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Why the Knicks should resign Herb Williams.
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Cookdcokehop
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7/7/2005  10:05 AM


Yes,I'm back on the Herb Williams bandwagon, but I have a good reason. First off, all the best available coaches that we wanted are signed to another team or not coming to NY. Another reason is that Herb has already start teaching his system and plays to the rookies. Its hard for a rookie to have 2 coaches and learn 2 different things before the season even starts. Plus Bill Laimbeer, has no NBA coaching experience, he is ****y, and I can see by his attitude, Marbury wont be cool with him.

If Herb resigns, we get Patrick Ewing as an assistant coach. Who better than Pat and Aguirre to work with our Bigs. The last reason why I think Herb should be resigned is the players like him. Its good to have a good relatiobship with your coach. He made them played harder. At times, he even made Crawford look like a smart player. I think Zekes will talk to him about playing Marbs less and playing the rookies more.

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OasisBU
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7/7/2005  10:07 AM
Personally I would love to see Pat Ewing on the sidelines at MSG guiding this team in the right direction and teaching our bigs everything he knows.
"If at first you don't succeed, then maybe you just SUCK." Kenny Powers
diderotn
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7/7/2005  10:12 AM
Here is another Knickebocker that still resides in the past partial success...Look, the time has come for you all to get a grip with realitiy. First of all, the Ewing era didn't earn the Knicks any championship, why in the world are you all so stock with it??? the ultimate goal is championship, as much as you all talk about the Ewing era, I have yet to hear any of you fans talk about our better years of Earl the Pearl and the other great ones that earned the Knicks many rings and credibiliy....
The true Knickabocker..........
Cookdcokehop
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7/7/2005  10:17 AM
Posted by diderotn:

Here is another Knickebocker that still resides in the past partial success...Look, the time has come for you all to get a grip with realitiy. First of all, the Ewing era didn't earn the Knicks any championship, why in the world are you all so stock with it??? the ultimate goal is championship, as much as you all talk about the Ewing era, I have yet to hear any of you fans talk about our better years of Earl the Pearl and the other great ones that earned the Knicks many rings and credibiliy....
Umm I didnt say anything about the Ewing Era. Im not as old as you, I havent been watching basketball since the Earl the pearl Era, Im only 18. Look what Pat did to Yaos game. Yao is more fierce now. Backs down with no fear, and way better defensively. Im just saying maybe he could teach or bigs some of that.
diderotn
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7/7/2005  10:23 AM
I am not that old either, I am just a student of the game. As for your comment about Yao, let me inform you, Pat didn't do much for Yao's game. He came in the league ready to contribute as a big man. Pat might have told him a few things or two, but how can you attribute Yao who has been so successful since his arrival in the league to Ewing???? that is insane. Pat had a good chance to coach bot Kwame and Haywood, neither of them did well during his time with the Zards. In fact they have both regressed...

Umm I didnt say anything about the Ewing Era. Im not as old as you, I havent been watching basketball since the Earl the pearl Era, Im only 18. Look what Pat did to Yaos game. Yao is more fierce now. Backs down with no fear, and way better defensively. Im just saying maybe he could teach or bigs some of that.
The true Knickabocker..........
Mac
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7/7/2005  10:25 AM
Posted by Cookdcokehop:



Yes,I'm back on the Herb Williams bandwagon, but I have a good reason. First off, all the best available coaches that we wanted are signed to another team or not coming to NY. Another reason is that Herb has already start teaching his system and plays to the rookies. Its hard for a rookie to have 2 coaches and learn 2 different things before the season even starts. Plus Bill Laimbeer, has no NBA coaching experience, he is ****y, and I can see by his attitude, Marbury wont be cool with him.

If Herb resigns, we get Patrick Ewing as an assistant coach. Who better than Pat and Aguirre to work with our Bigs. The last reason why I think Herb should be resigned is the players like him. Its good to have a good relatiobship with your coach. He made them played harder. At times, he even made Crawford look like a smart player. I think Zekes will talk to him about playing Marbs less and playing the rookies more.

Laimbeer ****y? You mean as a player? Herb should be re-signed because Laimbeer has no NBA coaching experience? How about championships with the pistons as a player and as a coach in the wNBA? Herb's deep head coaching resume involves losing his team's attention in the last part of the season, that's a lot better than rings...

Laimbeer even said that he hates it when coaches yell.

BTW, those guys probably played for DOZENS of coaches so one more won't hurt them.
...and Ewing taking the assistant spot if Herb resigns is like Ewing going out with Herb's ex girlfreind.
diderotn
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7/7/2005  10:30 AM
One reasons why Herb should not resign

What has he won throughout his basketball career???

Nada, rien, Garnix, niente= Nothing.....Herb has been a loser all of his basketball career, and it is a fact.
The true Knickabocker..........
Cookdcokehop
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7/7/2005  10:35 AM
I dont think his success in the WNBA will translate to success to the NBA. The WNBA is a jumpshot league. In the NBA, you got to deal with attitudes and egos, as well as playing time.Coaching females is nothing compared to coaching men. And just because he won rings as a player that means hell be a good coach? So I guess Derek Fisher should be a better coach than Laimbeer when he retires because he has more rings.
NYKBocker
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7/7/2005  10:39 AM
Posted by diderotn:

One reasons why Herb should not resign

What has he won throughout his basketball career???

Nada, rien, Garnix, niente= Nothing.....Herb has been a loser all of his basketball career, and it is a fact.

This is a copy and paste to my response to your post on the other thread...

You can't judge a coach by what he has done as a player. Check out Pat Riley's stats. He wasn't very good. A role player at best.

Check out Phil Jackson's stats. He was also a role player.

Gotta give Herb time. He is a NY Knick. Gotta give your own a chance first before giving a bad boy a chance.
Cookdcokehop
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7/7/2005  10:39 AM
Plus look at what kind of situation Herb was put in. Its not like we got George Karl. No we got and inexperinced coach. But he got us to play Hard. You know how many games we lost in the last 90 seconds? They tried for Herb. They actually showed heart. Tim Thomas showed he can put a body on somebody. Marbury played more 2. Crawford had a career high in assist. We have to take these things in account. He didnt have a good season wins wise, but he made the team play like a team.
Mac
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7/7/2005  10:41 AM
Posted by Cookdcokehop:

I dont think his success in the WNBA will translate to success to the NBA. The WNBA is a jumpshot league. In the NBA, you got to deal with attitudes and egos, as well as playing time.Coaching females is nothing compared to coaching men. And just because he won rings as a player that means hell be a good coach? So I guess Derek Fisher should be a better coach than Laimbeer when he retires because he has more rings.

your generalizations make it hard for me to take you seriously. Let's just say that between two coaches, if one of them has proven to be the best (even if its once, even if its in a "lesser" league), IMO that's the better candidate. You don't have a leg to stand on.
MattSuspect
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7/7/2005  10:46 AM
The Knicks should keep Herb, because it gives Zeke the leverage to make a change when someone really good becomes available. It's really that simple.

If he hires somebody like Bill L, he can't fire him for the next two years. Herb, he can get rid of in March if he feels he has to.

Herb's really the only logical choice at this point.
NYKBocker
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7/7/2005  10:46 AM
Posted by Mac:
Posted by Cookdcokehop:

I dont think his success in the WNBA will translate to success to the NBA. The WNBA is a jumpshot league. In the NBA, you got to deal with attitudes and egos, as well as playing time.Coaching females is nothing compared to coaching men. And just because he won rings as a player that means hell be a good coach? So I guess Derek Fisher should be a better coach than Laimbeer when he retires because he has more rings.

your generalizations make it hard for me to take you seriously. Let's just say that between two coaches, if one of them has proven to be the best (even if its once, even if its in a "lesser" league), IMO that's the better candidate. You don't have a leg to stand on.

Bill also got a full training camp to instill his plays. Give Herb a full training camp and if he fails then we can go to another direction.

What Herb showed me was that he was not afraid to ruffle anybodies feathers. In the games he coached, he went with the hot hand. My only complaint was that he benched Ariza a couple of games, but maybe Trevor did something to deserv the benching. I don't know.
diderotn
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7/7/2005  10:52 AM
Oh yeah!!!! how many championships have they won as players or coaches???? Pat won a couple of championship while playing for the Lakers, and need I address your statement about Phil Jackson???? He won a couple while playing with the Knicks too
You can't judge a coach by what he has done as a player. Check out Pat Riley's stats. He wasn't very good. A role player at best.

Check out Phil Jackson's stats. He was also a role player.

Gotta give Herb time. He is a NY Knick. Gotta give your own a chance first before giving a bad boy a chance.
The true Knickabocker..........
Cookdcokehop
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7/7/2005  10:55 AM
Posted by Mac:
Posted by Cookdcokehop:

I dont think his success in the WNBA will translate to success to the NBA. The WNBA is a jumpshot league. In the NBA, you got to deal with attitudes and egos, as well as playing time.Coaching females is nothing compared to coaching men. And just because he won rings as a player that means hell be a good coach? So I guess Derek Fisher should be a better coach than Laimbeer when he retires because he has more rings.
What did Herb do so wrong that he cannot be resigned? If we hire Laimbeer, that will be our forth coach in 2 years. A team needs consistency for success. This is Herb Willaims first time ever coaching, and by the way the team played for him, I say he is a good coach. Even other coachs complimented Herb. You put Laimbeer in the same time we put Herb in last year there wouldnt be much difference. Now with an upgraded and improved roster, Herb has more to work with. He already knows all the players and how they play. He knows what they need to work on. Quote me If Laimbeer is coaching were starting the season with a losing streak.

your generalizations make it hard for me to take you seriously. Let's just say that between two coaches, if one of them has proven to be the best (even if its once, even if its in a "lesser" league), IMO that's the better candidate. You don't have a leg to stand on.
diderotn
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7/7/2005  10:56 AM
How many years do you intend on sticking with this way of thinking???? the time has come for the Knicks to develop continuity in all areas. We need to instill a coaching staff that will be with the core players that we have around for a good 3 years....Herb is not the ideal guy...He has been with this franchise for too long and has not gotten a chance to go and venture around to learn new systems, etc. Herb has to go...

Posted by MattSuspect:

The Knicks should keep Herb, because it gives Zeke the leverage to make a change when someone really good becomes available. It's really that simple.

If he hires somebody like Bill L, he can't fire him for the next two years. Herb, he can get rid of in March if he feels he has to.

Herb's really the only logical choice at this point.
The true Knickabocker..........
MattSuspect
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7/7/2005  11:10 AM
There's no one out there right now. Bill Laimbeer is a halfassed WNBA coach.

Give me Martelli or someone of that caliber...mayyyybe. But don't get rid of Herb for some guy who has no real track record coaching to speak of.
NYKBocker
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7/7/2005  11:11 AM
Posted by diderotn:

Oh yeah!!!! how many championships have they won as players or coaches???? Pat won a couple of championship while playing for the Lakers, and need I address your statement about Phil Jackson???? He won a couple while playing with the Knicks too
You can't judge a coach by what he has done as a player. Check out Pat Riley's stats. He wasn't very good. A role player at best.

Check out Phil Jackson's stats. He was also a role player.

Gotta give Herb time. He is a NY Knick. Gotta give your own a chance first before giving a bad boy a chance.

Dang! Did Riley contribute to that title? Here is a link of his playoff stats.
http://www.basketballreference.com/players/playerpage.htm?ilkid=RILEYPA01

Here is Herb Williams.
http://www.basketballreference.com/players/playerpage.htm?ilkid=WILLIHE01

Here is Phil Jackson. Check out his stats on the NYK champ years.
http://www.basketballreference.com/players/playerpage.htm?ilkid=JACKSPH01

Also, if we are going by basketball success as a player as a pre-requisite to be a good coach. How do you explain JVG, StanVG, Scott Skiles? How about Rick Carlisle? Larry Brown is top 5 right now all-time for coaches yet he never played in the NBA.

Herb wasn't a scrub. He was unlucky have played in the Magic/Bird era during his prime. He came close with Knicks as Pat's backup but stupid Jordan had to be born. He was also 1 game 7 away from a championship. Does that count?
diderotn
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7/7/2005  11:11 AM
Isiah is a very smart cat, when it comes down to our coach next season, he will pick his old team-mate (Bill Laimbeer).

Posted by MattSuspect:

There's no one out there right now. Bill Laimbeer is a halfassed WNBA coach.

Give me Martelli or someone of that caliber...mayyyybe. But don't get rid of Herb for some guy who has no real track record coaching to speak of.
The true Knickabocker..........
technomaster
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7/7/2005  11:41 AM
I kind of think role players/bench warmers on winning/championship teams make excellent coaches.

Former superstars rarely become good coaches-- they can't understand why their players don't see the floor as well or execute as they once did.

Former unsuccessful superstars: Doug Collins, Magic Johnson, Isiah Thomas

Regular talents: Starters/role players (mostly PGs): Cheeks, McMillan, Porter, Avery Johnson, Phil Jackson, Larry Brown, Doc Rivers

Then you have the Xs and Os guys, career coaches who never really had pro playing careers: Fratello, JVG, SVG, Lawrence Frank

You rarely see former centers in head coaching positions because in general they weren't too concerned with everything happening on the floor as players.

I think a lot of the former dynasty Bulls role players would make good coaches: BJ Armstrong, Kerr, Pete Myers, Ron Harper
Posted by NYKBocker:
Posted by diderotn:

One reasons why Herb should not resign

What has he won throughout his basketball career???

Nada, rien, Garnix, niente= Nothing.....Herb has been a loser all of his basketball career, and it is a fact.

This is a copy and paste to my response to your post on the other thread...

You can't judge a coach by what he has done as a player. Check out Pat Riley's stats. He wasn't very good. A role player at best.

Check out Phil Jackson's stats. He was also a role player.

Gotta give Herb time. He is a NY Knick. Gotta give your own a chance first before giving a bad boy a chance.
“That was two, two from the heart.” - John Starks
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