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Getting the Bigs the BALL
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Elite
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2/26/2007  1:10 PM
We have serious trouble getting our big guys the ball. Eddy+Channing should be getting the majority of the plays ran thru them and they are - problem is our gaurds give up way too easy when it comes to getting these guys the ball.

If there is a double team.. USE it - drive and kick to the open man, dont just slowly rotate the ball back around the perimiter - thats exactly what the defense wants you to do - give up.

Also if the passing lane is not there to get it to EC then WORK on it.. dribble, position your self better dont expect him to do ALL the work in terms of getting position as a gaurd you have to do some work too to get the bigs the ball.

Too often when the defense makes it difficult to get EC or CF the ball our gaurds just give up and jack up a bad shot.. if we are running a play for a big, GET HIM THE BALL... Isiah run some godamn drills please what the hell its ridiculous bring back charlie ward thats one thing he could do was feed the post
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TMS
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2/26/2007  1:17 PM
the guards just stand there & wait for Eddy to fight for position down low... if the shot isn't there, drive to the hole or tell Curry to come out to run a pick & roll... it's the PG's job to orchestrate... that means telling everyone where they need to be & what play he wants to run... if the first option is cut off, switch to another & stop winding down the shotclock like you have no idea what you're doing... Marbury should know better than that & so should Jamal.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
nixluva
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2/26/2007  1:18 PM
Posted by Elite:

We have serious trouble getting our big guys the ball. Eddy+Channing should be getting the majority of the plays ran thru them and they are - problem is our gaurds give up way too easy when it comes to getting these guys the ball.

If there is a double team.. USE it - drive and kick to the open man, dont just slowly rotate the ball back around the perimiter - thats exactly what the defense wants you to do - give up.

Also if the passing lane is not there to get it to EC then WORK on it.. dribble, position your self better dont expect him to do ALL the work in terms of getting position as a gaurd you have to do some work too to get the bigs the ball.

Too often when the defense makes it difficult to get EC or CF the ball our gaurds just give up and jack up a bad shot.. if we are running a play for a big, GET HIM THE BALL... Isiah run some godamn drills please what the hell its ridiculous bring back charlie ward thats one thing he could do was feed the post

I totally agree. I really don't know why our guards are so bad at it. You'd think they would be able to figure out something by now. I just don't get what's so hard about countering what the defense does with a basic play. The defense doubles you can penetrate and kick or how about immediately going to a pick and roll? There's so many options. How a sending a cutter as soon as the defense sends an extra guy from the weakside? We're not playing off of the doubles the way we should.
Elite
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2/26/2007  1:20 PM
bad coaching really i mean what is isiah working on with these guys in practice???
Queeniepop
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2/26/2007  1:23 PM
I don't know what games you watch but when Eddy's out there, we get him the ball. And that is why Jamal starts- he knows how to get him the ball. Marbury takes too much time to do it and gets it to Curry too far away from the basket. Seriously, if you watch, Marbury wastes so much time...but he tries to get him the ball. If you watched during the 2nd Q of yesterday's game, when Isiah played a 2-man game between JC and Eddy, we went up by 9 or 11 points.

Marbury went for HIS yesterday...hence 2 assists and 5 to's (17 points in the first half and 1 assist, 1 TO...followed by 5 points, 1 assist and 4 to's in the second)

Plus, Isiah took him out of the game for extensive time yesterday at the end because Curry plays ZERO d.
Elite
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2/26/2007  1:24 PM
Jamal is better at it than Marbury but there are times when Jamal gives up way too easy.

QUeenie you say when eddy is out there we get him the ball... we did earlier in the seaon.. but how many FGA did he have vs. Philly? somethin like 4? We are not doing a good job
TMS
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2/26/2007  1:30 PM
Posted by Elite:

bad coaching really i mean what is isiah working on with these guys in practice???

Marbury should know how to play the game by now... there's no excuse for him to stand there & not know what to do if 3 guys are tripling down on Curry down low... it's common sense, if there's 3 guys on Curry, that means 2 of your other teammates are wide open... get the ball to them!!!

this is why it hurts so much to have a guy like Jefferies on the floor who can't shoot, can't drive to the hole, & can't post up... he offers zero on the offensive end so guys don't have to even bother guarding him... at least if we have Balkman on the floor, he can cut to the basket or dribble penetrate & draw a foul.
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Masterplan
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2/26/2007  1:34 PM
the last few games teams have fronted eddy, making that entry pass tougher, and had defenders ready to collapse on the lob pass. jamal i remember threaded the needle nicely a few times, and another non-PG, frye or Q i think. but i think teams are catching on as to one way to contain eddy through ball denial. we either need better passing to get it to him anyway or better shooting to keep help defenders honest. or better coaching to take advantage of what we have.
TMS
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2/26/2007  1:41 PM
what we need is a PG who has a clue as to how to effectively orchestrate an offense if the play that's called from the bench breaks down.
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Masterplan
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2/26/2007  1:44 PM
Posted by TMS:

what we need is a PG who has a clue as to how to effectively orchestrate an offense if the play that's called from the bench breaks down.

Q seems to be the best on the team at this- settling down the offense, resetting to the PGs or making the pass himself. not that he's a PG, just that he's a brain out there and seems to play within the offense well even when his 3 isn't falling.
TMS
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2/26/2007  1:48 PM
yeah, he's 1 of the few guys on this team who actually knows how to play the game w/o having it outlined for him from the bench... D Lee is another.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
jimimou
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2/26/2007  1:52 PM
Posted by Elite:

Jamal is better at it than Marbury but there are times when Jamal gives up way too easy.

QUeenie you say when eddy is out there we get him the ball... we did earlier in the seaon.. but how many FGA did he have vs. Philly? somethin like 4? We are not doing a good job

i agree that jamal gets eddy the ball good, but i think that is only b/c the 2 are very close and vibe well together. i dont think jamal can do that with any other knick. i haven't seen him be an effectiove passer once since being on the knicks. only guy on this team that can consistently ge the ball to the right spot for eddy (or anyone else that posts up for that matter, is Q.
MS
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2/26/2007  2:05 PM
Marcus Williams, Kyle Lowry?

No we have plenty of guards already. Trade Nate for Lowry asap....

Also Cato mentioned that they don't practice double teaming Eddy in practice, so its concievable to believe that they don't emphasize getting the ball down to the post
islesfan
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2/26/2007  2:07 PM
The Bigs can't pass out of double teams and they can't dribble without turning the ball over.
If it didn’t work in Phoenix with Nash and Stoutamire... it’s just not a winning formula. It’s an entertaining formula, but not a winning one. - Derek Harper talking about D'Antoni's System
Elite
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2/26/2007  2:08 PM
I'm sure Scottie Pippen would be able to get our bigs the ball... But i hate that queer i dont know if i could stand to see him in orange and blue
TMS
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2/26/2007  2:15 PM
Marcus Williams didn't show me squat last night... & Kyle Lowry is NOT an effective orchestrator & hasn't proven much of anything in this league other than that he can rebound & be a pesky defender for his size as a bench role player... neither 1 of those guys are the answer we need.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
islesfan
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2/26/2007  2:20 PM
Posted by TMS:

Marcus Williams didn't show me squat last night... & Kyle Lowry is NOT an effective orchestrator & hasn't proven much of anything in this league other than that he can rebound & be a pesky defender for his size as a bench role player... neither 1 of those guys are the answer we need.

Who on the Knicks showed you squat last night?

How about Jarrett Jack?
If it didn’t work in Phoenix with Nash and Stoutamire... it’s just not a winning formula. It’s an entertaining formula, but not a winning one. - Derek Harper talking about D'Antoni's System
TMS
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2/26/2007  2:24 PM
i commented on Marcus Williams & you come back w/that? so it would make sense to add a PG who hasn't shown me anything to a roster full of PG's who haven't shown me anything? sure, that makes sense... go for it Isiah.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
islesfan
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2/26/2007  2:39 PM
Posted by TMS:

i commented on Marcus Williams & you come back w/that? so it would make sense to add a PG who hasn't shown me anything to a roster full of PG's who haven't shown me anything? sure, that makes sense... go for it Isiah.

Come back with what? I'm supposed to base MW's future on last night's game?

Yeah, that makes a ton of sense.
If it didn’t work in Phoenix with Nash and Stoutamire... it’s just not a winning formula. It’s an entertaining formula, but not a winning one. - Derek Harper talking about D'Antoni's System
TMS
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2/26/2007  2:48 PM
that doesn't even make sense... i'm not even getting into this one w/you.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
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