What kind of season (or start of a season) has to happen for you to say that Isiah has not succeeded and should be replaced?

Personally, if they can't play .500 ball this year, he's gotta go. And there's no way I think they do. And if they are no better than 7-13 after 20 games, likewise, he's gotta go. I mean granted, I think in general, its time for him to step down, but if they came out and went 10-10 the first twenty games, I'd zip it, and let him finish out the season.

I've heard others (Nix?) say that anything less than a playoff berth is unacceptable. Everyone man up here, set your standard as low or high as you want.

Man up and draw a line?

I think the Knicks will achieve mediocrity this year.

But it's not like a do or die scenario in my mind. I already consider Marbury, Isiah and many of these parts structurally unsound, so I don't see them on a linear ever-upward climb. I could see them doing well short term and still come crashing down again shortly after.

I'd halt construction sooner rather than later to shore up the foundation before adding more floors.

They said the Knicks should have won under Larry Brown. Since then they've added:

Jared "The Glue" Jeffries
The Irreplaceable Fred Jones
Zach "I don't think anybody else went 23 and 10 last year" Randolph
Renaldo Balkman
Wilson Chandler

Plus a supposedly "in shape" Eddy Curry and Marbury who is all about team ball that he wouldn't play for Brown.

If Larry Brown was supposed to win before all that and with all that dead weight, then they shouldn't just be .500 this year. They should at least win a playoff round.

Posted by Panos:

Posted by BlueSeats:

I think the Knicks will achieve mediocrity this year.

But it's not like a do or die scenario in my mind. I already consider Marbury, Isiah and many of these parts structurally unsound, so I don't see them on a linear ever-upward climb. I could see them doing well short term and still come crashing down again shortly after.

I'd halt construction sooner rather than later to shore up the foundation before adding more floors.

So if I can paraphrase, you're saying they are already past the line in the sand for you, and nothing can be redeemed this year.

Others?

That's close. But I wouldn't say nothing redeeming can come of the season. I'm realist enough to think we can salvage some of the parts, and I'd like to see the cream be allowed to rise to the top. But like I said yesterday, I haven't seen a lot of tangiable player development going on during isiah's tenure, so I'd really like to see us put a viable long-term program into place as soon as possible.

Last season, and 05-06.

Posted by BlueSeats:

I think the Knicks will achieve mediocrity this year.

But it's not like a do or die scenario in my mind. I already consider Marbury, Isiah and many of these parts structurally unsound, so I don't see them on a linear ever-upward climb. I could see them doing well short term and still come crashing down again shortly after.

I'd halt construction sooner rather than later to shore up the foundation before adding more floors.

Very well said, Blue. Totally agree with you. Would hate to see Isiah auction off this yrs draft pick for another "numbers guy" in hopes of saving himself if the team gets off to an inevitable slow start.

I see a few pieces here (Lee, Balk, Chandler, Curry) that can be a part of an eventual solution. The problem is, with Isiah in win now/ fight for his job (perhaps last job?)mode, the young talent that needs to get valuable minutes and experince will wilt on the bench while overpriced redundant players snatch up all the minutes in one hand and losses in the other.

I'd rather lose now with the youth, in hopes of the experience factor panning out down the line.

[Edited by - bigbeast on 19-10-2007 6:00 PM]

Posted by Panos:

What kind of season (or start of a season) has to happen for you to say that Isiah has not succeeded and should be replaced?

You beat them and you beat them and you beat them over and over and over with a stick and they just don't get it. Huuuuuhhhhh!

Posted by TheGame:

I like IT as a person despite the problems he has had and the sexual harrassment issue and I think he has added some talent, especially the guys we drafted, but I have limits. This team has got to get to 40 wins this season and make a strong push for the playoffs. I will stop short of saying its playoffs or bust, but they better be pretty damn close to the playoffs in the final week or IT has to go.

You mean if this bunch gets close to 40, Isiah's going to be saved again? FUUUUUCK!!!

Posted by TheGame:

I like IT as a person

How does that work exactly?

I say as soon as MSG loses all their appeals in court and womens groups are setting the garden on fire while dykes on bikes and chicks with sticks gang rape the rocketts at radio city to protest the raping of decency by Dolan and his group of indecent frat boys, then will Dolan realize that now is the time to ride himself of the smiling serpent coach and his towel headed court jester!

With Isiah they might win 40. without him they might win 43. He is a continuous distraction and his bound to Jones, JJ1 and two, craw and Q.

Larry became insane with this group.

The knicks are living proof that coach/Gm is a bad Idea. In fact, Isiah is a bad idea. Imagine such a team that took a hall of fame coach, one that went to the finals two years in a row and turned him into an insufferable wretch in just a few months. Sticking Isiahs nose in the fecal matter of a roster he created was a nice touch by dolan but the time has come to flush him and start fresh. Having him in charge of both th teams roster on who plays is really going to kill us for years.