Personally I am upbeat after watching this game - in some respects- and disheartened at seeing the lack of any learning curve by players who have been in this league at least 5 years. The single most important thing this team really lacks - is a guy who understands the game and while playing -can also be removed enough from it - to watch what is going on and make a course/direction change. With all the minutes going to Crawford- the onus must squarely be on him - because I know I have seen Isiah do this constantly when he was playing. There are only so many time outs you can take and only so many times you can point out when to go inside, when to go to the hole and collpase the players to feed your post player, when to take the midrange jumper, and when to take the 3.

Crawford for all his effort will never (I think after 7 years -you can say that probability is on your side ) have that 'sense; of awareness and most definitely does not have the ball handling skills of a Nash/Kidd. He also despite is height has never learned to play a post up game like Baron. The lack of depth in the backcourt is really hurting the Knicks. I personally think - that they need to hire a designated backcourt coach - like a Magic Johnson, Stockton, Sam Cassel - and get some backcourt help--- get Damon Stoudemire (if your worried about the salary cap) or Kidd (if your not). These games show people the value of having a Marbury -even if the whole team unanimously votes to bench him- because with out his ability to break dow the interior defense and make the pass- the Knicks are definitely struggling-Robinson may get there- but Marbury has always been there in that sense (his main weakness if thinking his midrange jumper is better than it is - for him being a max salary pro -not streetball).

The post game press conference - he really put it out there- 'ball handling' (decison making) - terrible and the fact that Eddie Curry must learn to be more aggressive and be the post presence - he was picked to be -despite being double teamed or even playing against bigger players. Isiah/Knicks are willing to let this year go- IMO - to get these guys comfortable with each other - and in some ways it is working. Therefore this year Curry has improved fromwhat I see- he is not as clueless on D for 90 percent of the game - he has cut it down to like 40 percent of the time (which still hurts us - but is not insurmountable).

From what I have seen- Randolph is a valuable addition - and would really fulfill his role - if everyone else fulfilled theirs. There is no doubt that Randolph is increasingly showing his value as the season goes on- regardless of defensive concerns and temperament. The Lee/randolph combo is slowly becoming a powerful force at the half-way point -with them averaging 30 pts and 20 rebound a game. What I really like is in te last few games - Randolph is strating to use an underutilized part of his game (the fact that he is 6'11" and if he takes it to the hole - he will be much more effective- it will take abit of time but no doubt - the effort and improvement are discernable.

Fred Jones (thankfully he is expiring this year), Balkman should go-- Balkman provides nothing that Jeffries doesn't. Mardy Collins - I have no clue - as he hasn't played much - but his biggest weakness are in abundance at the guard position - no dominant ability to post up, not a great ball handler and no 'professional' midrange jumper. Q is valuable because if he ever gets a consistent stroke - he will be the 'extra' we need as a two way player at the SF position (another Knick weakness -the SF position was a depressing 0/7 tonite). This puts pressure on the guards - mainly Crawford - and if he and Nate are not hitting the 3 (0/7) - there is no incentive to force the defense to spread out. I really hope that Wilson Chandler is the two way player that Isiah thinks he is.

Anyway - just my thoughts.


The upside is that despite going only 1/15 from 3 point land and shooting 43% from the field -we only lost by 13 or so- and in reality - we could have lost be less- but Isiah (as he did in Washington) -basically was not going for it. He (rightfully so) took the loss - so that the 'team' may actually learn something. The upside is that we were not blown out - and we did come back quite a few times. I do see the 'team' as whole having a bit more hear and confidence, playing better defense (although just a little at a time), and only being two to three players away from having fantastic depth at every position. If Randolph Morris and Chandler do turn out to be as good as Lee/Robinson- and we get a 'real' floor leader. This team will be one of the deepest in the NBA.







[Edited by - iyamwutiam on 01-21-2008 6:21 PM]

[Edited by - iyamwutiam on 01-21-2008 6:24 PM]

[Edited by - iyamwutiam on 01-21-2008 6:26 PM]

Really, the disheartening thing here is that you come out of a 13-28 season preaching more time for a bunch of losers that Isiah Thomas has assembled. It's sad that you are "happy" we only lost by 16 instead of 45. Be it Curry, Crawford, Zach, or anyone else, they just don't cut it. You don't build a winning team by having Curry, Randolph, Crawford, or Nate as your main option. You build a team through defense, basketball IQ, and work ethic first.

The team may be playing harder now for whatever reason but it doesn't excuse 13-28. Nothing excuses that. The team doesn't need more time. The core of the team is together for a 3rd straight year and putting up the same or even worse numbers in the record column. Give me a break already. This must be how Dolan views things. Knicks win 4 of 6. "Man, look at this team now. They're playing on a whole new level. We've risen from the dumps." No.

Giving up on the season? Trust me buddy, he hasn't given up and never will. Not that I care anyway but at least if you give you get a chance at a top draft pick instead of ending up with 33 wins and the 9th pick.

Eddy Curry is still a terrible, terrible defender. He hasn't improved at all. Same goes for EVERYONE on the team. They have not improved defensively at all, especially in 5 games that has apparently turned their season around.

The only thing that keeps the Knicks in games is their scoring. They can score at will regardless of what is going on. That doesn't mean they're playing together or efficiently, it just means that there are talented scorers on the team. But they are scorers. Nothing more, nothing less.

Now the dead weight like Jeffries, Q, Malik, James, and Mardy aren't scorers and they aren't NBA players either. Balkman is only a decent player off the bench and nothing more. Lee is a 7th man who provides energy. Morris and Chandler? Who the hell even knows and cares?

The plan went downhill after Isiah decided to build a team around Stephon Marbury. Ever since then he's been treading water and going nowhere fast, all the while bamboozling Dolan and the remaining Isiah followers into thinking the team has a future beyond sucking ass. Isiah Thomas isn't Tom Coughlin, as he so eloquently suggested today. Tom Coughlin was actually pretty good but he never did anything in the playoffs until now. Isiah Thomas can't even make it to the playoffs. Hell, he did and got swept out and is now pretending to be turning the corner when you've won 13 of 41 games. He was laughing today on the sidelines when the game was over. I guess I'd be laughing too if I was doing such a horrible job, getting paid $6 million a year to do that horrible job, and having better job security than Bill Bellichek.


[Edited by - gkfv2 on 01-21-2008 6:39 PM]

LOL- if he has better job security than Bill Bellichek - that really is 'Greek to me'. As I have said before - and I am still looking - but there was a post on ESPN (article/interview) I can't remember - which said Dolan was hot for Marbury - since we all know with KVH, K. Thomas, Charlie Ward, Shandon Anderson - the knicks were not going anywhere.

The cre- which does have warts- would probably have been Curry,Crawford, Q, Nate, Lee, Jeffries and perhaps Balkman. personally - i think Balkman can not do anything Jeffries can not do- in addition - Jeffries is taller and as i have said earlier offers much more versatility. Randolph coming in has been valuable and I do think that once the backcourt earns to get it to the right guy and learn how to openopen the low blocks with timely mid-range jumpers and penetration - you will see a lot more games where the Knicks are winning.

Posted by iyamwutiam:

LOL- if he has better job security than Bill Bellichek - that really is 'Greek to me'. As I have said before - and I am still looking - but there was a post on ESPN (article/interview) I can't remember - which said Dolan was hot for Marbury - since we all know with KVH, K. Thomas, Charlie Ward, Shandon Anderson - the knicks were not going anywhere.

The cre- which does have warts- would probably have been Curry,Crawford, Q, Nate, Lee, Jeffries and perhaps Balkman. personally - i think Balkman can not do anything Jeffries can not do- in addition - Jeffries is taller and as i have said earlier offers much more versatility. Randolph coming in has been valuable and I do think that once the backcourt earns to get it to the right guy and learn how to openopen the low blocks with timely mid-range jumpers and penetration - you will see a lot more games where the Knicks are winning.

There is no way in hell anybody in NBA can look so helpless on offense like Jeffries.
I feel sorry for him like for mentally sick kid. But this is not alternative Olympics, this is NBA.

Posted by iyamwutiam:

BTW - if you want to compare Coughlin to Isiah - lets give him Le bron (#1 pick like Eli Manning), Camby (Strahan), Bosh (Plaxico Burress) and then add Lee, Nate, Balkman - lets nt forget the O line full of first round picks like Snee. There is NO comparison between the giants and what Cohlin walked into and what Isiah walked into with the Knicks. he giants were loaded with talent (he even had Tiki when he got on board).

He got team which was capable to with 35-37 games.
Now what he has after 4 years - team capable of winning 26-30?
And he spent 500 mils on this not talking about 4 first round picks and change of 2nd, did some all time worst trades and MLE.
Isiah is not comparable with anybody in any sport.
He is champion of champions forever...

I actually think this team would be watchable(and significantly more competitive on a nightly basis) if Isiah made one simple move--Bench and/or trade Eddy Curry.

With this one simple move, a number of things would likely fall into place:

1.) Randolph would get more shots. This guy really likes to get his shots each game, and he is worse about not passing out of the post when he is not getting his touches. Once Zach has more shots, he is much more likely to pass out of the double team and create for his teammates, which makes us function much better as a team.

2.) Lee will start exerting the energy that he showed us the previous two seasons. Lee has been alright this year, but he hasn't been the energetic player that he can be. Lee is leaving offensive rebounds on the court and he is not finishing as good as last year. Once Lee is put into a situation where he knows if he plays hard, he will get more minutes, and thus a bigger contract, that energy will very likely come back. Additionally, he should start, since he needs to rest between stints.

3.) Benching Curry will also open up more shots and opportunities for jamal and nate. Jamal likes his shots, just like Zach, and when Jamal is not getting his shots in the flow of the offense, he takes more bad shots. Additionally, you can tell Naterob has been holding back these past few games. You really need your best shooter(naterob) shooting whenever he has a good shot.

4.) Not having Curry in the game means a better defender will be on the court in his place regardless of who replaces him in the lineup. This guy doesn't have a clue out there.

It's that simple. You remove Curry from the lineup, and give these guys a chance to play together. Then, in the off-season, when each player's trade value has increased, you look to put together a coherent team.

Posted by Cash:

I actually think this team would be watchable(and significantly more competitive on a nightly basis) if Isiah made one simple move--Bench and/or trade Eddy Curry.

With this one simple move, a number of things would likely fall into place:

1.) Randolph would get more shots. This guy really likes to get his shots each game, and he is worse about not passing out of the post when he is not getting his touches. Once Zach has more shots, he is much more likely to pass out of the double team and create for his teammates, which makes us function much better as a team.

2.) Lee will start exerting the energy that he showed us the previous two seasons. Lee has been alright this year, but he hasn't been the energetic player that he can be. Lee is leaving offensive rebounds on the court and he is not finishing as good as last year. Once Lee is put into a situation where he knows if he plays hard, he will get more minutes, and thus a bigger contract, that energy will very likely come back. Additionally, he should start, since he needs to rest between stints.

3.) Benching Curry will also open up more shots and opportunities for jamal and nate. Jamal likes his shots, just like Zach, and when Jamal is not getting his shots in the flow of the offense, he takes more bad shots. Additionally, you can tell Naterob has been holding back these past few games. You really need your best shooter(naterob) shooting whenever he has a good shot.

4.) Not having Curry in the game means a better defender will be on the court in his place regardless of who replaces him in the lineup. This guy doesn't have a clue out there.

It's that simple. You remove Curry from the lineup, and give these guys a chance to play together. Then, in the off-season, when each player's trade value has increased, you look to put together a coherent team.

I agree that Curry makes almost this team worse. I wouldn't get my hopes up about him being traded or benched though. He was benched before but Isiah just put him back in the starting line up again one game later. Not exactly a surprising move on Isiah's part.

I really feel that Isiah is the right driver for this bus. He just needs to check the map, or stop at a gas station to ask directions. Then he'll be able to get us to our destination.

This team needs to do two things, not change a thing and move Jamal Crawford while he is playing his best basketball. We need guys that play smart and are willing to play defense. We don't need to win games so we can finish 10th in the conference. I would look to add Corey Magette for Crawford since he is expiring and we can get a little cap relief and perhaps have someone we can sign and trade for an additional pick in the offseason. Addition by subtraction, even if we can get a late draft selection for him fine, but isiah doesn't have the intelligence to use that pick on a euro that he can stash away while the mess is cleaned up.

We need to get derek rose and let him start till lebron becomes a free agent. Let Zach continue to put up numbers so someone takes a flyer on him. We have a lot of transition players like lee balkman and nate and no one to get them the ball. Let these guys along with chandler get minutes and see what you have. Q needs to be shut down for the rest of the season let him rest his back and try to get healthy.

This team would already be primed for a champioship if we hadn't made panic signing and decided to trade for eddy curry leaving three future allstars on the table and a couple of solid role players. Isiah hasn't drafted all that well so bring in new management team after the season to clean this thing up and this team is back on it's way to contention

I agree with the trade Curry argument. The guy is a beast on the offensive end when he gets the ball in decent position. However, the guy is the absolute worse reacting center on the defensive end that I have ever seen. During this game, he actually started to get mad and played harder and all he accomplished was turning himself into a mediocre defender. I can live wih Zach's defense because he is at least in decent position most of the time and does recognize some rotations but Curry rarely is in the right position and he is often our last line of defense. Dalembert is playing better this year. I would be willing to make a trade of Curry and Balkman for Dalembert and a top-10 protected first round lottery pick. This would open the low block to Zach and finally give use a shot-blocker. Plus, I would love to see Chandler get some burn.

So - forget it - unless you give up 5-7 first round draft picks -you are not getting a Yao Ming, KG, Kobe, le Bron- however - for two picks and a good player - you can get a 'used' to be franchise player all day long - like Vince Carter, Tracy McGrady, the Matrix etc.

Hey genius, Isiah HAS given up 4 potential lottery picks. And in those 2 trades, he hasn't gotten back anything close to Carter, McGrady or Marion. He got a psychopath loser in Starbury and a heartless, out of shape loser in Curry. That's a HUGE reason why the Knicks are in the situation that they're in now.