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OT what is going with these hurricanes?
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BRIGGS
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9/21/2005  6:01 PM
another massive blast-worse than katrina coming? i know that it's good for people along the atlantic coast for the most part in terms of storms because of cool water, but its going to be our turn here at some point?

they are going to have to build homes with concrete and come up with some kind of super fiberoptic instrument to attack storms at their epicenters
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EnySpree
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9/21/2005  6:17 PM
global warming.....ever see "Day after tomorrow" Climate shift? That could happen.
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Allanfan20
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9/21/2005  6:21 PM
Yeah, I have to say I think Global Warming very well could have something to do with it. People do some of the most careless things, and now we are all paying for it. But since the environment isn't an important issue in some eyes (Cough cough, George Bush) it doesn't really matter.
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teslawlo
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9/21/2005  6:21 PM
1 degree temperature change = natural disasters on the scale of this. Imagine what will happen if the temperature changes say, 5 degrees due to global warming. wow. I'm not going to even get into the right or wrong of politics, this is just horrible for everyday citizens of america and other countries.
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Caseloads
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9/21/2005  6:30 PM
yeah, this whole thing makes me worry about global warming.
nyk4ever
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9/21/2005  6:50 PM
Global Warming was and is the cause of El Nino and El Nino warmed up the oceans around the world immensly. Just take a look at the pictures of the artic where the MASSIVE glaciers that have been around for thousands and thousands of years which are beginning to melt away at paces that seem to increase every year. There isn't much that can be done about this now, over time we've slept in the bed and we're going to have to make it. There haven't been many hurricane seasons that can boast having to storms that were Category 4 and above to make landfall, let alone just have one that reaches that high but now lately you are seeing the amount of Category 4's to increase... It's scary really.
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martin
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9/21/2005  6:53 PM
Don't know much about global warming and all but did read State of Fear by Michael Crichton. Not a bad book and Crichton usually throws in more than a little truth about his topic du jour, this time it happened to be about global warming. Don't know how acurate the book it but it seems to argue that we have little scientific proof that global warming actually exists.
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OasisBU
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9/21/2005  7:25 PM
Posted by Caseloads:

yeah, this whole thing makes me worry about global warming.


but i bet you are still gassing up your car and driving like the rest of the world

it will take real natural catastrophe to make the oil companies change their ways and release the patents to alternative fuel products. When I say real, I mean something so catastophic we cant even dream it up yet with economic ramifications never before seen in the history of the world. Do you think oil companies cared about Katrina? No they lined their pockets off it.
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Rich
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9/21/2005  7:26 PM
It's either global warming or Bush is cursed.
OasisBU
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9/21/2005  7:28 PM
Posted by Rich:

It's either global warming or Bush is cursed.

How about a little bit of both?
"If at first you don't succeed, then maybe you just SUCK." Kenny Powers
Rich
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9/21/2005  7:35 PM
Posted by martin:

Don't know much about global warming and all but did read State of Fear by Michael Crichton. Not a bad book and Crichton usually throws in more than a little truth about his topic du jour, this time it happened to be about global warming. Don't know how acurate the book it but it seems to argue that we have little scientific proof that global warming actually exists.

A critique of Crichton's book an article by George Will praising it:

http://www.realclimate.org/index.php?p=90
Rich
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9/21/2005  7:35 PM
Posted by OasisBU:
Posted by Rich:

It's either global warming or Bush is cursed.

How about a little bit of both?

Makes sense.
MinsHeartsReezy
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9/21/2005  7:59 PM
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2005/08/0804_050804_hurricanewarming_2.html
Is Global Warming Making Hurricanes Worse?

John Roach
for National Geographic News

August 4, 2005

Hurricanes bring winds and slashing rains that flood streets, flatten homes, and leave survivors struggling to pick up the pieces. But has global warming given the storms an added punch, making the aftereffects more dreadful?

According to hurricane historian Jay Barnes of Pine Knoll Shores, North Carolina, ocean heat is the key ingredient for hurricane formation. More heat could "generate more storms and more intense hurricanes," he said.


Numerous studies in recent years have found no evidence that the number of hurricanes and their northwest Pacific Ocean cousins, typhoons, is increasing because of the rise in global temperatures.

But a new study in the journal Nature found that hurricanes and typhoons have become stronger and longer-lasting over the past 30 years. These upswings correlate with a rise in sea surface temperatures.

The duration and strength of hurricanes have increased by about 50 percent over the last three decades, according to study author Kerry Emanuel, a professor of atmospheric science at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology in Cambridge.

Emanuel's finding defies existing models for measuring storm strength. Current models suggest that the intensity of hurricanes and typhoons should increase by 5 percent for every 1ºC (1.8ºF) rise in sea surface temperature.

"We've had half a degree [Celsius] of warming, so that should have led to a 2.5 percent increase [in intensity], which is probably not detectable," Emanuel said. "What we've seen is somewhat bigger than that, and we don't really know why."

One possibility, Emanuel said, is that ocean temperatures may be increasing more quickly than atmospheric temperatures.

"When that happens we've shown theoretically you get an increase in the intensity of hurricanes," he said.

Anatomy of a Hurricane

According to Barnes, who has authored several books on U.S. hurricane history, the physics of hurricanes are complex and full of variables. "But the sun beating down on Earth is the primary thing that gets it going," he said.

Barnes explains in his book North Carolina's Hurricane History that the summer heat warms the ocean's surface and spurs evaporation. As heat and moisture rise into the atmosphere, billowing clouds, scattered showers, and thunderstorms form.


As the thunderstorms multiply, they can get picked up by low-pressure systems drifting through equatorial waters, forming a tropical depression.

The spin of the Earth causes the winds within the storm to whirl around the center of the low pressure. This spinning can form an eye of a storm.


The strongest part of a hurricane is the eye wall, on the edge of the calm center. "The size of the eye wall can vary, and the intensity of the storm can vary depending on how much heat is available" and other factors such as high altitude winds, Barnes said.

According to Emanuel, if global temperatures continue to rise, it is reasonable to assume that hurricane activity will increase, as there is more heat to drive the storms.

Global Observation

Previous studies have tried to measure whether typhoons and hurricanes were becoming more frequent. Emanuel's research, however, focused on the total energy generated by the storms over their duration.

"They can have the same frequency, but if they get stronger or last longer this metric will show an increase," he said.

When Emanuel looked at the hurricane record in the North Atlantic, where the storms of most interest to U.S. residents form, he found that intensity fluctuated from decade to decade.

This fluctuation roughly corresponded with factors such as the El Niño weather phenomenon, which has been shown to influence hurricane formation.

However, North Atlantic hurricanes account for only 12 percent of the total number of hurricanes and typhoons that form globally each year, Emanuel said.

"If you look at a more global measure of this metric, you don't see these strong interdecadal swings. They cancel each other out between one ocean and the other," he said. "You see instead a large upward trend."

According to Emanuel, on a global scale, the strength of storms corresponds with ocean temperatures: It goes up when temperatures go up, down when temperatures goes down.

Most scientists say the rise in sea surface temperature in the last 30 to 50 years is a signal of global warming.

"That's their conclusion, not mine," Emanuel said. "[But] it would follow reasonably well from this metric that the upswing [in intensity] … is a result of global warming."



MinsHeartsReezy
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9/21/2005  8:03 PM
http://www.livescience.com/forcesofnature/ap_050731_hurricanes_stronger.html

Study: Global Warming Making Hurricanes Stronger
By Associated Press

posted: 31 July 2005
06:29 pm ET



Is global warming making hurricanes more ferocious? New research suggests the answer is yes. Scientists call the findings both surprising and "alarming'' because they suggest global warming is influencing storms now -- rather than in the distant future.

However, the research doesn't suggest global warming is generating more hurricanes and typhoons.

The analysis by climatologist Kerry Emanuel of the Massachusetts Institute of Technology shows for the first time that major storms spinning in both the Atlantic and the Pacific since the 1970s have increased in duration and intensity by about 50 percent.

These trends are closely linked to increases in the average temperatures of the ocean surface and also correspond to increases in global average atmospheric temperatures during the same period.

"When I look at these results at face value, they are rather alarming,'' said research meteorologist Tom Knutson. "These are very big changes.''

Knutson, who wasn't involved in the study, works in the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration's Geophysical Fluid Dynamics Laboratory in Princeton, N.J.

Emanuel reached his conclusions by analyzing data collected from actual storms rather than using computer models to predict future storm behavior.

Before this study, most researchers believed global warming's contribution to powerful hurricanes was too slight to accurately measure. Most forecasts don't have climate change making a real difference in tropical storms until 2050 or later.

But some scientists questioned Emanuel's methods. For example, the MIT researcher did not consider wind speed information from some powerful storms in the 1950s and 1960s because the details of those storms are inconsistent.

Researchers are using new methods to analyze those storms and others going back as far as 1851. If early storms turn out to be more powerful than originally thought, Emmanuel's findings on global warming's influence on recent tropical storms might not hold up, they said.

"I'm not convinced that it's happening,'' said Christopher W. Landsea, another research meteorologist with NOAA, who works at a different lab, the Atlantic Oceanographic & Meteorological Laboratory in Miami. Landsea is a director of the historical hurricane reanalysis.

"His conclusions are contingent on a very large bias removal that is large or larger than the global warming signal itself,'' Landsea said.

Details of Emanuel's study appear Sunday in the online version of the journal Nature.

Theories and computer simulations indicate that global warming should generate an increase in storm intensity, in part because warmer temperatures would heat up the surface of the oceans. Especially in the Atlantic and Caribbean basins, pools of warming seawater provide energy for storms as they swirl and grow over the open oceans.

Emanuel analyzed records of storm measurements made by aircraft and satellites since the 1950s. He found the amount of energy released in these storms in both the North Atlantic and the North Pacific oceans has increased, especially since the mid-1970s.

In the Atlantic, the sea surface temperatures show a pronounced upward trend. The same is true in the North Pacific, though the data there is more variable, he said.

"This is the first time I have been convinced we are seeing a signal in the actual hurricane data,'' Emanuel said in an e-mail exchange.

"The total energy dissipated by hurricanes turns out to be well correlated with tropical sea surface temperatures,'' he said. "The large upswing in the past decade is unprecedented and probably reflects the effects of global warming.''

This year marked the first time on record that the Atlantic spawned four named storms by early July, as well as the earliest category 4 storm on record. Hurricanes are ranked on an intensity scale of 1 to 5.

In the past decade, the southeastern United States and the Caribbean basin have been pummeled by the most active hurricane cycle on record. Forecasters expect the stormy trend to continue for another 20 years or more.

Even without global warming, hurricane cycles tend to be a consequence of natural salinity and temperature changes in the Atlantic's deep current circulation that shift back and forth every 40 to 60 years.

Since the 1970s, hurricanes have caused more property damage and casualties. Researchers disagree over whether this destructiveness is a consequence of the storms' growing intensity or the population boom along vulnerable coastlines.

"The damage and casualties produced by more intense storms could increase considerably in the future,'' Emanuel said.

EnySpree
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9/21/2005  8:31 PM
well they say it's not global warming but then say it's the rising temperature of the surface water.......now i live in a van by the river married to my sister with 3 retarded children but I still know something is wrong with that.

We can't do anything about it, but there is something going on with the climate. We are on a planet and **** happens. They say the Earth is due to have a climate change. It has to do with the poles changing and the revolving around the sun. I'll see if I can find info on that.

Another thing to think about is the Dinosaurs.....something happened to them......like I said we are on a planet. Things happen that have been happening for millions of years.
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Killa4luv
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9/21/2005  8:58 PM
Global Warming is real and if it weren't for right wing think tanks financing research with their results in mind, we all might accept that and begin to do something about it.

Second hand smoke is real and evolution is a scientific fact. The sooner this country emerges from the dark ages and stops foresaking scientific reality because it doesn't flow nicely with their bible or Koran, the world will be a better place to live.
Nalod
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9/21/2005  9:28 PM
Layden.
BRIGGS
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9/22/2005  3:14 AM
175 mph! please lord, slow this thing down tomorrow and hook it due south i mean at this rate this thing will make a large chunk of texas waste lands perhaps through the middle of the entire mass of state! look at the map--this is the worst storm that has ever been documented right now it is 25-35% bigger than the storm that leveled NO and winds are atleast 25 MPH faster and surging into warmer waters!
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raven
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9/22/2005  3:25 AM
For those who would be interested by global warming, I kindly suggest you to do some research about El Nino, brought in the thread by nyk4ever.

This thing is an absolute monstruosity, that shapeshifts from snow storm s to crazy floods and dryness... Its effects have been known to increase since hte first years it "was born".

I guess all of our lack of responsability may be catching us. But we still have the time and the means to correct that.
EnySpree
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9/22/2005  6:14 AM
Posted by Rich:

It's either global warming or Bush is cursed.

Bush is the Anti-Christ.

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OT what is going with these hurricanes?

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