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KNICKS MULLIN SPREE'S FUTURE!!!!
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WOODMANnYk
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7/13/2002  11:14 AM
http://www.nypost.com/sports/knicks/19000.htm

The knicks need to get bigger at the 3 spot and having spree there, will only deteriorate his game and hurt the knicks. I said it before, Knicks won't win with these 2 shooting guards in the lineup. Spree is gonna be 32 and will eventually break down. One thing that seems to pull Houston back is Spree chucking the ball too much during games. He doesn't know how to incorporate his game with the other players. (A me first attitude) Also, having a natural three requires an individual with ballhandling skills such as Odom, Pippen, grant hill and spree doesn't possess that. Chaney seem to favor Houston more than spree. Well, while coaching the Pistons, he did draft Allan. Based on reports, Mr. Chaney favored the deal for Glenn Robinson and Earvin Johnson but Scott Layen opposed it!! In my opinion, trade spree for a legit pg. or a bonifide small forward.... what you knick fans feel about it>????????
The Future. GO KNICKS!
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BigSm00th
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7/13/2002  12:33 PM
If they're going to trade Spree, I don't think they should for the Big Dog/Johnson trade. Johnson isn't that good of a center, and the Big Dog I've never liked. But if that's the best they can do, then I'd do it. The lineup would be:
PG- Ward (Eisley, Williams)
SG- Houston (Anderson)
SF- Robinson (Weatherspoon)
PF- McDyess (Thomas, Harrington)
C- Johnson (Jerome James or Doleac, Knight)

That's really not that much better then what they would've had with Spree, and who's going to step up and be the leader of that team? Big Dog's a great scorer, as are Houston and McDyess, but that team would be real suspect on defense. I'd still want to add Van Exel, especially with adding Johnson down low.
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thomasdice
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7/13/2002  5:48 PM
"but that team would be real suspect on defense"

terrific point smooth, it's the major reason why I disapproved this trade from day one. As much as I would liketo have a center like johnson over james, doleac, rasho - it's simply too much of a downgrade on defense. Sprewell's relentless prowess on both sides of the court is what feeds energy off to the rest of the team, robinson is another dead-on shooter, but I believe is an unnecessary counterpart at this point. houston,spree,dice need to stay in tact, and I truly think having a true SF isn't as much of an impact as having the vivacity that sprewell brings, on BOTH sides of the court.
Jerome from Manhattan is my dad. Doris from Regal Park is my mother.
nwny
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7/13/2002  6:04 PM
“The Knicks need to get bigger at the 3 spot and having spree there, will only deteriorate his game and hurt the Knicks.”

Why do the Knicks need to get bigger at the 3? I know it seems like the correct basketball thing to say but who’s killing Spree? Try to remember all those Knick games you saw when Spree was guarding the other teams SF, and you said to yourself. ‘That guy’s killing Spree we need to get bigger at the 3’. You can’t name them because they don’t happen (with the exception of T’Mack, that guy usually kills Spree). The point is, no SF in the league can stop him, and he’s only has trouble guarding two guys (Pierce is the other one). We need to put the best players on the floor. If we do a trade for a “true SF”, we lose our only unstoppable player. Since we are not getting T’Mack, or Pierce, we would be downgrading at that position.

“One thing that seems to pull Houston back is Spree chucking the ball too much during games. He doesn't know how to incorporate his game with the other players. (A me first attitude)”

Ha, ha, ha, ha……yeah, that’s what’s holding Houston back. Dude you’re hysterical. Spree is not a chucker. I have never heard anyone associated with the NBA say this. You are crazy. He is “team fist”, and a great ball handler. He played point for the Knicks in few playoff games. Where have you bin?
WOODMANnYk
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7/14/2002  12:17 AM
"Ha, ha, ha, ha……yeah, that’s what’s holding Houston back. Dude you’re hysterical. Spree is not a chucker. I have never heard anyone associated with the NBA say this. You are crazy. He is “team fist”, and a great ball handler. He played point for the Knicks in few playoff games. Where have you bin?" (nwny)

Bro, you're crazy if you think Spree's got ballhandling skills. Why do you think he's not playing PG anymore?? cause he gets eaten up with a suffocating defense just like the one philly had. he'll turn the ball over. Bro, i don't think you're reading the stats accurately but Spree lead the team in turnovers cause he's playing out of position. I don't necessarily like Glenn Robinson cause he got no heart but i suggested Odom or Ron artest. SPree doesn't necessary guard the Sf on the opposition. Where have you been???? DO you watch knick games??? Spree tends to guard the shooting guard if he's the best player or around spree's height. For ex. Spree would not guard MAshburn cause he can't, Mashburn's too big. Spree would not guard Van horn or Kenyon Martin from NJ, Houston would cause they're about his size. Another player spree has probelm with is Stackhouse. Bro, spree shoots the ball 20 to 25 a game and is barely 40%pct field goal.. He chucks the damn ball and doesn't like to pass when he gets it. He's a ballhog!!!!! you know it and so do i... he may be a good defense player but that one on one defense. Team defense i don't know about that one especially when you got to rotate.
The Future. GO KNICKS!
knixphan
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7/14/2002  12:26 AM
I say let's evaluate Spree's situation once we have a legit center, and Dice is warmed up - It may be a whole different ball of wax then...We may not need to count on Spree OR H20 as much, if the other team's worried about Dice...

Funny that Mase also played the 3 for us...the exact opposite problem-
"I will dress in bright and cheery colors, and so throw my enemies into confusion."
thomasdice
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7/14/2002  2:32 AM
let's all remind ourselves that spree is the bama grad along with dice, and in spree, a comfort level exists for a country boy who's gonna do his best to get acclimated to playing in new york, if thats even possible. as much as houston and spree argue at times, I think a lot of the tension will dissolve between the two and spree's passing game will evolve in a few ways.

when houston would roam the perimeter, his stance doesn't necessarily 'demand' the ball. when mcdyess is in the low blocks against a weaker opposition, there is a demand.

I've noticed spree seems to respect houston's stance more when he doesn't look so stationary around the perimeter (waiting in one spot for the kickout after spree would drive to the basket). It was a matter of authority a lot of the time.

I think mcdyess' role in manipulating the d and finding houston when the time is right will be key, and it will also be key for spree to keep up that great intensity even when he doesn't have the rock.
Jerome from Manhattan is my dad. Doris from Regal Park is my mother.
HARDCOREKNICKSFAN
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7/14/2002  3:21 AM
Spree is the best player on the team (NcDyess is still unproven on this team so far). We had no Patrick in the blocks attracting double teams, no LJ posting up and also at times drawing double teams. The Knicks were relegated to a jump shooting, 3 flinging offense. BOTH Spree and Houston chucked up about twice their season averages for attempted threes. Spree, unlike Allan, has the game to get to the basket, but how can he if the opposition, knowing our weaknesses in the frontcourt, keyed in on Spree to deny him the lane. Double (and sometimes TRIPLE) teamed, most times down the court, ANYONE would have more turnovers.
Spree has the Fire & Talent we need more of. He also has the guts to put it all out on the floor. Knicks big up the frontcourt, watch and analyze Spree (as well as Allan & Dyess) then.


Another season, and more adversity to persevere through. We will get the job done, even BETTER than last year. GO KNICKS!
K9
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7/15/2002  9:04 AM
SPREWELL IS NO MICHAEL COOPER !!! AT 6'5 & 32YRS OLD, WHO IS HE GOING TO GUARD ??? BIG DOG IS 6'9, THAT IS DEFENSE IN ITS SELF, HIS OFFENSE IS ALSO HIS DEFENSE. HE IS 10 TIMES BETTER ON THE OFFENSIVE END THAN SPREWELL WITH LESS TURN OVERS & MORE REBOUNDS !!! SO WHERE WOULD WE MISS SPREWELL ???
Dan1078
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7/15/2002  11:54 AM
K9, you're a barking dog who knows very little about basketball.

To clarify your misinterpreting of a Sprewell Glenn Robinson comparison:

"HE IS 10 TIMES BETTER ON THE OFFENSIVE END THAN SPREWELL WITH LESS TURN OVERS & MORE REBOUNDS !!!"

Spree: 19.4 ppg, 3.7 rpg, 3.9 apg

Robinson:20.7ppg 6.2 rpg 2.5 apg

They both have the same scoring capabilities, but Spree has the potential to explode for 40. Big Dog really doesnt.

Spree is an excellent defender also. He has been doing a good job guarding bigger guys than him. He's a winner. Big Dog is kind of just there.
davpowerslave
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7/15/2002  12:13 PM
Reportedly the bucks want this deal and layden KO'd it, so he maybe holding this as a last resort if he cant get a more favorable move.....just seems like sprewell will be shipped out, i mean he has been notoriously silent this offseason, i havent heard any quotes by him about mcdyess or anything else, so layden may be trying to use sprewell to land a point guard and if he cant, he may then finally go back to the bucks on this trade.
WOODMANnYk
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7/15/2002  2:08 PM
Posted by K9:

SPREWELL IS NO MICHAEL COOPER !!! AT 6'5 & 32YRS OLD, WHO IS HE GOING TO GUARD ??? BIG DOG IS 6'9, THAT IS DEFENSE IN ITS SELF, HIS OFFENSE IS ALSO HIS DEFENSE. HE IS 10 TIMES BETTER ON THE OFFENSIVE END THAN SPREWELL WITH LESS TURN OVERS & MORE REBOUNDS !!! SO WHERE WOULD WE MISS SPREWELL ???
Look, i myself have been getting on Spree but i'll tell you this for sure, Spree got fire and plays with paasion. Robinson on the other hand maybe better than spree offensively but Spree's a better defender. One thing bout Robinson, he doesn't play with passion day in day out, he has no heart. Why do you think milwaukee wants to get rid of him CAUSE HE'S SOFT ON DEFENSE!! Anytime knicks battle Bucks, Robinson can't check spree and spree usually locks him up...
I wouldn't do that trade cause if they do where will the knicks get that fire and intensity from???
The Future. GO KNICKS!
Dan1078
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7/15/2002  2:19 PM
All very good points on Spree and his intensity, guys. Latrell
has many intagibles.

I was reading the NJO message boards and one guy made some really good points.

While Spree does take many jumpshots and threes (especially last year,)he is a slasher and a creator.

Glen Robinson is mostly a jump shooting big man. His offense is similar to Allan Houstons.

I think that having diversity on offense is key.

I think that if we get a monster rebounder and defender (Jerome James,) he will make up for the lack of height at the 3.

Thought?
davpowerslave
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7/15/2002  2:35 PM
Posted by Dan1078:


I think that having diversity on offense is key.

I think that if we get a monster rebounder and defender (Jerome James,) he will make up for the lack of height at the 3.

Thought?

I agree Dan, id rather keep sprewell, but something that people have to consider here is how sprewell is feeling here, he hasnt had any comments about the mcdyess move, considering they traded a good friend in camby away, he cant be thrilled about that, what if he wants out of here as well, just fed up with the situation and wants to go somewhere else? What then? Not only that, dolan was fuming when he walked out on one of his talks with the team, maybe he has already given the edict to layden to get rid of him? Layden may not be the one to blame if he gets traded.
ClydeDaGlide
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7/15/2002  2:39 PM
LOL, this is soooo stupid. Listen up all you Big Dog advocates:
Ask yourselves this questions: if G-Rob is so much better than Spree, why would the Bucks offer him and another player to aquire just Sprewell?! Know the answer? They wouldn’t! Everyone in the NBA knows that Spree is a great player, everyone in the NBA also knows that the Big Dog is a soft player…
I came here to drink beer and kick some ass, and we're almost out of beer...
WOODMANnYk
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7/15/2002  2:49 PM
Posted by Dan1078:

All very good points on Spree and his intensity, guys. Latrell
has many intagibles.

I was reading the NJO message boards and one guy made some really good points.

While Spree does take many jumpshots and threes (especially last year,)he is a slasher and a creator.

Glen Robinson is mostly a jump shooting big man. His offense is similar to Allan Houstons.

I think that having diversity on offense is key.

I think that if we get a monster rebounder and defender (Jerome James,) he will make up for the lack of height at the 3.

Thought?
SPree took many shots last yr and so did Houston cause knicks had no post up player. Many people don't realize this but Lj's absence really hurt the knicks last yr along with Camby juggernaut rebounding ability from his injury. The Knicks were forced to be a jump shooting team. Now, with the addition of McDyess, it will certainly escalate H20 and Spree's game. All they need now is to acquire some big guys to protect McDyess, clog the middle and block shots. Jerome(Mr. Candybar)James probably wouldn't be a good idea cause he will cost the knicks all the 4.7mm exception for over 5yrs of time. This guy was playing 17 minutes a game and definitely don't deserve that kind of money. If the knicks decide to give him half of it, Seattle will match that offer cause James is a restricted Free-agent. I had suggested the knicks splitting the 4.7mm to Jarron collins and Michael Doleac which will come alot cheaper. Both guys are not restricted and stand 6'11/255pds. Knicks need to spend less since they're payroll is amongst the top in the league.
The Future. GO KNICKS!
Dan1078
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7/15/2002  3:25 PM
Good points, bb10. I would love for the Knicks to get Keon.

They still have a chance. Check out this link

waymoresports.thestar.com...

[Edited by Andrew: The long link was messing up some browsers so I modified it a bit.]
HARDCOREKNICKSFAN
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7/15/2002  3:36 PM
I believe that the best strategy is for the Knicks to not rush into any signings right off the bat. Keon, Jerome, and the other restricted FA's will see the market shrinking, and their salary demands should follow suit. If not, then the options of trades and signing unrestricted FA's like what others have been mentioning.

If we play our cards right, we can keep the core 3 intact and successfully fill all the holes in our roster.
Another season, and more adversity to persevere through. We will get the job done, even BETTER than last year. GO KNICKS!
Dan1078
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7/15/2002  3:59 PM
What pt guards do you have in mind, HKF?
davpowerslave
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7/15/2002  4:21 PM
Posted by HARDCOREKNICKSFAN:

I believe that the best strategy is for the Knicks to not rush into any signings right off the bat. Keon, Jerome, and the other restricted FA's will see the market shrinking, and their salary demands should follow suit. If not, then the options of trades and signing unrestricted FA's like what others have been mentioning.

If we play our cards right, we can keep the core 3 intact and successfully fill all the holes in our roster.

Not rush into any signings? Last year, they didnt rush and ended up with weatherspoon haha....market shrinking implies the people available are dwindling, meaning if we wait to long, we may just end up with doleac cuz he's the only one left....and as for sign and trades, the knicks have explored some possibilities and have been rebuffed so far....if teams didnt want any knick players now, why would they want them later? Really, first you explore sign and trades and trades in general, and when those avenues become closed, you go after free agents.....if you wait to long, you risk losing out on both...personally i like clark, but he wants a warm weather town, knicks havent invited him yet for a tour....they invited james, and i think they are most interested in him because they feel they could get him, clark probably wouldnt sign an offer sheet with the knicks so its a moot point, everybody thinks we can just go out and sign anybody, but the fact is that the player has to agree to an offer sheet, so if the knicks sign james, and not clark, dont be upset because that is most likely an indication that they knew clark wouldnt sign with the knicks anyway.
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