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Noel and Burks Traded!
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martin
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6/29/2022  12:27 AM
NardDogNation wrote:
martin wrote:This is what Knicks have left... at this moment?

Brunson, Fournier, RJ, Randle, Mitch

Rose, IQ, Cam, Obi, Sims

Grimes, McBride


Need to jettison Fournier... to his original TPE in boston.

Could we dump Randle and Fournier on either the Blazers or Spurs? Seems like both are looking for veterans to help in an ill-concieved playoff push.

I got it.

Randle to POR for Bledsoe and picks. Bledsoe's expiring gets redirected to Spurs for Dejounte + POR picks + all the Knicks picks.

Brunson, Dejounte, RJ, Obi, Mitch

Rose, IQ, Fournier, Cam, Sims

Grimes, McBride

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martin
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6/29/2022  12:31 AM
NardDogNation wrote:
martin wrote:
NardDogNation wrote:
martin wrote:This is what Knicks have left... at this moment?

Brunson, Fournier, RJ, Randle, Mitch

Rose, IQ, Cam, Obi, Sims

Grimes, McBride


Need to jettison Fournier... to his original TPE in boston.

Could we dump Randle and Fournier on either the Blazers or Spurs? Seems like both are looking for veterans to help in an ill-concieved playoff push.

Knicks gotta trade Randle for picks that they include in the Fournier + Randle picks + other picks for Dejounte Murray trade

That would be the Happy Ending we all been waiting for

Why would you want Murray if we'd be paying big money to Jalen Brunson and Derrick Rose with Immanuel Quickly and Miles McBride still on the roster? I prefer Murray to the aforementioned but I think he'd be a poor fit with what we have.

No idea really, I'm so gamerweeeed I forgot Rose was on the roster

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martin
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6/29/2022  12:37 AM
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LivingLegend
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6/29/2022  1:12 AM
Saw a couple of late breaking tweets….

One states that even at the $110m for 4 years Brunson would only be 14th highest paid PG. If they flip the contract high to low he would be 12th highest paid PG next year.

One states we could end this all in a 3 team sign/trade where Walker/Burkes/Noel all go in same deal and could allow Knicks to play as an over the cap team so they could use full $10M MLE (ex. Malik Monk) and they could net a $9.5 M TPE for Walker (I think) so lots still tbd if they put the Kemba and this deal together as 1.
gradyandrew
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6/29/2022  2:01 AM
3 summers in a row Knicks have entered free agency with near max room.
ESOMKnicks
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6/29/2022  2:16 AM
gradyandrew wrote:3 summers in a row Knicks have entered free agency with near max room.

...and fail to sign a superstar.

Leon Rose is making some shrewd moves to clear cap space, but it is only Brunson on the other end. Decent player, but a far cry from Kyrie/Kawai/Klay/Kevin. I see the logic of it. With Mitch and RJ due for a major payraise, you are really salary cap constrained for another couple of years, so you add whoever you help now. But still, Brunson as the ticket to the promised land?
smackeddog
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6/29/2022  3:35 AM
TheGame wrote:
wargames wrote:

In typical Knicks fashion they got second rounders back

This is great trade for Detroit. They get two solid veterans for cheap on expiring deals. The vets can help their youth and the Pistons will have the option of trading Burks at the deadline for a pick.

As for us, we have all the cap space we need to sign Brunson and we did not have to give up much to do it.

No, no- these are albatross contracts for players no one wants that the Knicks will have to give up firsts to get rid of and/or untradeable- all the bball media have been telling us this all season.
smackeddog
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6/29/2022  3:43 AM
Now they're no longer Knicks, Noel and Burke will go from being lambasted by bball writers as 'players no one wants' 'terrible/overpaid contracts', to magically become "useful role players who can mentor Detroits young players and fill out their bench while providing good defense". The 3 firsts we got on Draft day, will remain essentially useless/irelevant/ will likely not convey, but the 6 2nd rounders we gave up will be considered a fortune that we gave up just to get rid of players we just signed last year.
smackeddog
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6/29/2022  3:46 AM
BigDaddyG wrote:Man, feel bad for Ayton. Lost leverage big time. But who can deny that Detroit ended up getting the better player with their space.

Wish we could turn Randle into Ayton, I'd feel much better- can't get excited about the Brunson signing while we have him on the roster, just because as things stand, a starting lineup of Mitch, Randle, RJ and Brunson just doesn't work either side of the court
smackeddog
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6/29/2022  3:46 AM
EwingsGlass wrote:
TheGame wrote:
wargames wrote:

In typical Knicks fashion they got second rounders back

This is great trade for Detroit. They get two solid veterans for cheap on expiring deals. The vets can help their youth and the Pistons will have the option of trading Burks at the deadline for a pick.

As for us, we have all the cap space we need to sign Brunson and we did not have to give up much to do it.

It’s too much cap space for just Brunson. Might be a bit more to this.

I hope so! Fingers crossed
smackeddog
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6/29/2022  3:54 AM
martin wrote:
Knixkik wrote:Moving off 19M in space without having to give up a first round pick. 28M if you include Kemba.

Burks + Noel = 2 second round picks
Kember = 4 second round picks

$30M for 6 second round picks?

I will never fully comprehend the draft day trade, no matter how many articles and breakdowns I read, but I think (and I may be wrong) the 4 seconds were grease to facilitate a 1 round pick swap in addition to dumping kebab.

Maybe it''s just easier to look at it as a whole:


-6 second round picks
- the number 11 pick

Into:

-Kemba, Burke, Noel salary dump
-3 future firsts (to trade for a future player or keep)
-Brunson

That's okay, I know some of it's redundant as if we hadn't signed this players last offseason, we could have just signed Brunson (think honestly the front office didn't see him blowing up like he did and were working last offseason on the basis Brunson could be had for around $10mil per) and kept the seconds. But the 3 firsts sweeten the pot and could help land something else. Plus I'd rather have 3 firsts than 6 seconds.
smackeddog
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6/29/2022  4:05 AM    LAST EDITED: 6/29/2022  4:14 AM

Was the Miami second the 'fake second' we got when we traded for Fournier to give the Celtics a TPE?

Also that legion hoops is the only one that's claiming we got 2 future seconds- any other source confirming that? Seems unlikely.

I wonder if this trade was really meant to be part of the draft day trade that just got finalized separately- so essentially from Detroits side, the intention was:

Detroit take on the Salary dump of Burke, Kemba, Noel for Duran and 2 seconds? But we lessened the loss for us by picking up those 3 firsts from OKC who were desperate to get Dieng.
gradyandrew
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6/29/2022  4:22 AM
ESOMKnicks wrote:
gradyandrew wrote:3 summers in a row Knicks have entered free agency with near max room.

...and fail to sign a superstar.

Leon Rose is making some shrewd moves to clear cap space, but it is only Brunson on the other end. Decent player, but a far cry from Kyrie/Kawai/Klay/Kevin. I see the logic of it. With Mitch and RJ due for a major payraise, you are really salary cap constrained for another couple of years, so you add whoever you help now. But still, Brunson as the ticket to the promised land?

Yeah, I was going to add that but didn't want to be a Debbie Downer. Can't win if you don't play though, right? I think Hayward and DeRozan were possibilities but the Knicks wanted to keep their powder dry.
Nalod
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6/29/2022  7:36 AM
Too soon to draw any conclusions.
Seems knicks are not done if its just Brunson. There is a play for Ayton there somewhere. I have bought up Randle and Mitch for him. LIkely more to this.
Drose and Mitch is not enough. Possiblities.

Burkes did not get a raw deal last year. He played well and demonstrated the utility to play three positions and perhaps extend his career.
Philc1
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6/29/2022  7:48 AM
wargames wrote:

If the Knicks waive Taj I think they have a max slot… or this could all be to be able to pay Brunson and Mitch and not go into the Tax before they pay RJ.

Will be $30 mil under
Philc1
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6/29/2022  7:48 AM
lurts wrote:Detroit's not going to be terrible. This trade improves Knick's chances on getting the Piston's 2023 pick. Bonus!

Good trade for both teams. Pistons might make playoffs next year
Philc1
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6/29/2022  7:49 AM    LAST EDITED: 6/29/2022  7:57 AM
EwingsGlass wrote:Could Miles Bridges be in the Knicks future? Deandre Ayton? Might be possible to get both if they can move Fournier for Murray and use Robinson’s 1.8m cap hold and bird rights to leverage their salary.

Murray
Barrett
Bridges
Randle
Ayton

1) Fournier and picks to SAS for Murray
2) Bridges is RFA. Offer max contract using Cap Space.
3) Ayton is RFA. Use Robinson and Reddish in sign and trade.

Would love to get both Ayton and Brunson but getting $30 mil under most likely is because they know Cuban is going to offer Brunson a big number to stay


Signing Brunson and then going over the cap to lock up Mitch long term is more than fine
SergioNYK
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6/29/2022  7:50 AM
I'm kind of shocked we traded both Burks and Noel. We are extremely young now! I wonder how Thibs is feeling? But kudos to the front office for pulling the trigger and deciding to go young. They are almost forcing Thibs to play the kids now.

But offseason is just starting. Let's see if this Brunson news is real. I still have doubts he's actually coming here.

But let's say Brunson does come here, we need a follow up move or two. And we REALLY need to think long and hard on Mitch. I do not think he is he ideal fit offensively.
EwingsGlass
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6/29/2022  8:02 AM
Philc1 wrote:
EwingsGlass wrote:Could Miles Bridges be in the Knicks future? Deandre Ayton? Might be possible to get both if they can move Fournier for Murray and use Robinson’s 1.8m cap hold and bird rights to leverage their salary.

Murray
Barrett
Bridges
Randle
Ayton

1) Fournier and picks to SAS for Murray
2) Bridges is RFA. Offer max contract using Cap Space.
3) Ayton is RFA. Use Robinson and Reddish in sign and trade.

Would love to get both Ayton and Brunson but getting $30 mil under most likely is because they know Cuban is going to offer Brunson a big number to stay


Signing Brunson and then going over the cap to lock up Mitch long term is more than fine

I think Bridges is the big dog this summer. His max is like 30mm and we are discussing film giving Brunson 27. Pony up the extra 3m and trade for Murray.

Once you resign Mitch, this negotiation leverage is gone. And if they do it right, they may be able to preserve the MLE

This is the Randle.
Philc1
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6/29/2022  8:06 AM
EwingsGlass wrote:
Philc1 wrote:
EwingsGlass wrote:Could Miles Bridges be in the Knicks future? Deandre Ayton? Might be possible to get both if they can move Fournier for Murray and use Robinson’s 1.8m cap hold and bird rights to leverage their salary.

Murray
Barrett
Bridges
Randle
Ayton

1) Fournier and picks to SAS for Murray
2) Bridges is RFA. Offer max contract using Cap Space.
3) Ayton is RFA. Use Robinson and Reddish in sign and trade.

Would love to get both Ayton and Brunson but getting $30 mil under most likely is because they know Cuban is going to offer Brunson a big number to stay


Signing Brunson and then going over the cap to lock up Mitch long term is more than fine

I think Bridges is the big dog this summer. His max is like 30mm and we are discussing film giving Brunson 27. Pony up the extra 3m and trade for Murray.

Once you resign Mitch, this negotiation leverage is gone. And if they do it right, they may be able to preserve the MLE

I’m loving how this offseason is playing out so far. We even have extra first round picks in the double draft next yr
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