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there is nothing positive about this team or situation
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BRIGGS
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11/14/2006  12:04 AM
even the staunchest supporter of this regime must be ready to go awol. It was not helpful that we won two games, because it's a false sense of what we are. crawford hitting 35 foot 3 point shots etc...anyone can sit her and dog lb but the guy was right on the money the sht needed to be ripped apart whther they liked it or not of course when you have a guy spend 500mm and has his reputation and large paycheck on the line he's going to cover his arse anyway he thinks he can hes going to $pin it after hes gone. that doesnt matter. we need something in between scott layden and isiah because they are the two extremes but ultimately the same. glen grunwald seems like a bright guy but hes not an answer. I would like to see if we can lure the younger Nelson in as GM
RIP Crushalot😞
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Nalod
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11/14/2006  12:33 AM
Larry was fired for our sins.
arkrud
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11/14/2006  12:52 AM
I disagree...
There is one positive thing about it - everybody are getting exposed.
This is the nice quality of the fools to help the truth to show up.
Thanks IT, thanks marbs, thanks Steve, thanks Eddy, and thanks Jerome...
Now even mister Dolan can see... Thank You , thank you...
"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
nixluva
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11/14/2006  1:14 AM
i guess you guys just can't let an opportunity pass to think negative.

1. Frye finally had a game that was more like what we expected. Let's hope he can keep that going
2. Q is showing that he's a good all around player and along with Lee, Nate and Balkman are the few good hustlers and defenders we have.
3. The team is actually becoming more and more competitive as we've gon along here. We've been in the games in the last few minutes.

Look the team not winning games isn't the only important factor. What is most important is the DEVELOPMENT of the team as a whole and individually. Somehow many of us seem to keep overlooking that point. This team isn't going to be a top tier team overnight and it was going to take years to get there no matter what we did. This team is showing progress and tho it hasn't translated into wins YET. You have to be able to see the small steps this team is taking.

Right now if we can tighten up our perimeter D and execute better in crunch time this team is gonna be pretty good. We haven't done it yet, but you have to give them time to get it together.
rain
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11/14/2006  1:16 AM
all we can do, unfortunately.. is wait this out... hope some chemistry develops, and some of the young guys improve steadily. This isn't a fixable situation at this point. We have to wait for Layden, Dolan, and IT's mistakes ... compounded with interest.. wash off our cap. Time will only heal this wound.
BRIGGS
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11/14/2006  1:20 AM
Posted by rain:

all we can do, unfortunately.. is wait this out... hope some chemistry develops, and some of the young guys improve steadily. This isn't a fixable situation at this point. We have to wait for Layden, Dolan, and IT's mistakes ... compounded with interest.. wash off our cap. Time will only heal this wound.

You need a new decision maker in place. That is the bottom line.
RIP Crushalot😞
BigSm00th
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11/14/2006  1:41 AM
Dolan is so inept he will wait until season's end, when the Knicks are making a late season run at 500 and Isaih is talking playoffs. When they don't make it, Isiah will be fired.

who will come then?

isiah will be fired, and it will be an absolute MESS in NY. no draft pick, with the pieces we have in place and the contracts, i'd say it would be a 5 year plan for this guy to turn the knicks into a legit playoff contender.

seriously, who would you keep on this team if you were going to start from scratch and make the knicks like an expansion team basically? david lee? curry maybe? crawford? nate?

marbury is OVER THE HILL. francis is OVER THE HILL.

these guys are done. marbury is having 0-6 games, remember this guy? he used to be EXPLOSIVE, he would slam on people. now after all of the ankle surgeries and other bs playing in these cheap shoes he has no explosion. its sad.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=7bulGujbms0

francis had a 45' vert out of maryland. he probably has a 38' vert today. he's done.

LB was right, briggs is right, anyone who can't see that these guys are all bums is nuts. marbury and francis need to be bought out, the team needs new leadership, new direction. i wouldnt be surprised if isiah, to save his ass, trades them both for .40 cents on the dollar to get them out of here and try to make a run with all of his young pieces.

[Edited by - bigsm00th on 11-14-2006 01:43 AM]
#Knickstaps
NJK
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11/14/2006  1:46 AM
Posted by nixluva:

i guess you guys just can't let an opportunity pass to think negative.

1. Frye finally had a game that was more like what we expected. Let's hope he can keep that going
2. Q is showing that he's a good all around player and along with Lee, Nate and Balkman are the few good hustlers and defenders we have.
3. The team is actually becoming more and more competitive as we've gon along here. We've been in the games in the last few minutes.

Look the team not winning games isn't the only important factor. What is most important is the DEVELOPMENT of the team as a whole and individually. Somehow many of us seem to keep overlooking that point. This team isn't going to be a top tier team overnight and it was going to take years to get there no matter what we did. This team is showing progress and tho it hasn't translated into wins YET. You have to be able to see the small steps this team is taking.

Right now if we can tighten up our perimeter D and execute better in crunch time this team is gonna be pretty good. We haven't done it yet, but you have to give them time to get it together.

Plus the fact that this team will have an added hustle/defensive pressence when Jared Jeffries returns off injury. Thing about it is; this is a bad team from last year; that has to go through a grinder of a schedule right off the start; and learn to put it together on a consistent basis.

Like IT or hate him; the Knicks are showing a sign of fighting; and it's the influx of hustle guys that are quietly leading the way. Yes we need more than Marbury, more than Curry.

We need that bonifide supertsar that puts it all in night in and night out. We're not getting that anytime soon; but we are getting more hustle then we were last year; more fight.

Looking forward to Jared's return to add to the mix; because if the Knicks do figure it out; they might have players that become more valuable when the trading deadline comes close.

Record wise, there isn't much to be concerned about. The schedule reverses it'self to become easier. Maybe by that time we'll have a core of players that have meshed together and figured it out.



[Edited by - NJK on 11-14-2006 01:49 AM]
Somebody Help my Knicks!!!
PhilinLA
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11/14/2006  2:29 AM
If we can just unload Marbury and Francis, we'd have one of the most fun to watch exciting young teams in the league.
http://amonthhoffundays.blogspot.com/ We got a ringer.
Rich
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11/14/2006  3:00 AM
Posted by Nalod:

Larry was fired for our sins.

And some people think that there are no positives.
BigSm00th
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11/14/2006  3:30 AM
Larry Johnson isn't walking through that door! Patrick Ewing isn't walking through that door! John Starks isn't coming to play! Charles Oakley isn't going to walk through that door!

Phil, you make a great point, and I think Franchise and Starbury are both gone at the AS Break.
#Knickstaps
franco12
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11/14/2006  7:20 AM
if the goal is a championship, this team is not it. there is no value in blowing this team up now- we don't have our own pick.
you can point a finger at isiah, but look behind the curtain, its dolan & mills that have been here for both isiah and layden.
dolan needs to wake up & realize there isn't a championship caliber all star on this roster- and won't be this year.
if we could dump marbury and francis and have it cost us some good player (Q, crawford, balkman), I say do it. fire isiah when chicago is using our top lotto pick, name herb coach and say rebuilding.
no more free agents. no more trading picks.
aim to tank bad next 2 seasons and see if there isn't a franchise talent out there.
I wonder if we could send chicago's pick this year to utah to clear that future obligation?
Michael6835
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11/14/2006  8:33 AM
Thats the point, the goal at this point is not a championship. Thats the problem many of you seem to not get, the team is competing with one goal to make the playoffs. They are so far from an nba finals its not even funny, they know that. Many people on this board have a short lease when it comes to this team, november schedule is rough and people are quick to point the finger.

The facts are, we are losing like we lost last year. The only difference is that the team and coach, are playing more aggressively than last year and the schedule is much harder to start. There competing against top talent teams and in most games have the chance to win. I could understand all of this talk if they werent playing with emotion, if they didnt have heart to come back (see last year) but their not.

Also, many people love to jump on Francis and Marbury because they are the top $$ makers and marbury is the face of the organization. If he scored 20+ every game we lost, you would still talk about him. The fact of the matter is scoring is not the issue, (I think Francis should come off the bench when jeffries returns)it's defense and turnovers that is why we losing. Silly turnovers.

I hate to see people always talk so negatively all the time. Take this and apply to a real world situation, if you were trying to teach your kid how to ride a bike and he wasnt getting and kept falling down. Would you automatically say screw this, you'll never ride a bike or lets trade your bike in for a skooter. What good does that do ? Eventually that kid will learn to ride the bike. Excuse my analogy, but I think it had to be made, your giving up on this team way to early!
M
arkrud
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11/14/2006  8:41 AM
Posted by Michael6835:

Thats the point, the goal at this point is not a championship. Thats the problem many of you seem to not get, the team is competing with one goal to make the playoffs. They are so far from an nba finals its not even funny, they know that. Many people on this board have a short lease when it comes to this team, november schedule is rough and people are quick to point the finger.

The facts are, we are losing like we lost last year. The only difference is that the team and coach, are playing more aggressively than last year and the schedule is much harder to start. There competing against top talent teams and in most games have the chance to win. I could understand all of this talk if they werent playing with emotion, if they didnt have heart to come back (see last year) but their not.

Also, many people love to jump on Francis and Marbury because they are the top $$ makers and marbury is the face of the organization. If he scored 20+ every game we lost, you would still talk about him. The fact of the matter is scoring is not the issue, (I think Francis should come off the bench when jeffries returns)it's defense and turnovers that is why we losing. Silly turnovers.

I hate to see people always talk so negatively all the time. Take this and apply to a real world situation, if you were trying to teach your kid how to ride a bike and he wasnt getting and kept falling down. Would you automatically say screw this, you'll never ride a bike or lets trade your bike in for a skooter. What good does that do ? Eventually that kid will learn to ride the bike. Excuse my analogy, but I think it had to be made, your giving up on this team way to early!

This team doesn’t look like a kid, more like a man with all timers’ disease. Grown man with the mind stuck in early teens.
But NBA is not the league for handicapped people. Sorry…




"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
BRIGGS
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11/14/2006  9:25 AM
Posted by Michael6835:

Thats the point, the goal at this point is not a championship. Thats the problem many of you seem to not get, the team is competing with one goal to make the playoffs. They are so far from an nba finals its not even funny, they know that. Many people on this board have a short lease when it comes to this team, november schedule is rough and people are quick to point the finger.

The facts are, we are losing like we lost last year. The only difference is that the team and coach, are playing more aggressively than last year and the schedule is much harder to start. There competing against top talent teams and in most games have the chance to win. I could understand all of this talk if they werent playing with emotion, if they didnt have heart to come back (see last year) but their not.

Also, many people love to jump on Francis and Marbury because they are the top $$ makers and marbury is the face of the organization. If he scored 20+ every game we lost, you would still talk about him. The fact of the matter is scoring is not the issue, (I think Francis should come off the bench when jeffries returns)it's defense and turnovers that is why we losing. Silly turnovers.

I hate to see people always talk so negatively all the time. Take this and apply to a real world situation, if you were trying to teach your kid how to ride a bike and he wasnt getting and kept falling down. Would you automatically say screw this, you'll never ride a bike or lets trade your bike in for a skooter. What good does that do ? Eventually that kid will learn to ride the bike. Excuse my analogy, but I think it had to be made, your giving up on this team way to early!

In my best Jim Mora "playoffs". This is the SAME team that won 23 games last year. Weve been down double-digits in every game. There are HUGE components of the team that have players who are QUESTIONABLE in terms of their ability to win. the ONLY guys that I see as keepers are Lee Nate and Q--we SHOULD be 0-8---am I missing a player who is going to bring us to where this franchise needs to go? JJ give me a break--that is insane.
RIP Crushalot😞
Nalod
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11/14/2006  9:38 AM
Posted by Rich:
Posted by Nalod:

Larry was fired for our sins.

And some people think that there are no positives.


THere is always some positive, but it does not add up.

The game was never in our control, we can make frantic runs, but it comes with turnovers. Especially at critial times. We will pull a few "Denver" type wins with miricle shots, but when push comes to shove if Nate got the ball there will wildness that works at times, but not with precison.

Marbury needs get on the DL and chill and put his game together. He is dragging the team down.

Its not his fault we lost, but his lack of production and two bad passes at critical times was very telling. His blaming Dlee for one was sickening! THe one that got picked off by LEbron was the game killer. He needs to be benched at games end.
TMS
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11/14/2006  1:49 PM
Nate, Lee & Curry have shown improvement & seem to be on the cusp of becoming good NBA players... there have been some positive signs out of Balkman & Collins as well, & Q Rich is playing like an Allstar.

things aren't as bad as you make them out to seem... certainly a few positives can be gleaned from this mess.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
TMS
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11/14/2006  1:51 PM
Posted by Nalod:

Its not his fault we lost, but his lack of production and two bad passes at critical times was very telling. His blaming Dlee for one was sickening! THe one that got picked off by LEbron was the game killer. He needs to be benched at games end.

that's been his MO ever since he got here... it's NEVER his fault that his passes go awry to him... always Nazr's fault, or KT's fault, or Keith's fault, or Channing's fault, or Eddy's fault, or David's fault, or...

After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
Bippity10
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11/14/2006  1:56 PM
Posted by TMS:

Nate, Lee & Curry have shown improvement & seem to be on the cusp of becoming good NBA players... there have been some positive signs out of Balkman & Collins as well, & Q Rich is playing like an Allstar.

things aren't as bad as you make them out to seem... certainly a few positives can be gleaned from this mess.

I agree with you, but the question is where do we go from here. We do need veteran leadership and stability and a franchise caliber talent. How do we aquire that if we don't put ourselves in position to do so. No high draft pick and no money under the cap and untradeable vets. How do you get out from this level of mediocrity/crap without these things? Right now it seems like we are operating completely on luck and hoping for the best instead of putting ourselves in position. We have been a laughingstock for 6 seasons now and in that time have had two late lottery picks. Where do we go from here? How do we not waste the improvement of the young players. We wasted an entire season of development last year by telling our guys that it was okay to not try if you don't like the coach. Now we are left praying that our guys play hard and mentor our vets instead of the other way around. It's an odd situation.

[Edited by - bippity10 on 11-14-2006 1:57 PM]
I just hope that people will like me
Swishfm3
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11/14/2006  2:05 PM
Posted by TMS:

Nate, Lee & Curry have shown improvement & seem to be on the cusp of becoming good NBA players... there have been some positive signs out of Balkman & Collins as well, & Q Rich is playing like an Allstar.

things aren't as bad as you make them out to seem... certainly a few positives can be gleaned from this mess.

exactly...At this point, I.Thomas needs to find the right combination instead of waiting for the team to 'gel'.

Lee, Robinson and Richardson are playing great. Give them the majority of the minutes...let the offense run through them and lets see where that takes us.
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there is nothing positive about this team or situation
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