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New Season -- Same Problems
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eViL
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11/7/2006  10:46 AM
We're looking at a team, this year, that is remarkably similar to the team last year. Our starters go down early. Our reserves bring us back. We're falling into huge holes quickly. We can't guard the pick and roll. Teams are making three pointers at will against us. We don't take care of the ball. Any small sign of cohesion disappears the minute the team is faced with adversity.

We've watched enough Knicks basketball last year to know that these are known problems. These are not new issues. How is it that, through an entire off-season, we have not managed to correct one of these issues?

I don't want to get too down on the team this early, but when effort is an issue -- we are in trouble. And in the last three games effort was a problem. Effort is the minimum we should expect and we are not even getting that. I thought the player's love for Isiah was supposed to result in greater effort. What's happening?
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djsunyc
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11/7/2006  10:48 AM
accurate assessment.

nothing's changed except for occasional ice cream parties and movie nights.
joec32033
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11/7/2006  10:49 AM
Posted by djsunyc:

accurate assessment.

nothing's changed except for occasional ice cream parties and movie nights.

~You can't run from who you are.~
Elite
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11/7/2006  10:49 AM
your right man.. its the exact same team..

Add Curry and Q Rich
Subtract Jamal and Frye

= Same team
izybx
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11/7/2006  10:51 AM
We need to integrate our starting lineup with our energy reserves. It really is a problem that our second unit is outplaying our starters just like they did last season.

Curry, Lee, Q (JJ), Craw (hell come out of his slump at some point), Marbury is just a better, more balanced line up, with hustle, rebounding, and perimeter shooting balanced with penetration and low post scoring.

Isian needs to man up and change the starting lineup.
Beat the Evil Empire. BEAT MIAMI
djsunyc
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11/7/2006  10:53 AM
Posted by izybx:

We need to integrate our starting lineup with our energy reserves. It really is a problem that our second unit is outplaying our starters just like they did last season.

Curry, Lee, Q (JJ), Craw (hell come out of his slump at some point), Marbury is just a better, more balanced line up, with hustle, rebounding, and perimeter shooting balanced with penetration and low post scoring.

Isian needs to man up and change the starting lineup.

if that's the case, then francis would be starting with steph off the bench.
izybx
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11/7/2006  11:04 AM
Posted by djsunyc:
Posted by izybx:

We need to integrate our starting lineup with our energy reserves. It really is a problem that our second unit is outplaying our starters just like they did last season.

Curry, Lee, Q (JJ), Craw (hell come out of his slump at some point), Marbury is just a better, more balanced line up, with hustle, rebounding, and perimeter shooting balanced with penetration and low post scoring.

Isian needs to man up and change the starting lineup.

if that's the case, then francis would be starting with steph off the bench.

Why do you think Francis would be better in the starting line up than Marbury?

Beat the Evil Empire. BEAT MIAMI
djsunyc
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11/7/2006  11:06 AM
Posted by izybx:
Posted by djsunyc:
Posted by izybx:

We need to integrate our starting lineup with our energy reserves. It really is a problem that our second unit is outplaying our starters just like they did last season.

Curry, Lee, Q (JJ), Craw (hell come out of his slump at some point), Marbury is just a better, more balanced line up, with hustle, rebounding, and perimeter shooting balanced with penetration and low post scoring.

Isian needs to man up and change the starting lineup.

if that's the case, then francis would be starting with steph off the bench.

Why do you think Francis would be better in the starting line up than Marbury?

he's more athletic at this point and rebounds better.
Bippity10
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11/7/2006  11:07 AM
Posted by eViL:


I don't want to get too down on the team this early, but when effort is an issue -- we are in trouble. And in the last three games effort was a problem. Effort is the minimum we should expect and we are not even getting that. I thought the player's love for Isiah was supposed to result in greater effort. What's happening?


Only the last 3 games?
I just hope that people will like me
izybx
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11/7/2006  11:09 AM
Posted by djsunyc:
Posted by izybx:
Posted by djsunyc:
Posted by izybx:

We need to integrate our starting lineup with our energy reserves. It really is a problem that our second unit is outplaying our starters just like they did last season.

Curry, Lee, Q (JJ), Craw (hell come out of his slump at some point), Marbury is just a better, more balanced line up, with hustle, rebounding, and perimeter shooting balanced with penetration and low post scoring.

Isian needs to man up and change the starting lineup.

if that's the case, then francis would be starting with steph off the bench.

Why do you think Francis would be better in the starting line up than Marbury?

he's more athletic at this point and rebounds better.

Fair enough, i think they are somewhat interchangable.
Beat the Evil Empire. BEAT MIAMI
BlueSeats
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11/7/2006  11:19 AM
Posted by djsunyc:

accurate assessment.

nothing's changed except for occasional ice cream parties and movie nights.

It's nothing some s'mores and a pillow fight wont cure.
TMS
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11/7/2006  11:27 AM
the only difference is the players have no more excuses to blame on the coach or the system.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
Bippity10
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11/7/2006  11:29 AM
Posted by TMS:

the only difference is the players have no more excuses to blame on the coach or the system.

And this sadly is our only hope for a turnaround.
I just hope that people will like me
nyk4ever
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11/7/2006  11:32 AM
Who would have thought we'd have the same problems as we did last year when we have the same players on the roster? Until nearly every player on this roster is gone, this team is going nowhere.

[Edited by - nyk4ever on 11-07-2006 11:44 AM]
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
Bippity10
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11/7/2006  11:43 AM
We spend an entire 82 games not playing defense and quitting in half the games. Then when we start out the next season with the exact same team not performing people are surprised. Amazing.

What's the definition of insanity again??? Oh yea, beleiving it's all LB's fault.
I just hope that people will like me
Anji
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11/7/2006  12:04 PM
I think you guys are going to be eating your words. First of effort is not the problem with the knicks, the biased or the untrained eye would of course jump to that conclusion, but the problem with the starting lineup is balance. Marbury&Francis don't want to step on each others toes in terms of being "the guy" with is why in all four games they played at their best with the other one fouled out(Francis Memphis)on the bench or hurt. THen there is Frye&Curry, but Frye is the only nervious one of the two and he is not accepting being the dirty worker powerForward to curry. So the starters lack of effort isn't the problem because you see when the starters are in the game with players playing off of them within Isiah's system they all look great.............. that didn't happen last season. Second, the team looks nervious, the team is nervious, when has anybody been nervious when they didn't care or want to give EFFORT???? THe whole team is showing heart and even though the baskets aren't falling for some of our top scorers, who can you say they aren't showing eefort??? BS!!!!!
YOu would think people could wait a month or two instead of four games to see if the team grows and get's better................. to much to ask I guess.
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eViL
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USA
11/7/2006  2:54 PM
Posted by Anji:

First of effort is not the problem with the knicks, the biased or the untrained eye would of course jump to that conclusion

Well, my untrained eye, and Walt "Clyde" Frazier's untrained eye, and Mike Breen's untrained eye all saw Knicks guards going under screens instead of over screens on defense last night. We also saw many wide open three pointers. Explain to me how that is not an issue with effort. Why did Isiah bench his starters again?

Posted by Anji:

when has anybody been nervious when they didn't care or want to give EFFORT????

When they are unprepared. Have you ever been nervous for a test you didn't study for? You can be nervous and it has nothing to do with effort.

Posted by Anji:

THe whole team is showing heart and even though the baskets aren't falling for some of our top scorers, who can you say they aren't showing eefort??? BS!!!!!
YOu would think people could wait a month or two instead of four games to see if the team grows and get's better................. to much to ask I guess.

It's not just four games. This team is picking up right where they left off last season. There are many optimists on this board, but I have not seen one (aside from you) jump into this thread to tout the Knicks' effort thus far this season. It's not like these guys are fighting all game and losing by 4 or 5. They are going down by double digits halfway through the first quarter in every game except for the first.
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eViL
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11/7/2006  4:19 PM
[ridiculous idea] Start Collins, Robinson, Q-Rich, Lee and Curry. [/ridiculous idea]

Would this lineup start the game with the effort needed to avoid going down by double figures in the first half of the first quarter? How would Marbury, Francis and Frye respond to being benched?
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Bippity10
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11/7/2006  4:39 PM
Some people will search and search and search and search for reasons for our losses. Some theories will arise as the season goes along, but our problems are many.

No leadership
Poor ball handling
Lack of a sustained effort
Poor chemistry
Poor roster make-up
Lack of fundamentals

The list goes on and on. We keep searching for one simple flaw, but I bet 80 other posters could come up with 80 other flaws. The major problem we have is that the players that we are relying on to win have never won, don't know how to win, don't lead and are showing every other person who joins this roster that things are hopeless because they don't know how to win.

Man do we need a win!
I just hope that people will like me
djsunyc
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11/7/2006  4:41 PM
Posted by Bippity10:

Some people will search and search and search and search for reasons for our losses. Some theories will arise as the season goes along, but our problems are many.

No leadership
Poor ball handling
Lack of a sustained effort
Poor chemistry
Poor roster make-up
Lack of fundamentals

The list goes on and on. We keep searching for one simple flaw, but I bet 80 other posters could come up with 80 other flaws. The major problem we have is that the players that we are relying on to win have never won, don't know how to win, don't lead and are showing every other person who joins this roster that things are hopeless because they don't know how to win.

Man do we need a win!

well i'm no rocket scientist...but i think the main reason why we lose is b/c we score less points than the team we play.

REFUTE THAT LBIP BROWN!!!
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