look, I know that sounds crazy, but Buttler and Wallace are about the same hight and Butler is still young. He is already a scorer in his own right, if he can concentrate on establishing himself on the defensive end, rebound and shot blocks, he could as well be the Center that we are searching for. Isiah is trying to court a lot of guys, I.E. Swift who is about the same hight and the softy Kwame. Since we are in trying stage right now, why not put Butler on the court with Frye and see what the two can do together?

Butler is a natural Center although short, and Frye is a natural PF...experiment with that possibility and see what we can get out of it.

We got 3 block shots between the two and a total of 8 rebounds...with much more playing together on the court, there is no telling if the production of the two will not resemble those of the Wallace brothers..

[Edited by - diderotn on 07/07/2005 11:26:03]

Simply answer to your question...no he'll never be the next Ben Wallace.

Its amazing how everyone just knows exactly how a player will or will not be. Come on, we haven't even seen Butler to think he will or he will never be like Wallace. And to me, thats not even the point. I only want Butler to be a good player that sticks around with the Knicks. Anything else will be a bonus...

To answer your question. Yes, he can be whatever he wants to be.

Do I think he will be? No. Just a gut feeling.

Posted by NYKBocker:

To answer your question. Yes, he can be whatever he wants to be.

Do I think he will be? No. Just a gut feeling.

[Kids]
I know I can (I know I can)
Be what I want a be (be what I want a be)
If I work hard at it (If I work hard at it)
I'll be where I want a be (I'll be where I want a be)

[Nas]
Be, B-Boys and girls, listen up
You can be anything in the world, in God we trust
An architect, doctor, maybe an actress
But nothing comes easy it takes much practice
Like, I met a woman who's becoming a star
She was very beautiful, leaving people in awe
Singing songs, Lina Horn, but the younger version
Hung with the wrong person
got her strung on that heroin
cocaine sniffing up drugs all in her nose...
Coulda died, so young, now looks ugly and old
No fun cause now when she reaches for hugs people hold they breath
Cause she smells of corrosion and death
Watch the company you keep and the crowd you bring
Cause they came to do drugs and you came to sing
So if you gonna be the best, I'm a tell you how,
Put your hands in the air, and take a vow

[Chorus - 2x (Nas and Kids)]
I know I can (I know I can)
Be what I want a be (be what I want a be)
If I work hard at it (If I work hard at it)
I'll be where I want a be (I'll be where I want a be)

[Nas]
Be, B-Boys and girls, listen again
This is for grown looking girls who's only ten
The ones who watch videos and do what they see
As cute as can be, up in the club with fake ID
Careful, 'fore you meet a man with HIV
You can host the TV like Oprah Winfrey
Whatever you decide, be careful, some men be
Rapists, so act your age, don't pretend to be
Older than you are, give yourself time to grow
You thinking he can give you wealth, but so
Young boys, you can use a lot of help, you know
You thinking life's all about smoking weed and ice
You don't want a be my age and can't read and write
Begging different women for a place to sleep at night
Smart boys turn to men and do whatever they wish
If you believe you can achieve, then say it like this

[Chorus]

[Nas]
Be, be, 'fore we came to this country
We were kings and queens, never porch monkeys
It was empires in Africa called Kush
Timbuktu, where every race came to get books
To learn from black teachers who taught Greeks and Romans
Asian, Arabs and gave them gold when
Gold was converted to money it all changed
Money then became empowerment for Europeans
The Persian military invaded
They heard about the gold, the teachings, and everything sacred
Africa was almost robbed naked
Slavery was money, so they began making slave ships
Egypt was the place that Alexander the Great went
He was so shocked at the mountains with black faces
Shot off they nose to impose what basically
Still goes on today, you see?
If the truth is told, the youth can grow
Then learn to survive until they gain control
Nobody says you have to be gangstas, hoes
Read more learn more, change the globe
Ghetto children, do your thing
Hold your head up, little man, you're a king
Young Princess when you get your wedding ring
Your man is saying "She's my queen"

[Chorus]

ow owww owww 6x more

Save the music y'all, save the music y'all
Save the music y'all, save the music y'all
Save the music

You guys are tripping. Look the question is "can Butler be the next Ben Wallace" not that I said that this kid was going to be the next Ben Wallace...

Posted by rvhoss:

no way...has he even shown anything that leads you to believe he is even the next Sweetney?

Exactly Masterplan

i do think we could see a success story of a high school kid who went undrafted making it in the league in the near future. it's totally feasible to have a talented kid go unrecognized that early in his life/career, lots of unheralded kids that age make a name for themselves in college or even after so why couldn't an undrafted high school kid develop? could be anyone, butler or any of too many other kids, but just because butler got some bad advice coming out of HS doesn't mean he's destined to be a scrub.

ah summer time, the scrub's time to shine in the SL.

Jackie is too good not shine. If this kid can dominate the NBDL, he sure as hell can do the same in SL. Now, the question is this, does he have a good enough PG to dish him the ball? Nate is a scoring PG, he doesn't know how to run a team. We need a true PG in that SL roster to help our bigs to shine. I don't know if you have realized that, Ariza had more assists than Nate.

Posted by NYKBocker:

If Jackie Butler doesn't shine in the summer league then he should be sent packing.

Just reserve your feelings towards the boy in a good 2 to 3 years.

Posted by SkyWalker:

NO....never even saw the kid, but my asnwer is NO

Posted by NYKBocker:

Posted by diderotn:

Jackie is too good not shine. If this kid can dominate the NBDL, he sure as hell can do the same in SL. Now, the question is this, does he have a good enough PG to dish him the ball? Nate is a scoring PG, he doesn't know how to run a team. We need a true PG in that SL roster to help our bigs to shine. I don't know if you have realized that, Ariza had more assists than Nate.

Posted by NYKBocker:

If Jackie Butler doesn't shine in the summer league then he should be sent packing.

He doesn't need a PG to play good post defense, block shots and rebound. I don't look at points from big men anyways due to the fact that they rely on the guards to give them the ball.

Here are the stats from the last game
NO NAME MIN FGM-A 3PM-A FTM-A OREB DREB REB AST STL BLK TO PF PTS
KNICKS .TEAM, N/A 0 0-0 0-0 0-0 3 1 4 0 0 0 1 0 0
04 Nate Robinson, G 25 7-17 1-3 5-6 2 3 5 4 1 0 3 4 20
14 Bruno Sundov, C 19 3-6 0-0 0-0 0 1 1 1 1 0 3 5 6
21 Trevor Ariza, F 37 6-12 0-1 4-5 4 4 8 6 0 0 4 2 16
25 Rueben Douglas, G 17 3-6 0-2 0-0 1 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 6
27 Aaron Miles, G 15 1-3 0-0 1-2 1 2 3 4 0 0 1 3 3
35 Brent Wright, F 13 4-5 0-1 0-0 0 0 0 1 2 0 0 1 8
42 David Lee, F 21 2-6 0-0 5-7 4 3 7 2 1 0 1 3 9
45 Jackie Butler, C 17 1-3 0-0 0-1 0 5 5 0 0 2 2 3 2
51 Channing Fyre, C 29 5-15 0-1 6-6 2 1 3 2 0 1 2 4 16
52 Otis George, F/C 7 1-2 0-0 1-2 2 1 3 0 1 0 2 3 3

He needs to get more than 5 rebounds a game. The 2 blocks are interesting.

[Edited by - NYKBocker on 07/07/2005 14:00:01]

5rebs & 2blks in only 17mins isn't bad!