and thats fine. Its not a popularity contest.

US serviceman abroad I hold in the highest esteem but here is another point, and your not gonna like it: They are a voluntary force who I be is pissed off cuz many did not really think they would have to fight a war. Not lets be clear, just cuz you enlisted and are deployed make yoru comments really that rightous. Why do many join the Forces? Education, money, get out of the city, a better opportunity than NOT going to college. Im down with that, and war sucks. So I bet there are many many soldiers who don't want to be there. I have my respect, but their opinion is just that, not the truth.

The truth is somting you seek and its not absolute. The truth to me is knowing the world is a mean and dark place at times and fairness is not always gonna happen.

Weather machines? Why not just have native americans do a "Rain dance!"
Silverfuel
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5/18/2008  4:32 PM
Posted by Nalod:

So I bet there are many many soldiers who don't want to be there. I have my respect, but their opinion is just that, not the truth.
Their opinion is going to be a lot closer to the truth than anyone else though wouldn't it? It has more weight and that is all playa uses their opinion as.
A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.
Nalod
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5/18/2008  9:43 PM
ITs a perspective that is very important. No doubt, but they are also getting screwed over and don't fully understand the full scope of what is going on. Im sure they feel they are not gettting all the support they can get, nor do they get all the geo/political ramifications of both the present day, and from a historical perspective.

They are soldiers who are trained to win a war and perhaps that is very frustrating to them.

But Soldiers are not suppose to ask, just perform. That ain't always right, but its the way it is. Those commercials the services run for recruitment sure do glamorize some things.

The services are a good deal for some. I just think that not everyone realizes that part of the job also means getting into a conflict and all the not so cool things that come with it.

WW2 was very unpopular conflict that we did not want to be involved in until the Japanese did Pearl Harbor and then our population was outraged and it became a nationalistic furvor to enlist and kick ass!

Im afraid we'll experience some motivation event soon if we keep whining about our involvement. Some evil **** out there folks.
Nalod
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5/18/2008  10:03 PM
ITs a perspective that is very important. No doubt, but they are also getting screwed over and don't fully understand the full scope of what is going on. In fact, I think most of us sure as hell don't either!

Im sure they feel they are not gettting all the support they can get, nor do they get all the geo/political ramifications of both the present day, and from a historical perspective.

They are soldiers who are trained to win a war and perhaps that is very frustrating to them.

But Soldiers are not suppose to ask, just perform. That ain't always right, but its the way it is. Those commercials the services run for recruitment sure do glamorize some things.

The services are a good deal for some. I just think that not everyone realizes that part of the job also means getting into a conflict and all the not so cool things that come with it.

WW2 was very unpopular conflict that we did not want to be involved in until the Japanese did Pearl Harbor and then our population was outraged and it became a nationalistic furvor to enlist and kick ass!

Im afraid we'll experience some motivation event soon if we keep whining about our involvement. Some evil **** out there folks.

All I know is the Middle east has been screwed up for thousands of years and the inherent problems still exist as they did in biblical times. To blame even the last 50 years of mismanagement thinking it could have been resolved otherwise is very naive. All we do is keep moving things along and maybe one day we can avoid the "final conflict"j.

What is really scarey is for those thousands of years one army could just beat another and then inhabit the land and rule. but with weapons of mass destruction the point of no return exists once they use them.

Do we finish the job once and for all or wait until they get the "technology" to do us first? Does anyone believe they would not nuke Isreal? Does anyone really think that is tolerable? And Isreal retaliates? 10's of million would die?

In the context of things, we do some pretty ugly things but nothing we have done even comes close to that scenario.

but to do a preemptive strike seems all so wrong to many and makes us seem like the agressor.

They build a nuke plant, tell everyone they want to phuch up Isreal and we suppose to sit back and worry what other people think? The same aszholes that appeased hitler and stalin and let them Sh!it all over them months later?

Get used to it, somthing bad will happen and then we'll have the rightous cause to phuch them up and justify it. Don't worry, Bush is an azzhole but this mess is not his fault. He just can't sell it to the american public.

I'd be more worried when China wants Mongolia back and Putin and his band of sh!t head corrupt generals can't do squat about it. We'll jump in the back door and clean up the middle east mess and let them duke it out until the Chinese need some technology to pump the oil out. China needs to thin its poplulation out every 50-70 years out anyway!

I know, thats rude, but thats history man, just history. I don't make history up. Send some OJ killiung MOfos to slice and dice and we could avoid this crap all together.

Phuch Paul Pierce and his act. Damm I was pulling for Lebron!
Silverfuel
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5/18/2008  10:10 PM
Posted by Nalod:

ITs a perspective that is very important. No doubt, but they are also getting screwed over and don't fully understand the full scope of what is going on. Im sure they feel they are not gettting all the support they can get, nor do they get all the geo/political ramifications of both the present day, and from a historical perspective.

They are soldiers who are trained to win a war and perhaps that is very frustrating to them.
If it was just one or two soldiers saying it, I wouldn't pay attention. Hell, if it was 10 or 20 soldiers saying it, we would still dismiss it. If it was just Al Jazeera articles, we would never even bother about it. The situation in Iraq, as playa is presenting it is in this thread however is what everyone agrees with. The Europeans, the Asians, the Middle east, the South Americans, the Canadians and now more than 50% Americans. Playa brings up the soldiers posts because they are in keeping with 100% of all others. I personally think the soldiers posts are a lot more significant than just opinions and perspective. They add a dimension to the truth that we would never have.
But Soldiers are not suppose to ask, just perform.
I dunno Nalod. Ever since I was a kid, I was told the guards at the gas chambers in Nazi Germany were wrong for not asking questions. That Milgrim experiment is supposed to teach us to always ask questions. I remember going to high school with more than one soldier in the US military and we were in the same class when they taught us that so I disagree with what you are saying there. No matter how much you try to brainwash someone into doing whatever they are ordered, if the kids are raised well, they will never just stand by and be a part of senseless tyranny. Ask a soldier, any soldier if you want. Ask them if they will just follow an order to commit a crime.
The services are a good deal for some. I just think that not everyone realizes that part of the job also means getting into a conflict and all the not so cool things that come with it.

WW2 was very unpopular conflict that we did not want to be involved in until the Japanese did Pearl Harbor and then our population was outraged and it became a nationalistic furvor to enlist and kick ass!
I think you are trivializing the role. The service is never supposed to be a good or a bad deal. You go into an army to fight for freedom. This war is being fought to further someone's political career and to make some other money. Why would anyway want to risk their lives for that? It has nothing to do with going to war. If there was a threat to the US from an invading force, people would line up at recruiting stations to get a gun and fight. In this case, they see through the bs and do not want to fight for a oil pipeline that makes Bush and Halliburton more money. I disgaree with you Nalod. I think we should read the Al Jazeera article, the soldiers post and consider what they are saying. Just dismissing it wouldn't be fair. But thats just my opinion. That al-jazeera article is in keeping with what many on this forum believe. I also applaud the soldiers for having the courage for speaking out against this mess.

BTW, do you know that the US Generals have threatened to quit if Bush orders Iraq war? That is proof right there that soldiers aren't just supposed to perform or follow orders.
A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.
Silverfuel
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5/18/2008  10:19 PM
You added to your post later so I am commenting on this part separately.
Posted by Nalod:

All I know is the Middle east has been screwed up for thousands of years and the inherent problems still exist as they did in biblical times. To blame even the last 50 years of mismanagement thinking it could have been resolved otherwise is very naive. All we do is keep moving things along and maybe one day we can avoid the "final conflict"j.
If it has been screwed up for 1000+ years, why are we getting involved with trying to fix it?
What is really scarey is for those thousands of years one army could just beat another and then inhabit the land and rule. but with weapons of mass destruction the point of no return exists once they use them.
That evidence was made up. They never had them.
Do we finish the job once and for all or wait until they get the "technology" to do us first? Does anyone believe they would not nuke Isreal? Does anyone really think that is tolerable? And Isreal retaliates? 10's of million would die?
1) Israel can take care of themselves. Trust me, the Iraq war has to do with OIL!
2) What is the alternative? Certainly not the Iraq war right?
In the context of things, we do some pretty ugly things but nothing we have done even comes close to that scenario.

but to do a preemptive strike seems all so wrong to many and makes us seem like the agressor.

They build a nuke plant, tell everyone they want to phuch up Isreal and we suppose to sit back and worry what other people think? The same aszholes that appeased hitler and stalin and let them Sh!it all over them months later?

Get used to it, somthing bad will happen and then we'll have the rightous cause to phuch them up and justify it. Don't worry, Bush is an azzhole but this mess is not his fault. He just can't sell it to the american public.
I don't believe that for one second. And please dont tell me American soldiers are dieing so that Israel can stay safe. Israel is more than capable beating all Arab nations down. Bush is an azzhole because it started this war out of greed. This has never been about Israel. He will fight Iran because they are selling OIL in all currencies except the $. He has also already admitted there is no evidence of nukes in Iran.

It is easy to say lets go to war to safeguard Israel when we don't have to fight in a war.
I'd be more worried when China wants Mongolia back and Putin and his band of sh!t head corrupt generals can't do squat about it. We'll jump in the back door and clean up the middle east mess and let them duke it out until the Chinese need some technology to pump the oil out. China needs to thin its poplulation out every 50-70 years out anyway!

I know, thats rude, but thats history man, just history. I don't make history up. Send some OJ killiung MOfos to slice and dice and we could avoid this crap all together.

Phuch Paul Pierce and his act. Damm I was pulling for Lebron!
I don't know what you meant by anything in the last two paragraphs so I will leave it alone.
A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.
Nalod
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5/18/2008  11:59 PM
I think I really was speaking about a nuclear capable IRAN not weapons of mass destruction in Iraq.

Isreal can b1tchslap any country there, but the doctrine of instigation that any attack by isreal, even in defense is considered an act of aggression that could unite the arab world against them. They will keep trying.

Arab blood is thicker than right or wrong.

Silverfuel
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5/19/2008  4:49 AM
Posted by Nalod:

I think I really was speaking about a nuclear capable IRAN not weapons of mass destruction in Iraq.
Iran doesn't have any WMD's, they are making it up! They did it with Iraq and now they are dong it with Iran. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice ....?
A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.
Nalod
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5/19/2008  9:12 AM
Posted by Silverfuel:
Posted by Nalod:

I think I really was speaking about a nuclear capable IRAN not weapons of mass destruction in Iraq.
Iran doesn't have any WMD's, they are making it up! They did it with Iraq and now they are dong it with Iran. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice ....?


So those contracts with Russia and France to construct are also fake?

Irans public statement that they will build it and nuke Isreal are also fabricated and not denied by the fundamental Iranian state?

Speaking of Iraq again, if there were not WMD found then the UN would have released oil export sanctions and allowed massive cash flow for Iraq.

Think Saddam would have afforded to rearm the regime again? ANd again, he told of his dream that he would be the one to remove Isreal from the planet.

Bush did a botch job of selling it and the PR on the Iraqi excursion is pretty bad.

The big picture is the Saudi's are holding a massive amount of US dollars and demand our inclusion to protect them and their oil kingdom. We in turn don't mind this because if the citizens of Saudi Arabia over took them and nationalized the oil fields two things would happen.

One is massive corruption of another level with a disorganized state trying to figure things out and opening up to civil war where the fundamentalists (Talaban)would fight tooth and nail for the opportunity to gain cash flow and beat down women.

The second and more unlikely scenario is an organized regime does evolve and distributes the wealth amung the people. At some point a middle class would evolve that builds schools, industry and health care with the money. But that leaves them kind of "Soft" against a "Jahad" that would look to set things right again by beating down the intelects, burn books, and put women back in the dark ages.

In either event the ecnomic funds to build WMD and kill the infidels is always present. Its just the way they want things.

So when do we draw the line? When does just laying back and doing nothing work when you have an openly hostile fundamental movement.

Iran is the breeding ground for Hezebellah. Those ****aroaches have infected Lebanon and their goal is not to protect or stabilize that country, but to beat down Isreal.
Silverfuel
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5/19/2008  11:12 AM
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/ARTICLE5/index.html

FAKE TERROR -
THE ROAD TO WAR AND DICTATORSHIP


It's the oldest trick in the book, dating back to Roman times; creating the enemies you need.

A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.
Why the United States Can't Leave Iraq

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