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Brunson putting Pressure on Knicks FO to build a winner
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blkexec
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6/29/2022  7:41 PM
Bye bye Murray. I didn’t like having 4 non shooters in the lineup anyway. But on the other hand, Murray and Young could be a dangerous back court.
Born in Brooklyn, Raised in Queens, Lives in Maryland. The future is bright, I'm a Knicks fan for life!
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Nalod
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6/29/2022  7:49 PM
Price matters. Leon won’t over pay. He’ll be wrong at times. We did not chase Gordon Haywood, Lowrey, or Derozen.
Did with Kemba. Jury out on Randle and Ef. Ef played to his contract. Sort of.

Question: does anyone think Brunson has another step up in talent? He ready for prime time? Vs. say Derozen who logically hi best days behind him. He makes 27mm. For the same money you get ones future vs ones past. Hindight can tell you the future.
Kemet
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6/29/2022  9:19 PM
smackeddog wrote:
Caseloads wrote:https://nypost.com/2022/06/28/jalen-brunson-to-knicks-momentum-is-growing/

The source close to Brunson believes it is important for the Knicks to lay out a detailed plan of how they will become a contender if Brunson joins them. That means everyone being aligned — front office, coaches, players — with one mission in mind. Brunson, the source said, will create a pros-and-cons list when it comes time to make a decision.

“The Knicks will have to present a detailed plan of how to create a winning culture,” the source said. “He’s very calculated. He’ll do what he thinks is best for his long-term career. Winning is extremely important to him. He wants to be in an organization where excelling is valued, around guys in the locker room buying into the same thing he’s buying into.”

Is this his elaborate way of saying “get rid of Randle”?


Yes! Yes! Yes! PG Randle have to go! And Thibs too!
Brunson's Pop's been looking over the Knicks from bottom to top the past 2 to 3 weeks.
And the Knicks 37-45 season shows the Knicks could use improvement in several areas in the organization.
Brunson's doing his due diligence by weighing his option on both Mavs vs Knicks team, plus measure his power of demand as a max player. Especially when it comes to the mismanagement Knicks.


If you were in Brunson shoes?
Would u leave a 52-30 season Mavs team for a 37-45 Knicks team?
Would you leave a low budget tax Dallas for a high tax bracket NYC?
Leave Cuban's charisma for the Dolan family rules?
Leave a strategic postseason winning head coach Jason Kidd for a non-strategic coach Thibs?
Leave a career all-star Doncic for a one time all-star Randle?
GustavBahler
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6/29/2022  9:32 PM    LAST EDITED: 6/29/2022  9:33 PM
Historically its not a good idea to spend too much of the cap on a PG. Especially if he isnt an elite PG. Brunson is a very good one. Sounds like Brunson (if signed) would only be the start. Would have to be to get the team deep in the playoffs.

I read Ayton wants out. Wouldnt surprise me if a deal, a S&T involving Mitch was pursued. If its doable.
Kemet
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6/29/2022  9:33 PM
Nalod wrote:Price matters. Leon won’t over pay. He’ll be wrong at times. We did not chase Gordon Haywood, Lowrey, or Derozen.
Did with Kemba. Jury out on Randle and Ef. Ef played to his contract. Sort of.

Question: does anyone think Brunson has another step up in talent? He ready for prime time? Vs. say Derozen who logically hi best days behind him. He makes 27mm. For the same money you get ones future vs ones past. Hindight can tell you the future.

How come I beleive the Dolan family hired some experts to come in the day after the NBA draft to cleanup the mess Leon & Perry signed last offseason.
Detroit was under the cap, and the trade the Knicks did this week could've been done on draft night, or the night before so the Knicks could've got Grant.
gradyandrew
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6/30/2022  2:18 AM
Caseloads wrote:https://nypost.com/2022/06/28/jalen-brunson-to-knicks-momentum-is-growing/

The source close to Brunson believes it is important for the Knicks to lay out a detailed plan of how they will become a contender if Brunson joins them. That means everyone being aligned — front office, coaches, players — with one mission in mind. Brunson, the source said, will create a pros-and-cons list when it comes time to make a decision.

“The Knicks will have to present a detailed plan of how to create a winning culture,” the source said. “He’s very calculated. He’ll do what he thinks is best for his long-term career. Winning is extremely important to him. He wants to be in an organization where excelling is valued, around guys in the locker room buying into the same thing he’s buying into.”

This sounds like Riley talking. Key for me would be Butler's 23000 minutes vs RJs 6600.
Vmart
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6/30/2022  11:52 AM    LAST EDITED: 6/30/2022  11:53 AM
fishmike wrote:
Vmart wrote:
fishmike wrote:Prolly why he wants to go play for Thibs

Best joke yet.

mom gave you posting privs back? Thanks for cleaning your room

Moms are awesome. Am I the only one here who thinks we are concentrating on the wrong position rather than Brunson we should be looking at Ayton. This team needs a floor spreading center. The Knicks have point guards Quickly and McBride.

I don’t understand the Knicks they always think grass is greener else where they don’t see the Mavs took a lot of time watering it. Something Knicks refuse to do with what they have. Ayton is the player the Knicks should be concentrating on or both Brunson and Ayton. I like Mitch but he is to restricted with his offense.
Nalod
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6/30/2022  11:56 AM    LAST EDITED: 6/30/2022  12:04 PM
Vmart wrote:
fishmike wrote:
Vmart wrote:
fishmike wrote:Prolly why he wants to go play for Thibs

Best joke yet.

mom gave you posting privs back? Thanks for cleaning your room

Moms are awesome. Am I the only one here who thinks we are concentrating on the wrong position rather than Brunson we should be looking at Ayton. This team needs a floor spreading center. The Knicks have point guards Quickly and McBride.

I don’t understand the Knicks they always think grass is greener else where they don’t see the Mavs took a lot of time watering it. Something Knicks refuse to do with what they have. Ayton is the player the Knicks should be concentrating on or both Brunson and Ayton. I like Mitch but he is to restricted with his offense.



But that grass might not be available. IF so what is the price of it? ITs a nice concept and one I agree with, but what will Ayton sign for, and what will PHX want in return. If you get a sign and trade for Brunson, we might have the space to sign Ayton and wait them out. But will we have the pulp to do a deal. meanwhile, time would be ticking. Brunson might be down with that.

on a side note, Read that Miami will not be meeting with Brunson. With Davis Bertains there is no need to bring on Duncan.

Chemistry: Dinwiddie and Bertans for KP. Mavs took off after that. Not a good haul back for Dallas on paper with KP being the best player but thats how it works.
Chemistry: EF bugged out Randle early in the season. Did it smooth itself out? Randle did not but was he being a diva for lack of execution of players. Read Randle held the ball too long because EF did not make his cuts. new team, new schematic. Randle being an Ass? Or justified? Fans give their impressions but I have not read anything concrete about this other than it was a thing then.

Get Mitch settled with a long term deal, Brunson to lead the floor, define Randle and have buy in, extend RJ, and you might have a good core to build on. Its June 30th, I don't see the minutes yet because I can't see the final roster.
HofstraBBall
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6/30/2022  12:26 PM    LAST EDITED: 6/30/2022  12:31 PM
Caseloads wrote:https://nypost.com/2022/06/28/jalen-brunson-to-knicks-momentum-is-growing/

The source close to Brunson believes it is important for the Knicks to lay out a detailed plan of how they will become a contender if Brunson joins them. That means everyone being aligned — front office, coaches, players — with one mission in mind. Brunson, the source said, will create a pros-and-cons list when it comes time to make a decision.

“The Knicks will have to present a detailed plan of how to create a winning culture,” the source said. “He’s very calculated. He’ll do what he thinks is best for his long-term career. Winning is extremely important to him. He wants to be in an organization where excelling is valued, around guys in the locker room buying into the same thing he’s buying into.”

Jalen- So what's your plan?
Rose- $30M per
Jalen- That's a good plan.

'Knicks focus should be on players that have grown up playing soccer or cricket' - Triplethreat 8/28/2020
martin
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6/30/2022  1:32 PM
HofstraBBall wrote:
Caseloads wrote:https://nypost.com/2022/06/28/jalen-brunson-to-knicks-momentum-is-growing/

The source close to Brunson believes it is important for the Knicks to lay out a detailed plan of how they will become a contender if Brunson joins them. That means everyone being aligned — front office, coaches, players — with one mission in mind. Brunson, the source said, will create a pros-and-cons list when it comes time to make a decision.

“The Knicks will have to present a detailed plan of how to create a winning culture,” the source said. “He’s very calculated. He’ll do what he thinks is best for his long-term career. Winning is extremely important to him. He wants to be in an organization where excelling is valued, around guys in the locker room buying into the same thing he’s buying into.”

Jalen- So what's your plan?
Rose- $30M per
Jalen- That's a good plan.

SPOT ON

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NYKMentality
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6/30/2022  2:06 PM
Maybe I'm not as high on Brunson as most.

Looking to get paid as an absolute NBA superstar?

But yet...

25 Years old.
0 All-Stars.
0 All-NBA 1st Team.
0 All-NBA 2nd team.
0 All-NBA 3rd team.

Most alarming?

Even during his breakout season last year his PER (PLAYER EFFICIENCY RATING) was 125th. Not even Top 100? Not even Top 50? Not even top 30? And nowhere close to top 10? But 125th?

If he becomes a Knick I'll 100% support him and hope for the best but I can't lie; I don't see the SUPERSTAR potential nor Star ability that everyone else is seeing.

fishmike
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6/30/2022  2:37 PM
NYKMentality wrote:Maybe I'm not as high on Brunson as most.

Looking to get paid as an absolute NBA superstar?

But yet...

25 Years old.
0 All-Stars.
0 All-NBA 1st Team.
0 All-NBA 2nd team.
0 All-NBA 3rd team.

Most alarming?

Even during his breakout season last year his PER (PLAYER EFFICIENCY RATING) was 125th. Not even Top 100? Not even Top 50? Not even top 30? And nowhere close to top 10? But 125th?

If he becomes a Knick I'll 100% support him and hope for the best but I can't lie; I don't see the SUPERSTAR potential nor Star ability that everyone else is seeing.

who sees star?

I was not really for this... he might be a 10 ten PG in the EAST. I have changed my tune and think this is very good for a few reasons.
Cost: finally we used cap space for an impact player. Yes its a big contract but these FA windows are rare and ours is closing. This lets us procure a player before signing RJ, Mitch, etc
Non-Cost: Yes we used 2nd rounders to move the contracts but we keep our draft capitol very strong with the extra first rounders
Fit/Impact: Takes the ball out of Jule's hands early and get him more scoring late. High % shooter. Plays super hard on both ends. Limited defender because of size but surely not effort
Downside: Maybe he clogs the starting spot for IQ who has more upside? (those are my emotions more than anything)

Assuming he stays injury free his value should be good (see FVV for example).

Knicks get better. Maybe he's actually pass Mitch the ball

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
fishmike
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6/30/2022  2:38 PM
NYKMentality wrote:Maybe I'm not as high on Brunson as most.

Looking to get paid as an absolute NBA superstar?

But yet...

25 Years old.
0 All-Stars.
0 All-NBA 1st Team.
0 All-NBA 2nd team.
0 All-NBA 3rd team.

Most alarming?

Even during his breakout season last year his PER (PLAYER EFFICIENCY RATING) was 125th. Not even Top 100? Not even Top 50? Not even top 30? And nowhere close to top 10? But 125th?

If he becomes a Knick I'll 100% support him and hope for the best but I can't lie; I don't see the SUPERSTAR potential nor Star ability that everyone else is seeing.

if you want the upside comparison for similar age/career/size its prolly this guy:
https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/l/lowryky01.html
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Vmart
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6/30/2022  2:40 PM
NYKMentality wrote:Maybe I'm not as high on Brunson as most.

Looking to get paid as an absolute NBA superstar?

But yet...

25 Years old.
0 All-Stars.
0 All-NBA 1st Team.
0 All-NBA 2nd team.
0 All-NBA 3rd team.

Most alarming?

Even during his breakout season last year his PER (PLAYER EFFICIENCY RATING) was 125th. Not even Top 100? Not even Top 50? Not even top 30? And nowhere close to top 10? But 125th?

If he becomes a Knick I'll 100% support him and hope for the best but I can't lie; I don't see the SUPERSTAR potential nor Star ability that everyone else is seeing.

I agree with you. He hasn’t done enough to warrant that kind of money.
blkexec
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6/30/2022  2:49 PM
NYKMentality wrote:Maybe I'm not as high on Brunson as most.

Looking to get paid as an absolute NBA superstar?

But yet...

25 Years old.
0 All-Stars.
0 All-NBA 1st Team.
0 All-NBA 2nd team.
0 All-NBA 3rd team.

Most alarming?

Even during his breakout season last year his PER (PLAYER EFFICIENCY RATING) was 125th. Not even Top 100? Not even Top 50? Not even top 30? And nowhere close to top 10? But 125th?

If he becomes a Knick I'll 100% support him and hope for the best but I can't lie; I don't see the SUPERSTAR potential nor Star ability that everyone else is seeing.

Not sure who EVERYONE ELSE is....But adding Brunson is more about fit. His potential was on full display in the playoffs, especially when Luca was out. Adding Brunson is also a way for Rose to save his azz. It's been 3 years and he hasn't shown much, as far as FA additions. It's a risk because of his pay will be linked to his expectations, and thats not fair to Brunson. Right now average players are making more than superstars with the money the NBA is bringing in. Brunson will be the 14th highest paid PG in the NBA, which isn't terrible. And I'm hoping he doesn't think he should turn into MJ and take all the shots. He seems to play within the system. Can anybody describe Thibs system? I still don't know, outside of give it to Randle / RJ and get out of the way. But Brunson (if we get him) appears to be well connected with certain players, coaches and the FO. I just hope we have enough money left over to fillout the roster with competent players.

Born in Brooklyn, Raised in Queens, Lives in Maryland. The future is bright, I'm a Knicks fan for life!
martin
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6/30/2022  2:53 PM    LAST EDITED: 6/30/2022  2:54 PM
NYKMentality wrote:Maybe I'm not as high on Brunson as most.

Looking to get paid as an absolute NBA superstar?

But yet...

25 Years old.
0 All-Stars.
0 All-NBA 1st Team.
0 All-NBA 2nd team.
0 All-NBA 3rd team.

Most alarming?

Even during his breakout season last year his PER (PLAYER EFFICIENCY RATING) was 125th. Not even Top 100? Not even Top 50? Not even top 30? And nowhere close to top 10? But 125th?

If he becomes a Knick I'll 100% support him and hope for the best but I can't lie; I don't see the SUPERSTAR potential nor Star ability that everyone else is seeing.

PER is so Chad Ford/John Hollinger early 2000's man.

Feel free to join the modern analytic game with the rest of everyone else. It would be akin to giving Steve Adam's 4-yr/$100M extension in 2016. Right Presti?

I can't believe you just showed us some PER numbers without laughing to yourself hysterically

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Nalod
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6/30/2022  3:04 PM
Superstars make more than Brunson will. A lot more.
I dont't know what the final number will be. Randle will make 23 this coming season.
Yet he is slammed as if paid like a superstar.
He is not WestBrick, Not paid 47mil. Taking risks is paying for something foward than in arrears.
fishmike
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6/30/2022  3:53 PM
the hope if Brunson does for NYK what Lowry did for Toronto. If you look at their ages/numbers/size/style of play you can see where that comes from
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
martin
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6/30/2022  4:10 PM
fishmike wrote:the hope if Brunson does for NYK what Lowry did for Toronto. If you look at their ages/numbers/size/style of play you can see where that comes from

I was just comparing Lowry and even CP3 numbers at current stages of career. CP3 obviously has massive talent over those guys but the shooting numbers in the midrange all favor Brunson.

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fishmike
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6/30/2022  4:27 PM
martin wrote:
fishmike wrote:the hope if Brunson does for NYK what Lowry did for Toronto. If you look at their ages/numbers/size/style of play you can see where that comes from

I was just comparing Lowry and even CP3 numbers at current stages of career. CP3 obviously has massive talent over those guys but the shooting numbers in the midrange all favor Brunson.

Lowery and Brunson have incredibly similar #s, almost the same with Brunson having a considerably higher FG% and Lowery having a higher assist number but about 2 per game

Brunson addresses all the needs from last year... a floor general, higher % shooting... he will really help

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
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