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Your patience time frame with Walsh?
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Cosmic
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Remember, the team is in a very bad situation, it could conceivably take two to three years to become a solid team once again. There's the off chance that a quick fix trade might return us to respectability (such as .500 and a playoff birth) as well but I wouldn't count on that personally. So, the question begs, how much time do you give Walsh to not just implement a plan of change but --- for you to have to SEE tangible results - even if those results are a well laid out plan that's full steam ahead? (meaning, we might be mediocre, but you can see the progress and see the finished product on the horizon). Also take note, choices 2, 3, 4 are predicated on the idea that we have talent and just need to re-work the roster. Choices 5, 6, 7, 8 are predicated on the idea we have to tear it down and rebuild --- so of course your patience will stretch far into the future given how long it will take to do that.
I already hate him, Fire Don-nie *clap* *clap *clap-clap-clap*
Just the Summer, we have talent, make it work over night!
Feb 2009 Deadline, we have talent, by then it should be revamped!
One Season, we have talent, November 2009 we should be a +.500 team.
18 Months - We're rebuilding, by Feb 2010 I want to see a plan unfolding rapidly.
2 Years - We're rebuilding, this takes time, by November 2010 we should be good!
2.5 Years - Rebuilding, by Feb 2011 we're adding those final touches.
3 Years - the 2011-2012 season is the season of dreams!
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franco12
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4/9/2008  6:19 PM
I think its going to take 3 years to undo the damage Isiah & Dolan did. Our lotto pick in 2010 isn't ours - Isiah traded about all of our second rounders away.

I'd like to see an energitic, team oriented young team next year finish with a very similar record, but without all the divas (though I expect Zach the Anchor to be here).

Add another pick, and we might have the start of a foundation.

But 3-5 years is what I think it will take to correct Isiah's mistakes and put us on a more solid footing/course.
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TMS
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4/9/2008  6:38 PM
i want to see a real plan in place by year 1... no more of leeway for nonsensical roster moves for me... it might be unfair but i've had enough of the waiting... i don't expect to see tangible results in terms of wins & losses for at least another 3 years, but in the meantime i wanna start seeing him implement a real plan to rebuild this franchise that makes sense & start targetting players that add overall team balance to this roster instead of more redundancy & years to the already crapped out cap.
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crzymdups
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4/9/2008  6:44 PM
yeah, if it's clear he has a plan, I'll grant him all the time he needs to implement it. if, like Isiah, the plan starts changing left and right, I'll just throw up my hands and be a portland fan next season.
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GKFv2
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4/9/2008  6:57 PM
If Isiah is still here (especially as coach) by the draft, I have 0 patience for him.
Thank you, Rick Brunson.
tkf
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4/9/2008  7:19 PM
sometimes GM's fail or don't succeed to the level we expect, I look at west in memphis, he didn't do great, but he didn't do bad. So even if walsh does just an adequate job, I can live with that. As long as he doesn't destroy the franchise and make it a laughing stock, with unloadable contracts and malcontent, lazy players...
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
loweyecue
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4/9/2008  9:02 PM
I dont care if it takes 3 years or more, I just want to see him make the right decisions. I want to see what types of trades he makes, how he uses draft picks and how well he communicates a long term plan as well as his overall vision. I'll give him as long as 5 years but I want to see serious measurable rogress throughout those 5 years. I am going to withold my judgemet on how good he is/is not till I have seen what he brings to the table in ACTION.
TKF on Melo ::....he is a punk, a jerk, a self absorbed out of shape, self aggrandizing, unprofessional, volume chucking coach killing playoff loser!!
misterearl
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4/9/2008  10:03 PM
Executive Transition

loweyecue - in 5 years Donnie Walsh will be 73 years old and retired. Forget the players, the most critical "right" decision will be the person he decides to groom as his heir to the throne in 3 years.

I don't forsee Donnie Walsh in office past the 2010-11 season.
once a knick always a knick
nyk4ever
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4/9/2008  10:45 PM
Posted by TMS:

i want to see a real plan in place by year 1... no more of leeway for nonsensical roster moves for me... it might be unfair but i've had enough of the waiting... i don't expect to see tangible results in terms of wins & losses for at least another 3 years, but in the meantime i wanna start seeing him implement a real plan to rebuild this franchise that makes sense & start targetting players that add overall team balance to this roster instead of more redundancy & years to the already crapped out cap.

Good post. I agree my man.
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
4949
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4/9/2008  11:51 PM
You give him the full time. Obviously, anyone' would need at least three years to start turning things around.

But he has got to make moves that make sense to an overall plan, on the way there. He's got to keep it consistent. The first few dumb moves (if any) will be a sign of more misery. We just gotta wait and see.
I'll never trust this' team again.
TrueBlue
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4/10/2008  12:28 AM
Posted by TMS:

i want to see a real plan in place by year 1... no more of leeway for nonsensical roster moves for me... it might be unfair but i've had enough of the waiting... i don't expect to see tangible results in terms of wins & losses for at least another 3 years, but in the meantime i wanna start seeing him implement a real plan to rebuild this franchise that makes sense & start targetting players that add overall team balance to this roster instead of more redundancy & years to the already crapped out cap.

Ditto he gets 3 yrs from me but it should be clear what he's trying to do at then end of yr 1.
LMFAO @ the Bio [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephon_Marbury[/url]
Cosmic
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4/11/2008  4:41 PM
A lot of interesting posts in here. I'm actually surprised and relieved to see so many willing to give him at least 3 years.

Personally after 18 months time I want to see a plan unfolding and that plan needs to make sense to me as a fan by then.

That's when I can then feel that maybe another 18 months on the job would yield results.


I think Walsh said something interesting when he said that he wants to preserve the chance to be under the cap in the summer of 2010 - YET - in the mean time he would attempt to improve the current team - without jeopardizing that Summer 2010 cap target.

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TrueBlue
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4/11/2008  4:44 PM
Posted by Cosmic:

A lot of interesting posts in here. I'm actually surprised and relieved to see so many willing to give him at least 3 years.

Personally after 18 months time I want to see a plan unfolding and that plan needs to make sense to me as a fan by then.

That's when I can then feel that maybe another 18 months on the job would yield results.


I think Walsh said something interesting when he said that he wants to preserve the chance to be under the cap in the summer of 2010 - YET - in the mean time he would attempt to improve the current team - without jeopardizing that Summer 2010 cap target.


Which could very well mean he'll increase the payroll the next 2yrs to get the flexibility 3yrs from now. Don't be surprised to see the numbers increase.
LMFAO @ the Bio [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephon_Marbury[/url]
Cosmic
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4/11/2008  4:48 PM
Posted by TrueBlue:



Which could very well mean he'll increase the payroll the next 2yrs to get the flexibility 3yrs from now. Don't be surprised to see the numbers increase.


As long as anything coming back expires in 2010 I'd have no problem with him making any trades to try to improve the team.

If he moved Malik and Marbury's 09 expirings for players that expire in 2010 - and remains committed to 2010? Then I don't have a problem with it.

We obviously cannot get under in 2009 so 2010 is the next realistic year. If while targeting that year - he also tries to improve us in the short term? I guess other than wondering about the 2009 draft I wouldn't worry one way or another.

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4949
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4/11/2008  7:23 PM
Posted by Cosmic:
Posted by TrueBlue:



Which could very well mean he'll increase the payroll the next 2yrs to get the flexibility 3yrs from now. Don't be surprised to see the numbers increase.


As long as anything coming back expires in 2010 I'd have no problem with him making any trades to try to improve the team.

If he moved Malik and Marbury's 09 expirings for players that expire in 2010 - and remains committed to 2010? Then I don't have a problem with it.

We obviously cannot get under in 2009 so 2010 is the next realistic year. If while targeting that year - he also tries to improve us in the short term? I guess other than wondering about the 2009 draft I wouldn't worry one way or another.

It was pointed out to me that he is only the president. What I don't get (at this point) is how's he going to make deals, if he has no GM position or even a GM?

I was under the assumption that he was automatically President-GM, like isiah was. Is being president and GM the same thing? Somebody straighten me out on this.
I'll never trust this' team again.
Cosmic
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4/11/2008  7:30 PM
Posted by 4949:





It was pointed out to me that he is only the president. What I don't get (at this point) is how's he going to make deals, if he has no GM position or even a GM?

I was under the assumption that he was automatically President-GM, like isiah was. Is being president and GM the same thing? Somebody straighten me out on this.

No, you're correct, as far as we know his present title is

President, Basketball Operations.

Isiah Thomas is still officially both General Manager and Coach. That...is likely to change.



While I think Walsh will eventually hire a General Manager in Isiah's place make no mistake about it: Walsh will be hands on in deal making.

I don't think he's here just to clean up the managerial side of things and then just be here to OK moves by the future GM.


Yet, you're right, talking about "Walsh making trades" is really just an assumption and not of fact until the management structure is laid in place by he himself.
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4949
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4/11/2008  7:59 PM
Okay, thanks. So he's the 'acting GM' until he actually gets one. Even if it means him making the pick in the draft himself as President. I'll take as that.
I'll never trust this' team again.
BigC
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4/11/2008  8:20 PM
I would give him about 2, maybe 2 and a half years. The Knicks have this year'ss draft pick and next year's draft pick. Lets not forget they also will players come off the books. So why should I not expect Walsh to improve the team in 2 years.
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4949
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4/11/2008  8:50 PM
Posted by BigC:

I would give him about 2, maybe 2 and a half years. The Knicks have this year'ss draft pick and next year's draft pick. Lets not forget they also will players come off the books. So why should I not expect Walsh to improve the team in 2 years.

As long as he doesn't make dumb moves and goes forward with not' damaging the cap any further and making it flexible, then he should have as much time as he needs to develop this team into a contender. This is exactly' what isiah should have done from the beginning.

I still remember isiah's first days in NY. He had dinner with JayZ, Chris Rock & Spike Lee. He asked for their advice and Spike basically said 'whatever you do, do it fast'. Turns out, it was horrible advice. By now isiah would have had this team contending, if he had did what Walsh is now doing. Concentrating on making the cap flexible.
I'll never trust this' team again.
islesfan
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4/11/2008  10:46 PM
I need to see 2 things happen first:

1) Donnie exterminates Isiah from the organization completely.

2) There's a legitimate plan in place.

Walsh already made his plan known, talking about the draft and managing the cap so that they're under it by 2010. That's a great start.

Now if #1 happens, I think Donnie should be given 2 years to clean up Isiah's mess and at least another 2 years to show progress with his plan. For you geniuses like Cosmic, that's 4 years.
If it didn’t work in Phoenix with Nash and Stoutamire... it’s just not a winning formula. It’s an entertaining formula, but not a winning one. - Derek Harper talking about D'Antoni's System
Cosmic
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4/11/2008  11:10 PM
Posted by islesfan:


For you geniuses like Cosmic, that's 4 years.

Since you're infatuated with my ass can you lick my hemorrhoids clean while you're back there?

Just in case you're wondering...I'm here to talk sports not argue with thickheaded scumbags like yourself who have personal agendas so don't expect to get replied to anymore.
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