Other than Jordan, Lebron is the most gifted basketball player i ever saw.

is GS not better than Malone / Stockton Utah?

probably not but even if yes, that utah team pushed the bulls hard and that bull team was freakin loaded.

Nalod wrote:After Heat lost to Dallas Lebron changed.
He won my respect from what he does on the court and off it he shut down the obnoxious public persona.

The Decison, the Pep Rally and then the Dallas disrespect all were awful.

I think he has eclipsed Kobe but how do you eclipse the perfection that was Jordan? YOu can't.
He might be a better player than Jordan but thats debatable many times over. Lebron in my mind has gone past Bird, Magic and Kobe.
Timmy Duncan did/does not have that "it" factor but at the same time should get more props with is gaudy ring collection. Maybe the big guys don't get the star treatment.
Kareem, Duncan, Russell all MVPs and all big time!

Rushmore?

Duncan, Kareem, wilt, Logo, Lebron, Jordan

Shaq?

He is in my top 3.

crzymdups wrote:I wouldn't bother ranking Lebron until his career is done - but in his own era, it's hard to argue he was better than Duncan or Kobe - all three guys have two rings a piece in the past 8 years and Duncan and Kobe were older and on their second or third leg of their careers in those eight years, having each won three rings before that.

I can't rank Bron over Duncan or Kobe from his own era.

He deserves a full career and I think he'll certainly be an all-time top ten player when he's done. He might crack the top five by the time he's done, but I don't think he has yet.

if wins this year, top 5 is sealed.

nobody has won with a crappy team. This guy has already been to the finals with the bottom of the barrel teams.

who else has done that?

crzymdups wrote:

mreinman wrote:

crzymdups wrote:I wouldn't bother ranking Lebron until his career is done - but in his own era, it's hard to argue he was better than Duncan or Kobe - all three guys have two rings a piece in the past 8 years and Duncan and Kobe were older and on their second or third leg of their careers in those eight years, having each won three rings before that.

I can't rank Bron over Duncan or Kobe from his own era.

He deserves a full career and I think he'll certainly be an all-time top ten player when he's done. He might crack the top five by the time he's done, but I don't think he has yet.

if wins this year, top 5 is sealed.

nobody has won with a crappy team. This guy has already been to the finals with the bottom of the barrel teams.

who else has done that?

that's true - but the East has been epically bad for the past... what... 15 years? Basically Bron's whole career the East has been a joke and the 7th and 8th seeds in the playoffs in the East have been under .500, whereas in the West the 7th/8th seed win 48-50 games. Teams built in the East seem to be built for the short run, no continuity, so even when a great team is assembled, like the Celtics in 08 or Magic in 09, they're only together for a few years.

I think it's fair to wonder if Lebron would have gotten to the Finals this year (or last year) if he played in the West. Look at that first round series between the Clippers and Spurs - that's the FIRST ROUND in the West and the basketball there feels like it was higher level than what we are seeing in the Finals.

Lebron is a great player - but if you are going to talk about dragging a subpar team to the Finals, you have to talk about his road to the Finals which was a young Boston team no one thought would make the playoffs, a wounded Bulls team that was tearing itself apart from the inside, a Hawks team that was completely wounded and injured and banged up.

very fair take, however, if he beats GS then he has done something that nobody has done. Not even close.

Many of Jordan's great shots I watched live on TV I never saw because my eyes would close with the ball mid-air... I knew they would fall and kill my team and couldn't bare it! I like Golden State and it's like the spirit of their 90s NBA Jam Run TMC team reborn with the Splash Brothers... but I hope LeBron just goes Super Saiyan and take this chip.

crzymdups wrote:

mreinman wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

mreinman wrote:

crzymdups wrote:I wouldn't bother ranking Lebron until his career is done - but in his own era, it's hard to argue he was better than Duncan or Kobe - all three guys have two rings a piece in the past 8 years and Duncan and Kobe were older and on their second or third leg of their careers in those eight years, having each won three rings before that.

I can't rank Bron over Duncan or Kobe from his own era.

He deserves a full career and I think he'll certainly be an all-time top ten player when he's done. He might crack the top five by the time he's done, but I don't think he has yet.

if wins this year, top 5 is sealed.

nobody has won with a crappy team. This guy has already been to the finals with the bottom of the barrel teams.

who else has done that?

that's true - but the East has been epically bad for the past... what... 15 years? Basically Bron's whole career the East has been a joke and the 7th and 8th seeds in the playoffs in the East have been under .500, whereas in the West the 7th/8th seed win 48-50 games. Teams built in the East seem to be built for the short run, no continuity, so even when a great team is assembled, like the Celtics in 08 or Magic in 09, they're only together for a few years.

I think it's fair to wonder if Lebron would have gotten to the Finals this year (or last year) if he played in the West. Look at that first round series between the Clippers and Spurs - that's the FIRST ROUND in the West and the basketball there feels like it was higher level than what we are seeing in the Finals.

Lebron is a great player - but if you are going to talk about dragging a subpar team to the Finals, you have to talk about his road to the Finals which was a young Boston team no one thought would make the playoffs, a wounded Bulls team that was tearing itself apart from the inside, a Hawks team that was completely wounded and injured and banged up.

very fair take, however, if he beats GS then he has done something that nobody has done. Not even close.

Agreed. I think it'll be interesting to see where Bron goes, game wise, in his 30s. He's at the second leg of his career soon. Guys like Kobe and Jordan embraced a less athletic attack and worked out of the post more. I wonder if Bron will do that. It'll be interesting to watch.

Side question - I wonder if Bron wishes he hadn't pushed for that Love for Wiggins trade right now. Next five years, who is a better player? Wiggins could have been the Pippen for Bron and Kyrie. You get the feeling Love will leave this summer or next summer.

I think that Lebron needs Love more than Wiggins just like he needs Love more than Kyrie.

Love had a very good year but Lebron could have done better with him and if he stays, I am sure that we will see that.

Bron has already added a very good post game in the last couple of years ... he is primed to move into the next phase.

Lebron is at the age where Jordan just started winning (crazy!).

Lebron also has a much better body for a prolonged career than Jordan did since he was much smaller and quickness was paramount.

Lebron can finish off his career as a prototypical PF if he chooses.