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Duty to warn : Mother of all bailouts
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meloshouldgo
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3/26/2020  6:19 PM
Why everything in American politics is a dog and pony show and how crises are harvested by the moneyed elite through their tools in BOTH parties. Please watch in it's entirety even if it destroys your favorite politician.

I cannot teach anybody anything. I can only try to make them think - Socrates
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meloshouldgo
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3/27/2020  2:30 PM
The American people need to understand what is happening. Then act on it - throw out the establishment of both parties. Demand transparency from corporations and demand that government start acting like it's for the people, of the people and by the people. This is our last chances to stop being sheep.

Fuck neoliberalism.

I cannot teach anybody anything. I can only try to make them think - Socrates
TheGame
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3/28/2020  3:55 AM
meloshouldgo wrote:The American people need to understand what is happening. Then act on it - throw out the establishment of both parties. Demand transparency from corporations and demand that government start acting like it's for the people, of the people and by the people. This is our last chances to stop being sheep.

Fuck neoliberalism.

You should just give up that dream. That is just unAmerican. We are going to continue to look after our own self-interest and mortgage our future and just trust that a future generation will figure it all out. Now that is American.

Trust the Process
newyorknewyork
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3/28/2020  11:45 AM
TheGame wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:The American people need to understand what is happening. Then act on it - throw out the establishment of both parties. Demand transparency from corporations and demand that government start acting like it's for the people, of the people and by the people. This is our last chances to stop being sheep.

Fuck neoliberalism.

You should just give up that dream. That is just unAmerican. We are going to continue to look after our own self-interest and mortgage our future and just trust that a future generation will figure it all out. Now that is American.

I was under the impression that this 2nd bill provided those protections against such practices, but i'm most likely wrong. But I thought that was what the issue was with the first proposed bill which is why it was held up.

Majority of Americans have come to the conclusion that the whole system is rigged and corrupt. Many are willing to turn a blind eye as long as their specific needs are met. Even if it means throwing certain groups of people under the bus. The leftovers aren't big enough for everyone.

Seeing the handling of COVID19 looking at the line of thinking and actions leading to this current outcome. You can just see that we are going to be absolutely screwed when it comes to climate change.

https://vote.nba.com/en Vote for your Knicks.
BRIGGS
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3/28/2020  5:25 PM
We have to get money into people’s hands so they can stay locked down. Think about how many hourly waged jobs are hit. If we can bail out banks we can directly help the American worker. There’s gonna be a balance and sacrifice from many people. I rent out a house in Madison ct abd I gave the family two months off of rent — and I put it on my Facebook page that if you own a property and can afford to take a month or two off peoples rents. Please do so. If u own a business try to help your employees by keeping them home abd getting some money to them. We need to lockdown but people have needs that must be met. We all got to do a part
RIP Crushalot😞
meloshouldgo
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3/28/2020  5:49 PM
newyorknewyork wrote:
TheGame wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:The American people need to understand what is happening. Then act on it - throw out the establishment of both parties. Demand transparency from corporations and demand that government start acting like it's for the people, of the people and by the people. This is our last chances to stop being sheep.

Fuck neoliberalism.

You should just give up that dream. That is just unAmerican. We are going to continue to look after our own self-interest and mortgage our future and just trust that a future generation will figure it all out. Now that is American.

I was under the impression that this 2nd bill provided those protections against such practices, but i'm most likely wrong. But I thought that was what the issue was with the first proposed bill which is why it was held up.

Majority of Americans have come to the conclusion that the whole system is rigged and corrupt. Many are willing to turn a blind eye as long as their specific needs are met. Even if it means throwing certain groups of people under the bus. The leftovers aren't big enough for everyone.

Seeing the handling of COVID19 looking at the line of thinking and actions leading to this current outcome. You can just see that we are going to be absolutely screwed when it comes to climate change.

Bernie held out for and got extra 6 weeks of unemployment pay - good for him. A real bailout should have ZERO assistance for Large Companies that use their money to buy back stocks, it says they have put "restrictions and oversight" but neither is defined and the companies will find ways to game this before April is over.

The main issue is that we have a one party democracy that shows itself as two separate and distinct groups one of them giving lip service to social values while in the end they all just vote for corporate interests. No one, not Bernie, not Warren (who only entered politics to fight corrupt bailouts), not AOC - no one spoke out against giving away tax payer money for free to small businesses (with Loan forgivance). And Lindsey ****ing Graham was "concerned" about workers getting more from unemployment than they would if they worked - while they are being forced to stay at home!

I cannot teach anybody anything. I can only try to make them think - Socrates
martin
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3/28/2020  6:26 PM
meloshouldgo wrote:Why everything in American politics is a dog and pony show and how crises are harvested by the moneyed elite through their tools in BOTH parties. Please watch in it's entirety even if it destroys your favorite politician.

I could barely listen to 5 minutes of this without stopping. These guys are just blathering on without getting into specifics. What are their expertise and backgrounds? Why should we pay attention to them?

Maybe you can detail them for us.

After than I really don't know what you are specifically getting at.

Also, you are kind of broad swath saying everyone is bad and we should get rid of them all. That's a nice pie in the sky but will never happen. So, give us some realistics. Otherwise, to me, IMHO, this is just bashing your head against a 5 foot thick concrete wall hoping for it to crack.

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meloshouldgo
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3/28/2020  10:57 PM    LAST EDITED: 3/28/2020  11:24 PM
martin wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:Why everything in American politics is a dog and pony show and how crises are harvested by the moneyed elite through their tools in BOTH parties. Please watch in it's entirety even if it destroys your favorite politician.

I could barely listen to 5 minutes of this without stopping. These guys are just blathering on without getting into specifics. What are their expertise and backgrounds? Why should we pay attention to them?

Maybe you can detail them for us.

After than I really don't know what you are specifically getting at.

Also, you are kind of broad swath saying everyone is bad and we should get rid of them all. That's a nice pie in the sky but will never happen. So, give us some realistics. Otherwise, to me, IMHO, this is just bashing your head against a 5 foot thick concrete wall hoping for it to crack.

What specifics would convince you?
Thet are clearly providing an opinion like any news agencies do.

Obama bailed out banks without holding them accountable - do really need specifics on that?
The Fed has made upwards of $4T available to businesses via REPO loans since Dec 2019, the large banks are using their potential insolvency(TBTF) to milk the Fed and pay dividends to their stockholders using tax payer dollars. Do you need specifics on that?
The Pelosi-Schumer faction hasn't opposed any of this most blatant of taxpayer money giveaway to banks and large corporations - do you need specifics of that? Ever heard any if our so called "left wingers" denounce the fed action on Repo loans? Do people even know what repo loans are? The fed is using your tax dollars to give loans to the large corporations against toxic assets and taking on their risk of default. All that's before this stimulus bill.
And the stimulus is now handing over free money without ANYobligations to business owners so they can acquire sm as lker companies and discount rates and then all valuations will be jacked up again with the next bubble. Is this so hard to see. You've already seen this 3 times since 2000.

Like I said they go after the entire ****show and they take no prisoners, it will ruffle all types feathers. But it is the truth. Every one of these so called dems have sold us out to corporate interests and now it sadly includes Sanders as well.

I cannot teach anybody anything. I can only try to make them think - Socrates
martin
Posts: 67903
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3/29/2020  12:00 AM
meloshouldgo wrote:
martin wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:Why everything in American politics is a dog and pony show and how crises are harvested by the moneyed elite through their tools in BOTH parties. Please watch in it's entirety even if it destroys your favorite politician.

I could barely listen to 5 minutes of this without stopping. These guys are just blathering on without getting into specifics. What are their expertise and backgrounds? Why should we pay attention to them?

Maybe you can detail them for us.

After than I really don't know what you are specifically getting at.

Also, you are kind of broad swath saying everyone is bad and we should get rid of them all. That's a nice pie in the sky but will never happen. So, give us some realistics. Otherwise, to me, IMHO, this is just bashing your head against a 5 foot thick concrete wall hoping for it to crack.

What specifics would convince you?
Thet are clearly providing an opinion like any news agencies do.

Obama bailed out banks without holding them accountable - do really need specifics on that?
The Fed has made upwards of $4T available to businesses via REPO loans since Dec 2019, the large banks are using their potential insolvency(TBTF) to milk the Fed and pay dividends to their stockholders using tax payer dollars. Do you need specifics on that?
The Pelosi-Schumer faction hasn't opposed any of this most blatant of taxpayer money giveaway to banks and large corporations - do you need specifics of that? Ever heard any if our so called "left wingers" denounce the fed action on Repo loans? Do people even know what repo loans are? The fed is using your tax dollars to give loans to the large corporations against toxic assets and taking on their risk of default. All that's before this stimulus bill.
And the stimulus is now handing over free money without ANYobligations to business owners so they can acquire sm as lker companies and discount rates and then all valuations will be jacked up again with the next bubble. Is this so hard to see. You've already seen this 3 times since 2000.

Like I said they go after the entire ****show and they take no prisoners, it will ruffle all types feathers. But it is the truth. Every one of these so called dems have sold us out to corporate interests and now it sadly includes Sanders as well.

Pelosi-Schumer have exactly 1 of 3 parts of the govt to their party. What exactly would you be doing in their shoes?

This is reality man. Head, meet concrete wall.

Carry on

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meloshouldgo
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3/29/2020  12:18 AM    LAST EDITED: 3/29/2020  12:19 AM
martin wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:
martin wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:Why everything in American politics is a dog and pony show and how crises are harvested by the moneyed elite through their tools in BOTH parties. Please watch in it's entirety even if it destroys your favorite politician.

I could barely listen to 5 minutes of this without stopping. These guys are just blathering on without getting into specifics. What are their expertise and backgrounds? Why should we pay attention to them?

Maybe you can detail them for us.

After than I really don't know what you are specifically getting at.

Also, you are kind of broad swath saying everyone is bad and we should get rid of them all. That's a nice pie in the sky but will never happen. So, give us some realistics. Otherwise, to me, IMHO, this is just bashing your head against a 5 foot thick concrete wall hoping for it to crack.

What specifics would convince you?
Thet are clearly providing an opinion like any news agencies do.

Obama bailed out banks without holding them accountable - do really need specifics on that?
The Fed has made upwards of $4T available to businesses via REPO loans since Dec 2019, the large banks are using their potential insolvency(TBTF) to milk the Fed and pay dividends to their stockholders using tax payer dollars. Do you need specifics on that?
The Pelosi-Schumer faction hasn't opposed any of this most blatant of taxpayer money giveaway to banks and large corporations - do you need specifics of that? Ever heard any if our so called "left wingers" denounce the fed action on Repo loans? Do people even know what repo loans are? The fed is using your tax dollars to give loans to the large corporations against toxic assets and taking on their risk of default. All that's before this stimulus bill.
And the stimulus is now handing over free money without ANYobligations to business owners so they can acquire sm as lker companies and discount rates and then all valuations will be jacked up again with the next bubble. Is this so hard to see. You've already seen this 3 times since 2000.

Like I said they go after the entire ****show and they take no prisoners, it will ruffle all types feathers. But it is the truth. Every one of these so called dems have sold us out to corporate interests and now it sadly includes Sanders as well.

Pelosi-Schumer have exactly 1 of 3 parts of the govt to their party. What exactly would you be doing in their shoes?

This is reality man. Head, meet concrete wall.

Carry on

False. This is why we have a one party democracy, because we let our politicians get way with this bullsheeit.
They are supposed to hold the bill up, represent the people they were elected to. What did Obama do with a majority on both houses? Gave the banks a free pass and billions in loans while they kicked out people from their homes??

I cannot teach anybody anything. I can only try to make them think - Socrates
martin
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3/29/2020  1:29 AM
meloshouldgo wrote:
martin wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:
martin wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:Why everything in American politics is a dog and pony show and how crises are harvested by the moneyed elite through their tools in BOTH parties. Please watch in it's entirety even if it destroys your favorite politician.

I could barely listen to 5 minutes of this without stopping. These guys are just blathering on without getting into specifics. What are their expertise and backgrounds? Why should we pay attention to them?

Maybe you can detail them for us.

After than I really don't know what you are specifically getting at.

Also, you are kind of broad swath saying everyone is bad and we should get rid of them all. That's a nice pie in the sky but will never happen. So, give us some realistics. Otherwise, to me, IMHO, this is just bashing your head against a 5 foot thick concrete wall hoping for it to crack.

What specifics would convince you?
Thet are clearly providing an opinion like any news agencies do.

Obama bailed out banks without holding them accountable - do really need specifics on that?
The Fed has made upwards of $4T available to businesses via REPO loans since Dec 2019, the large banks are using their potential insolvency(TBTF) to milk the Fed and pay dividends to their stockholders using tax payer dollars. Do you need specifics on that?
The Pelosi-Schumer faction hasn't opposed any of this most blatant of taxpayer money giveaway to banks and large corporations - do you need specifics of that? Ever heard any if our so called "left wingers" denounce the fed action on Repo loans? Do people even know what repo loans are? The fed is using your tax dollars to give loans to the large corporations against toxic assets and taking on their risk of default. All that's before this stimulus bill.
And the stimulus is now handing over free money without ANYobligations to business owners so they can acquire sm as lker companies and discount rates and then all valuations will be jacked up again with the next bubble. Is this so hard to see. You've already seen this 3 times since 2000.

Like I said they go after the entire ****show and they take no prisoners, it will ruffle all types feathers. But it is the truth. Every one of these so called dems have sold us out to corporate interests and now it sadly includes Sanders as well.

Pelosi-Schumer have exactly 1 of 3 parts of the govt to their party. What exactly would you be doing in their shoes?

This is reality man. Head, meet concrete wall.

Carry on

False. This is why we have a one party democracy, because we let our politicians get way with this bullsheeit.
They are supposed to hold the bill up, represent the people they were elected to. What did Obama do with a majority on both houses? Gave the banks a free pass and billions in loans while they kicked out people from their homes??

Hold up the bill and then what? What are the real world consequences of doing such a thing? And for how long do you reek havoc while states, hospitals, unemployed burn down?

I get that there should be a far better way. Our country sucks. It’s not top of the world at what it boasts. We are realistically an oligarchy. You are not paving a realistic path forward.

For me this is akin to Bernie’s campaign. I love some of his ideals. His choice of young voters and $20 grass roots contributions are fantastic. But if you can’t win primaries you are still dead ****ing last and not even running past second base in the first inning of a ****ing marathon that you didn’t know you were even aware you are running.

Start playing in the real world if you want to make a change.

Ideals are just that. Work in the real world. Get to know it and then bend it.

Otherwise, and I know I’m sounding ungodly and unnecessarily flippant, pucker up to that concrete wall that you are going to bang your head against

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GustavBahler
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3/29/2020  12:47 PM


https://www.counterpunch.org/2020/03/27/bailouts-for-the-rich-the-virus-for-the-rest-of-us/

One of the truths spoken aloud in a moment of political panic is that the Federal government can create as much money as it cares to and spend it any way that it sees fit. Neel Kashkari, President of the Minneapolis Federal Reserve, reconfirmed this truth. This reframes poverty, student debt, inadequate healthcare, Social Security shortfalls and austerity as political choices, not facts of nature. It also means that the thousands of workers being sent to early deaths from coronavirus could just as easily be saved.

While it’s clear that Donald Trump is a menace, Democrats have yet to reconcile that he is using the same logic— that people must be sacrificed to save ‘the system,’ that motivated Barack Obama’s bailouts of Wall Street. Rich bankers were given unconditional bailouts while nine million mortgage borrowers had their houses taken from them to restore bank profits. The ‘sanctity of contracts’ was cited to give bonuses to bailed out bankers while ‘moral hazard’ was claimed to deny relief to homeowners who were unable to pay their mortgages.

meloshouldgo
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Member: #5801

3/29/2020  1:23 PM    LAST EDITED: 3/29/2020  1:37 PM
martin wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:
martin wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:
martin wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:Why everything in American politics is a dog and pony show and how crises are harvested by the moneyed elite through their tools in BOTH parties. Please watch in it's entirety even if it destroys your favorite politician.

I could barely listen to 5 minutes of this without stopping. These guys are just blathering on without getting into specifics. What are their expertise and backgrounds? Why should we pay attention to them?

Maybe you can detail them for us.

After than I really don't know what you are specifically getting at.

Also, you are kind of broad swath saying everyone is bad and we should get rid of them all. That's a nice pie in the sky but will never happen. So, give us some realistics. Otherwise, to me, IMHO, this is just bashing your head against a 5 foot thick concrete wall hoping for it to crack.

What specifics would convince you?
Thet are clearly providing an opinion like any news agencies do.

Obama bailed out banks without holding them accountable - do really need specifics on that?
The Fed has made upwards of $4T available to businesses via REPO loans since Dec 2019, the large banks are using their potential insolvency(TBTF) to milk the Fed and pay dividends to their stockholders using tax payer dollars. Do you need specifics on that?
The Pelosi-Schumer faction hasn't opposed any of this most blatant of taxpayer money giveaway to banks and large corporations - do you need specifics of that? Ever heard any if our so called "left wingers" denounce the fed action on Repo loans? Do people even know what repo loans are? The fed is using your tax dollars to give loans to the large corporations against toxic assets and taking on their risk of default. All that's before this stimulus bill.
And the stimulus is now handing over free money without ANYobligations to business owners so they can acquire sm as lker companies and discount rates and then all valuations will be jacked up again with the next bubble. Is this so hard to see. You've already seen this 3 times since 2000.

Like I said they go after the entire ****show and they take no prisoners, it will ruffle all types feathers. But it is the truth. Every one of these so called dems have sold us out to corporate interests and now it sadly includes Sanders as well.

Pelosi-Schumer have exactly 1 of 3 parts of the govt to their party. What exactly would you be doing in their shoes?

This is reality man. Head, meet concrete wall.

Carry on

False. This is why we have a one party democracy, because we let our politicians get way with this bullsheeit.
They are supposed to hold the bill up, represent the people they were elected to. What did Obama do with a majority on both houses? Gave the banks a free pass and billions in loans while they kicked out people from their homes??

Hold up the bill and then what? What are the real world consequences of doing such a thing? And for how long do you reek havoc while states, hospitals, unemployed burn down?

I get that there should be a far better way. Our country sucks. It’s not top of the world at what it boasts. We are realistically an oligarchy. You are not paving a realistic path forward.

For me this is akin to Bernie’s campaign. I love some of his ideals. His choice of young voters and $20 grass roots contributions are fantastic. But if you can’t win primaries you are still dead ****ing last and not even running past second base in the first inning of a ****ing marathon that you didn’t know you were even aware you are running.

Start playing in the real world if you want to make a change.

Ideals are just that. Work in the real world. Get to know it and then bend it.

Otherwise, and I know I’m sounding ungodly and unnecessarily flippant, pucker up to that concrete wall that you are going to bang your head against

Quit with the talking points and answer why Obama bailed out the banks instead of the people whose lives got disrupted. We'll go from there. You are using the crisis to defend your precious centrist ****s, but you cant answer what they do when they actually have the power.

I cannot teach anybody anything. I can only try to make them think - Socrates
meloshouldgo
Posts: 26565
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Member: #5801

3/29/2020  1:39 PM
GustavBahler wrote:


https://www.counterpunch.org/2020/03/27/bailouts-for-the-rich-the-virus-for-the-rest-of-us/

One of the truths spoken aloud in a moment of political panic is that the Federal government can create as much money as it cares to and spend it any way that it sees fit. Neel Kashkari, President of the Minneapolis Federal Reserve, reconfirmed this truth. This reframes poverty, student debt, inadequate healthcare, Social Security shortfalls and austerity as political choices, not facts of nature. It also means that the thousands of workers being sent to early deaths from coronavirus could just as easily be saved.

While it’s clear that Donald Trump is a menace, Democrats have yet to reconcile that he is using the same logic— that people must be sacrificed to save ‘the system,’ that motivated Barack Obama’s bailouts of Wall Street. Rich bankers were given unconditional bailouts while nine million mortgage borrowers had their houses taken from them to restore bank profits. The ‘sanctity of contracts’ was cited to give bonuses to bailed out bankers while ‘moral hazard’ was claimed to deny relief to homeowners who were unable to pay their mortgages.

And crises must be harvested, like Obama did and Trump is doing now. This is the shock doctrine executed to perfection. While the so called democratic voters drink the centrist kool-aid.

I cannot teach anybody anything. I can only try to make them think - Socrates
martin
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Member: #2
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3/29/2020  3:04 PM
meloshouldgo wrote:
martin wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:
martin wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:
martin wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:Why everything in American politics is a dog and pony show and how crises are harvested by the moneyed elite through their tools in BOTH parties. Please watch in it's entirety even if it destroys your favorite politician.

I could barely listen to 5 minutes of this without stopping. These guys are just blathering on without getting into specifics. What are their expertise and backgrounds? Why should we pay attention to them?

Maybe you can detail them for us.

After than I really don't know what you are specifically getting at.

Also, you are kind of broad swath saying everyone is bad and we should get rid of them all. That's a nice pie in the sky but will never happen. So, give us some realistics. Otherwise, to me, IMHO, this is just bashing your head against a 5 foot thick concrete wall hoping for it to crack.

What specifics would convince you?
Thet are clearly providing an opinion like any news agencies do.

Obama bailed out banks without holding them accountable - do really need specifics on that?
The Fed has made upwards of $4T available to businesses via REPO loans since Dec 2019, the large banks are using their potential insolvency(TBTF) to milk the Fed and pay dividends to their stockholders using tax payer dollars. Do you need specifics on that?
The Pelosi-Schumer faction hasn't opposed any of this most blatant of taxpayer money giveaway to banks and large corporations - do you need specifics of that? Ever heard any if our so called "left wingers" denounce the fed action on Repo loans? Do people even know what repo loans are? The fed is using your tax dollars to give loans to the large corporations against toxic assets and taking on their risk of default. All that's before this stimulus bill.
And the stimulus is now handing over free money without ANYobligations to business owners so they can acquire sm as lker companies and discount rates and then all valuations will be jacked up again with the next bubble. Is this so hard to see. You've already seen this 3 times since 2000.

Like I said they go after the entire ****show and they take no prisoners, it will ruffle all types feathers. But it is the truth. Every one of these so called dems have sold us out to corporate interests and now it sadly includes Sanders as well.

Pelosi-Schumer have exactly 1 of 3 parts of the govt to their party. What exactly would you be doing in their shoes?

This is reality man. Head, meet concrete wall.

Carry on

False. This is why we have a one party democracy, because we let our politicians get way with this bullsheeit.
They are supposed to hold the bill up, represent the people they were elected to. What did Obama do with a majority on both houses? Gave the banks a free pass and billions in loans while they kicked out people from their homes??

Hold up the bill and then what? What are the real world consequences of doing such a thing? And for how long do you reek havoc while states, hospitals, unemployed burn down?

I get that there should be a far better way. Our country sucks. It’s not top of the world at what it boasts. We are realistically an oligarchy. You are not paving a realistic path forward.

For me this is akin to Bernie’s campaign. I love some of his ideals. His choice of young voters and $20 grass roots contributions are fantastic. But if you can’t win primaries you are still dead ****ing last and not even running past second base in the first inning of a ****ing marathon that you didn’t know you were even aware you are running.

Start playing in the real world if you want to make a change.

Ideals are just that. Work in the real world. Get to know it and then bend it.

Otherwise, and I know I’m sounding ungodly and unnecessarily flippant, pucker up to that concrete wall that you are going to bang your head against

Quit with the talking points and answer why Obama bailed out the banks instead of the people whose lives got disrupted. We'll go from there. You are using the crisis to defend your precious centrist ****s, but you cant answer what they do when they actually have the power.

? I have not defended or taken a position on any of my posts outside of pointing out the realistics of what is happening.

If you are trying to convince anyone of your position, you are doing a horrible job at it. I want exactly what you do and am already turned off by your interaction.

I've asked you directly about who is in the video you posted and why I should be paying attention to them. Start there.

If you can't convince, you are dead in the water. Again, I am with you and you can't even get me to pay attention to what you are saying and trying to convey

Official sponsor of the PURE KNICKS LOVE Program
GustavBahler
Posts: 41138
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Joined: 7/12/2010
Member: #3186

3/29/2020  6:27 PM
https://www.motherjones.com/coronavirus-updates/2020/03/the-us-sent-tons-of-medical-supplies-to-china-even-as-senators-warned-of-virus-threat-here/

The United States government sent nearly 17.8 tons of donated medical supplies to China—including masks and respirators—almost three weeks after the first case of the coronavirus was reported in the state of Washington. 

In a press release from the State Department dated Feb. 7, the agency announced it was prepared to spend up to $100 million to assist China as the number of COVID-19 cases and deaths continued to rise there. The day the press release went out, Trump tweeted that he spoke with China’s President Xi Jinping and that China would be “successful especially as the weather starts to warm & the virus hopefully becomes weaker and then gone.” 

meloshouldgo
Posts: 26565
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3/30/2020  10:35 AM
martin wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:
martin wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:
martin wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:
martin wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:Why everything in American politics is a dog and pony show and how crises are harvested by the moneyed elite through their tools in BOTH parties. Please watch in it's entirety even if it destroys your favorite politician.

I could barely listen to 5 minutes of this without stopping. These guys are just blathering on without getting into specifics. What are their expertise and backgrounds? Why should we pay attention to them?

Maybe you can detail them for us.

After than I really don't know what you are specifically getting at.

Also, you are kind of broad swath saying everyone is bad and we should get rid of them all. That's a nice pie in the sky but will never happen. So, give us some realistics. Otherwise, to me, IMHO, this is just bashing your head against a 5 foot thick concrete wall hoping for it to crack.

What specifics would convince you?
Thet are clearly providing an opinion like any news agencies do.

Obama bailed out banks without holding them accountable - do really need specifics on that?
The Fed has made upwards of $4T available to businesses via REPO loans since Dec 2019, the large banks are using their potential insolvency(TBTF) to milk the Fed and pay dividends to their stockholders using tax payer dollars. Do you need specifics on that?
The Pelosi-Schumer faction hasn't opposed any of this most blatant of taxpayer money giveaway to banks and large corporations - do you need specifics of that? Ever heard any if our so called "left wingers" denounce the fed action on Repo loans? Do people even know what repo loans are? The fed is using your tax dollars to give loans to the large corporations against toxic assets and taking on their risk of default. All that's before this stimulus bill.
And the stimulus is now handing over free money without ANYobligations to business owners so they can acquire sm as lker companies and discount rates and then all valuations will be jacked up again with the next bubble. Is this so hard to see. You've already seen this 3 times since 2000.

Like I said they go after the entire ****show and they take no prisoners, it will ruffle all types feathers. But it is the truth. Every one of these so called dems have sold us out to corporate interests and now it sadly includes Sanders as well.

Pelosi-Schumer have exactly 1 of 3 parts of the govt to their party. What exactly would you be doing in their shoes?

This is reality man. Head, meet concrete wall.

Carry on

False. This is why we have a one party democracy, because we let our politicians get way with this bullsheeit.
They are supposed to hold the bill up, represent the people they were elected to. What did Obama do with a majority on both houses? Gave the banks a free pass and billions in loans while they kicked out people from their homes??

Hold up the bill and then what? What are the real world consequences of doing such a thing? And for how long do you reek havoc while states, hospitals, unemployed burn down?

I get that there should be a far better way. Our country sucks. It’s not top of the world at what it boasts. We are realistically an oligarchy. You are not paving a realistic path forward.

For me this is akin to Bernie’s campaign. I love some of his ideals. His choice of young voters and $20 grass roots contributions are fantastic. But if you can’t win primaries you are still dead ****ing last and not even running past second base in the first inning of a ****ing marathon that you didn’t know you were even aware you are running.

Start playing in the real world if you want to make a change.

Ideals are just that. Work in the real world. Get to know it and then bend it.

Otherwise, and I know I’m sounding ungodly and unnecessarily flippant, pucker up to that concrete wall that you are going to bang your head against

Quit with the talking points and answer why Obama bailed out the banks instead of the people whose lives got disrupted. We'll go from there. You are using the crisis to defend your precious centrist ****s, but you cant answer what they do when they actually have the power.

? I have not defended or taken a position on any of my posts outside of pointing out the realistics of what is happening.

If you are trying to convince anyone of your position, you are doing a horrible job at it. I want exactly what you do and am already turned off by your interaction.

I've asked you directly about who is in the video you posted and why I should be paying attention to them. Start there.

If you can't convince, you are dead in the water. Again, I am with you and you can't even get me to pay attention to what you are saying and trying to convey

I am not providing solutions, I am raising awareness. The video isn't just about the bill, it's also about $4Trillion of your taxpayer dollars handed to banks and large corporations in repo loans outside of the bill. That's twice the size of the bill. This has become even larger now.

With all due respect pointing out the "reality" of what is happening is a position. The reality you perceive today has been manufactured by the machinations of the same one party system and their lackeys in MSM to obtain your consent.
I am not trying to sell you anything, you are trying to sell me this toxic and manufactured reality that is poisoning your cognitive functions. I don't care about either party or any candidates. I also dont subscribe to this reality where the poor democrats never have a choice. And as proof of that I have offered examples where the same poor Democrats acted in favor of corporate interests when they did have a choice. Does that mean that in this particular case they could do something different? I dont know, the journalists in the video seem to think so. All that money could be used better to develop test kits, assist overwhelmed hospitals, research treatments for COVID-19 instead we are giving banks and large corporations $4 trillion (now changed to *$700 Billion/week* in forever loans) with no strings attached and then making a huge fuss about attaching oversight on the other $2Trillion. That's how reality is manufactured and attention is diverted to talking points by the MSM which have completely overlooked the real bailout and those poor democrats never raise an objection to it.

I cannot teach anybody anything. I can only try to make them think - Socrates
martin
Posts: 67903
Alba Posts: 108
Joined: 7/24/2001
Member: #2
USA
3/30/2020  11:11 AM
meloshouldgo wrote:
martin wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:
martin wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:
martin wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:
martin wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:Why everything in American politics is a dog and pony show and how crises are harvested by the moneyed elite through their tools in BOTH parties. Please watch in it's entirety even if it destroys your favorite politician.

I could barely listen to 5 minutes of this without stopping. These guys are just blathering on without getting into specifics. What are their expertise and backgrounds? Why should we pay attention to them?

Maybe you can detail them for us.

After than I really don't know what you are specifically getting at.

Also, you are kind of broad swath saying everyone is bad and we should get rid of them all. That's a nice pie in the sky but will never happen. So, give us some realistics. Otherwise, to me, IMHO, this is just bashing your head against a 5 foot thick concrete wall hoping for it to crack.

What specifics would convince you?
Thet are clearly providing an opinion like any news agencies do.

Obama bailed out banks without holding them accountable - do really need specifics on that?
The Fed has made upwards of $4T available to businesses via REPO loans since Dec 2019, the large banks are using their potential insolvency(TBTF) to milk the Fed and pay dividends to their stockholders using tax payer dollars. Do you need specifics on that?
The Pelosi-Schumer faction hasn't opposed any of this most blatant of taxpayer money giveaway to banks and large corporations - do you need specifics of that? Ever heard any if our so called "left wingers" denounce the fed action on Repo loans? Do people even know what repo loans are? The fed is using your tax dollars to give loans to the large corporations against toxic assets and taking on their risk of default. All that's before this stimulus bill.
And the stimulus is now handing over free money without ANYobligations to business owners so they can acquire sm as lker companies and discount rates and then all valuations will be jacked up again with the next bubble. Is this so hard to see. You've already seen this 3 times since 2000.

Like I said they go after the entire ****show and they take no prisoners, it will ruffle all types feathers. But it is the truth. Every one of these so called dems have sold us out to corporate interests and now it sadly includes Sanders as well.

Pelosi-Schumer have exactly 1 of 3 parts of the govt to their party. What exactly would you be doing in their shoes?

This is reality man. Head, meet concrete wall.

Carry on

False. This is why we have a one party democracy, because we let our politicians get way with this bullsheeit.
They are supposed to hold the bill up, represent the people they were elected to. What did Obama do with a majority on both houses? Gave the banks a free pass and billions in loans while they kicked out people from their homes??

Hold up the bill and then what? What are the real world consequences of doing such a thing? And for how long do you reek havoc while states, hospitals, unemployed burn down?

I get that there should be a far better way. Our country sucks. It’s not top of the world at what it boasts. We are realistically an oligarchy. You are not paving a realistic path forward.

For me this is akin to Bernie’s campaign. I love some of his ideals. His choice of young voters and $20 grass roots contributions are fantastic. But if you can’t win primaries you are still dead ****ing last and not even running past second base in the first inning of a ****ing marathon that you didn’t know you were even aware you are running.

Start playing in the real world if you want to make a change.

Ideals are just that. Work in the real world. Get to know it and then bend it.

Otherwise, and I know I’m sounding ungodly and unnecessarily flippant, pucker up to that concrete wall that you are going to bang your head against

Quit with the talking points and answer why Obama bailed out the banks instead of the people whose lives got disrupted. We'll go from there. You are using the crisis to defend your precious centrist ****s, but you cant answer what they do when they actually have the power.

? I have not defended or taken a position on any of my posts outside of pointing out the realistics of what is happening.

If you are trying to convince anyone of your position, you are doing a horrible job at it. I want exactly what you do and am already turned off by your interaction.

I've asked you directly about who is in the video you posted and why I should be paying attention to them. Start there.

If you can't convince, you are dead in the water. Again, I am with you and you can't even get me to pay attention to what you are saying and trying to convey

I am not providing solutions, I am raising awareness. The video isn't just about the bill, it's also about $4Trillion of your taxpayer dollars handed to banks and large corporations in repo loans outside of the bill. That's twice the size of the bill. This has become even larger now.

With all due respect pointing out the "reality" of what is happening is a position. The reality you perceive today has been manufactured by the machinations of the same one party system and their lackeys in MSM to obtain your consent.
I am not trying to sell you anything, you are trying to sell me this toxic and manufactured reality that is poisoning your cognitive functions. I don't care about either party or any candidates. I also dont subscribe to this reality where the poor democrats never have a choice. And as proof of that I have offered examples where the same poor Democrats acted in favor of corporate interests when they did have a choice. Does that mean that in this particular case they could do something different? I dont know, the journalists in the video seem to think so. All that money could be used better to develop test kits, assist overwhelmed hospitals, research treatments for COVID-19 instead we are giving banks and large corporations $4 trillion (now changed to *$700 Billion/week* in forever loans) with no strings attached and then making a huge fuss about attaching oversight on the other $2Trillion. That's how reality is manufactured and attention is diverted to talking points by the MSM which have completely overlooked the real bailout and those poor democrats never raise an objection to it.

LOL well you do a poor job at raising awareness or communicating your point.

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Nalod
Posts: 68482
Alba Posts: 154
Joined: 12/24/2003
Member: #508
USA
3/30/2020  11:16 AM

Financial crisis was September 2008. Election was November. Obama inauguration January 2009. "obama" did not bail out the banks. It was the executive branch over two administrations. It was a 20 year build up of deregulation over differeent administrations.
Im not defending Obama, but implicating the wider body. Including the very people that took out mulitple mortgages. The Pension administration who bought subprime bonds withot doing their job. Should Wall St been selling htem as they were? No. Did Nalod buy them for his clients? No, I prescribe to the simple "risk/Reward" and the high yields alone told that story.
They were no illegal, but if you don't consider the underlying numbers then you did not do your job. Anyone that misguided those who trusted them divorced from their responsabities and deserve to go to jail.
My point is individuals need to take some responsablilty.
Now, regarding the top 20%? Yeah, im in there. Im not going to be objective and Im honest here. But if you blow them apart then the base to employ is also largely gone. Can't just redistribute the wealth. Fact is we'll have it back in our hands soon enough. Thats arrogant as hell but there is a truth.

Nalod might be in the top 20% but I am very much in the "Liberal Elite" who are ok with social programs, don't bitch about taxes if they go up, willing to vote and support programs that support help disadvangated get jobs, incubate small buisnesses and support financially many small groups that are helping others. I dont' itemize my taxes anymore and my donations are not tax deducatable. My firm picks up many of my former business expenses and I have no mortgage interest to deduct. Thus my donations are not financially motivated. But if my equity "wealth" via retirement aco****s and otherwise were to get wiped out I would no longer have the ability to support them. others like me would have to shut down their businesses who employ many. I could not frequent restaurants as I used to and thu wait staff income would decline.
My home drops in value as does my real estate taxes. My county tax rolls, sales taxes, and other taxes would not support the needs of the communities.
Kill the rich is good anger release but fact is when the top end gets hurt everyone gets hurt.
But........This current trend in the Trump adminstration is out of freaking control and is damaging. That I agree. I was not crazy about the corp. tax reduction and drop in my income tax for social reasons.
There are many republicans who stay there to defend their wealth. There are many democrats equally wealthy but are educated to understand the balance is not trending in the right direction. The Democratic elite are not without culpability over the years. I don't have the answer. Its one reason Hilary Lost but trump is far from the answer.
Want change? vote.

martin
Posts: 67903
Alba Posts: 108
Joined: 7/24/2001
Member: #2
USA
3/30/2020  11:34 AM
Nalod wrote:Want change? vote.

For me, this is the linchpin. More people have to come out and vote. Only way really

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Duty to warn : Mother of all bailouts

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