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Knicks Front office……….
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HofstraBBall
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6/24/2022  12:22 PM
Nalod wrote:
Marv wrote:dismissing the bpa at 11 as a “shiny new toy” sound like denial to me

Could be. Im looking for reasons and perhaps tilt to not getting mad when I can’t see the end result.
If Brunson is landed its about how his chemistry and game fits and could elevate the others. I don’t view him as a star or the starhuch. But he won’t come cheap.
For that matter, there is still much to do.
We don’t know the plan so we don’t know what was possible last night, and contingents. Ivey was always a long shot. Fans get caught in the frenzy. Its fun.

The disappointment, for me, is that it seemed the strategy was to continue to build through the draft and add inexpensive pieces in FA to compete. Feel we were doing a good job of that. Pivoting should only have come with the possibility of a true game changer. I watched a lot of Dallas games this year and Brunson is not that. Hopefully the FO is right and these shinny pieces were not very good. Thought a few available had upside and could be solid contributors. But I also though DSJR was going to be an All Star.

You are right though. Can't judge the offseason until it has been completed. FA is a big part of it. There is a possibility that these assets gained last night will be used in FA or to make a more appealing trade. We shall see. Not gonna lie though, last years bad season now only seems like a waste. Would have felt a bit better with a decent young addition.

'Knicks focus should be on players that have grown up playing soccer or cricket' - Triplethreat 8/28/2020
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blkexec
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6/24/2022  1:34 PM    LAST EDITED: 6/24/2022  1:38 PM
RSparrow2 wrote:
Chandler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
Philc1 wrote:Weak draft. Griffin can shoot but is just a catch and shoot guy and already has an injury history. Duren is redundant with Mitch, Noel and Sims already here. We need to sign a pg and now can plus we have future draft picks

trading to 2023 would have been smart. All we was waste a pick to undo last year's mistake(s)


what pick was wasted? Unless i'm missing something we used our Denver 2023 pick but got back a Milwaukee 2025 pick -- more of a pick swap. Plus were we really going to want 3 or 4 first rounders next year?

So we traded a present #11 for a future Milwaukee pick 2 years out that will likely be at the back end of the draft. Do you understand the concept of present day value of money, same applies to draft picks. In the NFL a 2nd round pick this year is worth a first rounder next year, as present value is greater than future years.

Drafting now, you get something tangible and development of a player for a year.

Did you read the protections on those other picks, we are NOT getting those picks next year, so again even if we do, we trade a near top 10 pick THIS YEAR (more value than future years if exactly equal) for a mid pick in Next Years draft....which will NEVER happen.

I think everybody is missing the point. OKC has increased the value of picks so much that it’s now a trade commodity. Reminds me of the value of cash vs digital currency. Picks are digital currency that can be used like cash. So regardless if it’s highly protected or not, that’s why we have so many 1st round picks now.

When the right trade comes up or if we need to go over the top to force a team trade with us, you can offer them the same protected draft picks for the player we want. So I’m ok with this move.

I’m not ok with the lack of pull or swindling I thought Rose would do with his multiple player and team networks. We haven’t seen him do anything more than your average GM, in 3 years. But until Brunson signs his contract and Mitch signs his contract, I will be the first to give their FO praise or boos. Right now it’s too early if the plan was to clear space while obtaining more digital currency. Check. Signing Brunson and Mitch while keeping your young core together and shredding the vets that will take up mins from the yoots, that would be checkmate.

Born in Brooklyn, Raised in Queens, Lives in Maryland. The future is bright, I'm a Knicks fan for life!
smackeddog
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6/24/2022  2:18 PM    LAST EDITED: 6/25/2022  1:39 PM
One of the callers to KFTV last night nailed it- we keep hiring execs to run the team who have no experience in the role- insane. Rather than go after Presti, Morey, RC Bruford etc with a shed load of money, we go after names who have no experience in the role- it's been crazy.
Marv
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6/24/2022  6:00 PM
jrodmc wrote:
Marv wrote:dismissing the bpa at 11 as a “shiny new toy” sound like denial to me

Dismissing the history we have of drafting pieces of **** at 8 thinking they were shiny new toys sounds worse to me

like the last one we drafted 2 years ago who in the games he started in his second year averaged 20.3/7/3 with 1 block and 1 steal and shot .57/.44/.82?

Marv
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6/24/2022  6:38 PM
or this one who was waiting for us at 11 last night?


Jalen Williams, Wing, Santa Clara
6’6”, 7’2.25 Wingspan 209 pounds, 21yrs old from Gilbert, Arizona
Last Season at Santa Clara: In 33 games (34.8 minutes per game)—18 points per game on 51% shooting (39.6% from 3, 80.9% Free Throw %) 4.4 rebounds, 4.2 assists, 1.2 steals 0.5 blocks

Awards and Accolades: Two Time All West Coast Conference Selection & 2021-2022 First Team All-ACC Selection, Finalist For Mid-Major Player Of The Year (Lou Henson Award) Averaged over 25 points per game as a senior in High School, both of his parents served in the Air Force.

21-year old Jalen Williams has become quite the trending topic since the NBA draft combine last month, where he tested, measured and played well in scrimmages, thus vastly increased his draft stock. Williams was productive over the course of his three year tour at Santa Clara, where he averaged 18 points, 4.4 rebounds and 4.2 assists — while shooting 51.3% and knocking down threes at a clip of 40%, and shooting just over 80% FT.


Jalen Williams was the only player in the nation to average such a level of production at such a high level of efficiency.

Very intrigued by Jalen Williams unique blend of poise + playmaking in the pick and roll, catch and shoot ability, and defensive versatility standing at 6’6” with a 7’2” wingspan. He's a very well rounded talent with the tools to become an extremely versatile player. #NBADraft

Jalen Williams’ IQ, vision, work ethic, size, skillset, and resumé of production this season are all undeniably great by anyones standards. In fact, it’s baffling that the consensus viewed Jalen as a second-round prospect just a few months ago. He bet on himself by participating in all phases of the combine, only confirming what the tape and stats already say about his immense versatility and potential.

Jalen Williams is THE most all-around skilled player in this draft. This is especially the case amongst the guards and wings. Time after time this season he has proven it: from the regular season to the NBA draft combine. His body type, athleticism, level, and frame are built like peak James Harden. Though he has a few other similarities to Harden, I would certainly point elsewhere for a more accurate comparison of Williams’ game. For starters, he arguably has more of a mature, empowering approach already. Jalen is more prone to involve his teammates in the offense as opposed to scoring himself which he also does very well, but not in the same breath as peak Harden of course.

Among the players whom used the pick-and-roll at least 300 times as both a scorer and passer, Jalen ranked as the second most efficient player in the nation. He possesses a deadly pullup game that forces his defenders to play over the screen or suffer severe consequences. He has a very capable jab step as a deadeye three-point scorer — uses the hostage dribble incredibly well to trap defenders until he makes a play either with a pass, a floater, attacking the rim, or the pullup jumper. He’s excellent at controlling the game & playing at his pace. He has the ball on a string, as well as everyone else around him.

Jalen has an elite depth of variety in ball-handling skills and maneuvering. He has excellent footwork and ability to explode off of two feet for stronger finishes around the basket.Jalen recorded a 39-inch vertical at the NBA combine as well. This further backs up what you see on tape with Jalen’s explosion off his feet. He adjusts well in mid air to finish shots. He’s also a legit lob threat and almost exclusively takes long drives to make scoop finishes using that freaky wingspan.

Jalen is also a solid defender with room to get even better defensively with NBA strength and conditioning training. He’s a great shot blocker when guarding one on one. Smart enough to simply raise his hands up. When opponents do attempt to shoot they end up highly contested or out right blocked. He also knows how to use his length well to recover defensively and will block shots from behind with that chase-down badge action.

He’s a great help defender and uses his wingspan to cover ground. He’s timely with ball stripping as he pokes at balls unexpectedly to create defensive plays. Jalen is a very active on-ball defender, using his 7’2” wingspan to wreck havoc on ball handlers, as well as in the passing lanes. He’s also great at defending handoffs, as he will quickly react to deflect passes causing turnovers in many cases which helps him average over one steal per game. He may actually be best when switched onto smaller guards being they have a really hard time shooting over his 7’2” wingspan


Even more notable are his synergy stats. According to Global Scouting, Jalen Williams ranks:

In the 97th percentile on spot-ups
In the 87th percentile as a cutter
In the 86th percentile as the PnR ball-handler
In the 86th percentile on floaters at the rim
In the 83rd percentile in transition

Again nearly every statistical category backs him up as an efficient playmaker and scorer. Jalen creates good separation when needed to get his shot. He can also play efficiently off-ball or even as a secondary facilitator. Jalen Williams played most of his preps career as a point guard. This served him well in developing his skill as he begin to have a massive growth spurt in his junior and senior years of high school.

Despite limited attempts, by all accounts Williams is a great shooter. This is especially so in catch-and-shoot situations as well as in zoom action shooting. He displays good potential as a moving shooter as well. Overall he shot nearly 40% from three this season on 3.2 attempts per game. On all contested catch and shoot jump-shots Jalen shot 61.5% (16/26) which ranks him in the 100th percentile, according to Synergy.

He has a quick release that many define as an unblock-able three point shot to go along with excellent & fluid form. He gets low in pre-catch to give himself a good rise on his shot arch although it can be higher.

Williams is a “late bloomer” prospect that clearly still has room to grow. Imagine how much better he can be once his body becomes familiar with NBA strength ns conditioning programs alone. He measured at roughly 6’6 in shoes with a massive 7’2 inch wingspan, which gives him a +8 wingspan and an even more intriguing piece of one’s core. His skill level not only heightens his ceiling but also raises his floor.

blkexec
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6/24/2022  7:24 PM
Marv wrote:or this one who was waiting for us at 11 last night?


Jalen Williams, Wing, Santa Clara
6’6”, 7’2.25 Wingspan 209 pounds, 21yrs old from Gilbert, Arizona
Last Season at Santa Clara: In 33 games (34.8 minutes per game)—18 points per game on 51% shooting (39.6% from 3, 80.9% Free Throw %) 4.4 rebounds, 4.2 assists, 1.2 steals 0.5 blocks

Awards and Accolades: Two Time All West Coast Conference Selection & 2021-2022 First Team All-ACC Selection, Finalist For Mid-Major Player Of The Year (Lou Henson Award) Averaged over 25 points per game as a senior in High School, both of his parents served in the Air Force.

21-year old Jalen Williams has become quite the trending topic since the NBA draft combine last month, where he tested, measured and played well in scrimmages, thus vastly increased his draft stock. Williams was productive over the course of his three year tour at Santa Clara, where he averaged 18 points, 4.4 rebounds and 4.2 assists — while shooting 51.3% and knocking down threes at a clip of 40%, and shooting just over 80% FT.


Jalen Williams was the only player in the nation to average such a level of production at such a high level of efficiency.

Very intrigued by Jalen Williams unique blend of poise + playmaking in the pick and roll, catch and shoot ability, and defensive versatility standing at 6’6” with a 7’2” wingspan. He's a very well rounded talent with the tools to become an extremely versatile player. #NBADraft

Jalen Williams’ IQ, vision, work ethic, size, skillset, and resumé of production this season are all undeniably great by anyones standards. In fact, it’s baffling that the consensus viewed Jalen as a second-round prospect just a few months ago. He bet on himself by participating in all phases of the combine, only confirming what the tape and stats already say about his immense versatility and potential.

Jalen Williams is THE most all-around skilled player in this draft. This is especially the case amongst the guards and wings. Time after time this season he has proven it: from the regular season to the NBA draft combine. His body type, athleticism, level, and frame are built like peak James Harden. Though he has a few other similarities to Harden, I would certainly point elsewhere for a more accurate comparison of Williams’ game. For starters, he arguably has more of a mature, empowering approach already. Jalen is more prone to involve his teammates in the offense as opposed to scoring himself which he also does very well, but not in the same breath as peak Harden of course.

Among the players whom used the pick-and-roll at least 300 times as both a scorer and passer, Jalen ranked as the second most efficient player in the nation. He possesses a deadly pullup game that forces his defenders to play over the screen or suffer severe consequences. He has a very capable jab step as a deadeye three-point scorer — uses the hostage dribble incredibly well to trap defenders until he makes a play either with a pass, a floater, attacking the rim, or the pullup jumper. He’s excellent at controlling the game & playing at his pace. He has the ball on a string, as well as everyone else around him.

Jalen has an elite depth of variety in ball-handling skills and maneuvering. He has excellent footwork and ability to explode off of two feet for stronger finishes around the basket.Jalen recorded a 39-inch vertical at the NBA combine as well. This further backs up what you see on tape with Jalen’s explosion off his feet. He adjusts well in mid air to finish shots. He’s also a legit lob threat and almost exclusively takes long drives to make scoop finishes using that freaky wingspan.

Jalen is also a solid defender with room to get even better defensively with NBA strength and conditioning training. He’s a great shot blocker when guarding one on one. Smart enough to simply raise his hands up. When opponents do attempt to shoot they end up highly contested or out right blocked. He also knows how to use his length well to recover defensively and will block shots from behind with that chase-down badge action.

He’s a great help defender and uses his wingspan to cover ground. He’s timely with ball stripping as he pokes at balls unexpectedly to create defensive plays. Jalen is a very active on-ball defender, using his 7’2” wingspan to wreck havoc on ball handlers, as well as in the passing lanes. He’s also great at defending handoffs, as he will quickly react to deflect passes causing turnovers in many cases which helps him average over one steal per game. He may actually be best when switched onto smaller guards being they have a really hard time shooting over his 7’2” wingspan


Even more notable are his synergy stats. According to Global Scouting, Jalen Williams ranks:

In the 97th percentile on spot-ups
In the 87th percentile as a cutter
In the 86th percentile as the PnR ball-handler
In the 86th percentile on floaters at the rim
In the 83rd percentile in transition

Again nearly every statistical category backs him up as an efficient playmaker and scorer. Jalen creates good separation when needed to get his shot. He can also play efficiently off-ball or even as a secondary facilitator. Jalen Williams played most of his preps career as a point guard. This served him well in developing his skill as he begin to have a massive growth spurt in his junior and senior years of high school.

Despite limited attempts, by all accounts Williams is a great shooter. This is especially so in catch-and-shoot situations as well as in zoom action shooting. He displays good potential as a moving shooter as well. Overall he shot nearly 40% from three this season on 3.2 attempts per game. On all contested catch and shoot jump-shots Jalen shot 61.5% (16/26) which ranks him in the 100th percentile, according to Synergy.

He has a quick release that many define as an unblock-able three point shot to go along with excellent & fluid form. He gets low in pre-catch to give himself a good rise on his shot arch although it can be higher.

Williams is a “late bloomer” prospect that clearly still has room to grow. Imagine how much better he can be once his body becomes familiar with NBA strength ns conditioning programs alone. He measured at roughly 6’6 in shoes with a massive 7’2 inch wingspan, which gives him a +8 wingspan and an even more intriguing piece of one’s core. His skill level not only heightens his ceiling but also raises his floor.

Potential will always look better than reality. And the reality is, the FO believes there’s only 1 or 2 players in this draft they would trade for and Ivey for one wasn’t possible anymore. So I understand their pivot to Brunson which is now a 50/50 chance he comes. And reality is he averaged 20 something in the playoffs??? Please correct me if I’m wrong. And without luca he scored 41 and led them to two playoff wins without their star. And I like what rose said about having a balance of financial flexibility for FA and picks for future trades, while allowing IQ, Toppin and Grimes (young development) to grow. I’m not mad at that vs potential of Jalen Williams or these other roll players that Thibs will not play. I like the 2nd round pick for the west Chester roster. Not mad at that either. He’s athletic and looks like a decent young PG that’s hungry.

Born in Brooklyn, Raised in Queens, Lives in Maryland. The future is bright, I'm a Knicks fan for life!
blkexec
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6/24/2022  7:33 PM    LAST EDITED: 6/24/2022  7:38 PM
If I would complain about anything its Leon Rose not meeting my our? expectations as a high profile sports agent who everyone loves. I heard he can do no wrong. So my expectations was he could use his connections to make big splash moves. But on the other hand it’s hard to argue how they have methodically created a solid base of player development within while having cap room to fill your big holes (PG-Brunson aka Vanvleet) This almost has to happen essentially with his dad already hired. So I think this is what I was expecting if he pulls this off. Add Brunson and Mitch back. Talk about potential?

Brunson / IQ
RJ / Rose EF
Grimes / Reddish
Randle / Obi
Mitch / Sims

Taj
Noel
Burks
Rose

Born in Brooklyn, Raised in Queens, Lives in Maryland. The future is bright, I'm a Knicks fan for life!
Marv
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6/24/2022  7:39 PM

Potential will always look better than reality. And the reality is, the FO believes there’s only 1 or 2 players in this draft they would trade for and Ivey for one wasn’t possible anymore. So I understand their pivot to Brunson which is now a 50/50 chance he comes. And reality is he averaged 20 something in the playoffs??? Please correct me if I’m wrong. And without luca he scored 41 and led them to two playoff wins without their star. And I like what rose said about having a balance of financial flexibility for FA and picks for future trades, while allowing IQ, Toppin and Grimes (young development) to grow. I’m not mad at that vs potential of Jalen Williams or these other roll players that Thibs will not play. I like the 2nd round pick for the west Chester roster. Not mad at that either. He’s athletic and looks like a decent young PG that’s hungry.

I totally get your point. And i totally disagree with it.

You have a chance to select a guy with the physical characteristics of williams and the game he displayed this year? and pay him rookie scale for 4 years while he develops with teammates his own age? Versus what the knicks pulled last night for brunson? Or rather a chance at brunson? No way any day imo

blkexec
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6/24/2022  7:57 PM    LAST EDITED: 6/24/2022  8:00 PM

And you might be 100% correct. But I probably have the luxury of not seeing Williams play much makes this strategy of the FO to get Brunson seems like a nice play. Potentially get the top young free agent PG to fill a hole that’s been vacant since (pick somebody MarkJackson?).

Only time will tell. If Williams turns into a solid roll player and Brunson plays like he did in Dallas while leading us into the playoffs. Who wins this debate????

Born in Brooklyn, Raised in Queens, Lives in Maryland. The future is bright, I'm a Knicks fan for life!
gradyandrew
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6/24/2022  8:13 PM
Wasn't this the same discussion we had last year when the Knicks whiffed on sure fire prospect Kai Jones at 19 who went on to average 22/11. Oh my bad, those were his season totals over 63 minutes. Let's not lose it. The value of draft picks declines to near zero as soon as they are made. The front office knows who they like and when that player is no longer available they move on. Cam Reddish was our draft pick.
blkexec
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6/24/2022  8:48 PM    LAST EDITED: 6/24/2022  8:50 PM
gradyandrew wrote:Wasn't this the same discussion we had last year when the Knicks whiffed on sure fire prospect Kai Jones at 19 who went on to average 22/11. Oh my bad, those were his season totals over 63 minutes. Let's not lose it. The value of draft picks declines to near zero as soon as they are made. The front office knows who they like and when that player is no longer available they move on. Cam Reddish was our draft pick.

I forgot about Cam. Don’t forget Deuce

But seriously he’s the type of player that wouldn’t mind the Gleague and he will not be a locker room problem because of it. But with Brunson, Rose and IQ…..the PG position is no longer the problem. Mitch comes back and now we just secured the two most important positions on a basketball team. Floor generals and rim protectors.

Born in Brooklyn, Raised in Queens, Lives in Maryland. The future is bright, I'm a Knicks fan for life!
gradyandrew
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6/25/2022  11:39 AM
The thing that angers me about this thread is that Thibs loves the players and the players seem to love him. We got a strong locker room. The team never gave up all season. The front office seems to like our young players as much as we do. If we can sign Brunson Knicks will have a solid group that's pretty injury resistant. Burks looks like pretty solid value at his deal. Let's say he's the one that gets moved and we roll with:

Brunson/ Rose/ Deuce
EF/ IQ
RJ/ Grimes/ Reddish
Randle/ Toppin/ Gibson
Robinson/ Noel/ Sims

Knicks are 3 deep at every position.

EwingsGlass
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6/25/2022  1:12 PM
gradyandrew wrote:The thing that angers me about this thread is that Thibs loves the players and the players seem to love him. We got a strong locker room. The team never gave up all season. The front office seems to like our young players as much as we do. If we can sign Brunson Knicks will have a solid group that's pretty injury resistant. Burks looks like pretty solid value at his deal. Let's say he's the one that gets moved and we roll with:

Brunson/ Rose/ Deuce
EF/ IQ
RJ/ Grimes/ Reddish
Randle/ Toppin/ Gibson
Robinson/ Noel/ Sims

Knicks are 3 deep at every position.

I guess the brotherly love doesn’t do much for me where they were the 11th worst team in the league and the only thing keeping the team in games was the second unit. Ye Band of Brothers still needs to perform and I don’t think adding Rose back to the second unit doesn’t fix much more - the second unit wasn’t the problem.

You consistently hype the number of 3s Fournier hit last season and that is good, but his offensive stats are directly and overwhelmingly offset by his defensive failings.

I don’t see what is changing from last year to this and I don’t want anyone on that team feeling too happy with themselves or each other. Until that loving feeling turns into ball movement, I am not impressed.

This is the Randle.
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6/26/2022  10:28 AM    LAST EDITED: 6/26/2022  10:28 AM
Marv wrote:
jrodmc wrote:
Marv wrote:dismissing the bpa at 11 as a “shiny new toy” sound like denial to me

Dismissing the history we have of drafting pieces of **** at 8 thinking they were shiny new toys sounds worse to me

like the last one we drafted 2 years ago who in the games he started in his second year averaged 20.3/7/3 with 1 block and 1 steal and shot .57/.44/.82?

2020 was actually a good draft. This year’s talent pool was meh

jrodmc
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6/27/2022  10:03 AM
Marv wrote:
jrodmc wrote:
Marv wrote:dismissing the bpa at 11 as a “shiny new toy” sound like denial to me

Dismissing the history we have of drafting pieces of **** at 8 thinking they were shiny new toys sounds worse to me

like the last one we drafted 2 years ago who in the games he started in his second year averaged 20.3/7/3 with 1 block and 1 steal and shot .57/.44/.82?

No, like Frank, and Knox, Jordan Hill and Channing Frye. And if I read this forum correctly, Obi was an orange traffic cone on his way out his rookie year, correct?

Oh, and nice sample size btw. 10 whole games he started. Glad you didn't site Obi's stats for the whole 2 years he's been here. Those don't look too shiny.

Marv
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6/27/2022  10:36 AM
jrodmc wrote:
Marv wrote:
jrodmc wrote:
Marv wrote:dismissing the bpa at 11 as a “shiny new toy” sound like denial to me

Dismissing the history we have of drafting pieces of **** at 8 thinking they were shiny new toys sounds worse to me

like the last one we drafted 2 years ago who in the games he started in his second year averaged 20.3/7/3 with 1 block and 1 steal and shot .57/.44/.82?

No, like Frank, and Knox, Jordan Hill and Channing Frye. And if I read this forum correctly, Obi was an orange traffic cone on his way out his rookie year, correct?

Oh, and nice sample size btw. 10 whole games he started. Glad you didn't site Obi's stats for the whole 2 years he's been here. Those don't look too shiny.

umm . . . when he finally got playing time?

you have a bad weekend or something?

BigDaddyG
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6/27/2022  10:43 AM
jrodmc wrote:
Marv wrote:
jrodmc wrote:
Marv wrote:dismissing the bpa at 11 as a “shiny new toy” sound like denial to me

Dismissing the history we have of drafting pieces of **** at 8 thinking they were shiny new toys sounds worse to me

like the last one we drafted 2 years ago who in the games he started in his second year averaged 20.3/7/3 with 1 block and 1 steal and shot .57/.44/.82?

No, like Frank, and Knox, Jordan Hill and Channing Frye. And if I read this forum correctly, Obi was an orange traffic cone on his way out his rookie year, correct?

Oh, and nice sample size btw. 10 whole games he started. Glad you didn't site Obi's stats for the whole 2 years he's been here. Those don't look too shiny.


Some would argue that 9 points a game/60% TS in 17 minutes is promising given the circumstances. 🤷
Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right. - The Tick
jrodmc
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6/28/2022  1:36 PM
Marv wrote:
jrodmc wrote:
Marv wrote:
jrodmc wrote:
Marv wrote:dismissing the bpa at 11 as a “shiny new toy” sound like denial to me

Dismissing the history we have of drafting pieces of **** at 8 thinking they were shiny new toys sounds worse to me

like the last one we drafted 2 years ago who in the games he started in his second year averaged 20.3/7/3 with 1 block and 1 steal and shot .57/.44/.82?

No, like Frank, and Knox, Jordan Hill and Channing Frye. And if I read this forum correctly, Obi was an orange traffic cone on his way out his rookie year, correct?

Oh, and nice sample size btw. 10 whole games he started. Glad you didn't site Obi's stats for the whole 2 years he's been here. Those don't look too shiny.

umm . . . when he finally got playing time?

you have a bad weekend or something?

No, I just remember investing large swaths of time reading about what level of defensive ineptitude and what low BBIQ we drafted in Obi. Not that he was some shiny new toy. And small sample sizes always seem weak to me. But that's just me. And I'm pointing out 4 out of 5 picks at 8. Not just one.

And my weekends are always actually great, thanks. My own personal NBA starts every Saturday morning at 7am. Can't beat it. Actually shot better in 5 games than Obi did in 10. But that's a ****ty small sample size, I know. But then, I'm 60. 5 games is practically an eternity.

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6/28/2022  8:17 PM    LAST EDITED: 6/28/2022  8:33 PM
EwingsGlass wrote:
gradyandrew wrote:The thing that angers me about this thread is that Thibs loves the players and the players seem to love him. We got a strong locker room. The team never gave up all season. The front office seems to like our young players as much as we do. If we can sign Brunson Knicks will have a solid group that's pretty injury resistant. Burks looks like pretty solid value at his deal. Let's say he's the one that gets moved and we roll with:

Brunson/ Rose/ Deuce
EF/ IQ
RJ/ Grimes/ Reddish
Randle/ Toppin/ Gibson
Robinson/ Noel/ Sims

Knicks are 3 deep at every position.

I guess the brotherly love doesn’t do much for me where they were the 11th worst team in the league and the only thing keeping the team in games was the second unit. Ye Band of Brothers still needs to perform and I don’t think adding Rose back to the second unit doesn’t fix much more - the second unit wasn’t the problem.

You consistently hype the number of 3s Fournier hit last season and that is good, but his offensive stats are directly and overwhelmingly offset by his defensive failings.

I don’t see what is changing from last year to this and I don’t want anyone on that team feeling too happy with themselves or each other. Until that loving feeling turns into ball movement, I am not impressed.

I actually think Fournier is the guy they try and trade away with those picks for a better defensive guy. Who that is, idk, but I think he is the last obvious weak spot on the roster. For example let’s say the OG trade rumors end up true and the Knicks make a trade for him.

Brunson/ Rose/ IQ
RJ/ IQ/ Grimes
OG/ Reddish / Grimes
Randle/ Toppin/ Gibson
Robinson/ Noel/ Sims

That roster On the low if it clicks under Thibs is a real scary team come playoff times. It would be Thibs Bulls 2.0. Not saying OG is who they chase, but a guy like that is who I expect them to chase. With a starting roster like the above the Knicks can hide Randle defensively (like they did two years ago) and have one of the better benches in the league. Fournier and Randle can’t mess defensively because they are both at best adequate defenders who cannot slot up or down defensively. You can only get away with one of those in the modern NBA and the team will likely designate Randle for that position.

The algorithm gives and the algorithm takes away
ramtour420
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6/30/2022  6:42 PM
Freaking geniusus they are!! Love it
Everything you have ever wanted is on the other side of fear- George Adair
Knicks Front office……….

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